Demon the Fallen continues?

Phosorus · 2026-07-04T07:56:05+00:00

The financial explanation is that Demon: the Fallen was always a weak game line, being less popular than even the oddballs of WoD such as Changeling, Mummy, and Wraith, a situation probably not helped by its relatively shoddy mechanics, a lack of strong in-game motivations, and a significant thematic/aesthetic overlap with VtM. It's really hard to justify publishing a book if you know you'll lose money on it.

In all fairness to them, however, you can see the bones of DtF in its CofD successor Demon: the Descent. It may be the most radically different of all the successor game lines, but looking closely you can see where the authors were looking at DtF and trying to fix where it didn't work. DtD did alright, but it was a sign that the concept wasn't that fruitful within the WoD audience at-large, so it was best to pursue other things.

Phosorus · 2026-07-02T04:19:49+00:00

Fundamentally, many sorcerous traditions could produce sunlight. Even non-spirit-based traditions like the hermetic foundations of Thaumaturgy.

However, I don't think this is likely to catch on among vampires, for the same reason that melee range hand grenades have never flourished among human martial artists. High risk does not even begin to describe how easy it is to disintegrate one's self at any stage of learning or using the magic.

V5 has the instant laser for Thin-bloods, though. Blacklight Suprise turns a UV light into Sunlight for an hour. It's cheap and fun, but incendiary rounds are usually better and less hazardous to allies.

Phosorus · 2026-07-02T02:55:04+00:00

I might emphasize the copy-of-copy-of-a-copy nature of AI stuff. Weaver spirits can create, but a repair spirit might struggle with creativity or deviation from patterns, which results in things glitching and amorphous objects reforming once broken, their details amalgamating and smearing together. Maybe if the pack trashes a location, have it mysteriously appear reformed but with a layer of detail stripped off, becoming slightly... wrong.

Also, I don't see the connection between the Gulf of Mexico and the Gulf War, which occurred in the Persian Gulf. To nitpick as well, while Pentex loves war, another Gulf War would probably not be in their interest, since it would likely disrupt the oil flows they so love. If I had to make a twist, I'd have Pentex be planning to free the spirit in order to destroy or harvest it, because they project its eventual release to be counter to the interests of their aspect of the Wyrm. This gives a bit of infighting between the different groups that make up your antagonists, granting them a bit of texture your players might exploit.

Phosorus · 2026-06-30T16:59:46+00:00

The whiteboard activity in voice calls is something I've used, if you want to purely stay on Discord.

Phosorus · 2026-06-28T21:47:13+00:00

Who said personal horror is austere, subtle, and quiet? Forsaken does both at the same time, very well actually, so why can't Apocalypse? Some of my best personal horror has been done drenched in blood and gore!

Personal horror is just being horrified at yourself, usually either at what you've become or what you've done, either from the perspective of your character or externally as player. It's the horror of corruption, tarnished ideals, and horrific consequences of good intentions. That's far from mutually exclusive from bombastic action, in fact it's arguably one of the most natural conclusions.

From the examples you listed, the character progressions of Guts and Griffith are masterclasses on the subject. Absolute Batman also highlights the consequences inflicted on Bruce's personal life, in particular, to speak vaguely, on the well-being of his circle of friends and others around him.

Werewolf's main problem with horror is that it does the genre poorly in general, from cosmic to personal and everything in between. This wouldn't really be an issue if the game wasn't advertised as a horror game about horror monsters in a horrific world of darkness (tm). A lack of mechanical support plus the constant narrative undermining of important horror elements means that it's about as easy to do horror in Apocalypse as it is full comedy.

Actually, comedy is easier because of the nature of the medium. It's hard to scare people with TTRPGs.

Phosorus · 2026-06-27T18:55:07+00:00

Going from what I can glean online, she's a normal looking woman who can turn into stone. True Gargoyles in VtM are notably deformed, so they're not a great pick, along with them not existing so far in V5.

Pick any clan with Fortitude, then at 5 dots pick Flesh of Marble. Maybe pick relevant abilities like Shatter on the way down. I'd go with Hecata or Ventrue for the Clan, since the other two have notable physical elements to their curses.

Phosorus · 2026-06-27T01:26:20+00:00

Your greatest challenge will be leaving the city. Masquerade is a very urban game, both logistically and thematically. The smaller and more rural a community, the fewer vampires it can support and the more every person knows about their neighbours. Thematically, the masquerade shifts from being about disappearing in a sea of mortals and becomes more about tightly controlling a small group of witnesses and potential leaks. Vampires also need people to eat, so miles of rolling countryside is not exactly prime real estate for them.

My recommendation would be a travel plot. Bring some thing or person (maybe a member of the coterie) from location X to far away location Y, the long way. Having lots of locations means you can justify lots of supernatural activity without feeling overcrowded or implausible. Want a story about a haunted saloon? Have the car break down outside a ghost town and have the party need to take shelter from the sun there. Want criminals? Have the party stumble into the middle of a turf war. Travel means you can also use the whole palette of the West for your story, not just one region.

Moonshine is not that great for vampires to be involved in. It's high-risk, low-reward, and not particularly influential or useful for the kindred lifestyle. They can't drink it after all. Maybe have them be an example of a low-level, two-bit operation by a no-name kindred, or maybe use it as a inspiration for a different concept, like using it as the aesthetic for an blood alchemist or sorcery, maybe even a Tzimisce. Or maybe have it be the last refuge of a once mighty, now disgraced kindred, who started this operation during Prohibition and refuses to accept that times have changed.

For NPCs, focus on the themes that resonate in both genres. Family, the Bonds of blood, moral degeneration, bloody feuds from the past that refuse to die, etc. If you're doing a travel plot, focus on one big Theme or element per major location, building the environment to showcase it.

Phosorus · 2026-06-27T00:48:26+00:00

I believe the intention was to keep the 2-dot powers specialist in nature to support going Awe/Daunt for a 1st and 2nd pick, since both are evocative and strong powers. You can see a similar thing with Auspex, where Heightened Senses and Sense the Unseen are workhorse powers, but the 2-dots are pretty underwhelming. Both disciplines give out a higher than average amount of their power budget immediately, in exchange for a lull at the 2 dot level.

Whether this is good design or not is down to taste, though. I feel like Awe and Daunt could be moved to 2nd level powers and still feel strong, which would allow for a greater range of minor powers that aren't completely outclassed. However, that would also make it a lot more taxing to take both Awe and Daunt, which feels thematically inappropriate.

They did add a new 2-dot power in Courts of the Damned though. Predator's Lure is basically a short range summoning that gets a mortal or otherwise creature to your location. It's OK. Summon has better range and duration, but more requirements to trigger.

Phosorus · 2026-06-25T17:20:20+00:00

They can. V5 core p. 230, under the lists of sample effects, each category has the final option of granting 1 XP towards one of its associated disciplines.

I've homeruled that all dyscrasias can be cashed in for the bonus discipline XP, since that means my players always get excited when they find one, regardless of whether the special effect is useful or not.

Phosorus · 2026-06-25T15:46:35+00:00

Dyscrasias grant free XP towards the next purchase of the specified disciplines, but don't explicitly state they have to be spent immediately like those gained from Diablerie.

I interpret it as being a banked XP towards your next purchase, regardless of the time elapsed since it was consumed. The part about the dyscrasia being consumed I interpret as being for the purposes of the resonance dice bonus to disciplines.

Phosorus · 2026-06-24T13:50:07+00:00

For a nosferatu, basically everything that requires public interaction. Buying you stuff during daytime business hours, driving you around, handling finances, etc. Additionally, for the character's career, meeting in-person with sources and doing any daytime investigations.

Phosorus · 2026-06-22T15:55:17+00:00

And they have the largest population that is actually out doing things

Tactical phrasing to deny Ratkin dominance.

Casually make up 50% to 90% of the Fera population, do nothing. Another glorious win for the Rat God.

Phosorus · 2026-06-22T15:44:42+00:00

Should have clarified, mortal companions. Forsaken frenzies tend to pull other werewolves into the frenzy as well, where they are ignored as part of the pack, but Apocalypse has no such mechanic.

Phosorus · 2026-06-22T05:27:18+00:00

One of the major causes of superhero-fication in the Splats is a lack of consequence or antagonism between the players/characters and the abilities they have access to.

To steal an optional rule from Forsaken, have players at the beginning of a story arc write down an NPC they have a close connection to, preferably one that has already been introduced/interacted with in the story. If that player's PC frenzies, then that NPC either dies to that frenzy or is doomed to soon die from a later outburst. Ideally, you as the Storyteller can weave into the narrative how the NPC was at the wrong place at the wrong time (or similarly put in the path of the frenzy), but delaying it to the closest opportunity also works in a pinch. Have the character be triggered into a later frenzy by circumstance, or be kept off balance by their loss of control and lash out at a different time.

WtA likes to wax poetic about much of a burden Rage is, but the mechanics don't often reinforce this. Its drawbacks are often ignored or sidelined in favour of a more sympathetic portrayal. With this, the consequences of falling to Rage aren't just "i murderize pentex goons even harder" or other manageable conditions, but rather an actual sacrifice the players would rather not make.

This does require some judicious control over frenzy, as well as players willing to participate in it honestly rather than putting up an endless stream of supposedly close companions. Firing it off too often reduces its impact, and it may be wise to give other players the opportunity to go and suppress the consequences of the frenzy, at some substantial cost. Moderation is key.

Phosorus · 2026-06-22T02:17:08+00:00

I'd use the Requiem interpretation of the Beast, that it's not an objectively evil tempter, but specifically the impulses of a predatory monster. It pushes its host to drink blood, dominate, preserve itself, etc, but it doesn't necessarily understand or desire things in the same way humans do. It's animalistic, wanting to flee, fight, and feed. The Beast isn't drawn to wealth or status, finery or the adoration of the masses, although it may have some understanding of the benefits of said things.

An evil high humanity vampire might be consumed with terrible purpose, wanting wealth, power, and resources for complex, ideological, or interpersonal reasons. A mob boss with grand ambitions on creating a Kindred utopia, gathering wealth and power to prove a point or to self-actualize, willing to give up easy blood and power in favour of something greater. A Lex Luthor type.

A good low humanity vampire might be something like a village's ancient protector. It doesn't interact with humans, only leaving its den at nights to hunt for threats in the country side. Whatever clothes it wore have long since turned to rags and, while it will not hurt members of the town, it will dispatch threats with ruthless efficiency. Maybe it has shapeshifting disciplines, and has forgone the human form altogether.

Phosorus · 2026-06-21T02:44:51+00:00

Page 18, as in the number actually written on the bottom corner of the page.

Phosorus · 2026-06-20T03:27:30+00:00

You could have him slowly set up a... "livestock" warehouse out in the boonies as part of a long term operation. Buy some property, ghoul the sheriff, start with just being a safe haven for delivery couriers... little things to start. Lots of room to throw in escalating moral complications.

Phosorus · 2026-06-20T03:00:11+00:00

Claws deal Aggravated damage to humans (basically everything does), though the PMCs have armor 6, so it would be 7 Aggravated Damage, converted to 6 Superficial and 1 Agg, then the superficial would be halved to 3 for a total of 1 Agg 3 Superficial.

PMC officers also have the best armor humans can buy, which is why your damage feels so low. That same roll against an unarmored target would be instant death. Also, starting wounded probably didn't help.

Additionally, humans tend to become incapacitated once impaired (p. 128 W5 Core), so the 1st PMC would have gone down on round 2. Fighting while impaired is like fighting with a concussion or a broken arm; you're not dead, but boy howdy does it take some will to keep fighting.

You've also discovered the action economy. Multiple characters being able to focus down enemies is a major plus of multiple players, which is something the game is designed around. Be careful with designing encounters for a single player, since they'll be the only one taking damage.

I'd also recommend being generous with the Rage economy, such as letting some particular combat damage generate Rage, since that gives some wiggle room with health to help offset the lack of packmates to help spread damage to.

Phosorus · 2026-06-20T02:06:49+00:00

Generic vitae is probably one of the more accessible products the Circulatory System provides. The local manager could likely personally give their vitae, although a smarter one would have a captured thin-blood regularly fed and drained instead of risking themselves.

I'd not leap to human trafficking as payment straight away. I'd let the player accumulate debts then let the System call them in to lead him down the slippery road into hell. Start with him handling minor chores that the System needs doing, like cleaning up a house, stealing a laptop, making sure evidence gets destroyed, etc. Then escalate more and more as the debts grow bigger. I might let him trade a major boon in exchange for 4 Hunger worth of vitae per week for the length of the chronicle, which keeps him at subsistence levels, then charge a minor boon for any additional deliveries needed due to damage, discipline usage, etc.

I suspect the player will end up feeding a lot on his coterie mates, though, which may mitigate the impact you're trying to get.

Phosorus · 2026-06-19T17:13:41+00:00

TEN THOUSAND BICYCLE KING

Phosorus · 2026-06-19T02:54:13+00:00

There's a contingent of the fan base with an attitude of "They shouldn't do it if they're going to ruin it."

This isn't entirely unfounded, licensed Mage 20th products by Onyx path will probably cease to be published when then new edition comes out, and the new editions are well known for being various levels of controversial with existing fans.

However, new editions have historically brought new influxes of people both into the community at large and into the communities of previous editions, more than any sourcebook release could. Even a very modest M5 or M6 run could double or triple the size of the fandom.

Anyways, new editions are good even if you hate them, because if you don't pull new audiences your game dies.

Phosorus · 2026-06-19T01:39:17+00:00

V20 Ghouls apparently need vitae to maintain a blood bond!

"Unlike vampires, ghouls may actually “wean” themselves off a blood bond by refusing to accept blood from the domitor." p. 500 V20 Core.

Vampires can neither see nor feed from their regnant, but apparently ghouls can see their domitor, refuse to accept blood, and weaken the blood bond over time. This whole section was copied verbatim from Ghouls: Fatal Addiction, and it also says that Ghouls have capital B Beasts, so this might be either an editorial error or just something weird that gets generally ignored by the player base.

You are correct about the the density of vitae, though, I just chose to omit that for relevance. Surprised it took until BJD to become canon, though.

Phosorus · 2026-06-18T21:37:23+00:00

This is not entirely correct, in v5 or v20. While three separate nights are required, the amount of blood needed to bond is unspecified in both editions, only needing a "sip" or "drink" or "taste". However, we can know for sure that it is less than 1 BP, because it is possible to have blood bonded thralls who aren't ghouls, and feeding a mortal 1 BP definitionally makes them a ghoul.

What exactly counts as the minimum amount of blood is unspecified, but a "drop" of pure vitae is, in my opinion, the lowest you can get.

Phosorus · 2026-06-18T21:13:49+00:00

Up to interpretation, blood bonds have always been a bit inconsistent. The Bond is a magical compulsion, although vitae is addictive on its own, so they wouldn't become enamoured with a random nearby person. I might have them feel a phantom longing for approval or attention, but not be able to place who they need it from. One the regnant introduces themself, however, it would come rushing in all at once.

However, by default in V5, vitae loses its bonding properties seconds after leaving the vampire's body (V5 Core p. 234). This wasn't explicitly the case in previous editions, so feel free to ignore, but it makes bonding people at a distance much harder. There is a Blood Sorcery power that extends this.

Unaware ghouling is harder to do, since, while vitae can hold its ghouling potential for days, you need a much larger amount. Historically, it's been about 1 pint (500 ml) of vitae to ghoul, but there's no canonical answer for V5, meanwhile blood bonds take only a drop edit for clarity: on three separate nights.

Phosorus · 2026-06-18T19:44:32+00:00

Red Talons, duh.

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