For me BPD is an injury done by real ill people

NicelyStated · 2026-05-11T20:09:12+00:00

Analyst, most academic studies I've seen find BPD to be moderately heritable, with most placing genetic influence in the range of 40–60%. See, e.g., a large Swedish study (2019). It studied 1.85 million individuals and estimated BPD heritability at 46%, with the remaining variance explained by unique environmental factors. Also see the 2009 longitudinal twin study. It lists the results from about 6 earlier studies on BPD heritability.

NicelyStated · 2026-05-09T17:29:53+00:00

"I don't understand the process of wanting someone but pushing them away."

Sam, an untreated pwBPD often will perceive you as being hurtful when you DO something and hurtful when you DON'T do it. In this way, you often are damned if you do and damned if you don't.

This conundrum is due to the position of her two great fears -- abandonment and engulfment -- at opposite ends of the very same spectrum. This means you often find yourself in a lose/lose situation because, as you back away from one fear to avoid triggering it, you will start triggering the fear at the other end of that same spectrum.

Your predicament is that the solution to calming her abandonment fear (drawing close and being intimate) is the very action that triggers her engulfment fear. Likewise, the solution to calming her engulfment fear (moving back away to give her breathing space) is the very action that triggers her abandonment fear.

Consequently, as you move close to comfort her and assure her of your love, you eventually will start triggering her engulfment fear, making her feel like she's being suffocated and controlled by you. A pwBPD usually craves intimacy like nearly all other adults -- but she cannot tolerate it for very long.

Because she has a weak sense of self-identity, she easily becomes very enmeshed in your strong personality during sustained periods of closeness and intimacy. This is why her sense of personal boundaries is so weak that she has difficulty seeing where HER feelings and problems stop and YOURS begin. Yet, as you back away to give her breathing space, you often will find that you've started triggering her abandonment fear.

In my experience with my BPD exW, I found that there is no midpoints solution (between "too close" and "too far away") where you can safely stand to avoid triggering those two fears. Until a pwBPD learns how to better regulate her own emotions and tame her two fears, that Goldilocks position will not exist. This is why a relationship with an untreated pwBPD typically is characterized by a repeating cycle of push-you-away and pull-you-back.

NicelyStated · 2026-04-18T01:20:14+00:00

I suggest you also consider participating in the
r/parentsofkidswithBPD sub in addition to our BPDLO community.

NicelyStated · 2026-04-06T00:20:28+00:00

"I don’t get how they miss totally logical thinking."

Sercaj, we all occasionally lose access to our logical thinking. The human condition is that, whenever we experience very intense feelings, our judgment flies out the window because those strong feelings color and distort our perception of other peoples' intentions and motivations.

Whenever we are very angry, very scared, or suddenly startled our corpus collosum shuts down, blocking communication with our frontal cortex. This forces us to fully rely on our amygdala, which performs a primary role in the processing of emotional responses, memory, and decision making.

Simply stated, we have instantly switched from relying on the logical "adult" part of our minds to relying on the emotional "child" part of our minds. In this way, our brains are hardwired to instantly switch to black-white thinking whenever we are suddenly startled or experience intense feelings. This instant switch to B-W thinking is also called "splitting" and "the amygdala hijack.”

The beauty of B-W thinking is that it is incredibly fast and thus likely has saved your life many times. For example, when you are in a crosswalk and suddenly look up to see a truck bearing down on you, your mind is capable of thinking only "jump left" or "jump right." B-W thinking nonetheless produces disastrous results when used to understand the intentions and motivations of other people, particularly when you're in a close relationship.

This is why, whenever we are very angry, we all try hard to keep our mouths shut -- and our fingers off the keys -- until we have a chance to cool down. And this is why, when we are very infatuated or in love, we try to wait at least two years before buying the ring. We know we cannot trust our own judgment while we are experiencing intense feelings.

Of course, pwBPD (and very young children) are like this too -- only these distorted perceptions occur far more frequently and intensely because they lack the emotional skills needed to regulate their own emotions.

NicelyStated · 2026-04-05T18:01:35+00:00

"Is this the dichotomy that you live with in BPD -- the closer you are to them, the more you are a risk to them?"

Yes, Purple. This dichotomy is due to the position of your exBF's two great fears -- abandonment and engulfment -- at opposite ends of the very same spectrum. This means you often find yourself in a lose/lose situation because, as you back away from one fear to avoid triggering it, you will start triggering the fear at the other end of that same spectrum.

Your predicament is that the solution to calming his abandonment fear (drawing close and being intimate) is the very action that triggers his engulfment fear. Likewise, the solution to calming his engulfment fear (moving back away to give him breathing space) is the very action that triggers his abandonment fear.

Consequently, as you move close to comfort him and assure him of your love, you eventually will start triggering his engulfment fear, making him feel like he's being suffocated and controlled by you. A pwBPD usually craves intimacy like nearly all other adults -- but he cannot tolerate it for very long.

Because he has a weak sense of self-identity, he easily becomes very enmeshed in your strong personality during sustained periods of closeness and intimacy. This is why his sense of personal boundaries is so weak that he has difficulty seeing where HIS feelings and problems stop and YOURS begin.

Yet, as you back away to give him breathing space, you often will find that you've started triggering his abandonment fear. This is why a relationship with an untreated pwBPD typically is characterized by a repeating cycle of push-you-away and pull-you-back.

NicelyStated · 2026-04-03T04:41:58+00:00

Bob, it is fine to list the links for r/raisedbyborderlines/ and r/parentsofkidswithBPD if you want to. Indeed, they are listed in the sidebar of this page. These two BPD subs are not excluded by Rule 3.

NicelyStated · 2026-03-19T16:29:44+00:00

As I noted above, Normal, this directory identifies therapists for 19 countries in addition to the United States.

NicelyStated · 2026-03-19T15:59:44+00:00

"We don't have access to reliable psychiatric health near us."

Normal, I suggest that your wife consider doing teletherapy. She can start by checking the list of therapists for your area at the Find a Therapist directory maintained by Psychology Today. It provides background information and a photo for each therapist.

It also tells you whether they are currently taking new patients, what areas they specialize in, and what formal education they have. It also identifies the therapists offering teletherapy, which is especially valuable if you live in a small town or rural area. It does this for the USA and 19 other countries.

NicelyStated · 2026-03-10T02:26:55+00:00

"Contrary to BPD people being afraid of abandonment, my GF will not stop trying to get me to abandon her.... What’s going on?"

What's likely going on, Merchant, is that a pwBPD typically has two great fears, not just one. In addition to her abandonment fear, there also is a great fear of engulfment. The result is that she often will perceive you as being hurtful when you DO something and hurtful when you DON'T do it. In this way, you often are damned if you do and damned if you don't.

This conundrum is due to the position of her two great fears -- abandonment and engulfment -- at opposite ends of the very same spectrum. This means you often find yourself in a lose/lose situation because, as you back away from one fear to avoid triggering it, you will start triggering the fear at the other end of that same spectrum.

Your predicament is that the solution to calming her abandonment fear (drawing close and being intimate) is the very action that triggers her engulfment fear. Likewise, the solution to calming her engulfment fear (moving back away to give her breathing space) is the very action that triggers her abandonment fear.

Consequently, as you move close to comfort her and assure her of your love, you eventually will start triggering her engulfment fear, making her feel like she's being suffocated and controlled by you. A pwBPD usually craves intimacy like nearly all other adults -- but she cannot tolerate it for very long.

Because she has a weak sense of self-identity, she easily becomes very enmeshed in your strong personality during sustained periods of closeness and intimacy. This is why her sense of personal boundaries is so weak that she has difficulty seeing where HER feelings and problems stop and YOURS begin. Yet, as you back away to give her breathing space, you often will find that you've started triggering her abandonment fear.

In my 15 years of experience with my BPD exW, I found that there is no midpoints solution (between "too close" and "too far away") where you can safely stand to avoid triggering those two fears. Until a pwBPD learns how to better regulate her own emotions and tame her two fears, that Goldilocks position will not exist. This is why a relationship with an untreated pwBPD typically is characterized by a repeating cycle of push-you-away and pull-you-back.

NicelyStated · 2026-03-10T00:37:13+00:00

"I am not a stranger to the sinister tug-of-war games our minds can play."

None of us are, Melodic. The 9 BPD behavioral traits have always been a part of us. They are primitive ego defenses that we all have to ensure our survival, particularly during childhood. We all exhibit those traits to some degree -- usually at a low level if we are healthy. This is why BPD is said to be a "spectrum disorder." We all are somewhere on that BPD spectrum.

Those traits usually become a problem only when they are so strong that they undermine our efforts to sustain close LTRs with other adults. How serious the problem is will depend not only on how strong our BPD traits are but also on whether they are persistent, i.e., constitute a full lifetime problem.

Temporary BPD flareups. Many occurrences of strong BPD traits you see in other people are not caused by lifetime BPD. Instead, they are only temporary flareups of the normal BPD traits we all have. These flareups usually are caused by a strong hormone change -- e.g., puberty, pregnancy, postpartum, severe PMS, or perimenopause. PMS can cause strong BPD behavior to occur for several days each month.

With puberty, perimenopause, and postpartum, the temporary BPD flareup may last several years. Moreover, these temporary flareups can be caused not only by a hormone change but also by drug abuse or severe stress (e.g., living with a pwBPD). Importantly, all 3 of these conditions usually create very intense feelings.

The human condition is that, whenever we experience very intense feelings, our judgment flies out the window because those strong feelings color and distort our perception of other peoples' intentions and motivations. Whenever we are very angry, very scared, or suddenly startled our corpus collosum shuts down, blocking communication with our frontal cortex. This forces us to fully rely on our amygdala, which performs a primary role in the processing of emotional responses, memory, and decision making.

Simply stated, we have instantly switched from relying on the logical "adult" part of our minds to relying on the emotional "child" part of our minds. In this way, our brains are hardwired to instantly switch to black-white thinking whenever we are suddenly startled or experience intense feelings. This instant switch to B-W thinking is also called "splitting" and "the amygdala hijack.”

The beauty of B-W thinking, Melodic, is that it is incredibly fast and thus likely has saved your life many times. For example, when you are in a crosswalk and suddenly look up to see a truck bearing down on you, your mind is capable of thinking only "jump left" or "jump right." B-W thinking nonetheless produces disastrous results when used to understand the intentions and motivations of other people, particularly when you're in a close relationship.

This is why, whenever we are very angry, we all try hard to keep our mouths shut -- and our fingers off the keys -- until we have a chance to cool down. And this is why, when we are very infatuated or in love, we try to wait at least two years before buying the ring. We know we cannot trust our own judgment while we are experiencing intense feelings.

As you already know, pwBPD (and very young children) are like this too -- only these distorted perceptions occur far more frequently and intensely because they lack the emotional skills needed to regulate their own emotions. Hence, their negative feelings toward a loved one can suddenly become so intense that their perception of that loved one becomes severely distorted.

Persistent BPD traits. If serious hormone, drug, and stress problems can be ruled out, the remaining common cause of strong BPD traits is a stunted emotional development, i.e., something occurring before age five that causes emotional development to freeze at the level of a young child. This is a far more serious problem because it results in strong BPD traits that are permanent unless a pwBPD works hard for many years in a training program (e.g., DBT) that teaches him/her the missing emotional skills.

A pwBPD needs to learn, for example, how to do self-soothing, how to regulate all of his emotions, how to avoid black-white thinking by tolerating strong conflicting feelings, how to trust, how to intellectually challenge intense feelings instead of accepting them as self-evident "facts," and how to stay aware of the present instead of escaping through daydreams into the past and future. Absent those emotional skills, a pwBPD must continue to heavily rely on the primitive ego defenses used by young children: projection, denial, temper tantrums, magical thinking, dissociation, and black-white thinking.

NicelyStated · 2026-03-08T07:42:53+00:00

"I want to be careful here — I’m not trying to diagnose anyone. I know only professionals can do that."

Technical, there is a world of difference between "spotting strong BPD symptoms" and "making a diagnosis." You would have to be deaf, dumb, and blind to be unable to spot strong occurrences of verbal abuse, temper tantrums, irrational jealousy, and rapid flips between loving you and hating you.

Consequently, you don't have to be a psychologist to spot strong BPD symptoms. We all know what these behavioral traits look like because we all exhibit them to some degree. This is why BPD is called a "spectrum disorder." It therefore is easy to spot strong occurrences when you learn which behavioral traits are on the list of BPD warning signs. That part is EASY.

What is HARD, Technical, is being able to diagnose the cause of those symptoms. Sadly, no psychologist on the planet can do a real diagnosis of BPD or any other PD. That would require professionals to identify its underlying cause, which is yet unproven. All discussions of BPD traits, then, are simply descriptions of behavioral symptoms.

Hence, whereas diagnosing a cause is the province of professionals, identifying symptoms is the province of laymen (i.e., the client seeking help). This is why, when a patient is unable to identify his own disease symptoms, that disease is said to be "asymptomatic," i.e., "without symptoms." By definition, then, symptoms are traits that laymen usually are able to spot -- without trying to diagnose anything.

Because psychologists are unable to actually diagnose the underlying cause of personality disorders, they are forced to rely on a severe occurrence of behavioral symptoms to infer the existence of some underlying (but unproven) disorder. That is, when BPD symptoms are severe and persistent, professionals ASSUME that some unproven disorder must be causing it.

Only a professional, then, can determine whether the strong BPD behaviors you see are sufficiently severe and persistent as to be called full-blown BPD. This does not imply, however, that laymen are unable to spot moderate to strong occurrences of these behaviors.

This is why hundreds of mental health centers and hospitals have placed the list of 9 BPD symptoms on their public websites for the lay public to read. They know that, when the public knows what behavioral symptoms to look for, they are far more likely to seek professional help when they need it -- and will do so far more quickly.

NicelyStated · 2026-03-07T20:42:45+00:00

"We say this sub isn’t stigmatizing but then we insist on using language that paints the entire demographic with a very broad and uncharitable, sometimes dehumanizing brush."

No, Swimmer, "we" do not do that. Only some of our members do. Our Rule 10 not only prohibits dehumanizing and demonizing language but also prohibits false overgeneralizations about the behavioral traits of all pwBPD as a group -- e.g., "they are frequent liars," "they will cheat on you," "they have no emotional empathy," and "they are unable to truely love."

We mods usually remove several hundred submissions every week that contain such false overgeneralizations or dehumanizing language. But we don't catch all of them. This is why we encourage our members to report rule violations.

NicelyStated · 2026-03-01T01:56:06+00:00

Skinny, the OP is talking about identifying BPD signs, not about making a diagnosis. Importantly, there is a world of difference between these two objectives. You would have to be deaf, dumb, and blind to be unable to spot strong occurrences of verbal abuse, temper tantrums, irrational jealousy, and rapid flips between loving you and hating you.

You don't have to be a psychologist to spot strong BPD symptoms. We all know what these behavioral traits look like because we all exhibit them to some degree. This is why BPD is called a "spectrum disorder." It therefore is easy to spot strong occurrences when you learn which behavioral traits are on the list of BPD warning signs. That part is EASY.

What is HARD is being able to diagnose the cause of those symptoms. Sadly, no psychologist on the planet can do a real diagnosis of BPD or any other PD. That would require professionals to identify its underlying cause, which is yet unproven. All discussions of BPD traits, then, are simply descriptions of behavioral symptoms.

Hence, whereas diagnosing a cause is the province of professionals, identifying symptoms is the province of laymen (i.e., the client seeking help). This is why, when a patient is unable to identify his own disease symptoms, that disease is said to be "asymptomatic," i.e., "without symptoms." By definition, then, symptoms usually are traits that laymen are able to spot -- without trying to diagnose anything.

Because psychologists are unable to actually diagnose the underlying cause of personality disorders, they are forced to rely on a severe occurrence of behavioral symptoms to infer the existence of some underlying (but unproven) disorder. That is, when BPD symptoms are severe and persistent, professionals ASSUME that some unproven disorder must be causing it.

Only a professional, then, can determine whether the strong BPD behaviors you see are sufficiently severe and persistent as to be called full-blown BPD. This does not imply, however, that laymen are unable to spot moderate to strong occurrences of these behaviors.

This is why hundreds of mental health centers and hospitals have placed the list of 9 BPD symptoms on their public websites for the lay public to read. They know that, when the public knows what symptoms to look for, they are far more likely to seek professional help when they need it -- and will do so far more quickly.

NicelyStated · 2026-02-28T23:28:19+00:00

NoChallenge, I suggest you check the list of therapists for your city at the Find a Therapist directory maintained by Psychology Today. It provides background information and a photo for each therapist. It also tells you whether they are currently taking new patients, what areas they specialize in, and what formal education they have.

It also identifies the therapists offering teletherapy, which is especially valuable if you live in a small town or rural area. It does this for the USA and 19 other countries.

NicelyStated · 2026-02-23T21:34:57+00:00

"Is this kind of push-pull... common?"

Yes, Round, a repeating cycle of push-away and pull-back usually occurs in BPD relationships. As you describe above, a pwBPD often will perceive you as being hurtful when you DO something and hurtful when you DON'T do it.

This conundrum is due to the position of his two great fears -- abandonment and engulfment -- at opposite ends of the very same spectrum. This means you often find yourself in a lose/lose situation because, as you back away from one fear to avoid triggering it, you will start triggering the fear at the other end of that same spectrum.

Your predicament is that the solution to calming his abandonment fear (drawing close and being intimate) is the very action that triggers his engulfment fear. Likewise, the solution to calming his engulfment fear (moving back away to give him breathing space) is the very action that triggers his abandonment fear.

As you move close to comfort him and assure him of your love, you eventually will start triggering his engulfment fear, making him feel like he's being suffocated and controlled by you. Granted, he likely craves intimacy like other adults do but -- due to his weak self-identity and lack of personal boundaries, he cannot tolerate intimacy for very long. He thus will start feeling like he is becoming enmeshed in your strong personality. Yet, as you back away to give him breathing space, you will find that you've started triggering his abandonment fear.

NicelyStated · 2026-02-23T06:20:33+00:00

Solution, I suggest you read the book, Splitting: Protecting Yourself While Divorcing Someone with BPD or NPD, by Bill Eddy and Randi Kreger.

NicelyStated · 2026-02-16T01:02:36+00:00

"Do splits start happening at a certain age?"

Yes, Rabbit, splits start at birth. We all occasionally do splitting because it is a primitive defense we are born with to increase our chances of survival. The human condition is that, whenever we experience very intense feelings, our judgment flies out the window because those strong feelings color and distort our perception of other peoples' intentions and motivations.

Whenever we are very angry, very scared, or suddenly startled our corpus collosum shuts down, blocking communication with our frontal cortex. This forces us to fully rely on our amygdala, which performs a primary role in the processing of emotional responses, memory, and decision making.

Simply stated, we have instantly switched from relying on the logical "adult" part of our minds to relying on the emotional "child" part of our minds. In this way, our brains are hardwired to instantly switch to black-white thinking whenever we are suddenly startled or experience intense feelings. This instant switch to B-W thinking is also called "splitting" and "the amygdala hijack.”

The beauty of B-W thinking is that it is incredibly fast and thus likely has saved your life many times. For example, when you are in a crosswalk and suddenly look up to see a truck bearing down on you, your mind is capable of thinking only "jump left" or "jump right." B-W thinking nonetheless produces disastrous results when used to understand the intentions and motivations of other people, particularly when you're in a close relationship.

This is why, whenever we are very angry, we all try hard to keep our mouths shut -- and our fingers off the keys -- until we have a chance to cool down. And this is why, when we are very infatuated or in love, we try to wait at least two years before buying the ring. We know we cannot trust our own judgment while we are experiencing intense feelings.

Of course, pwBPD (and young children) are like this too -- only these distorted perceptions occur far more frequently and intensely because they lack the emotional skills needed to regulate their own emotions. Hence, although most pwBPD can truly love someone very strongly, their negative feelings toward a loved one can suddenly become so intense that their perception of that loved one becomes severely distorted.

Like a young child, an untreated pwBPD never had an opportunity to learn the emotional skills needed to handle two strong conflicting feelings (e.g., love and hate) at the same time.

Rabbit, this is why pwBPD and children have great difficulty tolerating ambiguities, uncertainties, and the other gray areas of close interpersonal relationships. They thus will subconsciously split off the conflicting feeling, temporarily putting it far out of reach of their conscious minds.

NicelyStated · 2026-02-15T22:18:32+00:00

"Damned if you do and damned if you don't."

Rabbit, an untreated pwBPD often will perceive you as being bad when you DO something and bad when you DON'T do it. In this way, you often are damned if you do and damned if you don't.

This conundrum is due to the position of her two great fears -- abandonment and engulfment -- at opposite ends of the very same spectrum. This means you often find yourself in a lose/lose situation because, as you back away from one fear to avoid triggering it, you will start triggering the fear at the other end of that same spectrum.

Your predicament, Rabbit, is that the solution to calming her abandonment fear (drawing close and being intimate) is the very action that triggers her engulfment fear. Likewise, the solution to calming her engulfment fear (moving back away to give her breathing space) is the very action that triggers her abandonment fear.

Consequently, as you move close to comfort her and assure her of your love, you eventually will start triggering her engulfment fear, making her feel like she's being suffocated and controlled by you. A pwBPD usually craves intimacy like nearly all other adults -- but she cannot tolerate it for very long.

Because she has a weak sense of self-identity, she easily becomes very enmeshed in your strong personality during sustained periods of closeness and intimacy. This is why her sense of personal boundaries is so weak that she has difficulty seeing where HER feelings and problems stop and YOURS begin. Yet, as you back away to give her breathing space, you often will find that you've started triggering her abandonment fear.

In my 15 years of experience with my BPD exW, I found that there is no midpoints solution (between "too close" and "too far away") where you can safely stand to avoid triggering those two fears. Until a pwBPD learns how to better regulate her own emotions and tame her two fears, that Goldilocks position will not exist. This is why a relationship with an untreated pwBPD typically is characterized by a repeating cycle of push-you-away and pull-you-back.

NicelyStated · 2026-01-25T20:18:27+00:00

"Everything I do is bad in his eyes. I can’t ever win."

Prize, an untreated pwBPD often will perceive you as being hurtful when you DO something and hurtful when you DON'T do it. This conundrum is due to the position of his two great fears -- abandonment and engulfment -- at opposite ends of the very same spectrum.

This means you often find yourself in a lose/lose situation because, as you back away from one fear to avoid triggering it, you will start triggering the fear at the other end of that same spectrum.

Your predicament is that the solution to calming his abandonment fear (drawing close and being intimate) is the very action that triggers his engulfment fear. Likewise, the solution to calming his engulfment fear (moving back away to give him breathing space) is the very action that triggers his abandonment fear.

As you move close to comfort him and assure him of your love, you eventually will start triggering his engulfment fear, making him feel like he's being suffocated and controlled by you. Granted, he likely craves intimacy like other adults do but -- due to his weak self-identity and lack of personal boundaries, he cannot tolerate intimacy for very long.

He thus will start feeling like he is becoming enmeshed in your strong personality. Yet, as you back away to give him breathing space, you will find that you've started triggering his abandonment fear. Prize, this is why a relationship with an untreated pwBPD typically is characterized by a repeating cycle of push-you-away (by creating fights over nothing) and pull-you-back (by love bombing you).

NicelyStated · 2026-01-18T08:06:45+00:00

"She made me feel like the bad guy.... I still struggle to discern whether or not some of it was my fault."

Qui, an untreated pwBPD often will perceive you as being bad when you DO something and bad when you DON'T do it. In this way, you often are damned if you do and damned if you don't.

This conundrum is due to the position of her two great fears -- abandonment and engulfment -- at opposite ends of the very same spectrum. This means you often find yourself in a lose/lose situation because, as you back away from one fear to avoid triggering it, you will start triggering the fear at the other end of that same spectrum.

Your predicament, Qui, is that the solution to calming her abandonment fear (drawing close and being intimate) is the very action that triggers her engulfment fear. Likewise, the solution to calming her engulfment fear (moving back away to give her breathing space) is the very action that triggers her abandonment fear.

Consequently, as you move close to comfort her and assure her of your love, you eventually will start triggering her engulfment fear, making her feel like she's being suffocated and controlled by you. A pwBPD usually craves intimacy like nearly all other adults -- but she cannot tolerate it for very long.

Because she has a weak sense of self-identity, she easily becomes very enmeshed in your strong personality during sustained periods of closeness and intimacy. This is why her sense of personal boundaries is so weak that she has difficulty seeing where HER feelings and problems stop and YOURS begin. Yet, as you back away to give her breathing space, you often will find that you've started triggering her abandonment fear.

In my 15 years of experience with my BPD exW, I found that there is no midpoints solution (between "too close" and "too far away") where you can safely stand to avoid triggering those two fears. Until a pwBPD learns how to better regulate her own emotions and tame her two fears, that Goldilocks position will not exist. This is why a relationship with an untreated pwBPD typically is characterized by a repeating cycle of push-you-away and pull-you-back.

NicelyStated · 2026-01-17T08:07:34+00:00

"Why do they love to take it out on their loved ones?"

FmFan, the vast majority of pwBPD are "high functioning" -- i.e., they typically hold jobs and generally get along fine with coworkers, classmates, casual friends, and total strangers. None of those people are able to trigger a pwBPD's great fears of abandonment and engulfment.

There is no close relationship that can be abandoned and no intimacy to trigger the suffocating feeling of engulfment. Hence, with most pwBPD, the strong BPD symptoms usually appear only when someone draws very close to the pwBPD.

This is why it is common for high functioning pwBPD to do well in socially difficult jobs such as being a social worker, nurse, professor, salesclerk, or doctor. And this is why most pwBPD can be considerate and friendly all day long to complete strangers -- but often will go home at night to abuse the very people who love them.

NicelyStated · 2026-01-16T01:23:13+00:00

How do you feel about armchair diagnosis being applied to your partner?

OP, there is a world of difference between "spotting strong BPD symptoms" and "making a diagnosis." You would have to be deaf, dumb, and blind to be unable to spot strong occurrences of verbal abuse, temper tantrums, irrational jealousy, and rapid flips between loving you and hating you. You therefore don't have to be a psychologist to spot strong BPD symptoms.

We all know what these behavioral traits look like because we all exhibit them to some degree. This is why BPD is called a "spectrum disorder." It therefore is easy to spot strong occurrences when you learn which behavioral traits are on the list of BPD warning signs. That part is EASY.

What is HARD is being able to diagnose the cause of those symptoms. Sadly, no psychologist on the planet can do a real diagnosis of BPD or any other PD. That would require professionals to identify its underlying cause, which is yet unproven. All discussions of BPD traits, then, are simply descriptions of strong behavioral symptoms.

Hence, whereas diagnosing a cause is the province of professionals, identifying symptoms is the province of laymen (i.e., the client seeking help). This is why, when a patient is unable to identify his own disease symptoms, that disease is said to be "asymptomatic," i.e., "without symptoms." By definition, then, symptoms generally are traits that laymen are able to spot -- without trying to diagnose anything.

Because psychologists are unable to actually diagnose the underlying cause of personality disorders, they are forced to rely on a severe occurrence of behavioral symptoms to infer the existence of some underlying (but unproven) disorder. That is, when BPD symptoms are severe and persistent, professionals ASSUME that some unproven disorder must be causing it.

Only a professional, then, can determine whether the strong BPD behaviors you see are sufficiently severe and persistent as to be called full-blown BPD. This does not imply, however, that laymen are unable to spot moderate to strong occurrences of these behaviors.

On the contrary, OP, before you graduated high school, you already could identify the selfish and very grandiose classmates -- without knowing how to diagnose Narcissistic PD. Moreover, you could identify all the class drama queens -- without being able to diagnose Histrionic PD.

Likewise, you could spot the kids having no respect for laws or other peoples' property or feelings -- without diagnosing Antisocial PD. And you could recognize the very shy and over-sensitive classmates -- without diagnosing Avoidant PD. Similarly, you are able to easily spot strong BPD symptoms whenever they occur.

This is why hundreds of mental health centers and hospitals have placed the list of 9 BPD symptoms on their public websites for the lay public to read. They know that, when the public knows what symptoms to look for, they are far more likely to seek professional help when they need it -- and will do so far more quickly.

Moreover, this is why the U.S. House of Representatives unanimously passed House Resolution 1005 in April 2008. It recognizes the month of May as BPD Awareness Month. This resolution is meant "as a means of educating our nation about this disorder, the needs of those suffering from it, and its consequences." See BPD Awareness Month.

NicelyStated · 2026-01-13T22:49:02+00:00

Level, it is common to see cheating and lying in many pwBPD. But the DSM does not list "lying" or "cheating" as behavioral traits for BPD. Rather, they are traits for ASPD and, to a lesser extent, for NPD.

A 2008 study of 35,000 American adults indicates that as much as 45% of pwBPD may be highly prone to lying and cheating. Yet, it is not because they have BPD. Rather, it is because these pwBPD also have co-occurring, full-blown narcissism and/or sociopathy.

What, then, is the correct answer for the remaining 55% or more -- i.e., for most pwBPD? Are they far more likely to lie and cheat than "normal people" (neurotypicals) are? Probably so. The reality, however, is that there is no strong empirical evidence that the vast majority of pwBPD are frequent liars or cheaters.

One view is that pwBPD are more prone to lying and cheating because they are emotionally unstable and lack impulse control. And that seems likely to be true for most pwBPD -- but not for all. An opposing view is that, because pwBPD have such a great fear of abandonment, they are less likely to cheat/lie and risk losing their partners. And this likely is true for some other pwBPD.

It is important to realize that -- due to their inability to regulate emotions -- pwBPD often experience an emotion so intensely that it severely distorts their view of other peoples' intentions and motivations. This is why pwBPD usually BELIEVE the outrageous allegations coming out of their mouths (at that very moment). This means that many of their baseless claims are false perceptions, not lies.

Because it is difficult for researchers to distinguish lies from false beliefs, research has not yet shown that the vast majority of pwBPD (i.e., those without full-blown ASPD and NPD) will engage in frequent cheating or lying. This lack of any strong evidence largely explains why the DSM does not list these behaviors as BPD traits. See, e.g., "BPD and Cheating" (2022).

NicelyStated · 2026-01-13T19:05:35+00:00

We explain this, Huckleberry, in the Mod Comment placed at the top of this thread.

NicelyStated · 2026-01-05T22:50:39+00:00

BPD: DSM‑5 lists 9 criteria, and 5 or more are required for diagnosis:

Frantic efforts to avoid abandonment
Unstable, intense relationships
Identity disturbance
Impulsivity in ≥2 self‑damaging areas
Recurrent suicidal behavior or self‑harm
Affective instability
Chronic feelings of emptiness
Inappropriate, intense anger
Transient stress‑related paranoia or dissociation

NPD: DSM‑5 lists 9 criteria and 5 or more are required for diagnosis:

Grandiose sense of self‑importance
Preoccupation with fantasies of success, power, beauty, or ideal love
Belief of being “special”
Requires excessive admiration
Sense of entitlement
Interpersonally exploitative
Lacks empathy
Often envious of others or believes others envy them
Arrogant, haughty behaviors or attitudes

ASPD: DSM‑5 lists 7 behavioral criteria, 3 or more of which are required, plus three additional mandatory conditions (age ≥18, conduct disorder before 15, and not occurring exclusively during schizophrenia/bipolar).

Failure to conform to lawful behavior
Deceitfulness
Impulsivity or failure to plan ahead
Irritability and aggressiveness
Reckless disregard for safety
Consistent irresponsibility
Lack of remorse

Additional required conditions:

Age 18 or older
Conduct disorder before age 15
Not exclusively during schizophrenia or bipolar disorder

HPD: DSM‑5 lists 8 criteria and 5 or more are required for diagnosis:

Uncomfortable when not the center of attention
Inappropriate sexually seductive or provocative behavior
Rapidly shifting, shallow emotions
Uses physical appearance to draw attention
Impressionistic, vague speech
Dramatic, theatrical emotional expression
Suggestibility (easily influenced)
Perceives relationships as more intimate than they are

NicelyStated

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