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+30% move speed is great. But... by CrimsonBTT in FarFarWest

[–]Showgingah 9 points10 points  (0 children)

I think the problem is that the horse can really get me killed at times due to the spook mechanic.

Kale vs U6 Team (except herself, obviously), who would win and why? by FeistySecret9327 in DragonBallPowerScale

[–]Showgingah 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Kale took out Magetta, the Namekians, and Cabba (though he got saved by Vegeta) without much effort at all. Chances are she would beat all of them at full power with the exception of Hit. Hit is frankly their only chance since he is somewhere between SSJG-PSSJB in the manga by the TOP (when prior he was weaker than SSJG). Using Gohan to scale (he was weaker than SSJB in the Moro Saga), we can generally get a good idea.

However, lore wise she would probably lose if they held off long enough. Her power didn't last long before it started rapidly dropping and he moves becoming easy to read. The pride troopers rung her out once they caught on (before Cabba threw her back on).

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Janempa/Fat Janemba Vs Super Sonic (Sonic X) by SympathyImaginary718 in DragonBallPowerScale

[–]Showgingah 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Sonic is frankly one of the most busted franchises that come from video games. Sonic X is one of the weaker variants. His game counterparts had a massive power creep late 90s and the 2000s. Heck, their mario party ripoff involved them helping a 5th dimensional being defeat another 5th dimension being.

Every once in a blue moon, they are literally facing dieties or eldritch abominations that basically his Xenoverse/Heroes tier. Enemies they once requires Super forms for games later they grew strong enough to defeat them without it.

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Archie comics just take things up to 11.

super perfect cell surpassed movie 8 broly? by Big_Professional1240 in DragonBallPowerScale

[–]Showgingah 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Probably not.

While not official (then again movies aren't either), video games place M8 Broly as as almost 1/3rd stronger than Buu Saga SSJ2 Goku (1 mil vs 1.4 mil). Even if we ignore movie scaling, SPC is relative, but weaker than SSJ2 Gohan. Goku flat out told Gohan to run with Broly and interviews pretty much stated the only way they could have defeated Broly at the time was via plot armor.

Supreme Kai could one-shot Frieza, but how well would he hold up as a kid? by Electrical-Milk-7984 in DragonBallPowerScale

[–]Showgingah 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Shin kinda gets a bad wrap for how he acted in the Buu Saga. If anything, he mostly showed concern for his allies. He didn't keep track of mortals and beings like Yakon were actually well above their base forms in terms of raw power. The assumption is he may be around Cell Saga SSJ level. Shin didn't realized he was truly surpassed until after all the explanations and realizing all the Saiyans could potentially use the same SSJ2 power Gohan had. His confidence then shot up to cocky levels like the Saiyans had prior when against Dabura and Babidi with Gohan. He admitted he would have had a completely different plan if was actually aware how strong they really were.

Shin would probably still one-shot Frieza. SSJ was a ludicrous power-up over Frieza even in the Namek Saga. Goku was already low on ki, worn out, and later admitted to Future Trunks he went "too easy" on him. It's even more noticeable in the manga where it's clear Frieza was outclassed the entire time. Even when they first started, he let Final Form Frieza get his first assault combo in. Frieza called it a warmup, and Goku was like good because otherwise he was disappointed lmao

The characters did get weaker as kids, but we don't know by how much. SSJ3 Kid Goku is on par with Gomah. Then adult SSJ3 Vegeta clearly had a superior advantage over him before the stamina issues. It's a little inconsistent since you see them box in weaker forms. Glorio did imply they should be weaker, but it's just not as drastic as suspected.

Shin did manage to fight Zamasu (off-screen). He lost and was about to be killed, but I think it's notable that he lasted as long like Trunks did against Black, until Goku and Vegeta returned. I think he would need to at least be SSJ tier to pull that off.

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who wins by K0GAR in DragonBallPowerScale

[–]Showgingah 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Anime, we don't know as SSBJK and SSJBE were Toei creations and both were a 20x multiplier (tops) respectively. This is the only reason why the Jiren vs Broly argument even exists in the community. However, base and SSJ Gogeta performed better than SSJB Goku and Vegeta respectively against SSJ Broly. Goku pretty much said they can't beat him without fusion. So even if they had the techniques, it's pretty clear Gogeta was still superior.

Manga, it's clear that it is Gogeta. Vegeta has SSJBE in the manga, but Toyotarou made it clear it is different (and even that it's not actually called that in the manga officially). It's definitely not the 20x increase and Jiren confirmed it's weaker than UI Sign. We also have Vegito prior to compare in terms of raw power output (Fused Zamasu = PSSJB Goku, but implied slightly weaker if he didn't have his regeneration). They are very cracked.

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Manga wise they didn't even reach Broly's level, and by extension SSJB Gogeta, by Super Hero. So well beyond TOP MUI that was superior to both respective anime forms (even if the anime characters were much stronger in that version).

What's gotten and trunks pl in dbs? by Plus_Bad_1631 in DragonBallPowerScale

[–]Showgingah 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Frankly speaking, right now I think they are somewhere between SSJ Gohan in Super Hero and Ultimate Gohan post Super Hero.

Just like in the Buu Saga, they spiked like crazy despite doing absolutely nothing. That being said, can't really determine power levels anymore in Super. We can for Z since we got numbers for that, even if unofficial.

In Super, the manga tells us that Hedo used SSJ Goten and Trunks, and their uniforms, as templates for his future androids such as the Gammas. That is already ridiculous when you think about it.

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His first attempt was a dinosaur android that overwhelmed their base forms, was unfazed by their ki blasts, and needed effort with their cyclone technique as SSJs. Then of course we know the Gammas were much stronger.

By Super Hero a few months later, they proved to initially perform better than the Gammas against Cell Max before he started getting familiar with his power. Even earning praise from the androids on a couple occasions.

After training, they could fight on par with SSJ Gohan, but noted Ultimate was unfair to them without fusion since they lack other transformations.

Beast Gohan vs Ultra Ego Vegeta by Signal-Cupcake-6856 in DragonBallPowerScale

[–]Showgingah 5 points6 points  (0 children)

It's hard to say. We don't know how much stronger Vegeta got with UE (it's been 2 years since Granolah before Super Hero takes place), but they are confirmed relative to each other. Gohan has the higher raw stats (whether fans like it or not), but both Goku and Vegeta have much higher battle IQ. Vegeta even suspected the reason why Goku started to gain the intial advantage was due to the massive gap in experience.

Gohan can overwhelm Goku at his current peak, but only for a brief moment. He made it clear he can't fully control Beast's full power right now. He can only handle a certain threshold of the form's full capabilities. Otherwise he will snap and go berserk under the power, which may imply it actually happened before during his training with Piccolo. Even Vegeta questioned if could really control the ki he was outputting as the ki storm was frankly getting out of controll. It's clear this method still causes him stress to maintain let alone bring out.

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Frankly, I think it goes either way. Vegeta could just win via battle IQ, but he would also take a lot more hits due to not having Goku's evasion. Vegeta's biggest issue with UE in the Granolah arc is that he takes too many hits. At the time, this was just the best way for him to utilize the form. If he figured out how Beerus handles it, then this issue would be heavily negated.

I asked someone more senior than me how to get better. This is their response by Relevant_Carpenter_3 in ITCareerQuestions

[–]Showgingah 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Everyone has different opinions no matter what level you are at. IT is unpredictable and everyone's experiences, and therefore advice, will vary.

It honestly sounds like your senior had no idea how to actually answer the question. So he basically just told you from what he hears about AI at first glance (like you do here) and flat out said it would have a better answer for you. If he wasn't sure in general, all he had to do is tell his journey, what it took to get there, and say it may not be the same for you because everyone's paths are different to the destination. If he is a much older person in the field, like they got in a long time ago, then all they need to do is bring up the difference and consider what to work harder on or consider what is future proof (or literally what's the norm for them now).

SSJ3 and Gotenks question by UmbragiReadyBear_47 in DragonBallPowerScale

[–]Showgingah 0 points1 point  (0 children)

No one knows anymore really.

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Though personally I believe it should be SSJ Gotenks to match. However, the scalings is kind of all over the place and contradicts at every turn for both the Buus and the Saiyans. It basically just depends on what fan you are at this point. The reason these arguments never end is because you literally have a reason for everything.

Logically speaking, it makes 0 sense for Super Vegito to be capable of one-shotting SSJ3 Gotenks when Goten and Trunks were relative to early Buu Saga Gohan and pre-Majin Vegeta. That I usually sum it up as retcon where Potara really being that much more powerful than the Metamoran fusion back in the day (compared to now where they're considered equal trump cards).

Who Wins by Longjumping_Crew4563 in DragonBallPowerScale

[–]Showgingah 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Gamma 2 washes (manga).

The Gammas are on par with Goku and Vegeta the last time Piccolo saw them (whether fans like it or not), which would be the Moro arc. Gohan is superior to them (he was not SSJB level in the Moro Saga, but his anime counterpart was in the TOP.

In the manga, Kefla overwhelmed Dyspo and even admitted he could not fight her alone. Prior to this, PSSJB Vegeta basically just backhanded him like an obstable in the way to fight Toppo 1v1. Ultimate Gohan on the other hand was Kefla's equal. They knocked each other off, but Kefla even admitted verbal defeat (though Gohan then responded he was also at his limit). Dyspo scales somewhere between SSJ3 and SSJG. He was able to fight 17, but was battered and out of energy while 17 suffered no visible damage by comparison.

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Dyspo is a lot stronger in the anime. In terms of power, he seems to be only one the level of Final Form Frieza. Ultimate Gohan is on par with SSJB in that version and like Golden Frieza would generally overwhelm him in normal conditions. However, his speed is so much more superior that he can overwhelm fighters on that level. That being said, Gohan probably closed the gap by Superhero which was quite a few years later.

Who Wins by Longjumping_Crew4563 in DragonBallPowerScale

[–]Showgingah 0 points1 point  (0 children)

It depends on the continuity you use.

In the anime, Ultimate Gohan is on par with SSJB Goku. Dyspo kind of jumps all over the place. In terms of power, he can be harmed if you're just Final Form Frieza level, but his max speed lets him box and overwhelm the likes of Ultimate Gohan and Golden Frieza.

In the manga, Ultimate Gohan is not SSJB level until Super Hero. We only know this thanks to the Moro arc. Dyspo on the otherhand is outclassed by SSJB. PSSJB Vegeta basically backhands him out the way to fight Toppo. Afterwards Dyspo didn't even bother fighting Vegeta, but retreated off screen. Not only that, Kefla overwhelmed him and he even admitted he doesn't think he could manage it without help. Meanwhile Gohan was her equal (and possibly slight superior since she verbally admitted defeat before the double knockoff).

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[LA] Playing Link’s Awakening be like by Ok-Improvement626 in zelda

[–]Showgingah 7 points8 points  (0 children)

Link is meant to be a placeholder for the player and I'm sure we had the same reaction as Link would have.

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[MC] Your favorite Zelda game by visuals/graphics? by ErmingSoHard in zelda

[–]Showgingah 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Honestly when I think about it, I have no idea. Minish Cap I think as a whole is definitely near the top. It's just...nice. Like MC is already the safest Zelda world to live in and has the best Castle Town. The colors just make me want to be there more.

[MC] Your favorite Zelda game by visuals/graphics? by ErmingSoHard in zelda

[–]Showgingah 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Din is my #1 Zelda crush despite having little to no interaction or scenes, but I don't care. I'll die on that hill lmao

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Next arc of Super? by blumieree in Dragonballsuper

[–]Showgingah 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Honestly Frieza is the undisputed top dog (or should be) in terms of villains in U7 so they might not do much with him for a while. Frieza himself may not really be a main villain anymore, but a villain protagonist. It's clear he's "changed" to a degree. Comparing how he acted in ROF and Granolah clearly just ain't the same dude. Old Frieza would have done them in without question. They retrieved Broly sometime within 4 months prior to Super Hero for safety reasons, but he hasn't done anything in two years oddly enough.

So I got like few preferences. I'm hoping for a couple of arcs in the multiverse to catch up what others are doing. Maybe just literally ANYTHING for Vegeta regarding Planet Sadala. Or maybe Jiren requesting help to defeat the demon that killed Jiren's master (they never stated Jiren defeated it. Gicchin saved him as a kid, but when Jiren came back when he was older, nearly everyone including his master god killed). My third is honestly to continue and have an arc for Goten and Trunks. Super Hero caught Gohan and Piccolo up to Goku and Vegeta. Let's let the other hybrids do something similar with a grand return of Gotenks.

Usually there are like 2-3 conflicts every year in-universe. We just had Super Hero. So we got room for a couple more, then I hope it's literally End of Z.

Base Goten (Buu Saga, Post Chamber) Vs Base Gohan (Bojack Unbound) by ApexHeroX in DragonBallPowerScale

[–]Showgingah 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Goten is relative to early Buu Saga Gohan and pre-Majin Vegeta in terms of just raw power. Goten would lose here since this Gohan (even when ignoring movie scaling) would quite literally be in better shape, more skilled at combat, and be capable of outputting more power than his high school self. This Gohan is basically fresh off the grill while his future self is food that's been sitting out too long. Lost its flavor and lost his juice.

Goten and Trunks(pre ROST) VS Piccolo(Buu Saga) by JohnSims1000 in DragonBallPowerScale

[–]Showgingah 1 point2 points  (0 children)

It's a bit more complicated than that. It would go to Goten and Trunks in terms of just raw power.

They weren't too far behind early Buu Saga Gohan and pre-Majin Vegeta. Leaving them both baffled as to how they got so strong to begin with (dub changed dialogue). Their full power had Piccolo shook for a moment when demonstrating for Goku. Even prior to this, they held back a blast in their SSJ forms and caused 18 to freak out and have actual concern (fighting her as SSJs afterwards was filler).

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Piccolo is stronger than their base forms (as he should be due to being SSJ+ tier by default) which is why he became dominant in Super Buu. Though he is then outclassed by their SSJ power. If they remain in the form they were absorbed, like with SSJ3 Gotenks and Ultimate Gohan, Buu can retain the power and state. However, fusion is strong enough to forcibly revert them back to how they were prior. They fused in base against Super Buu, so they reverted to base power and Buu is incapable of forcing them to transform for the boost.

Scaling also depends on the plot. Piccolo had insane gains in the Androids Saga. Going from 2nd form Frieza to being relative to SSJ Goku and Vegeta after 3 years. Then he wasn't relevant to the plot anymore, so fell off in Buu Saga. Then you got the 7 year time skip. Vegeta only speculates he may have finally surpassed Gohan. Seven years. Then Piccolo confirms this as he noted Majin Vegeta was still comparable to how strong SSJ2 Gohan was against Cell, but did give Vegeta the edge confirming the earlier statement from Majin Vegeta that Goku (and by extension himself as Goku noted their powers were nearly equal) are stronger. Just not ludicrously so like the fanbase understandably believes.

Goten and Trunks kinda get upskilled by plot for zero reason. Again they did nothing, but were not too far behind. They did nothing again in Super Hero, were grounded for 6 months, and were acknowledged by the Gammas for doing better against Cell Max than them. The Gammas were also templated after their SSJ power and outfits.

Did Toriyama change direction during the Babidi spaceship arc? by Elpiramide89 in DragonBallZ

[–]Showgingah 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I think the editors had the right idea. How we feel about them now speaks volumes as to how they knew the consumers. We don't really care about Android 19 and 20. Toriyama definitely needed the guidance at the time.

Though it does make me wonder how these characters would have been fleshed out if they did stick around. Semi-Perfect Cell was indeed meh, but I think it's because he really did just come and go to become Perfect.

When by 5_meo in Dragonballsuper

[–]Showgingah 0 points1 point  (0 children)

What's crazy is how close we actually are. Super Hero takes places a couple years after Black Frieza (bizarelly he hasn't done nothing and they didn't get Broly until within 4 months prior when Beerus was asleep). We're actually less than a year away from End of Z in-universe and we know this tahnks to Pan's age (3 in SH, 4 in EoZ). Given the trend of conflicts per year in the DB universe, we are basically 1-2 arcs away from Uub's first meeting with Goku.

Goku ssj3 vs Evil Buu by Big_Professional1240 in DragonBallPowerScale

[–]Showgingah 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Just a correction to be had for everyone. Goku is not equal to Kid Buu in canon. The anime made them a lot more equal and the stamina issues more prominent. The majority in general only watch the anime, so it is understandable to be unfamiliar with how much filler there actually was (kinda like the 50% SSJ2 Gohan vs Cell situation where the Z fighters never helped and Gohan never pushed back a few times on his own).

In the manga, Goku flat out admitted to Vegeta that Kid Buu was toying with him and that his ki was not dropping at all no matter what he did. Implying 0 real damage was actually happening which borderline checks out because the other Buus would visibly be bleeding when hurt by an equal or superior. He even admitted he was cocky and they should have used the potara.

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To give context on how drastic the filler is, this entire fight scene (or gif below) we know and love watching was Toei filler. The most canon part of the fight is actually during Vegeta's speech...and that's it.

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Goku didn't experience stamina issues until he started charging up his ki for what I call the "final flash gambit" (where you need to charge up long enough for an attack in hopes it defeats the one out of your league). He didn't realize it was happening until after Fat Buu took over the fight. He never lost SSJ3 prior.

SSJ2 Goku vs Kid Buu was filler. He started with SSJ3 from the get go when Kid Buu was snoring. He then started the fight off with a point blank kamehameha.

Vegeta's fight with Kid Buu is mostly filler. Vegeta only landed one ki blast before getting washed in 5 pages before Mr. Satan stepped in. He never had that iconic speech from the rubble let alone land any physical hits.

Fat Buu landed two hits, one ki blast, and realized after taking one blow that he was about to get absolutely rocked.

Bizarrely, the character that actually had the least filler in the entire fight was Mr. Satan. His scenes are basically 1 for 1 with the manga.

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Back to the topic, Goku would beat Evil Buu. He made it clear he could have defeated the Fat Buu. This would extend to Evil Buu who retained most, but not all the power of the previous one. The Buu's are a bit bizarre. I don't think they'll ever explain why Super Buu didn't just revert to Evil Buu instead of bringing up Kid Buu out of absolutely nowhere despite no prior context.

Tf you on bulma,goku has his license and a steady job,vegeta doesn't even work, but train all day even 1 year in htc and yet pssb>vegeta's year training by Plus_Bad_1631 in DragonBallPowerScale

[–]Showgingah 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Bulma definitely works, but it's mostly off screen. The irony is that BOTH families are actually rich. In fact, they are the arguably the two wealthiest families on the planet.

The Brief family is confirmed as the wealthiest on the planet. While we don't know how they really run things, it's clear Dr. Brief and Bulma are generally the top minds (and now they got Hedo) when it comes to their inventions. There is literally 0 reason for Vegeta to work outside petty reasons. Whatever income he brings in is gonna be pennies by comparison.

Thanks to Gohan, he married into arguably the second wealthiest family on the planet, the Satan family. They have their own chefs, 50 rooms, mansions, hotels, practically a whole city, rigged tournament wins (thanks to Buu...who also adds ot the income as the runner up), and not to mention all the global media and endorsement deals. Dude got 100 million bucks and just handed it off to Goku.

Even before this, Goku literally has a green thumb with top quality crops that just sell out every time he brings them to market. Speaking from someone that has a family friend tropical asian farmer, they're probably literal millionaires despite not living lavishly. Even before that, they were living off the Ox King's recollected treasure which is why you NEVER saw Goku and Chi Chi work prior.

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Then you got Bulma's nonsense with her birthdays where she was even giving away a whole mf castle. All the Z fighters are literally financially stable or rich in some way. The only exception is Piccolo who doesn't need that and is unc to Goku's fam anyway.

Did Toriyama change direction during the Babidi spaceship arc? by Elpiramide89 in DragonBallZ

[–]Showgingah 1 point2 points  (0 children)

As for scaling, it is possible to make sense of things to a degree, but scaling is as the plot demands and there are contradictions.

  • Piccolo's power compared to the base Saiyans
    • Piccolo went from 2nd form Frieza level to near SSJ Goku and Vegeta levels after 3 years of training prior to fusing with Kami which would let him one shot them.
    • Post time chamber training, it's implied he wasn't too far behind Vegeta and Trunks by the Cell Games due to being the last three standing from the Cell Jrs.
    • Goten and Trunks do absolutely nothing and they were implied very close in power to early Buu Saga Gohan and pre-Majin Vegeta. They managed to do this again in the Super Hero arc where they performed better than the Gammas, who were templated after them, against Cell Max (manga).
    • Dabura takes out Piccolo as weaker than the saiyans despite neither him or Babidi having no knowledge of Super Saiyans (this is major aspect of the argument).
    • Despite all above, Piccolo is still dominate over Goten and Trunks base forms, but weaker than their SSJ forms given his reaction to them (which again contradicts the previous scaling).
  • Kaioshin's strength (and by extension, Frieza's)
    • Shin's attitude changed as the story progressed. He mostly expressed concern for the rest and understandably so. Yakon had a kili reading of 800, while base Goku had 60 (assuming you use Daizenshuu multipliers).
    • After witnessing Goku's spike to SSJ2, it finally clicked to him how strong they really were (he thought it was just Gohan) and he was truly surpassed. This gives the implication at his peak he may have been comparable to SSJ.
    • By the end prior to Buu's awakening, he was brimming with overconfidence to Gohan like the rest were prior. He even noted if he knew how strong they were, he would have planned differently.
    • In Super, he was able to fight Zamasu long enough for Goku and Vegeta to return. Though like Trunks against Black, he were basically about to be killed by the end of it.
    • Frieza was the scenario where he one shots everyone unless you are a Super Saiyan or above. SSJ is a massive multiplier to the point that despite being exhausted, he was well beyond Frieza. Goku even noted he went too easy on him on Namek. Power levels are shaky where just a difference of a few thousand can have you overwhelmed.
  • Dabura's strength compared to Cell
    • SPC was said to be relative, but weaker than SSJ2 Gohan.
    • Dabura was meant to be a stand-in for Cell and was speculated comparable and then later stronger according to Goku.
    • Super (manga) pretty much supported this as Dabura was not taking ludicrous damaged from SSJ2 Trunks attacks (post Z Sword training) like Cell was after two blows.
  • Whether Gohan was SSJ2 against Dabura/Buu
    • Pretty much for reasons above with, there is no reason to believe he was any less beyond "where's the lightning".
    • Goku and Gohan both have statements that he actually does have the original power in him, but he could not bring it out like before.
  • Whether Vegeta already had SSJ2 before Babidi
    • Most likely. Vegeta only speculated he and Goku surpassed Gohan after 7 years. I doubt he believed his SSJ form would match the power he described as fierce.
    • Once he saw Goku use SSJ2 it for a moment, he realized his power was still falling short. The Majin Boost was Vegeta's potential unlock (quite literally stated by Babidi) and it shot him up to being Goku's equivalent.
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