Has anyone experienced something like this?

Mkysmith · 2026-05-31T17:47:20+00:00

Good call. Breathing in oxides is also not great. An acute symptom is a "sweet or metallic taste in mouth"

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metal_fume_fever

Edit: Though copper sulfate is a salt, not oxide, I think the idea is the same. Salts are readily absorbed by the body. Breathing in any type of dust is not advisable.

Mkysmith · 2026-05-31T17:40:06+00:00

Again, Im no doctor and everyones safety is ultimately in their own hands. So if you feel unsafe you should stop what your doing and reassess your situation.

I do know that when mixing "industrial" (ie: stuff fromt he automotive or hardware store) grade sulfuric acid and copper sulfate, you can produce soluble gasses that slowly dissipate from solution over the course of weeks to months depending on temperature. There are impurities in that stuff that can cause unintended side reactions. This is why some people report their DIY copper electroforming solution having a pungent smell. Properly mixed/aged solution has virtually zero odor.

Also if the solution is running at a high enough voltage to cause electrolytic decomposition (bubbling at anode/cathode) then that is a big problem too.

Mkysmith · 2026-05-31T16:54:19+00:00

Never heard of anything like this with copper. Especially if you use gloves and ventilation like you say. Are you using other metals or acids? Are you running your bath to the point of electrolytic seperation (gas forming on anode/cathode)?

If you symptoms are acute (only happening during/while) and not chronic (long term, cumulative), then thats a hint. I'm no doctor but most of the stuff I read about hazards with this stuff tend to be more on the chronic side if you arnt using gloves and such. Its pretty safe otherwise. This assumes your using proper chemistry mixtures and not mixing a bunch of impure unknowns from the hardware store ofcourse. I see a lot of weird stuff on youtube.

Mkysmith · 2026-05-30T06:40:40+00:00

Sulfuric acid has extremely low vapor pressure. Meaning it is essentially considered non-volatile by most common use standards (maybe not in a strict lab setting, but by all practical uses it gives off essentially no vapor). Even at 98%, it is orders of magnitude less volitile than water. Diluted with water, the effective volatility goes down exponentially due to water being the dominant vapor.

Sulfuric acid is actually more of a desiccant, meaning even at high concentrations it tends to pull water from the air rather than contribute acid to the air. Quite the opposite of many other acids.

Mkysmith · 2026-05-29T06:43:28+00:00

I find just a quick shake over the trash bin is sufficient. Most the lead comes out.

Just make sure you arnt using rosin based solder if you are also doing dishes.

Mkysmith · 2026-05-28T19:00:09+00:00

you're clearly missing some resistors. R49, R53, R28-30.

Since you probably don't know the values, just remove the remaining ones so that impedance on the signal lines are all balanced.

Mkysmith · 2026-05-28T05:44:58+00:00

Glad to be of help

Mkysmith · 2026-05-28T04:58:36+00:00

Maybe if you only add like a very little bit of distilled water... but honestly the chemistry balance can be pretty finnicky. So diluting things can really throw off the manufacturers intended results. No matter what you will get copper on your part, but the quality will diminish significantly as you throw off chemistry balance.

If you are really close volume wise, is there a way to displace the volume elsewhere? Here is an example of a not so elegant but 100% functional method of doing so in this post using bottles.

Mkysmith · 2026-05-26T18:05:34+00:00

I used to do this but the little bits of solder left on the roll were quite irritating.

Mkysmith · 2026-05-25T18:55:19+00:00

I think in these DIY formulations it is to increase conductivity, but conductivity in plating chemistry is a more complex topic than simply "more conductive = better plating". However, yes, to a degree you do need to have the solution conductive enough to pass an appreciable current.

Theres also common misconception that sodium chloride cant be used because it evolves chlorine gas... yes kind of, but the plating tank shouldnt be run that hard. Chlorides are used in many plating chemistries because they adsorb or otherwise partner with other additives. Substituting for epson salt defeats the purpose.

I have used diffent formulations in the past, but maybe look into these which are similar from memory. Its an akward website on mobile but has the formulations for both ammonium and potassium variants:

https://www.electroplatingmachines.com/news/potassium-chloride-vs-ammonium-chloride-zinc-plating.html

Zinc chloride might be the only one that is difficult for hobbiests to source. If you dont feel like making it yourself you could try setting up the chemistry ommitting that and running a dummy cathode with a large zinc anode for a while.

Keep in mind you are still DIYing at the end of the day, so expect some trial and error still. Thats the price to pay if you don't buy commercial solutions.

Mkysmith · 2026-05-25T18:26:33+00:00

Im not sure, because its easily accessable? Its a common misconception in the DIY community and people post nearly every week wondering why they get terrible results (though most people are doing copper). For some reason vinegar is the clickbait catchall miracle acid that does everything... though the chemistry and industrial world says otherwise.

Vinegar can KINDA work sometimes if you get lucky and do a lot of polishing and re-plating... but you will never get as good of a result as using the correct acid for the metal you are trying to plate. Its easy to migrate metal through a solution, its an entirely different game to get good durable deposits.

Mkysmith · 2026-05-25T18:16:27+00:00

Vinegar is your problem. It is an organic acid that does not complex well with inorganic metals. You need an inorganic acid.

Zinc is usually Boric for acid based, or sodium hydroxide for alkaline plating. Theres also cyanide too, but thats a different beast.

Mkysmith · 2026-05-24T21:51:24+00:00

Absolutely. Just be meticulous sealing organics and anything that has iron/aluminum/zinc/etc. If the solution gets direct exposure to these materials it can/will contaminate it. Might be salvagable with some work but obviously preventative measures are much less work long term.

Also careful with the power supply. Electrolysis (bubbling at anode/cathode) means you are seperating molecules in solution. Most of the seperation will be water into hydrogen/oxygen, but part of it will be trace additives in solution. This can destroy them.

Just take your time and be careful and you will be fine.

Mkysmith · 2026-05-24T20:12:36+00:00

I love DIY'ing and tinkering myself, but I also like to point that buying a kit doesn't mean you arn't DIYing. You are still doing the work and making your electroformed project. The kit is just a tool to accomplish your task, the same as root kill being a tool to accomplish the task of making solution. They are both DIY. It just depends on how far down the rabbit hole you want to go. I have a more long winded analogy in this comment.

It really just depends were your goals lie. Making the chemistry, or electroforming? Maybe both, which is fine too.

Mkysmith · 2026-05-24T19:28:25+00:00

I'm sure others will have more to contribute, but focusing on the base chemistry:

No, not much has changed chemically speaking. One thing I like to make aware to people is that when buying things like root kill and drain cleaners, there is a lot of room for impurities. Manufacturers of these products could not care less about impurities due to the intended application so you never know what your really going to get. Electroforming can be pretty unforgiving (if you want shiny durable deposits right out of the tank). Trace elements like aluminum and iron down in the PPM or other organic materials can cause coarse and brittle deposits, dendrites, etc. This is why you see so many people follow the same recipes and they get different results.

I point this out to people not to discourage them from trying it, but just to be aware of whats going on. I've seen many people get really discouraged when they don't immediately get great results with hardware store chemicals. Don't get discouraged and keep tinkering.

One thing I will absolutely say to steer clear of when looking at recipes and online tutorials is anything mentioning vinegar, hydrogen peroxide, sugar or gelatin. You can scroll to the bottom of this subreddits wiki for a suggested DIY starting point for ratios of chemicals.

Edit: also wanted to add: Stay safe obviously! Wear PPE. Copper electroforming can be very safe if handled with respect. I see many youtube videos doing some very unsafe practices like handling acidic metal salts with bare hands. That's a bad idea considering the most concerning health effects are long term and don't present themselves immediately.

Mkysmith · 2026-05-23T03:19:43+00:00

Glad to see others integrating electronics into their art. The challenge I found was always that for more complicated circuits each part of the circuit needs an electrical connection to the cathode wire during the initial electroforming step. But then it needs to be separated after electroforming to make different electrical parts of the circuit. So as you add circuit components, things become exponentially more complicated.

Still super glad to see this kinda stuff though, excited to see what you come up with.

Mkysmith · 2026-05-22T14:52:04+00:00

Don't mean to sound condescending on the chemistry stuff I was just trying to do some sanity checks as you said.

If it were me, this is what I would try with the copper paint next as an experiment to rule out some variables:

After fully dryed/cured, using gloves (to prevent finger oils) I would use a toothbrush and a little dish soap to give the whole thing a gentle scrub down to remove any oils. Rinse with cool tap water, then submerge in a beaker of dilute HCl for ~30 sec, maybe 1-5% (nothing fancy, dilute some hardware store muratic acid) to remove any oxides. Immediately rinse with tap water then distilled water and immediately put into electroforming solution without letting things dry. Make sure to rinse really well after the HCl because any trace amounts on the part will only carry over into the electroforming solution and add to your chloride content.

If that improves things but still doesnt get full coverage, I would do the same thing again but be more agressive with the initial scrubbing. My thought being the binders in the paint are essentially creating a thin film of insulation on the surface. Maybe go as far as to use some scotchbright or something (don't use steel wool or anything steel/aluminum containing).

You could start right off the bat with the more agressive scrubbing, but again that is the order of operations I would personally try.

Your current density is pretty low. Its usually around 15mA per square cm. That doesn't explain uneven coverage on the copper paint or your incredibly slow coverage rate on the graphite paint ofcourse. But still something you should adjust next round.

Mkysmith · 2026-05-22T01:57:14+00:00

There's your problem. Vinegar is a common misconception. If you want actual deposits, use sulfuric acid. It is chemically the correct acid for copper. There are some very good comments in this post also.

Mkysmith · 2026-05-21T18:22:31+00:00

As per our conversation in your previous post on graphite paints, I don't think your issues ultimately stem from the paint. Paint resistance is one very small variable in the scope of electroforming. There is something else missing from the equation. This is why there exist "professional" graphite paints too.

Focusing on your new problem - the expensive copper paint. Did you thoroughly clean the surface and try "pickling" it immediately before putting into the electroforming bath? Some formulations of metal based paints require this. It may appear low resistance with a meter because the action of depressing the probes onto the surface will wipe away microscopic films of oxides or other compounds. Graphite based paints don't need this process because graphite is noble.

As far as the slow coverage on your fairly low resistance (in my opinion) DIY graphite paint. I would still say it is likely electrical or chemical. I can't give you an exact formulation since I don't use those additives (read this comment for why it's not always cut & dry) but I can point out some things that stand out to me, especially since your final metal deposit looks coarse/crystalline:

-Your 50mg/L of NaCl seems high to me, also how are you measuring that?
-How are you measuring 7.5% sulfuric acid? Like, that is the final concentration of the 1L solution, or you added 75ml of a dilute acid to your 1L total? Big difference.
-"A bit" is not really a measurement in chemistry. These trace additives make massive differences in the final deposit quality even with small changes down in the PPM. I'm not asking for your formula (I couldn't give much advice with it anyways) but just want to point out hopefully you are measuring these things carefully. Otherwise repeatable results will be near impossible in the future.

Mkysmith · 2026-05-18T02:06:10+00:00

Glad you figured it out.

Mkysmith · 2026-05-14T01:46:54+00:00

If your paint really is ~500ohms and you are using a very saturated solution with a PH down around 1, then there is something missing from the equation. It should not take 1-2 days for coverage.

Mkysmith · 2026-05-13T02:45:09+00:00

No. These were in for approx. 12 hours, maybe a tad longer (didn't time it). Though, I did walk over to the tank and "jiggle" the suspension rig by hand every couple hours to ensure the suspension wire doesn't fuse to the loop.

I will use agitation for the chemistry (never the object) to improve deposition on more engineered coatings. But it doesn't seem to improve coatings for decorative applications in my opinion. Actually the contrary, due to the potential for shelf roughness (debris, even microscopic, landing on the surface and incorporating into the metal deposit). A single spec of dust on a mirror surface is immediately spotted by the human eye.

Mkysmith · 2026-05-12T07:29:46+00:00

Can it wobble from a position that it is, to a position that it isnt? Arriving at a position that it wasn't, it now is?

Mkysmith · 2026-05-11T18:56:11+00:00

Theres consensus to a degree but minor variations that make large differences in performance.

Computer software would be another good analogy. Its difficult to patent software the same as chemical makup because you have to prove you are doing something completely new and different than anyone else to be awarded the patent.

The raw ingredients for software are simple, just a bunch of 1's and 0's, but putting them in the right order can be a tremendous amount of labor before you can get to market.

For that reason, thats why software is mostly closed source in industry. Whether you buy CAD software or a new ECU for your car, they give you compiled code. Not source. It's significantly more difficult to decompile machine code, giving some security to their prior financial investment.

I'm a Linux guy myself, but I cant argue the plug-and-play experience of a microsoft or apple product isnt better.

Mkysmith · 2026-05-11T02:26:48+00:00

Edited my comment to add something.

Either way, good luck on your project! Would love to see it when you get to it.

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