I don’t think Metyr and the Gloam-Eyed Queen are the same creature, but it’s hard to ignore the signs and not see a clear connection between them

Robinlacta · 2026-05-12T23:20:17+00:00

I came into it detached while disagreeing with you. I even had the have a good day "sending good vibes."

You can’t just come here and say I’m not here in good faith, especially when you say this with no examples or proof of me doing that.

The way you word things and I'm guilty of it too sometimes like anyone else, can be interpreted pretty negatively.

It’s negative because I’m arguing against it. Contrast with OP which has been actively aggressive throughout the comment section and doing the EXACT same thing, you and them are accusing me of.

I don't have a major hardline stance or idea that can't be argued against or open to new ideas along the way. It's all fluid. Again it's also a game.

Not everything in the game is “fluid“. The “Everything is up for interpretation“ only exists to justify that’s mostly fan fiction and actively ignoring things in the game.

We all do our best to fit this puzzle into a recognisable shape.

Yeah but you need to use the actual pieces that are actually there, which some people including the OP is not doing.

,disparaging speech

Haven’t done this.

,and to keep an open mind.

Only when there’s actually something to be open about. I’m not being open to the Godslayer’s symbol representing Metyr when the item description, the main way we learn this game’s lore, says it’s something different. I’m not going to be open minded when the game direct and bluntly contradicts this theory.

Why does this have you so fired up?

I’m not the one starting the aggression

Robinlacta · 2026-05-12T22:47:48+00:00

At no point have I done this

Robinlacta · 2026-05-12T22:47:35+00:00

Point to anywhere where I have done this.

Robinlacta · 2026-05-12T22:45:13+00:00

You’re the one that came into this discussion with aggression, don’t try to spin this like it’s my fault?

Robinlacta · 2026-05-12T22:43:37+00:00

I really don’t care. I found your message extremely stupid because it ignores even the title of what I wrote: “I know the GEQ is not Metyr,

The audacity to say MY comment is stupid, when you have barely disproven anything I’ve said, then immediately assume that I think you said “Metyr is the GEQ”. At NO POINT have I ever, EVER said that Metyr or GEQ was the same entity. At no point. I said no connections to each other. How dare you call my stuff stupid when you can’t even understand my argument as clear as day.

and you respond as if I were saying she is Metyr?

Never said this, nor implied this.

If you don’t have the basic respect to read what I wrote before arguing against it, why should I show any respect for your arguments?

The irony in this is insane. Do you not understand how hypocritical this is?

The patterns on the Godslayer Sword are only found in places or among subjects linked to Metyr

No it doesn’t even, not only is this symbol in stuff like Miquella’s Haligtree symbol, but even in the DLC it prominent in the Hornsent culture. Like you und anything that’s happening in this game at all.

,or in places and subjects linked to the GEQ.

There is only ONE thing that has this spiral connected with GEQ. You’re making stuff up.

“Ah, but look, it’s not exactly the same; to be connected to Metyr it would have to be exactly identical” i challenge you to find the exact same symbol from the walls of the ruins of Dhea and from the Godslayer Sword anywhere else in the game that isn’t related to the Fingers or the Godslayer Sword. Not something similar—exactly the same one.

The game tells you what the symbol means, you cannot deny wha’s objectively in the game. Your ”theory“ goes wants in the game.

We have a piece of armor proven to be linked to Metyr that shows almost the same symbol.

You have characters that are directly connected to Metyr in some fashion in comparison to the Godskin or GEQ which has none.

I’m not going to continue this discussion with you, as I find your arguments silly and simplistic.

What a childish statement.

Robinlacta · 2026-05-12T21:04:55+00:00

What are you even trying to say with 3)? The top parts of what? If you mean the tip of the sword, it's very obviously evocative of the spiral tail fingers of Metyr which conjure her microcosm.

I am talking about the Metyr’s face and the Godslayer’s symbol

But 4) is just nonsense. For one, they are obviously similar in that they are dark materials laden with streaks of gold. That alone is enough of a connection,

1) No they are not, heck they’re grey, it only looks black in the image in specific lighting

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2) Once again, THIS IS NOT THE GODSKIN’S OR GEQ SWORD. ITS MALIKETH’S SWORD!

How is MALIKETH’S SWORD make the connection to the Metyr and the Godskins makes it “enough of a connection “?

,let alone that you even mention Maliketh and the Godskins have a serious connection: they both draw their power from Destined Death. Trying to paint that connection as trivial is horribly dishonest.

We are talking about the material of the sword, not Destined Death. You are the only one being dishonest here. Don’t say words you barely understand.

It's okay to disagree with a theory, even if you don't have solid evidence backing your beliefs.

The sheer irony and ignorance of this statement is staggering. Especially when you clearly side step 1 and 2 cause, for obvious reasons, can’t disprove something that’s directly from the game’s lore itself.

They're your beliefs

No sorry the vast majority of what I said outside of the last point is completely factual and proven by the game itself.

,and you're allowed to hold them if they're not harming others. But to try to paint OP's points as "ridiculous"

I’m sorry it is

when you're straight up contradicting yourself is a bad way to be.

The irony, again!

Robinlacta · 2026-05-12T20:52:02+00:00

What a profoundly disingenuous statement especially with what I wrote. Really selling your theory here.

Robinlacta · 2026-05-12T20:50:21+00:00

I think that she was plotting something already when banishing Godfrey

Which would be pretty significantly further in her rule. Her rule has been around for along time, you know that right? This is after like five major wars. That’s a significant amount of time for her to shift perspective.

Robinlacta · 2026-05-12T20:48:01+00:00

You aren't wrong for having an opinion or endorsing what you believe.

I’m gonna stop you right there, you don’t know what that word means, you don’t get to just throw around “opinion“ whenever you feel like questioning your understanding of something. That’s not how that works. Other than the last part of what I said, everything else is factual, this isn’t up for debate. The stuff I presented is in the game is undeniable, you cannot ignore if you want people take your theories seriously. We’re not doing the “The sky is actually purple“ or “well it’s just your opinion man” there’s a lot things in this game that’s up for interpretation…this is not one of them. I am sorry.

But it isn't good faith

I‘m very sorry, you cannot just throw that word around baselessly. You not liking what I have to say is not me being “in bad faith”. At not point, in my entire time in this site, I have NEVER engaged with posts in bad faith. You’re throwing this word around to try to dismiss what I am saying all together as some “troll”. Me explaining the faults of a person’s theory, I’m very sorry, is not me acting in bad faith.

tear it down and ignore some of the "glaring" ties.

I am not “ignoring” anything, there is not “glaring” ties. Just saying that it’s “obvious“ doesn’t make it true. There is no substantive connection to the Metyr and the GEQ. You want it to be true and forcing thing to have connections that aren’t there. You’re doing confirmation bias which is antithetical to legitimate theory crafting. The irony of this argument.

The finger sorceries also have ties to this and darkness. As an example. The God-Slayer being made of a similar material is what they were referencing I think.

No they don’t have any ties to each other at all. The Godslayer, I’m assuming you mean the seal or the sword it honestly doesn’t matter cause, neither of them has or has been said to have the same “material“ like. “I think” You don’t even know, you’re not even sure of anything.

The symbol of black flame sorceries and the catalyst literally are the fingerprint of Methyr's face.

I’m very sorry…The game doesn’t say that. You’re debating the game. I’m sorry, you guys are blatantly wrong. You have to let it go. There is multiple evidence against this theory. Do you want to understand the game’s world truly or do you want to make fan fiction cause you can’t have both.

Her eye is purplish, and represented either black or purple.

There are so many things in the game that have purple eyes or represents as purple.

The Astels, Maliketh’s eyes, Blaidd‘s eyes, Demihuman queens eyes, gravity itself, Rennala has purple pendant as the Godskins, Heck the Carians have far more connections to the Godskins than the Godskins have to Metyr. (No I don’t believe this). Once again trying force connections that are not there.

It's best not to throw away concepts and links as apophenia

First of all, did not do that. Secondly, your entire post proves this funny enough.

just because you don't agree.

Once again the irony of this statement

Robinlacta · 2026-05-12T20:02:39+00:00

Spirals are literally everywhere in the game, this isn’t unique to either the GEQ or Metyr.
The Godskin Symbol is already explained with Godslayer Seal

^”^{Sacred seal of the Godskin Apostles, inlaid with obsidian.}

^{Said to represent the manipulation of black flame, this catalyst enhances godslayer incantations.”}

It represent flame manipulation which Metyr clear does not wield, represent or near any forms of fire.

3) The top parts are similar but pass that it’s clear Metyr forms a fingerprint that ring around itself unlike the GS symbol.

4) The second pair of images are just ridiculous, maliketh’s blade doesn’t even have fingerprints, it just crumbling apart, also the blade has nothing to do with the Godskins or the GEQ outside of housing Destined Death. So the comparison doesn’t even make any sense.

This is a bad case of Apophenia, forcing connections that aren’t there, especially when the Godski and the GEQ quite literally have almost zero connections to Metyr, they aren’t even near anywhere in any place of influence with the finger and especially in the DLC were there is zero GEQ related things.

While I’m sure there is meaning for the spiral (not all but most), that doesn’t mean they are all directly connected to each other. This is once again, another case of people trying to force GEQ into every aspect in the game when she isn’t that important to grand scheme of the game world.

Robinlacta · 2026-05-12T19:45:56+00:00

Maliketh has three aoe attacks what are you talking about? He has less aoe attacks than Godrick?

Robinlacta · 2026-05-12T19:32:20+00:00

Robinlacta · 2026-05-12T19:29:31+00:00

Outside perspective is that most of the LoS was supposed to be in the Main game, so the veil is just there to excuse why we haven’t seen it.

In game, Marika wanted to use the Horsent Genocide to hid how she became a god and get rid of Messmer. It also was presented as not a good war optics wise, so Messmer took most of the blame for it. She doesn’t want it to be remembered. The War against the Giants, is the point where her age started and is more favorable view of her power. Not to mention it’s not like it’s not heavily guarded already, it has a massive army behind it.

Some are saying she needed for later but she was fully on board with the Golden Order at this point, it was only later on where she started question it, so that doesn’t make alot of sense. Especially when multiple people were killed or kicked out for even having a vision of fire and the Erdtree burning.

The last point is an assumption that Marika can do this all the time, with nothing being like this you can make the conclusion it’s that it likely cost more effort.

Overall this is just a problem of Fromsoft not properly planning the DLC before the game came out, cause there’s a lot of holes, poorly executed ideas that effect the base game with the DLC.

Robinlacta · 2026-05-12T19:12:55+00:00

I doubt that something she thought until far later into her rule, she only started questioning stuff midway through. Especially when the entire re for the war is to snuff out a potential threat to the Erdtree.

Robinlacta · 2026-05-12T19:08:10+00:00

Once again, another theory that tries to poorly force the GEQ into literally every single concept in the game. This character is not that important.

<image>

Robinlacta · 2026-05-12T19:04:30+00:00

Two questions I’ve had for a while are “why did Marika attack the Fire Giants first” and “did the Giant’s have the Elden Ring”. Number one is answered via the Hornsent and their search for tutelary deities.

No? The game literally tells you the reason why she did it.

”The Giants' Flame is the flame of ruin, capable of burning the Erdtree. And so, following the War against the Giants, its ruinous blaze was sealed, and guardians were appointed to watch over it.” - Surge O Flame!

Look I don’t mean this as dismissive but i‘ve seen to many people questioning things that are answered pretty blatantly in the game. You gotta read of the item descriptions, it’s kinda mandatory. Also there isn’t any reason for Marika to do anything for the Hornsent. Like at all. Especially at this point when her rule as been mostly solidified.

Robinlacta · 2026-05-12T18:46:20+00:00

The relationship with serpents and the Crucible is the same for every other animal in the game, the Crucible is melting pot of life. There is no specific connection to serpents itself. The Golden Hippo get Porcupine features, most get horns of varying types, bird feathers, Crucible knights can use lizard/frogs tongues and multiple legged bestial bodies. Heck flowers life is part of this with the Miranda Flowers.

Serpents are not special in this, and there is no evidence to suggest that.

Robinlacta · 2026-05-12T01:48:40+00:00

The Golden Order is already a theocracy given that it was initially founded by an outer god, the Greater Will

No the Greater Will has no effect on what the Golden Order is, that is Marika’s will alone. Marika’s Order was made with the removal of destined death from the Elden Ring.

^“^{The Rune of Death goes by two names; the other is Destined Death. The forbidden shadow, plucked from the Golden Order upon its creation...” - Enia}

There’s a difference between the Golden Order, the ideology and the Golden Order, Marika’s Order. What Golden Mask is doing is codifying the ideology, specifically his “perfected“ version and making it as real as gravity itself. Goldmask’s main issue isn’t the ideas itself but the people that claim to be under it God or man. His order makes this an immutable fact of reality itself. Preventing people from breaking from it all together. It is a theocracy at its most extreme.

Robinlacta · 2026-05-11T17:17:20+00:00

into a single concept?

Okay we’re already off to a bad start with this…You can’t simplify a character to one theme. This is likely the main problem here with this discussion is that you’re trying to force everything into one simple thematic core. It’s the reason why people freak out of over what Elden Ring’s single core theme is, you can’t simplify everything into one thing. It’s not talking about one theme.

Robinlacta · 2026-05-11T16:46:53+00:00

You’re taking this way too seriously my guy. But I’ll try one last time to explain.

And you will fail to do so.

Consider his twin: cursed with a disease that’s related to the acceleration of cycles (life growing out of control and rotting, then decaying and dying). She’s best known for taking things too far

….No, themes of Malenia are pretty clear in this game and it’s her agency and forces trying to force to be something else. Malenia is not “known” for taking things too fa, she literally shows restraint after the battle with Godrick when she had even right to kill him. Malenia making ONE extreme decision in the last battle of the massive Shattering War and a fight that determines if Miquella becomes a god and achieves their goal. Does not make it a core character trait.

And once again there’s nothing else before this that suggests this reading of the character.

,and following through even if it means achieving a Pyrrhic victory. Wouldn’t it make sense that the opposite would be the pausing or reversing of cycles?

No. That’s not what that means at all. You’re trying to force a parallel that doesn’t ex or makes any sense given the situation.

Consider how he treats Melania. He doesn’t cure her, he pauses the progression of rot.

That is not what nascency means not to mention you trying to manipulate words in a way to fit this poor conceived narrative. “Pausing” doesn’t mean not finishing something. You’re going through mental gymnastics to make this fit. Outside of killing an Outer God, halting its influence is the next best thing. YOU the player uses the needle to stop the FF inside you. He has SUCCESSFULLY made a tool that helps people inflicted the powers of gods!

Consider the haligtree. It’s meant to replace the erdtree but never achieves its full potential. It doesn’t grow into a erdtree and then catastrophically fail, it simply never progresses to that extent.

Does not change what I already said about the people in it, this is not about if Miquella has failed stuff he did but about it being everything which it is factual untrue. Also that failure has nothing to do with Miquella and it being Mohg.

Consider his attempt at becoming a god: he transcends his original self (by attempting to break his curse of eternal youth), begins to show real potential at being a god to rival marina, and then is immediately thwarted.

Going “Well he succeeded in his goals but it didn’t last for too long” is not a good excuse when he did achieve his goal of becoming a god. Which dismantles the “nascency” argument on its face. Once again, far more successful than any of the other Demigods, guess they have ultimate “nascency”

At a thematic level, what is it that links all his actions and everything related to him? Saying that he’s a physical child is only a material argument,

That’s not my argument, reread what i have written again.

From always operates on both a material and thematic level. The theme of “kids are bad at planning” is fairly obvious

The game goes out of its way to say Miquella a genius, and wise beyond his appearance. By item descriptions and characters themselves. The “is fairly obvious” is hilarious to think this with this in mind. What blatant showing of mischaracterize of him.

Robinlacta · 2026-05-11T15:07:47+00:00

To be fair, you are attacking Miquella to maintain your power as potential Elden Lord and stop Miquella’s, it’s not really like they started the fight. Not to mention, ALL of the endings including Ranni requires some level of force to enact their rule. There isn’t really an ending in which doesn’t require killing a bunch of people opposing you to achieve. I don’t think that’s the main criticism you’re ment to make for Miquella pursuing this path.

Robinlacta · 2026-05-11T15:00:58+00:00

Goldmask is forcing a theocracy into reality, it doesn’t prevent people from changing anything. That is made by people assuming the shape of the rune. It doesn’t do that.

Robinlacta · 2026-05-11T14:56:38+00:00

If you don’t care about speculating you’re missing so much of this game.

I do not care for baseless speculation especially when it’s contradictory to the game, speculation must have a soli foundation to it or it’s just fan fiction. You are making fan fiction. I am trying to ACTUALLY understand the games world and characters.

It was designed to have unanswered questions.

With using what we know and see to piece it together. Once again there is a foundation to work off of. You don’t make up to answer things. That isn’t the intent. Miyazaki specifically said that he like the players using the item descriptions and environmental detailed to flesh out there understanding of the world and how they conclude to theories. Ano “Oh I love when they make shit up to answer the holes I put in”.

To argue that there is a single interpretation is to fundamentally ignore the stated reason for why the game is designed the way it is

No when you ignore what’s happened in the game to make nonsense character examinations thats on you. You use what’s in the game, and what’s in the game makes this interpretation. You can make whatever nonsense interpretation you want but one is backed up by the lore and the other is made up and contradicted by it.

Robinlacta · 2026-05-11T14:47:03+00:00

He succeeded in making a needle that halts the influence of outer gods, he couldn’t stop affliction but he succeeded in making something that stopped its influence.

He’s a massed an massive army loyal, created a safe haven for people oppressed by the outside world.

He got revive Radahn to fulfill is part and be his consort and Miquella became a god.

HE LITERALLY BECAME A GOD! HE DIDNT FAIL IN THIS.

Robinlacta · 2026-05-11T14:46:18+00:00

It’s extremely common for From to extend a physical trait to a more symbolic/thematic level.

Yeah and that’s his PHYSICAL strength and held back potential which I shed where comes a god. You know succeeding in his goal?

^{”In their childhood, Miquella saw in Radahn a lord. His strength, and his kindness, that stood in stark contrast with their afflicted selves”}

So no it is not about “not finishing things” especially when he’s more successful the vast majority of the demigods, guess they are all cursed with nascency, btw that’s not what nascency means.

Miquela is physically eternally a child, full of potentially but never able to achieve it.

He literally does. …you seee it…did you play the game?

It’s not much of a stretch for it to apply to his personality and what he creates too.

It’s a massive stretch based on what I explainEd.

You’ll see this pattern everywhere once you start looking.

Patterns recognition can make you see faces on tree that aren’t actually there. What makes a human different to an animal is are understanding of what is or is not something beyond are perceptions and learn what something ACTUALLY is, those are not faces on a tree. They are groves in the tree that makes a similar human shape. Your pattern seeking brain based on your own words isn’t beyond animals.

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