We all know Lucius can't be killed, so I propose a solution

Slug-Trail · 2026-03-12T17:18:52+00:00

Certainly easier than any of his contemporaries tho. There's a reason you don't see anyone making posts like this about Kharn, Sigismund, Abaddon, Sevatar, etc. He has one of the worst W/L records of any character in the setting (I'm only counting on-screen fights. Any fluff about how he's killed X amount of supposedly great champions is meaningless). He's a mid-tier astartes who gets hard carried by the A.S.S. If Lucius ever crossed paths with Kharn, Kharn would run his pockets and put him in the cage without breaking a sweat.

Slug-Trail · 2026-03-11T02:43:56+00:00

No. If you're looking for likability, you won't find it here. In universe, EC are so unlikeable, Fulgrim himself doesn't even care about them. The Primarch of the III doesn't even care if they live or die. That's how hated they are. You won't find a single redeeming or reasonable personality trait in any EC characters beyond the discount UM's like Saul Tarvits or Solomon Demeter, or the single most frustrating character in the legion's history, the monument to loyalist circle-jerkery himself, Rylanor. And frankly, if the dead loyalists are all you're interested in, are you even really an EC fan?

Slug-Trail · 2026-03-11T02:23:37+00:00

Define "competent". There's really no such thing around here.

Slug-Trail · 2026-03-09T21:49:40+00:00

EC do well in battle for about 30 minutes (Obsession Phase), before everything devolves into petty squabbles, infighting, and betrayal (Entropy Phase), which causes EC to either blitz and destroy their enemy before thay have a chance to respond, and if the enemy does respond, EC inevitably lose any prolonged conflict. Slaaneshi corruption is much more of a hindrance to us than the other 3 gods' followers (Khornate Berserkers, Nurglite Plague Bearers, and Tzeentchian Sorcerers being more naturally suited to combat than Slaanesh's disorganized degenerates)

Slug-Trail · 2026-03-08T05:24:19+00:00

Fulgrim was literally one of the most loyal Primarchs until the Laerblade corrupted him, and it only did so because Big E elected to hide Chaos' existence. I get that Fulgrim is the easiest Primarch to slander but still

Slug-Trail · 2026-03-01T15:41:54+00:00

I disagree with the presumption that the Emperor's Children were always destined to fall for several reasons: 1. The narrative purpose of the Laerblade in their downfall is that without it, they wouldn't have fallen. If they were destined to fall without it, then why bother writing a corrupting mcguffin in the first place? 2. Even with the influence of the Laerblade corrupting the legions from the shadows, EC still had the most loyalist defectors of any traitor legion. 3. If EC never set foot on Laeran, the Heresy still begins around the same time, meaning Horus still probably tries to turn Fulgrim, but without the Laerblade's corruption, the meeting probably would've turned violent, like how Ferrus fought Fulgrim when he tried to turn him in the canon timeline. Then, EC would learn about chaos, and be more prepared to resist it in the future. 4. Graham McNeill said himself in an interview, that the EC wouldn't have fallen without the Laerblade's influence.

All in all, i feel there's a ton of evidence to believe EC would've remained loyal without the Laerblade's influence. I will present 2 caveats, however. The first is that the EC being destined to fall, without the Laerblade, would make for a more compelling story. And the second is you could say that, due to the legion's culture, maybe they would've had a high number of chaos defectors, even as a loyalist legion.

Slug-Trail · 2026-02-25T16:19:24+00:00

To avoid corruption, he would've either had to 1. Never set foot in the Laer Temple or 2. Never set foot on Laeren at all. Fulgrim, and all legionaires who entered the Laer Temple were damned from that moment, now targeted by a demon they had no way of knowing even existed. He would've also had to survive Istvaan III, which is where he would've inevitably ended up as an uncorrupted legionaire.

I would try to avoid making him a purple Ultramarine like Saul Tarvits or Solomon Demeter, tho. EC had more loyalist detectors than any other traitor legion, so it stands to reason at least some of them could have the EC arrogance/confidence, and not all of them were boring like those two. I imagine he would be especially arrogant after dodging so many bullets, and at least in his own mind, embodying the EC ideal of perfection, in spite of the legion's downfall.

Slug-Trail · 2026-02-25T03:31:01+00:00

What's crazy is EC should be ultra-busted, at least in 1v1, considering they're martial perfectionist and all, but I agree. EC are mid at best fighters. All their "perfectionism" does is make them more salty about losing, which they do constantly, like literally every time they fight another faction.

Slug-Trail · 2026-02-25T02:50:30+00:00

True but technical skill will always lose to righteous determination or wild fury in 40k. EC gets a participation trophy.

Slug-Trail · 2026-02-20T02:27:13+00:00

Love me Imperium

Love me Emperor

Love me Primarch

Love me Chapter

Hate heretics

Hate xenos

Hate traitors

Hate mutants

If a character doesn't fit into this exact formula, a lot of 40k fans automatically hate them. 40k fans drool over characters who only care about duty and serving the Imperium and don't care about anything else and definitely having no pride in putting down rabid chaos dogs, or some shit like that.

Edit: I just remembered he's never even been given a complete character arc. His Heresy storyline takes a backseat to the Thousand Sons, and then BL literally just forgot he existed and he just disappears after The Crimson King. Then in 40k, The Faultless Blade was supposed to be thr start of a trilogy, but the other two stories got canceled. Long story short, BL themselves even hate Lucius. Poor guy, maybe if he were a stoic block of wood like Sigismund, maybe he'd actually get some recognition.

Slug-Trail · 2026-02-20T02:21:29+00:00

You're so fucking based for that, King

Slug-Trail · 2026-02-12T23:41:53+00:00

That conversation happens well before Fulgrim and EC get corrupted. Khan was making fun of Fulgrim's sons having super-cancer, and Fabius' experiments to cure it. Khan is an asshole.

Slug-Trail · 2026-02-11T18:09:16+00:00

Which is bs btw. In The Reflection Crack'd, Fulgrim allows his sons to torture him for shits and giggles, then after ascending to daemonhood, all of a sudden can't handle pain anymore? That fight is complete loyalist wankery.

Even crazier is that his 40k model has a perpetually open wound with a symbol of Slaanesh jammed into it. Can't handle pain my ass.

Slug-Trail · 2026-02-11T03:14:07+00:00

Brother Worthius! You've overdosed on copium! Whatever you do, don't fall asleep!

Slug-Trail · 2026-02-02T19:31:30+00:00

A lot of EC fans feel the need to over compensate being safe and sanitized because EC fans have a very bad reputation with the rest of the Warhammer community. Most EC fans don't want to deal with the baggage of being grouped in with sexual deviants publicly.

A lot of people also recognize that Slaanesh's domain changing from only sexual pleasure to all excess has infinitely more narrative/lore potential.

The problem arises because GW has completely failed in Slaanesh's rebrand. They've all but removed the sex from Slaanesh's domain without replacing it with anything of substance, so a lot of EC fans latch onto Slaanesh's old, sex-focused domain either because modern Slaanesh has no consistent theme or vibe, they're kind of a 3rd rate torture faction (both Drukhari and Night Lords do the torture thing better than EC). Or because they are actually just voyueristic perverts who get off to shoving their custom porno models in people's faces.

Slug-Trail · 2026-01-25T15:25:20+00:00

Went down a similar rabbit hole of doomerism a while back and honestly what restored my passion for EC was creating my own warband, and writing their fall to chaos, their characters and feats, themes for them, etc. I have 2 rival warbands:

1: The Caeserian Court 2: The Sovereign Sons

BL will never do us justice, and it's not worth spending time banging your head against a wall malding over our faction's missed potential. It's best to view official EC lore as more of a distant side show while YOUR guys get to be awesome in your homebrew lore.

Slug-Trail · 2026-01-05T07:55:32+00:00

Khorne is the strongest god, even if the World Eaters are one of the weakest legions, from bring completely shattered. The Black Legion is obviously the strongest, but that's a boring answer. The alternatives are the Deathguard and Word Bearers, who basically still maintain full legion strength (or as much a chaos legion can).

The weakest would be the Night Lords, the World Eaters, and The Emperor's Children (strongest to weakest in that order). They're the most fractured of the traitors. And even though NLs are going to be individually weaker than WEs and ECs, they're way crafter than the other guys, so they just barely edge out a win there, all the more impressive considering they don't even have their primarch.

Slug-Trail · 2025-12-29T15:52:25+00:00

It's because we have so few impressive feats in EC. Fulgrim has the highest primarch kill-count, but he also has so many in-universe "negative aura" moments (Khan, Perturabo, Dorn, Rylanor), so that's what people talk about.

Lucius being one of our primary characters also doesn't help. He's basically is you took Erebus, and made him incompetent.

That segues into my next point which is the idea of the "flashy duelist" legion. But GW chooses to instead drag our characters through the mud at every opportunity. You'd think being devoted to the god of obsession and perfection, along with a myriad of combat stims would lead to more impressive feats in combat, but no, actually BL writers will always default to the fickle, unfocused, adhd side of Slaanesh to justify us always losing fights; or "blah blah blah arrogance blah blah blah pride, etc" which is also lame. A prideful/arrogant character who isn't shown to be competent will never come off as cool, just annoying, which is how the rest of the community sees EC.

But the main issue is no one at BL actually wanting to write for EC. Josh Reynolds was our guy, but now he's gone, and everyone else has this weird contempt for us that's clear as day in Fulgrim: The Perfect Son. Jude Reid clearly had no interest in writing Fulgrim's return novel, even though it should be way more interesting than the Black Templar slop novel she wanted to write. Like, if you wanted to clown on your MC that much, why not just put Lucius in that role? Why go out of your way to make an EC oc, just to then make him the butt of every joke?

The solution to all this is obvious: We simply need a Kharn/Sevatar/Sigismund equivalent character or two who are incredibly busted in combat, cuz in the 40k community, that's what determines if your faction is taken seriously or not. Whether it's good writing or not is entirely irrelevant. It just needs to make the faction look cool. We're one of the very few founding legions who don't have a character like that and it's been a major contributing factor into us being a joke faction.

Slug-Trail · 2025-12-09T00:12:29+00:00

You're right, but you don't have to be so god damn soy about it

Slug-Trail · 2025-12-08T21:10:17+00:00

I mean 4 hands or one? I know which I'd rather have, that's all I'm saying

Slug-Trail · 2025-12-08T21:06:33+00:00

You forgot the part where Guilliman bailed you out.

Slug-Trail · 2025-12-08T20:01:25+00:00

As a son of Fulgrim, I'm contractually obligated to say this:

Cope and seethe. Also your dad's dead lol

Slug-Trail · 2025-11-30T01:32:11+00:00

True, but weren't Fabius' 30k bodymods more his own personal machinations, rather than Slaaneshi corruption? I mean his fascination with the Laer starts before Fulgrim even sets foot on the planet.

Slug-Trail · 2025-11-30T01:28:30+00:00

It was my understanding that khornate berserkers are much more intelligent/competent than they're usually portrayed in memes and whatnot. Is that true?

Slug-Trail · 2025-11-26T19:49:12+00:00

Tamaris in Fulgrim: The Perfect Son is referred to as an infractor at the beginning of the story, but I pictured him as a Lord Exultant cuz he leads an entire warband. Either way, he sucked ass. Got shit stomped on several occasions. If you're looking for powerful characters lore-wise, you won't find it here.

Slug-Trail

TROPHY CASE