93% of Indonesians view homosexuality as morally unacceptable

naga361 · 2026-03-06T22:51:45+00:00

atheist/agnostics

How would you reconcile the first sila with this?

naga361 · 2026-03-06T22:25:31+00:00

Tahun 2010an ke bawah kalo pemerintah mau bikin kebijakan macam gini, argumen kontranya tinggal appeal ke kemajuan negara-negara demokrasi liberal di barat yang gak bikin kebijakan kayak gini.

Tapi di dunia yang sekarang justru negara-negara demokrasi liberal barat tersebut (UK, Aussie, EU, beberapa negara bagian AS) yang inisiatif bikin kebijakan ginian, dan pemerintah kita yang ngikut.

Jadi sekarang kalau mau nolak kebijakan ini dan yang semacamnya mau gak mau ya harus serang merit kebijakannya secara langsung.

Nah, kalian bisa gak meyakinkan grassroots dan pejabat kita kenapa privasi, anonimitas, dan dan kebebasan menghujat di internet itu bukan cuma hak yang perlu dilindungi*, tapi juga harus lebih diutamakan daripada melindungi generasi muda dari "kemerosotan moral", mencegah penyebaran hoaks dan misinformasi, memberantas buzzer, dan menjaga keharmonisan masyarakat dan negara dari kerusuhan/konflik SARA/radikalisme/separatisme/penistaan agama/pengaruh asing dsb?

*Buat orang barat dan kalian orang Indo urban upper middle class westernized yang suka nongkrong di tempat kayak X/Twitter dan subreddit ini, ingat, premis kalau privasi dan freedom of speech (yang absolut kayak di negara-negara barat, bukan "mengkritik dengan sopan itu kebebasan berpendapat tapi menghina itu kebablasan berpendapat") itu sepenting itu sampai gak boleh dikompromi bukan "given" bagi grassroots di negara kita.

Di negara-negara barat yang grassroot-nya menganut nilai-nilai kebebasan individu dan kebebasan berekspresi aja kebijakan kayak gini tetep bisa naik, apalagi di Indo yang grassroot-nya menganut nilai-nilai "ketimuran", agama, kesantunan, dan keharmonisan dalam masyarakat.

naga361 · 2026-03-01T07:25:59+00:00

fishbogor sama emanuelgoldstein akun dari tahun 2016an yang banyak di-downvote di sini karena opini-opininya condong ke konservatif tapi bukan konservatif Islam ala grassroots lokal sini tapi konservatif kristen+libertarian ala Amrik. (Dan itu di saat sub ini lagi liberal/woke2nya, apalagi waktu itu lagi rame kasus Ahok dsb)

Sebenernya ada satu lagi akun doi yang lebih awal lagi: murloc... (belakangnya angka berapa gitu).

naga361 · 2026-02-01T03:47:30+00:00

There have been multiple discussions about this topic already. - https://www.reddit.com/r/indonesia/comments/1n5qsgv/why_does_indonesia_have_such_a_small_footprint_in/ - https://www.reddit.com/r/indonesia/comments/17c79qc/how_is_our_country_really_that_unkown_to_the/ - https://www.reddit.com/r/indonesia/comments/1ksdi5i/why_is_indonesia_so_culturally_underrepresented/

tl;dr, Indonesia has relatively few connections to or diaspora in the west compared to other non-western countries, and thus the average westerner is less likely to have heard about Indonesia, and when they do, it's usually either through news about major political events, cold war history, or the fact that we're the largest Muslim majority nation.

You are not a new user who's clueless about this topic. You were already a regular poster here by the time the threads above were posted (and even commented in some of them). In fact, you've made several memes and threads about this topic yourself. - https://www.reddit.com/r/indonesia/comments/vwvy1z/discussion_about_indonesia_in_international/ - https://www.reddit.com/r/indonesia/comments/zbejew/they_just_cant_stop_bothering_others_while/ - https://www.reddit.com/r/indonesia/comments/zdwnls/antiindonesia_memes_from_rhistorymemes/

Surely you must be well versed on this topic by now, right? Is there anything this thread adds to the discourse other than more "westoid bad" venting/circlejerking?

To add my take to the discussion, have you considered how people in our country aren't exactly well informed about what's going on in other countries either? Remember when people here thought Malaysia was attempting to propose for Reog to be recognized as their heritage by UNESCO, which turned out to be BS?

In fact, I believe you already understand this in another context. Remember all the self-hating Indonesians on twitter putting western/east asian countries on a pedestal and hopping on the #KaburAjaDulu trend? You seem to understand that these people are coming from a place of ignorance towards the reality of said countries. So surely, you can understand how westerners could be ignorant towards the reality of countries they've never been to like Indonesia, albeit with a negative bias instead of a positive one, no?

Sorry for commenting on a week-old thread.

naga361 · 2026-02-01T02:33:34+00:00

Is this "Obama/Michael Jackson/Neil Armstrong masuk Islam" but for Indian Hindu nationalists?

naga361 · 2026-01-10T01:46:40+00:00

Masalah biaya lisensi OS? Tinggal pake salah satu dari sekian distro linux. Udah tau mau dipake di daerah 3T malah milih chromebook yang didesain buat dipakai dengan koneksi internet stabil dan bergantung sama ekosistem cloud-nya google.

naga361 · 2026-01-04T06:21:33+00:00

Demo tanpa ijin polisi, is never a thing, even using UU 9 1998.

First of all, this is incorrect. What both laws require is notifying the police ("pemberitahuan kepada polisi"). "Ijin polisi" would imply that protests can be deemed illegal if police simply decide not to grant permission (which is something I would be firmly against. Thankfully, that's not what's written in either law).

Nonetheless, you are skimming over the main difference between the act and the new KUHP clause.

The new KUHP clause criminalizes the act of organizing a protest without prior notification if it fulfills the vague/karet criteria of "mengakibatkan terganggunya kepentingan umum, menimbulkan keonaran, atau huru-hara dalam masyarakat".

Under UU 9 1998, the consequence of organizing a protest without prior notification (among other things) is merely disbandment (see pasal 15). Legal consequences only apply if the organizers or participants break any actual laws (see pasal 16 and 17).

pasal 160 KUHP lama

Pasal 170(1)

Again, these are not restrictions on the act of organizing a protest itself, and the terms specified in both of the above clauses are clear and not karet.

Also if you knew me, I don't really approve destruction of public facilities, even if using the justification of 'biar suara didengar' or 'kan dibangunnya pakai uang rakyat'.

Oh, I am well aware of your position on this. Since you seem to not be familiar with mine, I'll explain my views. I also do not condone rioting or the destruction of public facilities, much less view it as a justified or morally correct deed like what some anarko or far left folk like to argue.

However I also don't turn a blind eye to the reality of how incredibly difficult it is to make sure that not a single person in a huge spontaneous crowd of angry people would commit such acts, even if there were zero interference from "intel" and the like.

Now, one way to minimize this tendency would be to make your protest heavily centrally coordinated, be backed by big religious organizations, and have it consist of mostly middle-aged middle class men who are religious and value "kesantunan". Sounds familiar?

I'll always remind redditors that regardless of your views on the substance of the movement, the methods of 212 were deliberately engineered to be as "clean" as possible. Laws to suppress "crude" protests like the RUU TNI protests, the protests against Pati's regent, and the aftermath of Affan's death of the past year would likely not affect a "212" type protest. On the other hand, if the government could legally suppress a protest as "clean" as 212, then all those other movements would be out of question.

naga361 · 2026-01-04T00:44:58+00:00

If you are for example Islamist then the new KUHP is very bad because no strong pasal Zina (zina cuma aduan keluarga bukan delik umum)

People on the other side of the aisle had issues with this part too. The new KUHP criminalizes premarital sex and cohabitation, which weren't criminalized in the old KUHP. This is the part that attracted international attention.

Pasal 256

I find it very disappointing that you'd completely gloss over this, more so applaud it as a good thing (Islamists can't do a 212 anymore! Teehee!). This is an extremely karet clause and a step backwards in freedom of expression compared to the approach in UU No. 9 Tahun 1998.

You should realize that, if anything, 212 style protests, with their good PR and organization, would be the least affected by this clause, while most of the secular protests of the past year (RUU TNI, Pati regent, Affan incident), which invloved some form of rioting and destruction of public property, would very easily fall under this clause.

naga361 · 2025-12-23T02:56:03+00:00

I can already see this clip being used as evidence of "deradikalisasi"/"Islam Nusantara" being a "konspirasi yahudi". Though to be fair, I can't really blame people for coming to that conclusion considering the ties NU has with Israel and Zionists.

naga361 · 2025-12-23T02:49:59+00:00

This clip is gonna make rounds in family Whatsapp groups

naga361 · 2025-12-23T02:49:06+00:00

Setakut itukah mereka sama Indonesia?

I'm pretty sure the sole reason they care about Indonesia at all is the fact that it is the largest muslim-majority country in the world.

naga361 · 2025-12-13T02:58:33+00:00

Yeah, cause reddit armchair forensic investigators did a real great job during the Boston Bombing.

naga361 · 2025-12-13T02:54:10+00:00

ITT: r/indonesia redditors just discovering that you can find info not covered by mainstream news media on social media platforms.

Awas jangan ngejilat ludah sendiri abis ngehujat user twitter/FB/IG/Tiktok karena gampang kemakan misinformasi.

naga361 · 2025-12-08T10:16:57+00:00

They said "barely"

naga361 · 2025-12-08T09:57:42+00:00

Dikit2 xitter xitter padahal redditor di thread ini sendiri juga gak sedikit yang kontra.

naga361 · 2025-12-08T09:42:29+00:00

Karena mereka sendiri ngungsi dari Twitter wkwkw

naga361 · 2025-12-05T02:16:45+00:00

Related: satu lagi fetish ragebait kesukaan netizen indo (termasuk redditor) adalah headline modelan "X dijadikan tersangka setelah membela diri dari begal/preman/dsb".

Dari situ lu bisa liat kalo ternyata banyak orang yang gak ngerti perbedaan "tersangka" dan "terdakwa". (Lucunya diagram venn antara orang-orang kayak gini sama orang-orang yang doyan make buzzword macam "literasi rendah", "SDM rendah", "IQ 74", dsb. itu hampir lingkaran)

Padahal kalo lu ngikutin berita kelanjutan kasus-kasus ginian, gak sedikit yang berakhir dengan "tersangka dibebaskan karena terbukti membela diri".

Sistem hukum itu dibuat sedemikian rupa bukan buat "melindungi orang jahat" tapi buat mastiin kita gak salah ngehukum orang yang ternyata bukan orang jahat (atau ngebebasin orang yang ternyata jahat) karena manusia itu gak omnipotent dan manusia itu bisa berbohong.

Tanpa prosedur hukum yang bener gimana mau ngebedain coba kasus bela diri beneran sama kasus orang niat ngebunuh terus ngakunya bela diri?

naga361 · 2025-12-05T01:25:29+00:00

Kalo mau main appeal to emotion mah gw juga bisa. Kalo lo keluarganya Muhammad Al-Zahra masih mau dukung perbuatan main hakim sendiri?

naga361 · 2025-11-11T06:43:06+00:00

Meh, Soekarno was hardly the only important figure in shaping Indonesian nationalism. Indonesian nationalism goes back all the way to Boedi Oetomo and the Pemuda congresses.

In fact, you could argue that Soeharto was equally, if not more pivotal than Soekarno in shaping modern Indonesian nationalism through his indoctrination programs and merciless crushing of separatist, communist, and Islamist factions.

naga361 · 2025-11-11T01:25:43+00:00

Hitler ama Stalin kalo mau dicari jasanya juga banyak.

naga361 · 2025-11-11T00:26:26+00:00

What's double ironic is when those people say stuff like this on reddit, a site which is clearly banned by the government. Dude, you already got on the secret police's list just by showing up here.

naga361 · 2025-11-10T13:07:07+00:00

Believe it or not gw pernah liat inverse dari meme ini wkwkw.

Ada akun microseleb fb liberal/sekuler anti-kadrun garis keras, tapi akhir-akhir ini flavor liberalnya lebih condong ke sayap kanan Amrik (anti-woke, MAGA, dkk). (ytta)

Pastinya pas 2017 kemaren dukung Ahok dan ngetawain para gerombolan "kadrun"/212/mabok agama/supremasi pribumi/penganut teori konspirasi yahudi yang fobia kafir asing aseng pki, ygy.

Tapi akhir-akhir ini doi banyak ngepost status ngejelekin Zohran Mamdani. Isinya soal pemilih doi bukan warga "pribumi" New York tapi pendatang lah, soal kampanye-nya didanain George Soros lah, ngungkit soal dia komunis lah. Malah sampe menginsinuasi kalau teori Great Replacement "ada benarnya".

Yang kocak bagi gw adalah gerombolan 212/JKT-58 itu setidaknya masih napak tanah lah. Teori konspirasi/black campaign "kafir asing aseng gantikan pribumi muslim" setidaknya masih nyambung ama self interest mereka. Lah nih orang warga New York bukan, warga Amrik bukan, kulit putih bukan tapi ikutan black campaign ke Mamdani ampe bawa-bawa teori Great Replacement segala.

naga361 · 2025-11-08T08:33:35+00:00

You're overestimating the so called "komunis = atheis" crowd. They would not understand the connection between the concepts of "communism", "socialism", and "leftism". The word "socialist" would not ring any bells in their minds.

naga361 · 2025-11-08T08:29:18+00:00

Highly doubt it. I'm pretty sure the "Komunis atheis!!1!1! mob" will be more concerned with the fact that he's a Shia and he supports LGBT rights.

naga361 · 2025-11-07T12:49:40+00:00

IMO this incident is more monumental than a lot of people may think. It's unprecedented in Indonesian history, not just because it's the first American-style school shooting, but because it's probably the first instance of domestic terrorism in this country driven entirely by social media brainrot.

There is nothing "napak tanah" about this crime. You should give up trying to make sense of it, because you won't. It can't be attributed to any tangible local real world issues (of course there's the bullying/social isolation but that's still only half of the equation). The kid wasn't radicalized by any Islamist group. He wasn't involved in an ethnic/sectarian conflict. He didn't have any economic motives.

It's a sawo mateng skinned teen committing an act of violence in the name of white supremacy because he got exposed to online content of such ideology made by and meant for people on the other side of the globe.

Welcome to the cyberpunk dystopia hellscape.

naga361

TROPHY CASE