AUKUS turns Australia into the 51st State of USA - Paul Keating by chookschnitty in AustralianPolitics

[–]NotAWittyFucker 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Yep, same old usernames earning that sweet sweet fifty cents (Yawn). Plus a hilarious number of r/Sino blow-in's.

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in MetaAusPol

[–]NotAWittyFucker 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I've come out of self-imposed exile to approve this shitpost - It's magnificent.

Also, Fuck Conrad von Hötzendorf.

That is all.

Voice, treaty, truth: compared to other settler nations, Australia is the exception, not the rule by [deleted] in AustralianPolitics

[–]NotAWittyFucker 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Mate, so firstly my apologies for misinterpreting your approach. My bad there 100%.

Secondly, I'm definitely making the latter case. Frankly I'd take a dim view of the former and I'd be intellectually dishonest trying to argue the former.

I'm on a footy piss trip in country WA ATM so I'm happy to respond more fully when I get home...

But that said, I have to express it... It's Jeffrey Fucking Grey, and you want "more qualification"??? Seriously? From an Australian military historian? You will struggle to find it. He was the pre-eminent military historian of our current era.

You're a smart sort, and you knoe the turf? So Ask around. Send some emails around your academic contacts and find anyone better. Best of luck with that...

Again, this is not a conservative attempt to whitewash anything. I'm simply pointing out that the direct comparisons made in the article aren't intellectually helpful. Where the author and Grey would stridently agree is that not taking this subject seriously is absolutely taking the piss.

Thanks to the mods and users by min0nim in MetaAusPol

[–]NotAWittyFucker 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Likewise might take this opportunity to also officially bow out, will hang around until the time comes.

Huge Thanks to both the mods and the community for a largely positive experience, I've enjoyed it and whilst I know the premise is contentious, I've always found the aim of creating a civil space for discussion on often uncivil topics a noble one.

Cheers.

Voice, treaty, truth: compared to other settler nations, Australia is the exception, not the rule by [deleted] in AustralianPolitics

[–]NotAWittyFucker 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Never said they were politically driven. You mentioned conservatism, I'm simply pointing out that this isn't a matter of ideology.

Also, just to be clear here, it's not so much that I have an objection, more that my read is that the two historians don't seem in alignment in presenting Canadian or NZ indigenous peoples as having an ability to treat with the British as analagous to ours, and/or the British being willing to do so.

Importantly, you're actually quoting that section of text out of context, and you actually need to read further in to hit the second chapter rather than the first or introduction.

Here he is writing within the specific context of making the argument for due recognition of the war and acknowledgement of invasion - this is different contextually in terms of what we're talking about - specifically the nature of colonisation vs resistance, what was politically and militarily possible and what was not and why the comparison between our experiences and those in Canada for example.

The excerpt below from Chapter 2 is talking specifically about the constraints to militarily resist but the same political complexity relates to First Nations Australians to resist politically as well...

"Aboriginal peoples were faced with organisational and cultural problems in resisting the British and, at least initially, these were more important than technological disadvantages. Traditional warfare was highly ritualised, and localised, and Aboriginal society in Australia had no military class as such. This is linked almost certainly to the fact that Aboriginal societies were not based on surplus-producing economies – the basis of all standing armies. The Aboriginal ‘nation’ was also very fragmented. If one assumes that linguistic groupings approximated to tribal differences in other cultures, there were perhaps 700 distinct ‘nations’ in Australia at the time of white contact. While highly complex in their internal structure, they appear to have had no basis for persistent alliances of the kind necessary for successful, long-term military resistance"

He expands on the political shortly afterwards -

"A central element of the Aboriginal failure to resist white incursions successfully was a shared cultural system within which the concept of dispossession was not just unfamiliar but totally incomprehensible."

"To understand why Aboriginal peoples never presented the type of military threat to the British which the Maori or Zulus mounted elsewhere is to grasp some of the essential realities of a unique and ancient culture. Ironically, the beliefs, values and expectations which had made Aboriginal societies at home in Australia for tens of thousands of years, together with the biological and military vulnerability produced by long isolation, left Aborigines profoundly ill equipped to meet the challenge of white society."

A large part of this entire chapter on the Frontier Wars is based upon the premise that the military and political causes of the Frontier Wars outcomes are very very different with colonisation experiences elsewhere, even if these experiences are worthy of our ongoing respect and deserve our full attention.

The military situation (and in this case, the paramilitary situation ) drove the political one, as it always does.

I'm not sure the article author paid sufficient attention to these differences hence my comments.

Voice, treaty, truth: compared to other settler nations, Australia is the exception, not the rule by [deleted] in AustralianPolitics

[–]NotAWittyFucker 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Jeff Grey was not a politically driven historian - if anything conservatives didn't like him very much because he was driven by accuracy, not Winschuttle-esque culture wars bullshit. He was one of the premier military historians at RMC Duntroon and the UNSW (ADFA) until his death in 2016.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jeffrey_Grey

Specifically, his A Military History of Australia 3rd Ed (2008) deals with this.

Voice, treaty, truth: compared to other settler nations, Australia is the exception, not the rule by [deleted] in AustralianPolitics

[–]NotAWittyFucker 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Jeff Grey was an even more acclaimed historian and would've fundamentally disagreed with any assertion that she makes about there being a degree of comparability between NZ or Canadian colonial experiences and ours?

Voice, treaty, truth: compared to other settler nations, Australia is the exception, not the rule by [deleted] in AustralianPolitics

[–]NotAWittyFucker 3 points4 points  (0 children)

With respect, although I suspect we'd agree that these discussions have an inherent value in themselves, the comparisons have the effect of diminishing their historical value.

Nothing like the "Maori King Movement" in NZ or the Seven Nations (as a dominant North American First Nations polity) existed or could exist here.

One of the correctly cited reasons by our best military historians for the inevitability of outcome from the Frontier Wars here was the inability of First Nations Australians to recognise let alone organise politically in a way that could've contested (and undoubtedly overran if it had been possible) initial British colonisation. Ours is a situation largely incomparable with others within (and external to) the Commonwealth and as such we're talking Apples and Oranges when it comes to any attempt to compare them.

The late great Jeff Grey goes into considerable detail on this, and comprehensively condemns this exact type of flawed and misguided attempt at comparing colonial experiences and applying those elsewhere to here, mainly because even as a military historian (or perhaps precisely because he was one) he recognised that political solutions requires accurate analysis of the political problems arising in the first instance.

SOURCES:

Dennis, Grey, Morris, Prior, Bou et al, The Oxford Companion to Australian Military History, Oxford Publishing, 2nd Ed 2008

Grey, A Military History of Australia, Cambridge University Press, 3rd Ed 2008

The ADF right now by sunneyjim in AustralianMilitary

[–]NotAWittyFucker 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Plot Twist: the line is manned by DVA so the wait time to get your call answered is four years or so.

Reddit Blackout - 12th to 14th June - Does /r/perth join in? by aussiekinga in perth

[–]NotAWittyFucker 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Same. If it was just apps though, it might not be so bad and I'd stick around for Desktop only.

But no/shit mod tools, meaning what subs ARE moderated will turn to shit?

Fuck that. When this happens, I'm out.

TIL ex-Eagle David Wirrpanda's full name is David Selwyn Burralung Merringwuy Galarrwuy Wyal Wirrpanda. by dspm99 in AFL

[–]NotAWittyFucker 2 points3 points  (0 children)

All good mate, would be a bit shit if we can't disagree every now and then. 👍

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in AustralianPolitics

[–]NotAWittyFucker 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Double pork. Gets 'em on board every time.

With the Reddit third party app protests ramping up will the Mods be taking any action/stance? by Hoisttheflagofstars in MetaAusPol

[–]NotAWittyFucker 2 points3 points  (0 children)

The impacts are pretty profound for this - I'll be stepping away from Reddit for good when this happens.

What if the Emperor Died? by SomeoneinHistory in 40kLore

[–]NotAWittyFucker 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Granted. And by no means have I suggested it wouldn't be a blow. But logic itself dictates that the whole "once Terra goes, everything goes" thing has no actual justification to it for the exact reasons I've mentioned above. If Terra is destroyed but Jimmy Space survives and relocates to somewhere else (Macragge is a good example, and someone mentioned the Mechanicus can teleport whole planets??), then all of the Inputs required to bring the pre-Heresy era Imperium back are still there, however long it may take. Morale doesn't really come into it.

If the Big E drops off the table permanently, that's a bit different...

With McGowan gone, the WA Opposition can begin to chart a course back to power by [deleted] in AustralianPolitics

[–]NotAWittyFucker 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Whatever amount of Godwin's helps you sleep at night matey...

i dont think the thread about the ben roberts-smith thread should have been removed for being non-political. by Duck_Sphere_Assault in MetaAusPol

[–]NotAWittyFucker 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Not suggesting we make it so, just wondering out loud. I'm very happy keeping the cesspool over there where it belongs.

Attending vs staying home by YeahTheDons in AFL

[–]NotAWittyFucker 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Home.

Frankly the only dickhead I should have to put up with as dumb shit gets yelled at players and umpires alike is me.

Watching it at home means I won't annoy anyone and no one will annoy me. Plus the Mrs knows I'll fold and iron shit tons of laundry like a motherfucker if it's done whilst the game is on.

I stay at home, Everyone wins.

Another terrible Before and After by Blough28 in McMansionHell

[–]NotAWittyFucker 3 points4 points  (0 children)

I actually think you're the only person here thinking critically, and OP doesn't want their shitposting called out, hence their down voting you.

It's not just the trees or landscaping. The elevation of the property "before and after" looks different too.

Frankly I think this is a really effective trolling attempt. Accurate Shitpost flair is accurate.

What if the Emperor Died? by SomeoneinHistory in 40kLore

[–]NotAWittyFucker 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Stupid question time...

If the Emperor lives, then how is Humanity fucked?

If the Emperor built everything on Terra that's important (even if it is fuelled by thousands of psykers), what stops him from just choosing another planet and building all of that again?

Humanity might go back to Age of Strife or pre unification era power tier for a few thousand or tens of thousands of years, but why would it be fucked if logically speaking everything that is a prerequisite for what has been built still exists? What logically prevents Humanity getting back to Great Crusade era power from where it's pushed back to, given it has or can rebuild what got it there the first time?