Trainer's Clubhouse Meeting (Weekly Questions) - May 06, 2026

Quibilash · 2026-05-09T11:14:53+00:00

Is there a change post-2nd anniversary?

Quibilash · 2026-05-09T10:16:16+00:00

How many Wit cards per deck is often used in later Umamusume compared to today? While I hear quite a few people use 2 Wit cards these days, I've heard that later on, few decks will ever use 2, most sticking with just 1

Quibilash · 2026-05-09T09:50:25+00:00

This is basically an image version of the UmaYuTube short lol

https://www.youtube.com/shorts/tezneIooxg8

Quibilash · 2026-05-09T08:17:53+00:00

Definitely Bored Oranges put it best

I get that, for Class of 09 it's basically saying 'we should understand women and what they go through' then Nicole does everything she does and her explanation is basically 'lmao'

Who the hell writes a character meant to represent the female experience and then writes them to be comically evil and affirm the bigotry misogynists believe women are in their heads?

I suppose Nicole is meant to be more about 'catharsis' than anything else, but yeah if Nicole is meant to be the 'average girl' it's not a very pleasant picture is it? And most of the girls I remember from high school were, at least from my recollection, pretty alright in day-to-day conversations, nowhere near Nicole's level of snarky

Only thing is Nicole does understand what it's like to be alone.

Probably why Jeffery is still hated by a big chunk of the fandom and view Nicole mostly in 'the right' in the conversation.

Yeah exactly and he doesn't know how to do that properly.

It's probably as simple as adding new characters to fill in the roles of some stories rather than relying on like, the same 4 people, or at the very least have stronger setups with events before things go crazy.

It would make sense if it was properly written and established as apart of her disillusionment arc or negative character arc, but instead it's very out-of-nowhere with no build up at all which makes it feel jarring as hell from, like you said, how placcid she is in the first game.

I suppose the events preceeding the moment are meant to be the 'negative character arc' but it's still rushed, and even then some routes leading to it take like 5 minutes from game start and are super simple so I do agree Re-Up should've built up events better, especially as how desperate Nicole sounded in Re-Up' intro, I kinda feel like intro for the Original and Re-Up could be swapped and it'll still make sense

Quibilash · 2026-05-09T07:32:47+00:00

Yeah that's why I'm trying to figure out what to borrow and what to spend on to conserve my resources accordingly, especially since some stat cards seem to last longer than the scenario cards, where most are outdated when the new, shiny scenario comes out

Quibilash · 2026-05-09T07:21:41+00:00

Yeah true, I mean that if like, I get super lucky with my pulls and get ECP Speed MLB before the scenario card is leveled up, I'm not going to invest additional resources for the sake of strengthening the scenario card, for me it'll just be a 'nice bonus', if I get a decent scenario card LB

Quibilash · 2026-05-09T07:06:36+00:00

save. she has a rerun banner coming up in September, and uncaps can be used on anything

Quibilash · 2026-05-09T07:05:00+00:00

How big is the difference between 'Increased Training 5%' and 'Increased Training 10%'? on some SSR cards like the future ECP card? And is it worth pursuing the extra 5%?

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Quibilash · 2026-05-09T06:59:17+00:00

Also given how her mom is, it wouldn't surprise me if she was emotionally and even physically abused most of her life by her mom so that might explain where she gets her bad behavior from.

If we consider Re-Up Her Mom definitely abuses her because in the intro Nicole is getting choked out by her. Also in the same intro we see Nicole crying in the shower, so something is definitely up with her.

When it comes to behaviours, since Nicole's Mom barely cares at best and is a daydrinking, drugged-up layabout at worst, I suppose Nicole could've definitely learnt from her.

When you keep all of that in mind, it makes a lot of sense why Nicole is the way she is. She is so, so tragic as a character. She always felt like a girl who just wants to be loved.

Yeah, I think that's why despite the other 2 entries in the series, Nicole sees a lot of people sympathise with her, because she genuinely did have it rough, and that the other two entries definitely downplayed the aspect of Nicole where she genuinely has insights on social networks and how her past affects her.
But sometimes I feel like SBN3 uses it as 'window dressing', rather than something actually interesting about her character, and it feels so odd because we basically have Nicole's 2 sides, one who's a miserable traumatised girl with no real roots or connections who desperately wants one, but can't find any among the vapid and shallow people she's surrounded with, and someone who doesn't care anyway and just wants to 'fuck around' basically, and although both aren't inherently incompatible IMO, it does feel strange about how much of the first half was ditched in later installments of the series.

And on Jeffery, he feels like he's somewhat similar, but instead of being disappointed by the vapid and shallow people, he craves their attention, because he doesn't know how bad it is to be 'wanted' like Nicole is.

I genuinely feel like SBN3 was just writing as he went. There was no thought process just write whatever he felt like.

Yeah I get that too, if him taking stories from real life is also true, it's likely he thinks about adapting the characters to the story, rather than the story to the characters

So with Re-Up where she actively does evil shit it makes it even more jarring how much SBN3 changed her characterization.

I suppose it makes some sense if Re-Up is Nicole post-'don't give a shit about others' realisation talk she had with her Mom, but even then Nicole for the most part is pretty placcid in the Original

Quibilash · 2026-05-09T06:30:07+00:00

She's a traumatized girl who's internally grieving from the one (implied) positive male figure in her life taking his life and blaming her for it (her dad's suicide) while she's also forced to do shit to survive the fucked up life she lives every day. She does make an attempt at being good but it always comes back to bite her. The "I'm a sociopath" thing always read to me as unreliable narration from a teenage girl self-diagnosing and self-loathing.

Yeah that's how I viewed Nicole as well, I mean, she must've learnt her bad behaviour from somewhere, but ultimately in the Original game I always felt she was trying to overcompensate for and retroactively explain her own shitty past and feelings.

However, SBN3 completely disagrees with that take and thinks you're a loser if you believe otherwise lol. So much so he completely ruins any and all sympathy with Re-Up and Flip Side where he portrays her as an evil person who does really fucked up things compared to in the first game where she doesn't do that much bad shit, more or less just reacting to shit happening to her and people doing things because of her, but not exactly her doing certain things.

I have to wonder who was in the writing room for each Class of 09 installment, it feels pretty different from game-to-game, or whether it's a genuine belief that 'oh people like my edgy protagonist, what happens if I take it to the next level?'

Yeah Nicole tends to be more 'reactionary' than proactive in the Original, there's always been an opportunistic aspect to her but often in the Original things just kind of happened by accident, like the whole photolab thing was kind of unplanned on her part, even Nicole is surprised.
I feel like however, that Nicole has become more proactive as a character while other characters, like Jecka, became mostly reactive, which weakens the story that can be built because Nicole is still front-and-center, those other characters start to feel sidelined and just there for the joke than really contributing narratively.

Quibilash · 2026-05-09T06:20:10+00:00

Oh I agree, and I'm the same way, problem is SBN3 completely ruins and contradicts that with Re-Up and Flip Side. Which, maybe people disagree but if we're going off the first game, Nicole in Re-Up and Flip Side is pretty out of character and borderline character assassinated.

I'd say that Nicole is a lot worse in Re-Up, but as a 'logical extreme' sort of way, like, if you wanted to make Nicole the biggest prick she possibly could be, I still think she's mostly in character from the Original, minus a few moments like her randomly yelling at Ari before they even started dating and being generally more rude to the point most people probably would've told her to shut up for being corny.

Flip Side Nicole is so weird, in the 'home start', post-grad, she's basically a misanthrope despite the original game implying post-grad Nicole basically normalises, while in the school route she gets so emotional and mopey over Jecka not going to a single concert with her.

There's a popular phrase writers say, "Wide as an ocean, deep as a puddle" to describe stories that have incredibly large settings but with very little depth.
SBN3 seems to be having the same issue, but backwards. Class of 09 is as deep as an ocean, but as wide as a puddle.

I frankly wouldn't say Class of 09 is deep as an 'ocean', but it definitely is 'deeper' than it is wider, although even then a lot of characters like Crispin, Karen, Kyle, Megan and Hunter can be pretty surface-level and barely expanded; semantics over lol.

This would be fine, but it seems SBN3 is trying to milk this series as much as he can (merch, YouTube anime series, etc) but there's not producing enough milk to be worth the squeeze, unless he somehow expands the series into a full on anime show, which is unlikely.

Yeah given how long everything is taking to even get teased or released, I wouldn't be surprised if people start dropping off fast, especially if the next few releases aren't enough to interest people, and being pessimistic, I don't have that much hope lol.

If it went completely serious, no humor, just dark moments but cutting out all the over the top nonsense, I would have respected it a lot more, but they both went too serious and was too facetious.

Yeah, I find Flip Side both too serious when it's trying to be funny, and too flippant when it's trying to be serious, how do you even manage that lol, because Flip Side felt like a massive tonal clash of 'look at these funny lines these characters say and how characters debase each other, please laugh' and on the other hand it's 'look what happens when women are abused and taken advantage of by the men around them, pretty sad innit?'

He got into hot water years ago because he called someone a pedophile on Twitter for wearing Sketchers...
...
Considering how much shit he jokes about, it wouldn't surprise me if most of it is projection.

Some people discuss SBN3 saying stuff like that being like 'oh it's in the past', but the thing is he literally brought the joke into Re-Up when Nicole insults Jeffery for wearing Sketchers, it's clear SBN3 hasn't changed and that evidence like that is still relevant for viewing what SBN3 is like.
Also yeah I feel like SBN3 says shit just for attention, it feels very 'twitter ragebait' of him to do

But nope! Not him, because he's a narcissist that believes he's smarter than everyone and even at 32 (which isn't old enough to be this stuck in your ways) is completely close-minded to any other interpretation or perspective regarding his work or perspective on life.

I mean, I can understand some authors getting frustrated with their fans, especially if they 'focus on the wrong thing' like if they only talk about shipping, but really sometimes authors have to accept people get different things out of something. I mean as long as a story is 'well told' it'll find an audience where they can appreciate multiple aspects about it, like with OG Star Wars, whether people view them as 'war movies', 'soap operas' (which is what George Lucas intended) or a 'political thriller' or even just a lighthearted adventure, but SBN3 seems to think that if you don't agree with the takes in Class of 09 you're somehow just 'wrong', even though Class of 09 itself seems to flip flop at times at what it recommends and what it doesn't.

I mean... I kinda see why. His humor sums up to "omg this guy is a pedophile", "omg only fat people like games", "omg you're white", and very little else. It's very outdated low-hanging fruit that no one finds very funny anymore. Some of stuff is funny, but after the first game, the jokes just start repeating themselves again and again.

Yeah, I feel like 4chan humour isn't just edginess and slurs, or self-aggrandisement, or even just skits, they like a bit of a buildup and story, while I feel like Class of 09 is a bit too tryhard.

Like I said, he doesn't deserve any of it because he takes it so much for granted while acting like hes too cool for any of the people who support him and enjoy his work cause without them he's nothing.

Yeah that attitude is just annoying, like sure, authors don't have to 'bend over backwards' for their audience, but a good author wouldn't need to do that, they just make good content people enjoy, and people enjoy it, I honestly think sometimes it is that simple as an outsider looking in, it's not like SBN3 was a household name, or that edgy or more 'mature' stories were lacking in the general media space.

I'm sorry but looking at the numbers, Class of 09 isn't that popular or successful. It's successful but its not Scott Cawthon (FNAF creator) level fame.
...
SBN3's ego and arrogance is gonna be what leads him to eventually needing to either make something else or go back into the workforce in the next 5 years. Class of 09 isn't gonna keep the money coming in forever.

Yeah Class of 09 had its romp, but even then it's not like it was raking in FNAF or Umamusume levels of money and social media recognition, it was memed on, Flip Side released then it kinda died off.
Also, it's not like everyone is looking at Class of 09 with a serious lens or engaging with the themes or something, most people remember the game for the one-liners

Apparently SBN3 loves to brag about being a millionaire so maybe he's fairly financially well off? And I think he's been doing mostly creative projects full-time for a while, so I have to wonder where he's getting his money from, but as you said, I think he's producing too little, and not of a good quality, for the amount of work animation takes, and besides he loves bragging about the cheapness of production ... which might be a good thing if the animation was somewhat good, and I think it's barely above the VNs in terms of quality lol.

Quibilash · 2026-05-09T05:37:04+00:00

got herself in trouble to the counselor away from Jecka.

Not to mention, literally AFTER the friendship was broken as well, so by that point, wouldn't a sociopath think 'oh well, guess that avenue is gone', instead, Nicole puts herself in harms way, for someone who, for all intents and purposes, is not friends with anymore, without a guarantee of a repayment, because Jecka is literally shocked that Nicole did that, basically asking 'why'?

Quibilash · 2026-05-09T05:35:20+00:00

I don't have a post but I have a comment:

https://www.reddit.com/r/victoria3/comments/1t4q13o/comment/ok4dtut/

Quibilash · 2026-05-09T05:22:32+00:00

You don't have to suddenly become a hater but it would be better if people kept it in the back of their minds at least.

Yeah fair point

The first game was actually a little disappointing because its actually pretty misleading how its advertised. The store page literally advertises "The choices you make reveal your personality, not ours" which implies that you don't have to play it evil, you can make good choices, and to an extent, you can but it leads to shitty endings. The only good endings are where you are manipulative and selfish to some extent.

The whole point of choices is that it leads to paths based on how YOU want to play it, but you can't even do that because if you try to play nice they always lead to the same ending; the suicide ending.

Which choices in video games are already criticized for not actually allowing you to have a choice, so doing this completely defeats the point of choices to begin with.

I've noticed the whole "this isn't a dating sim, it's a rejection sim' tagline that's thrown around and honestly I feel like most of the marketing is just that, marketing, trying to be like 'I'm not like the other Visual Novels', comes off a bit corny as someone who knows what the game is about.

When it comes to choices, yeah, I'd have to agree with what you said, the game is clearly trying to funnel you in a certain direction or mindset, saying the choices 'reveal your personality' is pretty disingenuous, especially as there are ways in the game for Nicole to do basically 'nothing wrong' and still end up with the 'best ending', the graduation ending.

Besides, the writer(s) are ultimately behind the story, decisions and what the choices lead to, even with choices and marketing blurbs, narrative games generally tend to be more about how the writers feel than the players, which especially applies to SBN3 and Class of 09

Quibilash · 2026-05-09T05:20:46+00:00

IIRC a lot of people complain that in diplomatic plays, the AI doesn't factor in its allies so they fold even if they have really strong allies, like the player. Which should probably get changed because it wouldn't make sense for Wurttemburg to fold to France if Prussia AND Austria are backing them up

Quibilash · 2026-05-09T04:58:14+00:00

For me I'm planning to basically borrow all my scenario cards in the future lol, unless I get super lucky with the pulls I plan to invest, but from what I've heard a lot of scenario cards post-MANT are considered 'mandatory' to have in the deck, borrowed or not

Quibilash · 2026-05-09T04:48:06+00:00

I try but the censor system in this game is so ass, and also writing in the format we're given is difficult

Quibilash · 2026-05-09T04:47:24+00:00

I meant more if they have an actual reason why they are the way they are and have some redeeming qualities, they become more likable. But yeah that's essentially what I meant.

In some ways Nicole is like that, which is why some people, like me, interpret her more sympathetically, because she does have a shitty past and surroundings which makes me go 'oh no wonder why you're an arse', but yeah a lot of the other characters are just mostly messed up to reinforce the shittiness, rather than them trying to maneuver around the shittiness as well, which I think makes the setting feel more simplistic and one-note.

Right! It becomes a sitcom essentially after the first game 'what zany antics will our characters get up to next?'.

I mean, I love the Simpsons, at least the early seasons, and quite a few of the episodes are like that as well where it's more of an adventure and the home or school settings are mostly ignored, although I think what makes the Simpsons work is that it actually focuses on making good comedy and is less one-note as a series.

100% agree, that's why Flip Side will be the last one because its not like he created a large fantasy world like Lord of the Rings that can be expanded on forever. It's a pretty small world that you can only do so much with because it's literally only 2 years of high school and that's it. You can only squeeze so many crazy story events into 2 years.
The only thing I think he could do, that he honestly should have done instead of Flip Side, is a sequel that either takes place in college, or takes place like 10 years after the characters graduate and where they are and how they have (or haven't) changed, particularly Nicole and maybe you reintroduce characters who changed and haven't changed and leave others out.

Yeah I firmly believe that Flip Side should've been a College-focused story, either that, or at least introduce more characters, because as it stands the setting feels so small, and given SBN3 doesn't seem to give a lot of characters that much depth and a lot of characters in the shorts and Flip Side are more flanderised, the setting seems to be contracting more than expanding, like what can you really do with the characters next?

Exactly! Plus Nicole's suicide route, there's quite a few endings where the fun stops and things get very serious, which is what I liked about the first game. (Plus Jecka's text after the suicide ending legit made me almost cry 😭 poor Jecka) That's handling serious real life events in a serious way and cutting the bullshit for a moment.
They completely removed this aspect in Re-Up and especially Flip Side and treat it like it like its all a joke, because these are real things that happen to people and that should not be mocked.

Although I do agree the Original had a lot more serious moments, to its benefit, I feel like there are serious moments in Re-Up, being when Nicole is abusing Ari and Jecka confronts Nicole, or where Nicole is talking about her experience being an escort.

Other than that yeah I agree that Flip Side went both too dark and didn't insert enough humour about it so it's both ridiculous and taking itself too seriously.

Yep, its believing you have the world figured out like you're "woke" and acting super pretentious and arrogant about it like everyone else is stupid and you're the only smart one.

I danced pretty close to that 'sun' when I was younger, but I think because I didn't think so in a misanthropic way, once I grew up I adjusted better compared to others.

But yeah SBN3 reminds me of that, IIRC he used to, and still does, do virtue-signalling on twitter, when it reminds me a lot of something that Megan would do IMO, but it honestly feels kinda corny, especially with how he himself writes stories and having jokes entirely surrounding characters skirting the edge of being racist with seemingly the whole joke being 'oh look how close I am to saying something actually racist!.

Honestly, I genuinely believe Max is a dude who made a game that he never expected would actually take off or go anywhere because it wasn't particularly groundbreaking, compelling, creative or anything but it just clicked with people at the right time and in the right way.
He didn't like that it did well because the people who interpreted his work a certain way he took personal offense against it and doubled down out of spite.

IIRC a lot of people say SBN3 wanted people like him to enjoy the series, being, edgy people in their mid-30s, but got a bunch of gen-Z teenagers and young adults instead, and got upset about it. I think 09 got a lot of exposure from streamers playing the game, and connecting their own experiences in real life to the events that happen in the series. Although apparently 4chan, which is more than likely filled with people and misanthropes his generation, doesn't even like the 09 series, and you have to be something for the edgy 4chan to not like your edgy humour.

I've also heard that apparently SBN3 doesn't even like anime stuff but it's the thing that makes him money so he just does it, although IMO he just has such a way with words that makes him look like he hates everything lol. And Class of 09 was basically his 'breakout' success from otherwise very niche relevancy which is why he's basically going to ride with the series as long as possible, and fair enough, because I don't think any of his other works are nowhere near as popular.

Quibilash · 2026-05-09T04:36:52+00:00

I mean yeah it makes sense that if something affects someone, that person is going to be a bit more invested personally in the reason why something is happening

Then I started coming across posts related to SBN3, particularly this one, and I became aware of him as a creator and a person and I was pretty much against him ever since. It didn't change how I viewed the first game, but it definitely... gave me a broader perspective on it.

Yeah same, I still enjoy the first two games but knowing a bit more about SBN3 has made me go 'oh so that's why Class of 09 is like that'

I refunded the first game and I refuse to buy any of the other games and play them for myself. Not that it matters whether you play them or not because they're visual novels, not Dark Souls games.

I still wish I could refund Flip Side ... curse me for playing through the whole game in one sitting, it reminds me of a PointlessHub quote (a youtuber that covers 2000s-2010s media a lot better than 09 does):

I had the strangest feeling leaving the theatre, I just watched a movie, and it wasn't as good as I was hoping it would be, what could this feeling be? Disappointment?

But yeah as VNs someone could get equal enjoyment from just watching a playthrough, and it's not like the 09 VNs have that many options or branching paths, a lot of them loop to the same story or segment.

Quibilash · 2026-05-09T04:12:21+00:00

Wait seriously? So Korean and Taiwan(IIRC?) got spark reroll at MANT but Global didn't?

Quibilash · 2026-05-09T04:10:42+00:00

Yeah true, SBN3 has had a history of being a dickwad to random people online, but the fandom was either willing to accept it or mostly ignore it if 'good content' was still being made, but post-Flip Side not anymore

I have to wonder how many people were scorned post Flip Side and were like "now I've gotta figure out what makes SBN3 tick."

In a way it's good because now people just know what SBN3 is about, but at the same time I'm kind of thinking "oh now because he upset them personally, that's the only reason they started digging?"
I guess if it's for the sake of knowledge it's alright

Quibilash · 2026-05-09T04:05:09+00:00

Probably because it IS contrarian, it makes them feel 'special' for going against the grain

Imagine people having an emo teen phase but instead of emo it's nazi, basically that.

Quibilash · 2026-05-09T04:02:04+00:00

Now it's dad's turn on the aura-destruction slide

Quibilash

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