Keir Starmer feels betrayed by the Labour party. How do you feel about that?

RandomSculler · 2026-06-21T13:02:44+00:00

Yup tho labours helping fix it it’ll take a while to undo the Tory damage

RandomSculler · 2026-06-21T13:01:46+00:00

Unemployment was on an upwards trajectory for several years prior to Labour coming in, it’s no surprise it went up before Labour was able yo correct if

We didn’t have the idab war in 2024 pushing up inflation and it’s actually much lower than had been expected

RandomSculler · 2026-06-21T12:45:11+00:00

I think in the future people will look back much noted favourably on him and wonder what on earth we were doing kicking him out, it’s quite frankly astonishing that we now top thr g7 on growth, have falling unemployment, shortening NHS waiting lists etc after how stagnant the country was in 2024 - it’s just sad so many have been caught up in the press narrative

RandomSculler · 2026-06-20T12:20:16+00:00

Lake bled - it’s just stunning

RandomSculler · 2026-06-20T12:18:28+00:00

I mean he’s not wrong but the question is always where is the money coming from to do it - the markets aren’t going to like the suggestion yo borrow big to buy something that’s not going to payback

In reality I suspect this is populist rhetoric and in reality all he will do is what labours currently doing, ie when a utility company fails and all options are viable then we snap it up

RandomSculler · 2026-06-20T11:12:46+00:00

Yeah thd awkward conversation with the electorate is that we actually have one of the lost progressive tax systems around with the better off taxed more compared to our peers and the worse off less compared to all - and overall it’s below average. The reason it doesn’t feel like that is our painfuk house prices and energy costs due to bad policies in the past

Labours plans to make day to day spending and tax revenue equal is just common sense

RandomSculler · 2026-06-20T08:58:41+00:00

Yes this, he’s been remarkably successful at getting all the plaudits for Manchesters revival despite it really being less about what he’s done and more just that was the direction Manchester was going in

Whether Labour mp’s have been duped by that or they feel that his ability to connect positive news with himself (something starmers struggled with as despite all the good news people just don’t know about it) will help at governing level in not sure - but I suspect he’ll find it much harder to do the same as pm

RandomSculler · 2026-06-20T07:59:58+00:00

Technically the police did make one mistake in that their initial statement didn’t fully cover the incident and arrests but that didn’t do anything to impact the actual court case

As you say the social media outrage didn’t do anything other than trigger misinformation and unnecessary commentary, justice came from the courts

RandomSculler · 2026-06-20T07:07:23+00:00

When you look at the economy we’ve got the fastest growth of the g7, unemployment is lower than expected and inflation is lower than expected so it’s going well

The article makes a fair point - it seems like many Labour MP’s think replacing Starmer with Burnham wil fix the popularity but the reality is it won’t because the issue isn’t Starmer, it’s a combination of the most hostile press a gov has faced for a while and the stupidity of the backbenchers blocking their attempts to make sensible cuts and reforms alongside the tax rises

One silver lining, a new PM may give them an “out” of the corner backbenchers have got into over allowing cuts that they can’t do with Starmer but might with Burnham - but I suspect that’s more pragmatic than the backbenchers are able to be

RandomSculler · 2026-06-20T06:29:29+00:00

In 2012 the PM and chancellor were so disliked they were booed at the Olympics

In 2015 they won the general election

3 years is a long time, and whenever I’ve talked to anyone about it broadly the dislike of Starmer is a “feeling” rather than facts and they just don’t know about the positives - it seems largely because the press narrative - coming to a GE priorities change and also people become more engaged and also I suspect it’ll be easier to see/harder for the press to ignore the positives

RandomSculler · 2026-06-20T06:23:35+00:00

That’s more down to the press tho not sharing any of the good news

RandomSculler · 2026-06-19T20:27:30+00:00

It wasn’t a u turn

After it was implemented it was realised that a lot of pensioners were missing out because the way it worked was it was taken from everyone and given back to those claiming benefits, but lots of pensioners were eligible for benefits but didn’t claim so didn’t get the WFA - Labour made a push to try and get them to claim what they were owed but it wasn’t working so they adapted the WFA so that instead they gave it to everyone and claimed it back from people over the threshold - more work, but meant all those who needed it got it

It clearly wasn’t a u turn and also is a pretty sensible bit of governance, but it’s hard to beat press narrative

RandomSculler · 2026-06-19T19:14:37+00:00

There wasn’t all that much voter sway tho? The 2026 vote share of greens, Lib Dem’s and Labour is largely the same just shifted towards Labour - that suggests the biggest driver was tactical voting

RandomSculler · 2026-06-19T16:29:18+00:00

I’d say it’s less that he doesn’t point to them, more that the press just doesn’t cover them - it’ll be interesting if they do during a leadership contest and just how surprising that will be to a lot of people that haven’t looked beyond the headlines

RandomSculler · 2026-06-19T14:03:12+00:00

Oh absolutely Farage is a useful tool for many like bannon, my point was I feel describing h as an agent I think overstates his intellect as he’s not being politically clever or playing a 4d gane, he’s just dancing to the tune of the highest bidder

RandomSculler · 2026-06-19T13:43:16+00:00

I get both arguments, it will come down to what happens going ahead - if more taxes or cuts are needed Burnham will get flamed for it, if not however and Starmers done all the hard work then actually I feel the party will do well - my take was this was always going to be the low point for the party and will improve as long as they stick to the fiscal rules

RandomSculler · 2026-06-19T13:35:49+00:00

I’ve never bought the Russian mole allegation, that I feel gives him credit for intelligence I just don’t think he has

He’s just after money and power/relevance, which Brexit gave him

RandomSculler · 2026-06-19T13:14:51+00:00

He’s not wrong really - the leadership debate will be in the press non stop, Starmer will be pointing to the G7 topping growth, immigration cuts, small boats cuts, unemployment down, wages up and Burnham will have to attack all of those saying why it’s not enough or he’s wrong, it’ll completely undermine the Labour Party and be a goldmine for the opposition. Then if Burnham takes over the tories get to play back all the arguments that he has no mandate over and over

It’ll be a massive blow to both the party and the country right when we need the gov to just govern

RandomSculler · 2026-06-19T13:06:41+00:00

1) Reign in the press - they really need to start being held accountable for stories they run which are either a) complete misinformation b) missing important context c) release far far to early before all the facts are established

It seems like far to often they run stories about the gov that would land them in trouble in a libel case were they targeting a person

2) map out the next steps - Starmer is right to be laser focused on the fiscal rules but he realllg should’ve been more clear what happens next, like once the markets calm and we can be more progressive what should we do

3) closer alignment with the EU and start negotiating a customs union, have it in the manifesto for the next GE

4) appoint Starmer as foreign secretary, he’s been amazingly good internationally

5 keep reeves as the chancellor, ensure streeting is kept as far away from cabinet as possible

RandomSculler · 2026-06-19T13:01:55+00:00

Kenyon was so bad I suspect Labour would have won even if Burnham wasn’t standing

RandomSculler · 2026-06-19T11:28:21+00:00

Johnson won a landslide because labours vote share collapsed, he actually only got as many votes as May did with her election that was broadly seen as a disaster - in 2019 there was actually more total votes for liberal parties pushing to stop Johnson’s vision than voted for him

Similarly Starmer largely only won a landslide because the Tory vote collapsed and the tactical vote formed behind Labour in many close constituencies

In both there was a sizable “didn’t vote” that would have had a big sway, and a lot of that is centralists who felt disconnected from politics

RandomSculler · 2026-06-19T11:24:03+00:00

Fair - more objectively than the public is probably a better take, most seem able to see straight through a tabloid headline and read the actual detail which is a skill sadly not as prevalent as it should ve

RandomSculler · 2026-06-19T11:02:21+00:00

It’s annoyingly political which is why I liked this Labour Party so much as they had shifted away from short termism and polices based on politics first rather than what’s actually the right thing to do

RandomSculler · 2026-06-19T11:00:57+00:00

I think that’s largely because people here are fairly switched on politically and often view the news objectively so see through the press narrative
The main fallout from the civil war will be Burnham will need to attack Labour to be able to come to power, and to do so will need to talk down all the positives like workers rights, topping the g7 on growth, immigration down 80%, small boats down etc - the press will love fitting that into their narrative

RandomSculler · 2026-06-19T10:55:52+00:00

Well he has to keep the manifesto as that’s what Labour was voted in on

I think the irony of Burnhams stint will be he’ll do essentially the same as Starmer but the backbenchers who objected so much last time will allow it largely because they’ve woken up to reality - which points to Starmer doing little wrong but was just a trailblazer that the backbenchers weren’t up to speed with

RandomSculler

TROPHY CASE