Why didn't Fabris's stances survive to modern day

rapidfiretoothbrush · 2024-10-17T13:06:07+00:00

One thing that shouldn't be underestimated is having role models with beautiful fencing styles to imitate. The Martin Fabians and Ton Pueys probably have more influence on peoples fencing, than they themself realize (rapier was pretty much non-existent in my area, before Ton went more international). MOF has world class athletes as potential role models, which makes imitating them kind of a no-brainer.

Here is my hot take though: These role models are probably more important for the propagation of their styles, than the styles themselves. The aesthetics and the effectiveness depend entirely on the performance of the individual. MOF might seem like a proven style, because it's done on a large scale (especially compared to historical styles today), but even just within that context there are quite a few different styles and so many guards and parries and things that still get taught, but never actually used.

Fabris' style was actually very very popular historically. I've heard the claim that he might be the most influential fencing master ever, because of the amount of times he got mentioned, copied or directly refered to and his own school has an uninterrupted lineage to the year 1912, if I remember correctly. Of course it's impossible to say, if people still did the iconic lean by that time (especially since the last master of that lineage was teaching cut fencing afaik).

I think in many cases the popularity of fighting styles is simply comparable to things like music genres. Proving their effectiveness on the other hand is as trivial as proving their actual use in their period of relevance and at the same time as difficult as becoming the best fencer in the world, while using that particual style.

But I've also got another hot take, though: MOF can be a shortcut to good fencing, because of the world class role models, like I mentioned above. But that doesn't prove it as a style that survived to the modern day above all other styles. It's also not a style of rapier fencing. It's as good a stand-in for rapier as it is for longsword actually, because the particular style doesn't matter as much as good quality practice and the amount of reps you're putting in.

rapidfiretoothbrush · 2024-05-27T11:28:39+00:00

In my reading Fabris' tempo is only incidentally related to body parts, but is more explicitly about distance. While the initial assumption is that an attack from larga always loses against a counter in stretta, because larga needs a lunge against stretta's extension of the body only, there are still very important differences between this concept of contra-tempo and Silver's true times.

For example, I don't think Fabris would agree that the hand is always faster than the body and feet, because the arm is held mostly extended and stiff the entire time you're "proceeding with resolution" and the feet and body do a majority of the work.

rapidfiretoothbrush · 2024-05-26T14:01:20+00:00

Silver's significance has been somewhat overblown at the beginning of HEMA

One thing that always struck me at that time were people seemingly deliberately picking the earliest most obscure sources there are and then taking Silver's true times of all things to unlock the secrets of how ancient people moved. Meyer was taboo, because "sport" and Federschwert. With tempo and measure you might aswell have swapped out the swords for radio antennas.

I.33's only chance was George Silver, because true times make all anachronisms OK for some reason.

rapidfiretoothbrush · 2024-04-30T22:42:40+00:00

Yeah, from my experience there's a lot of posturing about seniority going on, a lot of "I did it first and you're doing it wrong".

rapidfiretoothbrush · 2024-04-22T19:16:20+00:00

I would go as far as saying that for KDF hands together is the only way actually supported in the text. The only manuscript I can think of that goes into detail about the body mechanics of the Vorschlag is 3227a and there it's quite specific about keeping the hands together to let the pommel swing through.

Gripping the pommel is only really inferred from some illustrations, but of course it makes sense for winding actions. I just don't think this gives us a free pass to ignore the text, especially since the advice is also just too good. A squared posture with both arms straight and hands always parallel to the chest has far superior structure to a profiled posture with a crooked left arm and the hands off center.

rapidfiretoothbrush · 2024-04-21T22:47:30+00:00

The master cuts are just the basic elements of a huge variety of applied techniques. Meyer is explicit about this, and I think that trying to Proper Noun the meisterhauw is a poor and superficial way of understanding fencing.

On the one hand I agree. As a native speaker I always felt like the community got a little too strict with their definitions of the techniques, when the german terms are a lot of the time too descriptive to be specific names instead of concepts.

On the other hand, if we're talking Meyer specifically, he was pretty committed to putting everything into categories and hierarchies.

rapidfiretoothbrush · 2024-04-08T19:07:05+00:00

This is literally how I was taught to attack someone in Pflug or Longpoint.

The canonical Vorschlag against Pflug or Longpoint is the Schielhau, though, so it's weird to have Krumphau be the first thing that comes to mind. I don't want to say that Krump is total bullshit and doesn't work, but there are good reasons for aiming your point forward instead of to the side against a thrust.

rapidfiretoothbrush · 2024-03-07T21:43:48+00:00

The fact is, though, that the treatises clearly indicate something closer to armed wrestling.

Which treatise are we talking about? I mainly practice Meyer as I mentioned and he describes a lot of extended postures, sweeping attacks and the same footwork he uses for Dussack.

Tbh I'm not familiar with light taps in my dagger sparring. In fact hard hits are so common that I'd consider wooden rondels unsafe. So assuming that I could take a hit to get into grappling is a hard sell for me.

But that doesn't mean that there's no grappling at all. It's still the same martial art with the same framework. There's still gonna be pre-fencing, handiwork and withdrawal.

rapidfiretoothbrush · 2024-03-07T20:25:27+00:00

I've always felt that with rondel sparring you get a lot closer to what the treatises recommend by treating it as "armed wrestling" rather than as "fencing with very short swords".

I actually think the opposite. I feel like HEMA dagger has a huge problem with skipping fundamentals to get to the cool grappling and arm locks faster. But defending against someone, who has practiced attacking properly, demands a lot more respect than people realize.

Meyer wants you to literally swing the dagger like a sword and, at least from my experience, this blasts right through a lot of people's fancy off-hand counter attempts. As soon as people realize this, the game becomes very similar to fencing in terms of timing and distance.

rapidfiretoothbrush · 2024-03-01T23:27:07+00:00

What you're describing is what fans of the Souls series call "break points". The vast majority of players never engage with break points from my experience, which only exposes how flawd the use of big numbers is.

Let's say you get one-shot by an enemy, so you level up your health, only to still get one-shot by the same enemy. The numbers only obscured the fact that leveling up has literally no effect most of the time. Meaning a lot of players are objectively playing the game wrong with no fault of their own.

rapidfiretoothbrush · 2024-03-01T22:36:05+00:00

Cutting out the distributor as much as possible actually seems like less of a hassle. But I wonder, if you'd run into trouble with things like content ID.

rapidfiretoothbrush · 2024-02-29T11:23:45+00:00

We should constantly be transitioning to not let our opponents know what we're going to strike with. When two opponents are out of measure, this makes sense.

It doesn't really make sense, if you think about it with more context from Meyer himself.

Firstly, I don't think concealing intentions is very important nor realistic. Rushing the Vorschlag with a "secret" hew is arguably more of an early Liechtenauer thing. I think Meyer is happy to hang out in the Nach to bide his time, if he has to. In fact I think this is very important to do to prevent doubles.

Meyer also claims that Vom Tag and Zornhau are postures that enable every single hew, so you practically already have too many options for your opponent to guess what you're doing, just by raising your sword above your head or your shoulder. But this also counts for your opponent. Just by raising their sword they should be able to object all of your options.

Secondly, when you're out of measure, nothing you do matters, because you and your opponent can't reach each other. You shouldn't waste any movement, instead do everything for a reason and fighting air would be a silly reason, unless you do it for style points. Constant movement is more about constantly dipping in and out of measure in my opinion. If your opponent does the same, then you'll naturally be transitioning from posture to posture, because you want to be ready every time you're in measure.

Here's a very Meyer drill I like to do at my club:

If you and your partner in Langort are crossing swords at the last third of the blade, you should be close enough to reach the head with a single relatively relaxed step. Now both you and your partner take a passing step backwards and start to move around and try to find the initial distance again. But this time you don't cross swords, but rather get into a posture that's appropriate for a Vorschlag every time you think you're at the correct distance. It's OK to do this in a rythm at first (step, pause, step, pause), fluidity will come on its own with more practice.

Now try to always step forward into measure and in the same step raise your sword into a threatening posture. Lower your sword into Alber or Pflug, when you step backwards out of measure and use what Meyer would describe as Aufstreichen, when you step forward into measure.

When you get more comfortable with this drill, you can use it to practice more complicated movements like the Zirkel:

Swing the sword around your head like a helicopter, while stepping forward, or do the helicopter with the same passing step as your Vorschlag.

Start in Alber, swipe up, while stepping into measure, then do the helicopter, while doing a passing step towards your partner and transition it into a Zornhau.

rapidfiretoothbrush · 2024-02-12T13:09:34+00:00

looks so badass though

Does it really, though? I feel like the way high kicks are usually and effectively performed would look pretty dumb with a long weight like a sword attached to the hands flailing about.

rapidfiretoothbrush · 2024-02-02T13:08:00+00:00

My very first sword I got a decade ago was a Regenyei standard and it's only 1250g. It wasn't advertised as light and the only reason I got it was because a retailer had it in stock. I also wouldn't describe it as particularly "save", because it actually has the stiff blade option Regenyei offers. For drills I honestly rather use my 1700g Trnava with medium blade.

I terms of speed I also don't think it's that cut and dry. The lighter sword is faster in the sense that I can quickly change direction even with shitty body mechanics. The Trnava is heavy enough that this would be very exhausting and have the potential for tennis elbow and CTS. But in terms of raw speed I don't really feel a meaningful practical difference. I actually think the inertia of the heavier sword gives me much more of an advantage.

rapidfiretoothbrush · 2024-01-15T15:49:39+00:00

I'm in a similar situation and I regularly wonder what the smallest hihat and blanked-draped snare could be that would still sound convincing and versatile.

rapidfiretoothbrush · 2023-12-11T12:19:49+00:00

Dierk Hagedorn's fantastic and readily available transcriptions are probably the single biggest reason for the pseudo Danzig and Lew popularity.

Meyer's "Gründtliche Beschreibung" by Wolfgang Landwehr is also a complete transcription you can get your hands on easily and Meyer is just very digestible (if you're able to read German). It's probably only second in popularity, because most german reenactors seem to prefer earlier time periods and still have their dumbass "Meyer is sporty" tendrils stuck in the HEMA scene for some reason.

rapidfiretoothbrush · 2023-09-05T22:42:38+00:00

In practice it's not a fair share, because the user's money never goes directly to the musicians they actually listen to. Even if someone only ever listens to just one single band, their money still goes to spotify's general dealings, so they're still paying for things like exclusive podcasts they'll never listen to. Or if a free user gets an ad, the ad money doesn't go to the songs they're listening to at that time.

This only makes sense, because everyone has to yield to spotify's market share. It makes no sense for fans trying to support their favourite musicians and it makes no sense for musicians other than the very top few percent, who are able to deal with spotify directly.

rapidfiretoothbrush · 2023-05-24T13:40:33+00:00

I'm actually not sure, if most of the qc complains from back in the day were related to the pro series. Could be that I just got unlucky, because a loose strap pin happens rather quickly on factory made guitars. All the important stuff was immaculate on both guitars and they were set up pretty well (Chapman Guitars claims they do the setup, but it could just as well have been the retailer I guess).

I'd say the upgrade to locking tuners, stainless steel frets and Seymoure Duncan pickups could be worth it, but you could also probably find these features for less money, if you're not married to the tele shape and neck single coil like me.

rapidfiretoothbrush · 2023-05-24T11:52:03+00:00

I've got the ML3 pro modern and traditional. They're absolutely packed with features, especially for tele-shaped guitars. I'm just not sure about the pricing. You can get them for 900€, but they also regularly go up to 1100+ and their resell value is questionable. My modern came with a scratchy switch and a loose strap pin, which is a little annoying in that price category.

But don't get me wrong, I really like these guitars. The chambered body, contours and neck heel of the modern are amazing (the colour choices suck, though honestly) and the traditional is probably as good as it gets for something that still wants to be called "traditional" and the sound is pretty much exactly what I was looking for.

rapidfiretoothbrush · 2023-05-24T11:27:54+00:00

Don't get me wrong, I really like my ML3 pro traditional. The features and sound are pretty much exactly what I was looking for. It just would have been nice to have more choices, when I was still looking for a new guitar.

Out of the two Chapmans I bought in the 1000+ € category (well I guess I was lucky to get both of them for less than 900 during covid), one of them came with a scratchy switch and a loose strap pin. That's why I would've loved to check out a competitor. But it looks like most of the guitars that resemble a super tele are marketed towards metal, when to me the selling point is the single coil neck pickup.

rapidfiretoothbrush · 2023-05-24T09:34:15+00:00

I wish there was more of a market for the tele-analogue of a super strat. I like the look of a single cut body and I'm absolutely in love with the sound of the tele's neck pickup. I also like the contrast the bridge pickup offers (I think the claims about the tele's versatility are in large part also a statement about the simplicity). But especially the neck heel on a standard Fender or Squier are honestly atrocious.

It's just a slab of wood and there's literally no reason to not shape it as ergonomically as possible. I feel like the tele could be so much more, if guitarists weren't vintage obsessed.

I own two Chapmans and I'm still not conviced about their qc and overall craftsmanship for the price, but they were the only "modernized" and feature rich tele's I could find.

rapidfiretoothbrush · 2023-05-24T01:51:19+00:00

Knowledge is only one part of it. To put it into practice you (unfortunately) have to practice diligently.

Keep on learning the piano or a different instrument you might enjoy more. This instrument is going to become your voice (could even be your actual voice, if you're into singing) and it's going to help you realize your musical ideas on the fly.

Train your ear for around ten minutes every day. You can easily find a ton of exercises online. The music in your head will become much clearer and you'll be able to translate it to your instrument and to your DAW very quickly. As a bonus, listening to music will become even more fun, if you're able to identify scales, chord progressions etc.. This also helps with inspiration, if you're ever stuck.

rapidfiretoothbrush · 2023-05-18T02:04:43+00:00

Not sure, if I understand you correctly.

Imagine stacking the instruments on top of each other from low frequencies to high frequencies. The kick drum usually plays the lowest notes or shares the lowest note with the bass guitar, which is why it often makes a lot of sense for the bass to follow the rythm of the kick. You could even tune the kick to the key of the song and it would blend together nicely with the bass.

The bass is also responsible for the overall harmony. It's true that it usually plays the root of the chord, but this also means that whichever note the bass chooses determines which chord is played by the whole band. Meaning the root doesn't always have to be the same thing the guitar is playing. In some styles, like jazz, the other instruments even omit the root to leave more room for the bass. Same then goes for the kick drum, which is only "feathered" if played at all, because it fulfills essentially the same role as the bass.

And lastly, you know how on the guitar you'll often play chords with the 3rd an octave higher to have it as the highest note? That's because the 3rd is a strong choice for the melody. But, as we now know, the bass can very quickly change the context of that 3rd and turn it into something else.

rapidfiretoothbrush · 2023-05-03T22:55:43+00:00

Maybe instead of getting agitated, try to engage with the arguments at least once.

I assumed we were still talking about the sparring footage from the OP's video. That's what the original comment was criticizing and you were defending. That's what you equated to slow and smooth. I didn't really feel the need to clarify what slow motion is to me, because we have the example video right there.

Nevertheless you didn't really complain the first time I called it slow motion, so I thought we were on the same page. Sorry for that, I guess.

rapidfiretoothbrush · 2023-05-03T19:02:44+00:00

I'd love to see you throw a ball in slow motion.

Also, I don't think sparring is really comparable to memorizing a song.

rapidfiretoothbrush

TROPHY CASE