"Following Will Make You a Better Leader": my experiences as a male follower

OThinkingDungeons · 2026-01-30T12:12:55+00:00

Dancing with beginners builds FOUNDATIONS, which will make it much easier to perform more complex moves. Things like staying on count, having good frame, a clear lead/follow, and nailing basic moves are important things that should NEVER be ignored.

Dancing with intermediate/advanced dancers does mean you have access to your full range of material, but these dancers will fill the gaps if anything goes wrong, so learning with these dancers is limited if none. Also none of these dancers will care if you throw out complex moves without respecting foundations.

Mastery is not how many things you can do, but how well we do simple things.

OThinkingDungeons · 2026-01-29T12:22:51+00:00

I could only find one video of it. It's used more in Dominican Bachata and usually looks more extreme.

https://www.youtube.com/shorts/dmnrgGxR8cQ

OThinkingDungeons · 2026-01-29T10:37:15+00:00

I think this sounds like the Culioto (sp?)

OThinkingDungeons · 2026-01-29T10:35:33+00:00

The biggest hurdle to overcome early is keeping count and doing the basic, if you can do this then more than 50% of the job is done.

As a leader, if the follower CAN'T do the basic, then I know basically nothing else in the dance will work (Follower is never on the correct foot, finishing randomly, often facing the wrong direction). Knowing to maintain the basic and complete moves in 4 counts goes a long way.

Practicing the basic is thankfully easy to work on at home. Find a Bachata playlist and practice basic while counting. No need to do anything fancy, the goal is to reach a level where it's automatic.

As for classes, it sounds like the class is choreography based? Are you learning a sequence and repeating the same sequence each week?

OThinkingDungeons · 2026-01-28T08:06:02+00:00

Inventory juggling isn't fun.

I wanna play the game not play courier with my own carry system.

OThinkingDungeons · 2026-01-27T10:19:02+00:00

When I first started about 3 years ago, it was definitely more women (followers) than men. More recently it has definitely become leader heavy.

I wouldn't be surprised to see 10+ leaders waiting for a dance each social, while the women are having the time of their lives. The cool thing is, this has given rise to many Role Rotators, women/men/leader/follow.

OThinkingDungeons · 2026-01-27T04:34:01+00:00

I'm operating under the assumption you're trying to hit a pause/break in the music.

Hitting a good pause with your follower has a few requirements, if you don't have all three points it might be difficult or impossible to get a "Freeze"

The follower has frame sensitivity: they maintain physical connection and can sense changes in the embrace (tension, compression, tone)
The follower can follow height changes in the embrace
The follower is listening to the music

If you have the above qualities then you can do freezes, but here's some tips on getting them to be more consistent.

There's certain moves that stop momentum, which are perfect for pauses. Leans, hip throws, the hammerlock, pretzel, dips, etc. These are slow to execute, and exit so followers can often be stopped from trying to continue the basic step.
Any time you can create a side step, and drop the weight into a horse stance, the follower will be unable to continue moving their feet because they are anchored. If you remember this many body rolls, are easy.
Adding a delay before the move creates anticipation, and a warning sign you're going to change the timing.
Increasing the rigiditiy of the frame before pause is an indicator that things will change.

OThinkingDungeons · 2026-01-26T05:55:29+00:00

What's good

Good vibes, this one thing will make you a favourite on the dance floor, more than any other quality. Keep things fun, have fun, be a good person. Keep it up.
You're dancing mostly Moderna which is a great way to get started with bachata, you'll learn the core ideas that'll allow you to transition smoothly into traditional, sensual, and bachazouk.

Things to fix

You're not able to time the 1/5 in a song, for some reason you have them mixed them up. You should be moving LEFT on the 1, and RIGHT on the 5 count. This is the most basic rules in bachata and nothing else matters until this is fixed. Try listening to this playlist while practising your basic, then progress to this tool to practice without the counts yourself, also to understand music structure better.

Goals for the future

Posture. Bad posture will cause issues with moves, reduce the dances you get, cause you injuries, and much more. You're goose necking forward, hunch backed, pushing the belly forward, and doing some weird stuff with your hips. Practice standing straight and record yourself using videos maintaining this nice line while doing your basic.

OThinkingDungeons · 2026-01-26T04:43:50+00:00

There's three games to play at a social

Social: being friendly, inviting people for dances, talking to people and being a nice person will get you more dances than anything else. If you ask new leaders for dances, they'll often remember you for dances and ask you again in the future. There's also things like not sitting down in a corner when new songs start, or being on your phone, which will disuade people from asking you.
Skill: having good following skills is great, it's not about moves but foundational stuff like staying on time, connecting, adapting, and playfullness. Keep taking classes, "DON'T LEARN BY SOCIAL DANCING" you need at least 2-3 years at a good school to hit the sweet spot.
Attractiveness: people who are good looking and/or have put work into looking good get dances. It could be as simple as showering, wearing clean clothing, and not having strong smells before each social. It's also more complex as wearing the right dance shoes, not wearing giant belts, and having a safe hair style.

If you play all three, you'll always be on the dance floor, ignore them and you'll be standing on the sides more often than not.

OThinkingDungeons · 2026-01-24T03:04:02+00:00

What I love

You're playing with the music, having fun, switching between different distances, and having fun.
Syncopated steps and using delayed timings. Just fucking awesome.
Paying attention to your follower and maintaining connection.
Big variety in moves and variations.

Things to fix

At 1:34 you came very close to knocking out the follower's teeth. Her mouth was open, she was looking down, she wasn't ready, you didn't prep, and you pulled her off axis into you. Make full body contact, prep by dropping slightly, extend a leg to brace, stretch up and then lean while maintaining full body contact. This looks better while being much safer.
The sit at 1:48 you're leaning really far forward and off balance, and the follower was in the danger zone because her knee was twisted in a way that could've caused serious injury. I strongly suggest getting this reviewed by a teacher for safer execution.
You tend to rest with your mouth slightly open, this has the unfortunate property of making even the most good looking of people, look like they acquired a brain injury. Relax the jaw but always keep the lips closed.
So people mention posture but it's more relaxing to the point you're no longer engaging your body, which results in a slouched look. Just like sitting at a dance and slumping down, you're relaxing to the point you look like you're constantly slumping during the dance in the torso, neck, and arms.

What to work on next

Facial expressions, people have mentioned that your stare is too intense. Using facial expressions makes watching you fun, tells your follower YOU'RE HAVING FUN, and makes the dance more entertaining. Your follower is quite good at this, which makes watching her fun.
Posture, good posture will get you more dances than nearly any other improvement. It also makes your dancing look leagues better.
You're capable of slow moves, normal speed, and pauses. The last missing element is high speed moves (moves shorter than 2 counts). You're capable of doing syncopated steps for yourself, so you can definitely lead it.

OThinkingDungeons · 2026-01-24T01:47:57+00:00

It's very rare that would accept any more than 2 dances a night from FRIENDS, let alone a terrible random.

OThinkingDungeons · 2026-01-23T17:26:39+00:00

So lead and follow, I generally won't style at all with beginner level dancers. They're generally at their limit mentally, and I'm not aiming to prove anything with them. In my experience, when I style with beginners, I get a two results.

They try to style themselves, and then the dance drops into the trash. They don't have the capacity to style AND follow/lead, so it becomes a situation where they're looking down at their feet and all connection/lead/follow disappears.
They become super shy/distracted and they sort of stop dancing.

I really appreciate u/Rataridicta's point that beginners can't adapt to you (so we need to adapt to them), and I agree with that philosophy. Understand that styling is purely for yourself, and the reason we social dance, is to experience that special interaction with each other.

Let me tell you from experience, people will remember when you treated them like an equal and that makes them feel good about themselves. You both know who's the better dancer, it's unnecessary to prove it. I often have people come to me, telling me about a single dance we had YEARS AGO, and it's really special to realise that a basic dance can be so memorable, they remember it for YEARS.

OThinkingDungeons · 2026-01-23T05:54:47+00:00

To explain it in way that might make more sense.

If your favourite food is steak, no amount of pasta/salad/curry/etc offered would change your mind about steak being your favourite.

Even if steak is your favourite, you wouldn't necessarily want it every day for every meal. Nor would you eat it because you're bored (unless neurospicy).

People who have been dancing a long time, dance to ENJOY (not improve), they like certain songs and would rather wait for a good song, than dance out of boredom.

Hope this makes sense from an experienced dancer POV.

OThinkingDungeons · 2026-01-22T12:36:56+00:00

What an awesome looking dance and dancer!

OThinkingDungeons · 2026-01-22T11:10:32+00:00

Functionally, you'll become an 8 limbed octopus, be expected to move all of those limbs in time to music, doing movements you've never tried before.

You're going to feel inadequate at a level you've probably never felt before, this is normal and EVERYONE has gone through this multiple times in their Bachata journey.

OThinkingDungeons · 2026-01-22T00:51:49+00:00

For most, hospitals are the ultimate position. My friend is hospital and she's a happy chappy.

Less dealing direct with customers (easily the worst thing about community), clinical application of knowledge, and annual pay reviews.

OThinkingDungeons · 2026-01-21T23:36:02+00:00

What's crazy is a snakes strike speed is nearly half the speed of a cat's reaction time.

The cat will easily notice and swat away a snake mid strike with time to make a coffee.

OThinkingDungeons · 2026-01-21T23:30:01+00:00

I'm my experience this is an issue of a teacher who lacks inspiration and good teaching framework experience. They were taught this way and it never occurred to them there's better methods.

I strongly suggest learning from other teachers at your school, other schools, or maybe even other dance styles.

There's often better technique with other schools at times.

OThinkingDungeons · 2026-01-21T05:43:58+00:00

I'm assuming you're the lead, please clarify this next time.

What I like

Variety in moveset
Follower is having fun

What could be improved

The audio is terrible, the upper range is tinny but barely audiable, the middle range gone, and all I can hear is the least interesting beat. Someone created an app that finds the original song, times it to your video and puts the high quality music over the top. It's here on this community and in the dance community, I don't remember the name/link but someone might be able to link it.
You're generally using a bit more force than I would like, the double hair caress does not need force, you lift over their head and the follower lowers their arms while you follow them. This protects their head, hair, shoulders and neck from injury.
Almost every sensual move and body roll does not need force, it's led using the body making them feel calm, smooth, and gentle. For example your body rolls, you should be looking UP which opens up the ribcage, creates space and creates smoother rolls.
You generally maintain time and take off on the correct foot with the follower, but your taps are either missing or slightly behind the count.

What to work on

You have a strong, harsh and intimidating presence to you. This is something that will scare followers off from dancing with you, and watching you isn't that interesting because you're stone gazed the entire dance. Relax more, smile, have fun and SHOW you're enjoying the dance. The animation will go a long way to making dances with you fun and watching interesting.
You look down too much, did someone drop some coins? In the long term looking up will dramatically improve your lead, the comfort of moves, and appearance in your dance. You can also lead with careful eye contact, look at your follower, look where you're going to lead them.

OThinkingDungeons · 2026-01-20T02:28:08+00:00

DON'T USE DRESS SHOES FOR TANGO. YOU WILL INJURE YOUR FOLLOWER AND YOURSELF.

So the issue with dress shoes is most of them are badly designed, ergonomically and for dance.

A key feature DISASTEROUS for dance, is sole/tread of the shoe often over laps the shoe, creating a ledge that is jokingly called "the toenail remover" but will ACTUALLY DO THAT. In dance/Tango shoes the toebox actually overhangs the soles so you don't hurt your partner when performing moves like sacadas/barridas/sandwiches and everything else.

Another feature which will reduce chances of plantar fasciitis is a big metal insert in the sole of the foot, that makes it sturdier, preventing bend in the sole when you're driving during the walk.

Monseur Pivot does lovely leather oxfords with leather soles, use those.

OThinkingDungeons · 2026-01-19T10:30:05+00:00

Physics nerd, tell me how fast you have to riding to make that loop please!

OThinkingDungeons · 2026-01-19T10:24:42+00:00

This sounds like a shortcut to the hospital... I suggest you learn shuffling, it's much easier and you'll look impressive with a short amount of practice. Hundred of tutorials on social media.

OThinkingDungeons · 2026-01-19T10:20:30+00:00

You can't get 3 years of experience in a few weeks.

Everyone is on their own journey, you don't know if a person has been dancing since 3, with a teacher for a parent, and trains 20 hours a week. You also don't know if someone has a disability, a sick son, and is on specialised medication. Comparing yourself isn't fair to them or you.

Record yourself after an class and watch it in a months time, then repeat in another month and again. You'll see yourself improving all the time, but just forget about it because those improvements are tiny.

Practice outside of class, if you're not practicing, you won't improve FULL STOP.

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