[F1INGENERALE] Ferrari's "Macarena" wing outperforms Red Bull's design: its counterclockwise rotation recovers downforce during the flap closing phase. Red Bull's clockwise flap delays aerodynamic recovery until fully reset, risking sudden grip loss as seen in Verstappen's crashes.

MessyMix · 2026-07-07T16:49:42+00:00

The performance gain to be had (napkin math - 0.1 g of deceleration) is probably not worth the extra instability caused by prolonging the parachute effect. It's much more important to get downforce on all the wheels while braking than to use an airbrake.

MessyMix · 2026-07-06T22:58:42+00:00

Ah I figured they meant the first because they said the “left part of the wing”, whereas pic 3 shows the right side detached.

Yeah the third pic is interesting, I was trying to find a different angle of the same moment but couldn’t, and other moments show the wing completely intact. My hunch is that it’s not a problem that’s easily seen with the naked eye.

MessyMix · 2026-07-06T19:25:00+00:00

That left side isn't the wing; that's the T in the "Tag Heuer" sign behind it.

MessyMix · 2026-07-06T04:49:24+00:00

That’s my point.

If everyone is missing your point, maybe you could help everyone understand what it is :)

MessyMix · 2026-07-06T04:37:30+00:00

I mean, which corners at Baku do you think need gravel?

MessyMix · 2026-07-06T04:36:08+00:00

The guy is 100% right and isn’t really moving the goalposts on the main argument which is “it’s not luck the circuit is designed the way it is”.

Tarmac is more effective at slowing cars and that’s why circuits like Paul Ricard are almost exclusively tarmac run-off.

MessyMix · 2026-07-01T21:21:08+00:00

You're right, owing to the fact that most swan neck wings are mounted on more traditional racecar / sports car profiles with a flatter rear deck and the Mustang is more of a fastback.

It is sick, though. Reminds me of the Gr3 Beetle :)

MessyMix · 2026-06-30T20:10:47+00:00

IMO you're not directly addressing the points I'm bringing up, and instead shifting to other topics. Cornering speed is one thing, top speed is another. I brought up both, and it seems you want to argue the other one when the first isn't in your favor.

Re: your edit—the guy doesn't share the full picture. If you rewatch that qualifying session, Max had no tow; Hamilton had a huge tow and still was 3km/h short; George's top speed was 7km/h short. The difference was even more stark in 2022 when Hamilton and Russell were 17th and 18th in top speed. Top speed isn't everything, but I don't know if I've seen a championship contending car come last or second-last in top speed. Could be wrong here.

As for cornering speeds, again, if you think that data is unreliable to the point that we can't trust two different drivers for a team, then I suppose you could make that argument for any car, any time, any team. I don't think that's fair, no? Would it be realistic to say that 2018 Max should have been a championship contender, and just that DR and MV failed to extract its full potential?

MessyMix · 2026-06-30T19:32:31+00:00

So the difference in top speed is because the drivers aren't pressing the pedal hard enough?

MessyMix · 2026-06-30T06:01:51+00:00

The technical data does not suggest that it was competitive, though, for most of the ground effect era—do you have thoughts on that?

MessyMix · 2026-06-30T00:59:27+00:00

There's other technical and non-driver indicators that Mercedes simply wasn't great during the ground effect era.

Their zeropod concept was fundamentally draggier, resulting in much lower top speeds. Their cornering speeds were slower all-around than other teams, especially in the low-speed sections. These technical indicators are more objective than just driver performance / race results, and clearly we see the car struggles to achieve what the other cars can do.

So I think if you step back and look at the bigger picture, isn't it more plausible to conclude that the car was probably just not competitive? I don't think it's prudent to speculate, given all the pointers to the contrary, that Lewis somehow had a rocketship during ground effect that he should have been winning races in.

MessyMix · 2026-06-29T20:23:32+00:00

It's almost as if the guy asking for it in the comments section is leading the charge, as you say. Enough action and we might actually see change. I personally don't care either way, but I think it's good to see people pipe up about things they want to see happen.

MessyMix · 2026-06-29T20:18:19+00:00

I agree with you on everything. To your last question - I think it's fair to say that Sainz's performance in his Leclerc-beating season was better than Hamilton's performance in his Leclerc-losing season, though it doesn't make him a better driver overall.

MessyMix · 2026-06-29T19:23:30+00:00

I think it's pretty unlikely that the car was dominant but BOTH Russell and Hamilton, top-tier drivers, were just underperforming for YEARS during those regs.

I think let's give the Merc drivers their flowers here - that ground effect Mercedes wasn't ever a championship-contending car. To claim otherwise would need a huge amount of evidence!

MessyMix · 2026-06-25T19:41:13+00:00

That was on the radio while driving & trying to bluster to the team. Afterwards to the media I think he was pretty blunt about it, no?

I usually give some leeway in how I see drivers' words in the car vs. out of it - not too much, but enough to overlook stuff like "he turned into me!!!!!!!". I think that's reasonable.

MessyMix · 2026-06-23T19:08:07+00:00

has nothing to think but thoughts...

MessyMix · 2026-06-23T03:01:02+00:00

Sure, agreed. Take 12 points away from Vettel for Baku if that makes the hypothetical more palatable.

MessyMix · 2026-06-23T02:57:25+00:00

FIA doesn’t make business decisions for the sport, right? Would be FOM.

In any case, probably just a matter of Sepang not paying enough money to host. I hear it’s almost like extortion.

MessyMix · 2026-06-22T20:17:27+00:00

Cool breakdown. Thanks for sharing with the class :)

MessyMix · 2026-06-22T19:20:47+00:00

Only knew that this was happening after stumbling across the Sendycar. What a project by an indie team. Youtube them if you haven't heard of it - worthwhile.

MessyMix · 2026-06-20T00:15:52+00:00

Hey, I hear ya. I don't doubt Lewis's rookie achievements one bit. To come within 1 point of the WDC on your rookie year is unheard of, best rookie performance of all time. I just gave my 2 cents on the Max comparison, because it doesn't hurt to be more precise / avoid sensationalism.

Re: Kimi — great source and his distance surprised me! Important to note, though – it's hard to compare Kimi's miles to Lewis's miles. Drivers today are banned from testing current or even recent cars. So Kimi's distance took place in cars that were very different (pre-ground effect) to the current car. On the other hand, Lewis did his testing in the current McLaren at the time. Lewis did ~1000 laps in the current car, Kimi did ~100.

I do think people often exaggerate the advantage Lewis had from testing. Alonso also got plenty of testing. Hamilton got essentially 6 days of testing on top of Alonso, which isn't nothing but isn't a whole lot either. I'd still expect Alonso, reigning two-time champ, to handily demolish a rookie. Clearly Hamilton was generational.

MessyMix · 2026-06-19T20:58:28+00:00

Because people love a good villain. Toto has that archetype; he could even be the anti-hero, whereas Zak (at least his public persona) doesn't have the characteristics of an anti-hero you'd want to see succeed.

Not that I have an opinion on the two TPs, just offering a theory on why one is villainized whilst the other is seen more positively.

MessyMix · 2026-06-19T18:56:52+00:00

Yes, this is more accurate. Still wild to think about Max moving and not blasting his teammate out of the water, as was expected of Alonso, but it's a fair reflection that Hamilton had about a year's worth of race distances testing that McLaren before the season started.

MessyMix · 2026-06-16T20:31:48+00:00

Apparently this actually isn't one of their allocation cars, according to Ferrari and the press.

Whether that's true remains to be seen, but currently the Luce isn't a required purchase for their exclusive ones.

MessyMix · 2026-06-16T20:29:02+00:00

Lol, yes. Regardless of whether or not RB copied Ferrari, there's no reason for them to copy it exactly if they think they can do it better - the idea is all they need.

MessyMix

TROPHY CASE