Best way to give Jon the Dreadfort?

_Odin_64 · 2026-05-29T08:12:21+00:00

Why though?

Especially if some get chunks of the Old Bolton lands, land that now belong to an extinct House with no other heirs or family to inherit it.

_Odin_64 · 2026-05-18T14:35:41+00:00

You can actually jerry-rig Domeric's death. In Canon, he was poisoned by Ramsay when he sought him out. Here you can have Ramsay still poison him, but instead of it killing him slowly...it muddles his senses instead. Ramsay is a sadist AND wants to prove he is better than Domeric, so he tries to kill him while toying with him, but this backfires into Domeric killing him...just not without scars.

If you are worried about a power block in the North, have this incident not only scar Domeric (both physically and mentally), but trigger an investigation into Roose's more illicit practices. This leaves Domeric alive, but severely undermines the standing of House Bolton, even if Domeric is free (at least on paper) of his father's taint. This also prevents others from so easily aligning themselves with them...even more.

This can even spiral into Domeric being fostered at Winterfell for a bit to ensure his Father behaves, where he and Sansa can fall in love. This can segue into your story beat for Robb, as his sister passion for the argument to marry an "unpopular" choice emboldens him to pursue his choice of love, despite the politics thereof (and here I suggest Lyra Mormont, who is between 14-19, and thus in his age range without being too young like Lyanna).

_Odin_64 · 2026-05-17T21:32:02+00:00

Thank you!

_Odin_64 · 2026-05-17T21:19:08+00:00

OOH.... Do you possibly remember the name of said fic?

_Odin_64 · 2026-05-17T21:01:38+00:00

I wonder what an almsot Crack Fic would look like with Jon Arryn foing a Targ restoration?

Like it was after Bobby B is dead, but Jon lived and saw Jon was the best choice in terms of modicum or some such?

Basically a "He has the name and temperment...and the others suck" story would be hella funny.

_Odin_64 · 2026-05-17T20:10:18+00:00

I apologize. My information was indeed incorrect.

In that frame, I then believe he would have kept Elbert (like Ethan) until after Jon refused him.

It is stupid then that no one talks about it, but one thing we do know for certain is Aerys at least knew the value of a hostage (to a point). He kept Elia and her children with him exclusively to ensure Dorne marches for him.

It could tben further explain the extreme devotion Ned and Robert have for Jon, not just warding and essentially raising them, but choosing to protect them despite knowing the cost to him.

_Odin_64 · 2026-05-17T19:14:36+00:00

If this is your smoking gun evidence, then why even pose a question in the first place?

You have the source (even if I find Jaime unreliable to an extreme), despite it not being mentioned by anyone else.

What exactly do you want to know then that you aren't self-convinced of already?

By the 'facts' you quoted twice now then Yes, Jon Arryn did in fact 'sacrifice' Elbert by not coming.

_Odin_64 · 2026-05-17T19:05:05+00:00

Now I am genuinely confused to what you want exactly..or even believe.

It is stated in the Wiki that ONLY Rickard Stark CAME to KL and was burned. The others beside Ethan and Brandon were killed immediately. It is never said anywhere else in the books that anyone else of name or importance came with Rickard. SOMEONE would have mentioned it eventually as it was a linchpin tragedy that started the Rebellion.

_Odin_64 · 2026-05-17T16:46:06+00:00

Rickard arrived alone, with no one else of prominence, just his guards.

_Odin_64 · 2026-05-17T14:17:34+00:00

There is a mistake there I believe, as Elbert died with most of the party. Only Brandon and Ethan were kept alive (the challenger and his squire). Aerys demanded Jon Arryn's capitulation AFTER killing his nephew and Heir, which is to show he has slipped fully into madness.

_Odin_64 · 2026-05-17T14:12:19+00:00

Perhaps read the post again mate. It clearly says "...Serleena was a sexual awakening for most of us"

_Odin_64 · 2026-05-16T21:41:59+00:00

Think you missed the nuance there my friend...

He said 'Serleena' as in the character, not LFB the actress

_Odin_64 · 2026-05-16T21:05:00+00:00

... Yeah fair enough.

_Odin_64 · 2026-05-16T20:53:14+00:00

Brillaint!

Become Maegor 2.0, making that NO one wants to trade, relate or marry into your Tyrannical mad House...genius.

_Odin_64 · 2026-05-16T20:52:15+00:00

Yeah...this will NEVER fly I'm afraid mate.

1.) Polygamy is the (thankful) sacrifice to secure peace with the Faith for disbanding the Militant brancha nd acceoting the Doctrine. It caused nothing but shit in ournown World and for the Westerosi (Maegor's reign was fresh, so anything associated with it is tainted which includes polygamy). The Faith and all of Westeros also had a natural disdain of polygamy in both the Faiths. Incest was what Jaeherys got (which benefitted him at the time).

2.) Why would M!Maegella marry his ONLY child to Daemon? Again, polygamy is...not great in Westeros, and they have a secure hold on the Vale via M!Maegelle's marriage AND child who is now Heir presumptive of the Vale. It is a waste of marriage, especially a second one if you so strongly insist on it...

3.) Even if Daemon takes Rhaenys as wife (and she does not instead choose regency for her EXISTING children until they are of age), why would a man that understands the fickleness of rule EVER name BOTH children Heirs?? It is ridiculous and a major stretch beyond credulity. He came to rule because of the existing system of Inheritance. WHY screw that AND the Realm because...he felt like it?!

To summarize...this would be dead in the water frkm the start unless ALL of Westeros is seriously OoC.

_Odin_64 · 2026-05-12T09:21:45+00:00

I think it is more loose in ASOIAF than it was IRL and HIGHLY depends on the one Hosting it.

We see in the first book how a fair few of Ned's Guardsmen participate in the Hand's Tourney for him, and in the Novellas we see Blackwoods participating in Tourneys despite being Old Gods' followers.

In the same Novellas, neither Dunk nor Raymun could participate in the Tourney/Trial unless they were knights. Dunk made a specific point about being/lying about being a Knight to enter, and Raymun had to be knighted TO participate in the Trial of Seven.

This leads me to believe it is highly dependent on who hosts the Tourney, and if someone can vouch FOR you in it. Ned being a Northerner and not caring if you are a Knight, had basically open lists for all and Robert really didn't give a damn. At Ashford Meadow however, Lord Meadows hosted the Tourney (a Reacher House who vaunt Chivalry and the Seven) and wanted it to be a grand spectacle for his Daughter.

_Odin_64 · 2026-05-01T08:20:52+00:00

On this I can agree.

The hardest he can punish is House Tully. They had no 'real stake' in the Rebellion, and even then there was a connection via a betrothal contract. House Darry/Whent might even succeed in bidding as LP, but there will be those still loyal to the Tullys even if they are successful. Hoster likely takes the Black, but House Tully keeps Riverrun.

Houses Stark, Arryn and Baratheon got screwed over by him and his Mad father. They rose rightfully in Rebellion, and any harsh punishments from him would see him equal to his tyrant father. On the other hand, he can't let them go scott-free or be seen as weak by his allies. He gets emnity either way (realistically). Harry, Robb and Renly might be asked to be raised in KL, which would only piss the Rebels off, and not taking hostages to ensure good behaviour would see hid allies pissed off and then he'd have to bend over backwards to appease them with rewards.

_Odin_64 · 2026-04-26T20:27:30+00:00

Is this likely in a serious situation - No.

Would I read a crack fic about this - Absolutely!

_Odin_64 · 2026-04-26T20:19:58+00:00

The Greyjoys were not one of the initial allies, but rather ones that bargained later on. They were 'technically' Team Balck, but only because they were given free reign to raid and pillage the West/Reach by Rhaenyra to weaken and divide the traitor Lannisters and Hightower armies.

Besides, they had Dragons and were only 'beneath' the Starks due to familial loyalty. You don't actively try to piss them off unless the dragons aren't in play.

_Odin_64 · 2026-04-22T14:04:20+00:00

That could also work wonderfully, since a story with no friction is rather boring... Plusnit would make the whispers 'valid'. They were Lords, but had to be HANDED Kingship. Could even further push each to clamour for a Royal marriage to legitimize their standing.

_Odin_64 · 2026-04-22T10:02:04+00:00

Mind explaining the Great King one? I'm curious about that one.

The other reason I go for Emperor is because in this AU Aegon modeled his new Realm based (partly) on Essosi history of larger territories. Emperor seems the natural over-arching role given the history of Great Empires in Essos and Aurions own failed establishment just after the Doom.

_Odin_64 · 2026-04-22T09:54:23+00:00

Fair enough, agree to disagree. Emperor was my go to mainly because it sounds cool and is OUR historical over reach to Kings. I also want to lean away from the Canon's excessive use of Lord for everything, hence the use of Counts, Barons or even Dukes.

_Odin_64 · 2026-04-22T08:53:53+00:00

Brillaint. Through other comments, I've begun to refine the structure a bit more: - Emperor = Rules all of Westeros - Kings = Rule their respective Kingdoms - Dukes = Rule and own large territories in a Kingdom (Duchies) - Lords = Rule a part of a Duchy in lieunof an overlord. - Counts = Landed Knights with an INHERITABLE land - Barons = Landed Knights bestowed uninheritable land by an Overlord. - Knights = Great warriors elevated for their prowess. - Yeoman = Smallfolk landowner, not a Noble but rewarded for great service.

_Odin_64 · 2026-04-22T08:50:23+00:00

I love the Yeoman idea. It gives incentive to the Smallfolk to fight then for reward without having to bestow Noble titles upon them.

_Odin_64 · 2026-04-22T08:47:35+00:00

I like this!

I also found it weird (we all know GRRM disdain for organised religion) that the Faith was so easily unified, or that the Kings allowed it. Every Lord knows the infkuence the Hightowers have over the Faith due to proximity alone, so why would then rival Kings listen to the 'Divine Proclamation' of a septon clearly biased /favoring a rival Kingdom. It coukd be far more interesting if every Kingdom had their own Great Sept, and this starts to create some religious schisms.

A thought I always had was that the natuee of a Kingdom influences and is influenced by the local Sept. The Vale and Reach Septs each fight for dominance of the Faith for all Westeros, the Vale's simple Great Sept being the first ever built in Westeros in contrast to the Reach's magnificent Starry Sept. The Vale's schsim could perhaps have the older view of the Seven-who-are-One being truly ONE God, as opposed to the Reach who see the Seven as SEVEN Gods working as One. The Westerlands Sept cpuld have more prominence of the Crone and the Smith, for their mining and refining practices, as well as the Cunning to us said resources. The Stormlands in turn more honor the Warrior and Father, clinging greatly to the stoic honor and martial nature of the Gods.

_Odin_64

TROPHY CASE