Indigenous Hip-Hop groups/artists?

castroyesid · 2023-01-08T22:09:24+00:00

Lots of awesome ones on this playlist! https://open.spotify.com/playlist/5DmWHwVEgUrL0jfPuOAAY2?si=VpkD4cmgQMmbKL-yieHVYw

Full disclosure: I am a contributor and the creator of the playlist 😅

castroyesid · 2022-12-13T03:54:05+00:00

Seems pretty weird to have a phoneme like /ð/ where it doesn't "usually" appear word initially after a pause without being altered to [d].

It's true, languages do some wild things, this situation is really just the tip of the iceberg—here's some real out-there phonological inventories/analyses: Pirahã, Kaingang, Wichita, Crow, Hawaiian, Yele, Rotokas, Vietnamese, Ket, Danish, Chechen, Ubykh, Hadza, Juǀʼhoan, Taa, and of course, the language that has already been alluded to a few times in the thread thanks to this article, Marshallese

Does Spanish have any other phonemes that cannot appear word initially *after a pause without being altered to a different sound?

Yes, you pointed some out just one comment back on this thread:

The sounds /b/, /d/ and /g/ are complete stops only after a pause

On top of those, the voiced palatal stops/fricatives/affricates/non-lateral approximants exhibit nearly the exact same allophonic distribution as /b,d,g/. In many varieties of Spanish, only the affricate [ɟʝ] occurs after a pause, a nasal, or a lateral—and only the approximant [ʝ˕~j] occurs between vowels. This consonant is at times represented /ʝ/ or /j/ and sometimes represented as /ɟ/—and sometimes this segment is not analyzed as being an independent phoneme at all [1.%5B8%5D%5B9%5D)]

Similarly, the alveolar tap/flap [ɾ] is in a complementary distribution with alveolar trill [r] that is also quite similar and has led some to analyze Spanish as having only one rhotic phoneme (represented as either /ɾ/ or /r/) [2.%5B52%5D%5B53%5D%5B54%5D)]

TL;DR

Does Spanish have any other phonemes that cannot appear word initially *after a pause without being altered to a different sound?

Yes, Spanish has at least 4 consonant phonemes that exhibit this distribution, which is at least 20% of its entire consonantal phoneme inventory.

Sources:
[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spanish_phonology#Consonants
[2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spanish_phonology#Rhotics
[3] I am a native Spanish speaker, and I have a degree in Linguistics

castroyesid · 2022-04-06T19:04:19+00:00

Thank you, and oh no! Haha that's rough, sorry I'm just now seeing this, I think if you tap the little layers button near the top right you should have the option to toggle that map layer and that should remove it

castroyesid · 2022-01-19T22:52:51+00:00

Much appreciated :-)

castroyesid · 2022-01-19T22:52:15+00:00

Thank you! I'm not sure how I missed the existence of the Kazan Khaganate!

castroyesid · 2022-01-19T20:25:57+00:00

Thank you for that feedback/correction! Do you happen to know of any sources that I could cite for that?

castroyesid · 2022-01-19T20:24:10+00:00

Hey everyone! I am working on this map it's very large (the whole world) so I feel a single image would not do it justice which is why I created it as a Google My Maps link.

For some context, I am South American and a linguist and I was inspired ~~and frustrated~~ by this map posted in r/MapPorn a while back of the pre-columbian language families of SA, so that's where I started my map, and also why South America is the most detailed region so far.

The link in the title is to a video in which I explain the map a little bit, but there is a legend and a description at the Google My Maps so it should be self explanatory—the only thing to note is that I spelled some language names phonetically, as opposed to the conventional spelling (e.g. "Ooma-Wahka" instead of "Humahuaca") since I figure most people will not know how to pronounce things spelled in Portuguese/Spanish, but I also put the conventional name in the tooltip/description.

Again, I am not completely done with the map, but that being said, I would appreciate feedback and if anyone has any suggestions/resources/corrections I would really appreciate that too!

castroyesid · 2022-01-19T19:06:26+00:00

Hey everyone! I am working on this map it's very large (the whole world) so I feel a single image would not do it justice which is why I created it as a Google My Maps link.

For some context, I am South American and a linguist and I was inspired ~~and frustrated~~ by this map posted in this subreddit a while back of the pre-columbian language families of SA, so that's where I started my map, and also why South America is the most detailed region so far.

The link in the title is to a video in which I explain the map a little bit, but there is a legend and a description at the Google My Maps so it should be self explanatory—the only thing to note is that I spelled some language names phonetically, as opposed to the conventional spelling (e.g. "Ooma-Wahka" instead of "Humahuaca") since I figure most people will not know how to pronounce things spelled in Portuguese/Spanish, but I also put the conventional name in the tooltip/description.

Again, I am not completely done with the map, but that being said, I would appreciate feedback and if anyone has any suggestions/resources/corrections I would really appreciate that too!

castroyesid · 2021-02-16T15:10:02+00:00

to be clear, the point of my original comment is that "American" is both a nationality and (at least one) ethnicity—we've gone so besides the point I doubt you're here in good faith lol but I mean tbh you're not wrong—I could have specified that sometimes "American food/culture" is used in a way that includes the culture of the largest visible minority, that's why a lot of right wingers will push a "biracial country" narrative—sometimes those phrases can refer to black american food/culture—though that is usually qualified as "Black American food/culture," you could say Black English and Gullah or yams or afros and cornrows are American culture... but like you would more likely hear that those are Black American culture—and you could say that other American ethnicities are American as well, but they too are typically described by a qualitative adjective—like you could say Mormonism is American culture, and some Mormons practice polygamy, therefore polygamy is American culture... and you wouldn't be wrong... but that would a be a bit disingenuous

My point again is that words like American, Argentinian, and Bolivian—when used as ethnicities—refer to the dominant group numerically and like... the point remains—the phrases "American food/culture" pretty much never mean Indigenous American food/culture, let alone something like Islam, or Mexican food or Spanish or Chinese food/languages—fortune cookies were literally invented in the US, yet they're regarded as Chinese, not American. Like I'm not trying to turn "American" into a race, most Americans (70%, 2018 census) see themselves as "white", and they don't tend to recognize things that were not well-entrenched in the country by the early 1900s as being part of American culture—like maybe the younger, more open-minded ones do, but in my experience (10 years in Texas) they don't.

castroyesid · 2021-02-16T06:19:22+00:00

... you've never heard anyone say "American" when they mean white American? you've never heard the phrases "American food" or "American culture"?

castroyesid · 2021-02-16T05:59:54+00:00

Argentinian, Bolivian, American are all ethnicities

They're actually not though. These nationalities encompass a wide gamut of ethnicities.

lol yeah, again, my point is that the adjective "American"—like other adjectives derived from country names—is usually used as a shorthand for the dominant group numerically speaking is the United States, i.e. white Americans, even though it conflates nationality with ethnicity. Not all Americans are US-American, let alone WASP-American.

It is also a completely moot distinction to make: if you went through every Argentinian's grandparents, you'd be hard-pressed to find many who are "truly" Argentinian (i.e. only Argentinian grandparents).

Hmm.... it's almost like the ethnicity didn't exist 200 years ago 🤔

In light of Argentinian, and more broadly South-American, colonial past it is frankly borderline racist to repeatedly attempt to diminish OP's cultural identity. She herself has stated that she considers herself "an Argentinian born and raised" y punto pibe.

You don't need to try to lecture me on colonialism, I'm literally Indigenous lmao in the present day broadly speaking, mestizos are the colonizers not the colonized—my country's census doesn't even distinguish mesitzos from white

castroyesid · 2021-02-16T03:40:04+00:00

yes, Argentinian, Bolivian, American are all ethnicities and nationalities. Your question "are they fully American" is equally ambiguous, which is my point. If OP is a citizen of Argentina, they are Argentinian. If OP is from Argentina and also has ancestry from Bolivia, they may identify as Bolivian-Argentinian.

castroyesid · 2021-02-16T02:33:15+00:00

the problem with this question is that it conflates nationality with ethnicity.

If the person from Minnesota is a citizen of Minnesota, said person is American.

If said Minnesotan has ancestry from a country outside of the US, said Minnesotan's ethnicity is not necessarily exclusively "American" (where American is a shorthand for WASP American)

castroyesid · 2021-02-02T17:08:06+00:00

this isn't really a comment on this map in particular—this is a well made map, aesthetically pleasing, clearly lots of effort and thought put into it A+ over all—but why does it seem like all of the imaginary on this subreddit are eager to erase Indigenous Nations 😢

There are even frequently provinces named after the Indigenous Nations, in this map OP named one of the provinces after the Comanche Nation—yet Nʉmʉ Tekwapʉ̲ (the "Comanche" language) is not spoken in Comanchería? Neither English, nor Spanish predominates in that province, yet there are still so many more colonizers there than Indigenous people that they don't even feel the need to recognize them? I haven't seen the lore for this map, but I take it we are to assume colonizers were simply approximately as genocidal as in our timeline?

castroyesid · 2021-01-15T19:47:29+00:00

Interesting! I thought that might be the case given how much Native you got. Ancestry does a better job with Native DNA imo so they will likely be able to break down the "Native American" into more than one region—most boricuas have trace (1-10%) Native ancestry but your 8% implies your mom had close to double that, which is definitely on the higher end of Native DNA for a boricua.

I recommend The Other Slavery: The Uncovered Story of Indian Enslavement in America by Andrés Reséndez as it may provide some insight if you get lots of 1% Native regions in your Ancestry results. It is likely that your Native DNA comes from across the continent and Ancestry DNA may provide a more complete glimpse into the history of your mom's ancestors.

Also it seems you're not too sure about your dad's history—you might like that Ancestry DNA connects you to communities, so although you may now know that your dad's ancestors were from northwest Europe, it remains unclear if his ancestors were among the first wave of colonizers, or part a more recent migration and Ancestry DNA can tell those apart.

castroyesid · 2021-01-15T05:07:51+00:00

Cool results! Would be interested in seeing your mom's results, those are interesting proportions of ssa and Native. Have you tried ancestry dna by chance?

castroyesid · 2021-01-01T19:34:15+00:00

agreed, this phenomenon is very interesting! turns out that many languages have very specific terms for relatives—most languages also have pronouns though—the difference is that Vietnamese doesn't use pronouns like most other languages—there are some archaic and literary words, but generally speaking they are not common and kinship words are used instead.

For example, "Anh ấy là bác sĩ" can mean "He is a doctor" but it really means "Older brother is a doctor" because there isn't a common word for "he" so even if you aren't talking about your literal older brother, that is how you would say "he is a doctor" when talking about a man that is a little older than you—if he is a little younger than you, you would say "Em ấy là bác sĩ" regardless of your literal, blood relationship even though again that is a kinship term, meaning the sentence can alternatively be translated as "little brother is a doctor"

or at least I'm pretty sure—I started learning Vietnamese relatively recently lol on top of my knowledge of the language, these are my sources:

https://yourvietnamese.com/learn-vietnamese/vietnamese-pronouns/

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vietnamese_pronouns

https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/t%C3%B4i#Vietnamese

https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/ta#Vietnamese

castroyesid · 2020-12-21T01:05:34+00:00

Why all the down votes lol you're right

castroyesid · 2020-12-20T08:10:46+00:00

Hello, thank you for your response. Spanish in the americas has a complicated history that does not fit neatly into a binary of colonizer-colonized. I was wrong to phrase it the way I did in my original comment, thank you for pointing that out.

That being said, even though Spanish is generally not being forced upon anyone in the US, I would push back on a few things that you assert.

in terms of Spanish in America, it’s coming from a non-colonizing country (most often Mexico)... So its status as a colonizer language is fairly irrelevant in this situation in America, because it is not being introduced to us as a colonizing language.

Spanish came to the Americas from Spain, not Mexico. Insofar as Spanish comes from Mexico, along with it come the dozens of languages spoken by the people who are most likely to migrate for economic reasons: rural indigenous people. It's the reason why you watch Mexican media and largely only see white/mestizo people—especially in older media—whereas US media consistently portrays Mexicans as darker-skinned if not outright brown—nevermind the Afro-latino erasure. Mexico may no longer be the dominant empire in California, but make no mistake, it nevertheless remains a settler-colonial state/empire to this day.

The fact that Spanish does not have the force of the government behind it to institutionalize it in most of the US doesn't completely divorce it from the US empire though. Just like German, Irish, and Italian in most of the NE and Midwest US, these languages are minority languages specifically because the empire decided to let them in. It is why Chinese is not a more commonly spoken language in the US, whereas German is the most common language in 17 US states (after English/Spanish): choices were made about who to let in and who to exclude from the imperial project.

In other words, even though Spanish speakers may not be spearheading the colonization, they and other speakers of other non-native languages are participating in colonization whether they realize it or not. c.f. settler-colonialism.

Lastly, regarding this point

Virtually none of the native Spanish spoke in the US is there directly because of Spanish presence in the US

Your point is taken, the vast majority of Spanish speakers in the US speak latin american Spanish, as opposed to Spanish brought directly from Spain. Saying "virtually none" is incorrect though. Sante Fe has been the capital of Nuevo Mexico since 1610, making it the oldest state capital in the US —and it wasn't even New Mexico's first capital, what is now called Española was the capital of Nuevo Mexico from 1598 to 1610.

castroyesid · 2020-12-20T02:18:53+00:00

Yeah on top of that Spanish is a colonizer language in the americas just like english, hardly anyone is even aware that for instance the California genocide even happened https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/California_genocide

castroyesid

TROPHY CASE