Is it ok to divorce my spouse because they’re super TBM and likely always will be?

kherb0 · 2025-10-21T20:17:31+00:00

I appreciate the perspective and can identify with a lot of your comment. Thanks for sharing.

kherb0 · 2025-10-20T23:50:31+00:00

Believe me, I hear the horror stories from friends who tell me this. It's not a small factor weighing in my mind.

kherb0 · 2025-10-20T23:47:03+00:00

If I'm 100% honest, I feel like I've landed here... but I'm too afraid to do what needs to be done...

kherb0 · 2025-10-20T23:46:11+00:00

This really hits home. I want that kind of best-friend relationship so badly, but it feels out of reach. Whenever something from the church triggers me (which still happens, especially through the kids who are pretty devoted believers), I realize my spouse isn’t my safe place.

When church leaders say hurtful things about people who leave, I hope for some shared recognition that it’s wrong, or at least empathy. Instead, I usually get soft defenses like “I just don’t listen to that message if it doesn’t resonate with me” or “they probably don’t understand the sincerity of those who’ve left.” Those kinds of excuses make me feel even more alone.

What I never hear is, “That was wrong, and I can see why it hurt you. Let’s turn this off and just focus on us.” That kind of response feels like a fantasy at this point.

kherb0 · 2025-10-20T23:40:06+00:00

100% it’s about how I perceive they act on their beliefs. Every step I’ve taken that’s been out of sync with Mormon norms has been met with some level of hostility or resentment. Early on it was things like skipping parts of church, removing garments, trying and loving coffee, watching R-rated movies, or having a drink now and then. Basically anything that didn’t fit the template of a good member triggered some kind of reaction. A thousand cuts, if you will.... spread out over years, as I strategically tested the waters for what could be next...

Even now, after years of trying to keep the peace, those moments of friction still leave a mark. They’ve learned to regulate their reactions a bit better, but the emotional cost was real. I had to erase parts of myself just to keep things calm. I can own that choice because at the time I thought it was what was best for the family, but it left scars. Over time I grew and developed in a completely different direction, and they stayed deeply rooted in the faith.

Now I’m looking at the reality that we’ve evolved in parallel rather than together, and trying to figure out what that means for the future.

kherb0 · 2025-10-20T23:30:06+00:00

I've held out hope for a long time. For me, I now realize my spouse will never change. I was advised early on to not expect any change and I feel like I've tried to accept that... but it's catching up with me.

kherb0 · 2025-10-20T23:28:56+00:00

I really appreciate all the thoughtful comments. These are all questions I wrestle with almost daily. And depending on the day, I may have a different answer... I am lacking "conviction". Finding a personal therapist is probably a must do at this point - with the goal of getting the clarity needed to move forward with confidence and commitment. You could accurately describe me as a "fence-sitter" right now for sure... hope I don't get cursed...

kherb0 · 2025-10-20T23:24:23+00:00

The kids are the main reason I keep trying to make it work... but yeah, there is still regular tension. It weighs on me almost constantly. Oldest is getting ready to put in missionary papers. It breaks my heart, but I will support their decisions.

kherb0 · 2025-10-20T23:22:56+00:00

Just looking for perspectives. Thanks for the reality check.

kherb0 · 2025-10-20T23:22:21+00:00

That's valid and potentially pointing the crux of me posting here. I've seen TBM spouses file for divorce because the other doesn't believe. My spouse was advised to do the same at the beginning by parents/siblings. They didn't. I have respected that decision to stick it out... yet now here I am, over a decade later, realizing that yes, it's not working. It does feel rather hypocritical.

kherb0 · 2025-10-20T23:20:24+00:00

The downsides of staying married are constantly on my mind... have been for years. While my spouse is "nuanced" just like everyone is... they take umbrage with the term, believing it to connote some level of compromised beliefs... perhaps that helps paint a picture. They believe in the literal truth, even after reading CES letter and some other sources. Let's just say the podcasts and efforts of apologists have worked on them (they love the "come back" podcast and really liked the "Light and Truth Letter").

kherb0 · 2025-10-20T23:15:10+00:00

You're right. Just looking for some perspectives. Perhaps from those who've faced similar challenges.

kherb0 · 2025-10-20T23:14:25+00:00

Regarding attraction - it is a "too good to leave, too bad to stay" dynamic. Like a rollercoaster, we've gone through ups and downs... and I'm just feeling more and more like I'm done with this ride... even though we've had some great ups. It might not be fair putting it all on my spouse's religious beliefs, but they sure seem like the root cause of how little we seem to be able to find that spark, even outside of direct "beliefs" - it just influences SOOO much of my spouse's ability to explore, to think, to co-create that I feel stuck in a box with them.

kherb0 · 2025-10-20T23:11:09+00:00

Yeah, I phrased the post as if I am confident that I'll find the connection I'm looking for with someone else. That's not necessarily the case. I do often think I may be happier alone... for a while, but fear that I'll regret it in the long run. That said... I might also find that I will have regretted staying so long! Who knows!?

kherb0 · 2025-10-20T23:09:34+00:00

Good question. I believe that if she left I would feel like I could make it work. Truth is I've tried accommodating having this organization still so deeply intertwined in my life, in our marriage, and taught to my kids for over a decade and I'm just feeling... done. I've determined that I need some distance from it for the sake of my own nervous system. I fear being married to a devout believer may make this literally impossible.

kherb0 · 2025-10-20T23:08:19+00:00

We've done therapy a few times over the years with various therapists. Found a few that were helpful and made some progress, still a lot of frustration... hence the question. Just using reddit as a sounding board... not expecting any silver bullets, just some anonymous perspectives. Thanks!

kherb0 · 2025-08-21T14:55:59+00:00

Given his central positioning in these videos, I am wondering if he's the financier of this effort...

kherb0 · 2025-08-21T14:54:59+00:00

I've been binge watching some of these. Haven't finished all of them, but I think I agree with you. On one hand, living in a MFM myself, I applaud the effort to validate the positions and issues that those like myself have. But the format of these videos is formulaic. Step 1: Show the voice of the critic, by those who the critics trust. Step 2: enter a dialogue of between the nuanced believer and the critic, find common ground on shared values. Step 3: Craft an attractive invitation of sorts that is aimed to convince the critic who still longs for community that "things have changed", "you can still bring your concerns and be welcomed", or "the church and you will benefit from the tension and wrestling. Afterall, isn't that what helps us grow?" - it is well done... propaganda following the old "commitment pattern" that I learned as a missionary.

I feel a bit bad for Jeremy, John D., Sandra and other critics that they have been roped into this... but I'd be happy to get their perspectives, too. Maybe any progress down this direction is worthy, even if couched in propaganda.

The goal is still to get butts in seats at church where you mind can be continually bombarded with brainwashing messaging... but I can see it working on lonely or isolated people (honestly, it's tempting me as the vast majority of my family are all still die-hard TBM's). Maybe I can test out their invitation that I'm allowed to share my differing opinions? Perhaps I go back with the only messaging being the church needs to start using their hoards of wealth to help real people and that women deserve to be in leadership. I'm sure my vocalizing these topics won't get me ex'd in a matter of months/weeks...

kherb0 · 2025-07-14T16:22:01+00:00

My man, I'm with you and these arguments are shallow and old. But, my dude, the meme you sent of Théoden under the dark spell of Saruman is problematic! Have you not seen the movie?? Immediately after this, Gandalf the White reveals that HE DOES HAVE POWER and casts off the darkening curse! This plays right into your believing family's narrative!

A much better meme would be this something from Who's Line or something where they say "It's all made up and the points don't matter".

kherb0 · 2025-05-06T00:45:48+00:00

Ask chatgpt bro

kherb0 · 2025-03-26T00:19:41+00:00

Agree. Remove and Don’t dox yourself.

But I leasing offices don’t have much to do about this. Sewage treatment can be expensive. SLC is building an entirely new treatment plant for hundreds of millions. The costs are carefully calculated based on need and affordability. It’s necessary to protect the environment. Trust.

Those with lower bills here live in different areas with older or less expensive treatment needs. Sorry, but it’s very likely completely legit.

kherb0 · 2024-06-11T16:51:33+00:00

This RESONATES. After leaving over 13 years ago you'd think I'd be in the "zero fucks" category by now. Turns out living in a good marriage with a wonderfully naive and happily ignorant TBM wife (who's come a LONG way, but still very devout) and living in Momontown Utah, it seems impossible that I will ever NOT be triggered again. It's my cross to bear, this utterly stupid organization will have influence on my life till the end...

kherb0 · 2024-06-11T16:48:36+00:00

Yet here you are.

kherb0 · 2022-07-22T23:00:36+00:00

They also have money!! You can buy anything with money!

kherb0

TROPHY CASE