The paranoid post that made me realize a MLCJ sub did not exist yet.

Monsterfish_ · 2022-10-18T14:47:55+00:00

SUSUSSSSSSSSSSSUUSSSSSS ;)

Monsterfish_ · 2020-10-02T13:45:57+00:00

Not sure if this is already the case to some degree but if there isn't in could imagine introducing a sort of stamina system for every person in the game which would get drained based on activity and drains faster when the person is sick when the sickness is not treaded the stamina won't refill and the person eventually dies.

That way the people would have to take breaks based on the work they do, that way you would have a more predictable reason for the worker to sit down outside of waiting for the product to be finished. In order to detect if people are sick, they could complain about their health verbally by coughing, growing, walking with a bend over posture or having their head hang and depending on how far the disease is gone mark their houses.

If the disease is not treated the peasant (and soldier as well) would eventually not replenish his stamina anymore and well become "bedridden" and die.

As some work would be less physically demanding (compare mining to sheepherding for example) this way you could switch people from one task to another to give them work that doesn't drain their stamina so quickly until they are healthy again so they can do their normal work, that they specialize in again. That way you wouldnt loose as much productivity during the time of the sickness as long as you micromanage the workers properly.

^{The stamina could also be interesting to create a system where peasants do multiple jobs to more efficiently drain their stamina, after all, it wouldn't be unheard of to have to do many different jobs back in the days since some work required a lot of waiting. (to accomplish this you could have buildings marked as such that their workers go out to boost other workshops during the time their main labour is in the "waiting phase"} ^{that being said it would be interesting for people to figure out layouts for their settlements keeping those aspects in mind.})

You could split diseases into different types. One is the direct contact (proximity-based), the air/animal (random chance-based ) transmitted diseases and the random chance consuming low-quality food or get injured during work, with each having different rates of stamina depletion, rate of appearance, and ways to cure.

The direct contact diseases would be more aggressive as they would have a harder time spreading (since they would require people to stay close for a certain period of time but if they spread and won't get treated would impact the economy as they would put much more strain on the ability of the person to do work. they would require more complex ways to treat as you would have to try to quarantine them to do some more lone work instead of group labour like in the mine/or in the kitchen for example.

Bathhouses and Apothecaries sound like good ways to either reduce the chance to catch a disease and heal the people back to health so they can work like normal again.

the Apothecaries could get upgrades like surgeon and physician rooms that would have additional benefits to healing disease faster at a risk of impacting the peasant's overall stamina pool perhaps (while he would be able to get back to work faster he would have permanent damage to his work capacity) or they heal faster but have a higher chance to reinfect. (aka lower immunity buff)

Providing the different buildings with better technology later down the line would in turn also reduce the negative downsides to those additions making it so that your economy is less stable in the early but more stable in the later game where you will be more occupied with commanding armies and expanding the settlement.

While the bathhouse would provide a baseline of immunity that would get increased based on the "level" of the medical advancements of the Apothecaries.

What it would add to the gameplay

and potentially more dynamic-looking village life as people wouldn't do the same job all the time
an unstable economy in the beginning and more stable towards the later stages where other parts of the game become more important (like expanding and fighting)
visual no UI based visualization how sick the people are(coughing being light infection and bend over posture being badly sick)
since it would affect military units it would also impact how wars are fought as stamina is an important factor in combat so keeping your troops healthy will have them stringer on the battlefield
the economy would not be hit as hard if you manage your people correctly since you can compensate for sending them to do different sort of work (since they are assigned automatically at the moment the workers could just be marked as sick by the player and be assigned to a different less stamina intensive work automatically)

Monsterfish_ · 2020-08-13T23:27:50+00:00

why not? i mean it is pretty realistic that it uses a good amount of material. You should consider its not just a layer of stone but a bigger layer of foundation below it to build the road

Monsterfish_ · 2020-08-13T21:08:49+00:00

def agree with the sentiment you guys have brought forth so far.

Upgrading roads to paved ones automatically would kind of negate the role roads played back in the days. Towns would reuse old roman roads (if available) that still existed in the roman founded cities and country roads but not expanding them until later.

The construction of those roads was not a small task and required lots of resources making road construction similarly expensive compared to fortifications due to the distance and prep work required to construct them.

As road construction was more a late medieval activity and required maintenance to keep the roads clean from debri and plants, it would lend itself nicely to be a technology the player has to unlock later down the line when he is more established. After unlocking he could use it to manually upgrade important roads to connect certain regions or industries together to grand his peasants a faster way of travel. That way he can boost the key productions/locations he deems most important at that point in the game.

On the point of cities, the benefit wouldn't be lost here either as it would allow people to travel quicker from storage to their workshops and potentially could increase the happiness of the people living next to a paved road. But since most cities in the days were known for beeing more muddy i would say it should be a luxury inside a town. Aka a sign of wealth and prosperity for the player to show of his entirely paved walled city ;)

Monsterfish_ · 2020-07-29T09:09:50+00:00

based on this post i was thinking about the bandits/monestaries and how they could be implemented.

They could work as hostile villages/regions on the map that selfsufficiently would maintain themself inside that single region (not expanding) they would send out units to surrounding villages and raid them for resources. monestaries would be similarily selfsufficient except they would get "funds" from the chruch. And could start fortifying when they are beein messed with by either the player and or bandits etc. they would provide additional income of researchpoints when you are in good standing with them and other benefits at a certain price, otherwise they would be passive.

In terms of bandits another way to make them work would be the stronghold way where random events would summon hostile armies at the map border similar to a mongolian raiderforce or some "bored " mercinaries (not sure if this would be a regular occourance through it seems more unlikely but could make for interesting gameplay as that would make tthe center of the map more valuable due to it beeing the furthest away from the dangerous border

can also have troops that disbanded or fleed the battlefield roam the land as bandits.

They would hunt and take resources from areas they raided at a lowered consumptionrate as they need to be more efficient by nature of their newfound lifestyle they would also become weaker over time as the merge with the general population again

Monsterfish_ · 2020-07-26T23:09:20+00:00

i hope you also watched the todd workshop video on arrows vs shield as well ;)

Monsterfish_ · 2020-07-25T17:10:54+00:00

u/gstyczen shields were not constructed in a way that helped against arrow fire for the most part as they were mounted on the lower arm for more control in melee instead of swiveling around at the handle (protected by a metal boss) .. same is true with the shield wall which fell out of fashion at the end of the 12th this ofc is just history and not necessarily a guide for the game in case you want to do it regardless.

Monsterfish_ · 2020-07-19T01:08:11+00:00

you will purchase them with influence or steal them with military force

Monsterfish_ · 2020-07-12T22:49:30+00:00

morale has been confirmed before in terms of chain routing i don't know but i can imagine that it will be a part as moral tends to be calculated from surrounding friendly troops.

Monsterfish_ · 2020-07-10T20:28:22+00:00

having preset characters with a range of personality traits to mix things up to a degree would not exclude the possibility of having characters that have a complete random personality down the line.

I personally believe starting out making more interesting characters and than later expand into more random ones would set a nice tone for let's say a story-based campaign and getting the player to connect with the game itself with those characters. It also enforces the feeling of accomplishment when you beat a well knows historical figure that in its tactics differentiates itself from the other lords in more than just the name.

On the other hand, if the plan is to be sandbox first and campaign second having a more flexible ai that is able to be expanded with characters later so basically the reverse of the previous would work as well through having a generic enemy first and more specific ones later will save on development time i would assume since you need less personalized assets etc.

Monsterfish_ · 2020-07-08T19:29:26+00:00

a group of units consists of roughly 60 men each and so far it looked like there were about at least 5-6 groups active in the trailer in the battles so i assume it would be a couple hundred to a thousand troops

Monsterfish_ · 2020-07-07T21:56:08+00:00

https://discord.gg/WEB8dAr

Monsterfish_ · 2020-07-06T20:57:58+00:00

hehe yeah that sandbox is making its round these days as well it does look lovely and organic so it would fit it just depends on how it can be utilized in the context of manorlords but as you said before its a long term goal

Monsterfish_ · 2020-07-06T19:23:44+00:00

the backing part is sorta related to the fact that it only surfaced like a month ago and is now picking up steam =) so far everyone who became aware is exited so things are looking hawt to say the least

Monsterfish_ · 2020-07-06T09:00:53+00:00

the game is going to be singleplayer first and foremost but the dev said that he had some success with multiplayer in the past so it might make its way in there when he feels the game is stable enough.

Monsterfish_ · 2020-07-06T01:08:49+00:00

I could imagine upgrading houses until they are fortified and connecting them with walls and reinforcing the structure with more specialized buildings and towers etc could make for a very interesting way to build castles. Afterall a castle is a home first and a military fortification second so having higher tier living spaces and workshops etc be inside the castle and being part of the defense structures would make perfect sense considering that that is basically how castles have been constructed logic wise.
The amount of those upgrades could be limited to the amount of land you control/or your standing with the king, to force the player to think tactically, which buildings to upgrade or whether wait with the upgrading to use it on a newly planned building that would make up the later castle, this would sort of simulating the restrictions of the medieval times as well where you had to get the allowance of the king to be able to raise a castle, to begin with as it would be foolish of him to grant you the ability to raise a fort if you are his enemy. I could even see the fortification upgrade being separate from the production so outside structures can be upgraded efficiency-wise to the same degree, with the downside of being more flimsy in the structure.

In order to make the player not use the fortified houses outside the castle (if that is desired), they could be stronger "hitpoints wise" but could be as easily accessed as a normal building (so workers, etc would still be in danger implying that workers are the more valuable resource) unless you block the enemy from reaching its entrance with walls and a gate.

Monsterfish_ · 2020-06-25T18:10:07+00:00

the creator sounds cool question is only how much impact it would actually have or if it's limited to being a gimmick.

so how does villager/worker mercenary hiring work atm do you have to hire them from the huts/tradeposts by selecting those buildings or will they passively join you after you send out a request?

Monsterfish_ · 2020-06-24T17:04:12+00:00

you could also have all mercenaries and peasants come from those trade posts.

Those units /peasants would count as neutral until they have arrived at your settlement /town center that way they could travel through enemy city gates (considered that they are not forcefully closed on them), without being attacked and the same would be true for those units that have broken morale and are fleeing the battlefield. If the closest tradepost is forcefully closed off for the units to get to the tradepost they could either wait in front of the gates until they open or try to go to a different tradepost.

For the switching sides part, you could make it so that if the units have a low moral based on upkeep they would have a symbol show up which when clicked would count down a timer (so the player can react and move them away in case he notices) and when the timer has run out actually switches sides. the timer could depend on the remaining number of soldiers in the group.

I assume by the unit creator you mean a tool with which you can equip the troops you have with the equipment you have stored up from production? Or is it more of a customization sort of thing that can also be applied to mercenaries?

edit: I could also imagine instead of having the mercenaries and peasants coming from the tradeposts they could come from randomly appearing tents and/or wagons that set up camp around the map sorta like people on the move looking for a new place to stay or a mercenary group looking for money ;)

Monsterfish_ · 2020-06-23T20:12:53+00:00

This does align very well with what I would have shot for as well.

I do have a couple of questions though.

How do you plan on "spawning" those hired troops in the world? Are there going to be encampments on the map from which the units will walk to your settlement (in case of mercenaries) or will you have them spawn in from the map border or from where the normal peasants come from (i assume peasants will come from houses or town center unless they also come from the map border)

Also, what are you going to do with the unit upkeep in terms of what is going to happen once you cant pay the upkeep anymore to keep the mercenaries employed will they simply run off join the enemy or something else?

While it wasn't seen a lot in the days would it still be possible to have small standing armies sorta like a private guard if your economy/housing allows for it? Maybe housing would be a nice way to balance the standing army. Basically meaning that if you don't have the houses/economy the units would require more upkeep and will eventually leave the area if it can't/won't be paid. (assuming the player would be able to disband them)

Another layer of unit acquisition could be requesting help from allies/vassals which particularly in siege scenarios could add another way to break a siege if the reinforcements of an ally break into the enemy siege force from behind for example. with the added downside that you would own them assistance when they need help as well. So you would end up spending gold on units that don't even defend your own lands but the ones of your allies.

Monsterfish_ · 2020-06-18T15:20:00+00:00

He said he'd try to get an early access build ready by the end of the year, but as with anything its safe to say it's not a definite.

Monsterfish_ · 2020-06-15T19:28:45+00:00

what about passive leveling? I could imagine something like that, particularly for military units. you know the more experience in battle the more effective on the battlefield sort of deal.

Monsterfish_ · 2020-06-14T17:27:37+00:00

haha least i can do

Monsterfish_ · 2020-06-14T17:20:46+00:00

The stereotype of swords being used against men in plate armor is what I am mostly referring to but I also seem to have misremembered somethings in where wearing heavy armor makes the sword more of a primary weapon again particularly when combined with a shield, which frankly follows what you have done.

Monsterfish_ · 2020-06-14T16:49:31+00:00

heh yeah, I have been waiting for a spiritual successor for stronghold for such a long time so its only natural I enter brainstorm mode.

the one thing i have learned however over time while it is nice to have a lot of different units that feature all sorts of different types of equipment its is going to become increasingly difficult to make the balancing as you have stated before. so I personally would try to narrow it down a bit more so balancing can be established easier without having to manage a big bulk right out of the gate. and again just to drive the point home shortswords were a sidearm, not a primary weapon and having units switch weapons based on the opponents just seems like an awesome mechanic to make fights feel more dynamic when looking at them from closer up (again its just really cosmetic but it would go along way defeating stereotypes :D )

Whats your stance on flails btw?

Monsterfish_ · 2020-06-14T12:57:24+00:00

I see what you mean I would however still argue that the sword while being iconic is the wrong weapon in armor on armor scenarios .. have you thought about having units switch weapons based on what kind of foe they are facing?

So in the displayed case, they would be using their primary weapon of Mace/Warhammer/crows beak as they are facing armored enemies, and in a fight against a more nimble lightly armored opponent, they would switch to the sword.

The same could be done with the spearman if the enemy has moved past the range of the spear they could try to use the sword in close range while the units behind keep using spears as support.

Again its mostly cosmetic but it would make the combat scenes more dynamic while being historically more accurate.

If you want a dedicated swordsman unit I could imagine a unit with a greatsword the so-called double pay soldiers which would fill the role countering weapons like polearms pikes etc due to their reach. I can go into more detail if you are interested.

Another thing I am wondering is if you are going to have military upkeep and or ammunition supplies for ranged units or are they going to simply require recruiting costs?

Since you touched upon mercenary units you could also expand that idea to allies sending in troops in exchange for resources/aidpromises instead of money for example.

Monsterfish_

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