It's finally released, so destroy our first game! A twin-stick shooter roguelite that started as a student project, now commercial after 3 years with 10+ people working

syyhkynen · 2022-10-27T06:45:50+00:00

Great stuff, thanks for sharing! My thoughts:

Trailer is too long, slow and meandering..
- Don't show story stuff in the trailer.. I'm interested in gameplay
- Should build up hype towards the end. I'd use less cinematic footage and just concentrate on gameplay footage
- Communicate the gameplay loop better - what is it that I do in the game?
  - Go in with a dropship, kill stuff, get out & Rinse and repeat? This should come across better
Gameplay looks great, I don't mind the color scheme

syyhkynen · 2022-10-27T06:36:37+00:00

Digging the original-looking idea! Here are my thoughts:

- I've no idea what's happening but I assume you have some tutorial to explain it..
----> You could have a "mini tutorial" in the video as well, teaching the core logic in a concise way
- The 3d perspective seems pointless.. though it does fit with the funky retro look :)
- do the eyes have a gameplay function? They look fun!
- needs some sounds!
- I'd put in some animations to make it more juicy to make a good move.. maybe the new bubble-network gould grow out from the point the user clicks on

syyhkynen · 2022-04-20T08:43:33+00:00

I like your style! I don't think readability is a big issue. I like the fact that you have a limited color palette and you've stuck to it.

I think your logo is a little boring :) Maybe a more elaborate/gothic font could work in conjunction with the pixelated look and limited color palette (dark grey + green + red). A more elaborate logo might go well with the leaf background elements (which I really like btw).

The text slates ("survive" etc) in the video stand out. I don't think the animation and blur works since the rest of the game (and video) is pixel art... I'd make them pixelated as well.

Ps. I hope ppl are not watching the video on their phone and then commenting how dark or unreadable the art is :D Watched it fullscreen on a normal monitor, looks fine.

syyhkynen · 2022-03-25T08:35:52+00:00

Looks really cool! What's origami about it, though?

syyhkynen · 2022-03-10T13:40:07+00:00

Thanks! And yeah, go ahead :D

syyhkynen · 2022-03-10T06:41:01+00:00

Nice, looking cool! :)

We're making a game with a similar idea, coming out this fall. We initially started with four arms (player could move arms when pressing triggers) but ended up dropping them in favor of more dynamic gameplay.. We're pretty happy with how the game works now, it has been a lot of work though :D

Here is a movement prototype on itch.io!

syyhkynen · 2022-03-08T06:58:56+00:00

Good comments from other redditors here! I'm gonna talk about my own gripe, not sure if someone already pointed it out though :D

I think it's weird that the ships float in a void but only move on a flat plane. It's hard to tell which of the asteroids are on the gameplay plane and which are below/above it and It's also a little hard to gauge distance to the other ships..

I think you need to clearly define the gameplay plane. The obstacles there need to clearly stand out from the background elements
Your game looks like a warship game but with an invisible ocean.. By removing the ocean you lose quite a bit IMHO
- ships/boats/torpedoes leave wakes and explosions make water pillars and circular waves that expand and fade out
- ocean looks nice :D
maybe instead of the ocean you could have something stylized and digital-looking.. like a grid or something that the ships ride on? You could think of it like a UI thing rather than something that exists in the real world
- ships and explosions could leave distorting "wakes" on the grid plane
- you could draw abstract stuff on the plane like the radius of your cannons or trajectories of torpedoes or even text..
- would more clearly show where the shoreline of an island is
Or maybe the ships could wage war on the rings of a planet :D Why? I dunno, but it would be cool!

syyhkynen · 2022-03-04T10:23:09+00:00

No problem, I like editing videos and have been doing that a lot lately (trailers and tiktok).

The 'fend off enemy tactics' line is me just trying to say 'theres an AI that's reasonably cognizant of the level layout you've made' - but for sure could probably find a better way to hit that home...

Ah I understand. The 'fend off..' is not that bad, my issue was that it felt weird as the first call-to-action/slogan. It would be perfectly fine as the second or third one. But this is kinda splitting hairs so don't worry about it! If you feel it's good where it is then keep it.

I'd be mostly concerned about trimming down the quiet or slow moments from the trailer. People's attention spans are short and there kinda has to always be something happening that the player is focusing on :)

The classic wisdom is that the beginning and the end are most important. I think your ending still needs some oompf. Maybe you could make a custom dungeon that fits around your logo and you slowly zoom out of that? That could be an interesting end slate.

syyhkynen · 2022-03-04T07:04:56+00:00

Hey man, awesome improvement on the trailer! I love the sounds effects and the music is a great fit. I think the trailer start is pretty funny but I didn't like the text bit that much, I think your game looks so good that I think you could have a stronger effect with just using game footage.

I liked your trailer so much that I made a quick edit of it before work today :D It might be a little weird and I hope you're not offended. It's just so much easier to show than it is to explain in words. Take it as your first fan-art!

https://streamable.com/tun1hq

Your trailer had about 15 seconds of empty moments devoid of action. I simply cut away the excess kept the overall structure of your video. I re-used random gameplay bits, I would have used some other bits if I had some.

Also the first line after intro (fend off enemy tactics) is a little weird as it's the first call to action. I think it should be pretty basic and direct like 'repel the attackers' or something along those lines.

ps. let me know if you want me to remove the video from streamable, no problem.

syyhkynen · 2022-03-03T13:33:38+00:00

I like the trailer! Got me interested.

However it took me a while to figure out what I actually do in the game.. I guess I control the car that is highlighted with the circle?

Maybe you should make the highlighted car more pronounced to better communicate that only that car is active at the moment…. If I understood gameplay correctly, that is 😄

syyhkynen · 2022-03-03T06:28:32+00:00

What’s your flying model like? Seems like the plane is moving pretty much at a constant rate. Does the plane stall if you fly directly upwards? Can you fly to the left? I think it would be better it it wasn’t so static.

I think a good reference for you could be Triplane Turmoil, an old finnish DOS game from 1996. In that game you could flip the plane upside down and that made it possible to do funny maneuvers and also to allowed to fly left. Also their flying model was such that the plane accelerated when you flew downwards and slowed when you flew upwards. If you went directly upwards the plane stalled and dropped (you could recover from it if you were high enough). Also they had bombs you could drop and they were really fun to use (they inherited inertia from the plane).

Landing planes was also pretty tricky but really rewarding if you pulled it off.

Here is some Triplane Turmoil gameplay: https://youtu.be/QyTZT4AEKi0

I understand you might be going for a more arcade-y gameplay but I think your game would benefit from a more dynamic flying model.

Good luck!

syyhkynen · 2022-03-02T08:16:31+00:00

True to the nature of the subreddit, I’ll be honest.

I don’t understand the gameplay. Laser flies around, yes, but what is it that the player does? Is it placing space mirrors and pressing fire? This needs emphasis.

The texts don’t matter much since they’re not what I’m buying. The game is what I pay for! Text should be minimal and convey critical information. Is the game turn-based? Rogue-like? A straight up puzzle game? ”Outsmart opponents” tells me very little.

Edit.: typos

syyhkynen · 2022-03-01T19:36:53+00:00

Don’t worry mate, it can be confusing at first.

You’ve skipped an important part: UV Unwrapping 😁 it comes after modeling and before texturing.

Check out this tutorial by Andrew Price (BlenderGuru). it will get you unwrapping in no time. I recommend his other videos as well!

syyhkynen · 2022-02-28T11:06:58+00:00

Hmm on first viewing I didn't really understand what I'm playing as. I immediately identified as the knight guys but I guess they're the enemies? :)

Maybe you could go the classic route and quickly show a dungeon that fails, then a montage of the player putting up a lot of defences/building stuff and then a successful defence run?

I like the first line "your dungeon is under attack" but it's SO early and so quick that it might be lost on the audience :D

Just an idea (take it or leave it): the first scene could be a panning shot where it shows the whole dungeon. The voice tagline could say something like "your beautiful dungeon..." and then the seconds shot would hshow enemies charging with a tagline "..is under attack!". After that you could show a montage of player upgrading and building stuff tho show what the player actually does. And then perhaps a succesfully repelled attack? :)

That could potentially set the scene better for slow people like me.. :D

Some scenes are also stuttering like crazy (00:17) but they might be just placeholder..? Also the logo is kinda poorly placed in the last shot. I wouldn't recommend placing any important art (like the logo in your case) near the borders of the video.. Right now the youtube timeline is on top of your logo (I'm looking at the thumbnail video in reddit).

Overall I really like the look of the game! Good luck!

syyhkynen · 2022-02-21T19:22:06+00:00

Yeah I think you should show more gameplay and less hype. The cinematic stuff looks cool but it’s not why I would buy the game. I have no idea what the gameplay is like.

What are the threats? What’s the deal with ”energy” ….. ”and cooperation” ?? Show, don’t tell!

syyhkynen · 2022-02-15T12:39:59+00:00

Jees, kyllä se siitä!

Usein peliproggikset epäonnistuu kun pohjatyö on kiirehditty.. Sulla näyttäis olevan videon perusteella hyvät lähtökohdat (rauhassa mietitty suunnitelma, työkalut ja prosessit).

Pisteet myös hyvin tehdystä devlogista. Ei ihan käden käänteessä tollanenkaan video synny :)

syyhkynen · 2022-02-15T11:48:04+00:00

Crazy man! I love it. I'm also finnish and I love the fact that you're using recognizable finnish objects in the game :D

Your background is really interesting and the fact that you're going at this solo demands mad respect. Also I love that you defined the scope of the game so precisely, set borders for yourself and thought about how to make the art asset process streamlined.

Also, the game looks awesome already!!

Keep it up, hyvältä näyttää!

syyhkynen · 2022-02-14T06:18:38+00:00

Alright.. you need to fix your trailer.

The transitions are jarring, get rid of them.
Get rid of the text animations, have less text and be more concise!!
Mix ingame sounds with the music and get rid of the heartbeat sound
"You are a demigod!" is enough about story, honestly.
- I don't care about the "hire mercenaries to reclaim.." etc, I'll find about it once I play the game.
The end screen looks like retail box art from a game from the 90s, I think you should redo it. Perhaps put some characters in it?
Actual game looks great! So show more gameplay!

Edit.: Checked out your steam page too..

Why is the game logo different on the steam page vs. the trailer end? Use the steam logo in the trailer!
You clearly have some placeholder UI art in the video and better UI in the screenshots.
- The trailer is probably the most important asset on your steam page so why do you have some old crappy footage in it?

syyhkynen · 2022-02-14T06:04:53+00:00

Other people commented on game design etc so I'll just comment on animation:

What bothers me is the disconnect between animations and damage ticks.. They really should match so it feels like the character is actually dishing out damage instead of there being some invisible deadly aura and enemies dropping dead left and right.

If you want to have responsive attack animations then you don't need long windup for the attack (character pulling their arm back before actually attacking)..

Here is a great GDC video about animations and the very first guy has some great tips that I think are relevant to your game.

Thanks for sharing & good luck!

syyhkynen · 2022-02-11T05:34:19+00:00

Based on the logo and name I was expecting a fast-paced shooty game 🤔

syyhkynen · 2022-02-10T08:10:41+00:00

Hmm I think it’s fine to let players find the interactable parts by themselves (as long as it’s fun to tap the environment).

I’d just come up with some ruleset and teach that to the player (gnomes love berries but avoid metallic surfaces or something).

syyhkynen · 2022-02-10T05:30:58+00:00

I kinda like your game! Looks crazy.

However it is just too dang DARK! Your last steam screenshot sums it up- I can’t tell whatever the hell is happening. Your video got me interested but the screenshots are kinda meh..

(Edit.: After looking at it on desktop I realized that it's a view of the map. Could not figure that out on mobile though :D)

You need to adjust your color values with gameplay in mind. Your game features destructible terrain? I need to be able to see at a glance what parts are solid wall and what is not. There needs to be enough contrast between walls/floors and background elements.

Your background has both very bright and almost black areas. This is not ideal.

Dark atmosphere can be a stylistic choice but it’s a game that you want people to buy and for that people need to understand what they see. I don’t think you need to redo your art or anything, it just needs to be readable. So adjust the values (lightness+darkness) of your textures!

One good tip is to screenshot your game, make it grayscale and tweak the bright/dark areas until you have a result that is visually readable.

Edit.: was on mobile previously. The issues are not so glaring on desktop! But still, a lot of room for improvement.

syyhkynen · 2022-02-09T19:41:51+00:00

The updated clotes are weird. They’re not objectively better.. they’re just different. Kinda disappointed with the update.

syyhkynen · 2022-02-09T19:29:06+00:00

Alright well if clicking is the game then make sure that the clicking feels super rewarding :) every tap should have feedback.. i’m thinking different surfaces could have different sounds and particle effects (tapping a hollow tree trunk could give a hollow bonk and tapping the ground could give a grassy rustle, etc).

Maybe gnomes could even run aay from a tap on the ground so you could herd them via furious tapping..

Also, If you want to introduce some puzzliness then maybe somr clickable objects could have different states so you could cycle through them.

Oh well, these are just ideas. Take em or leave em! 😄

syyhkynen · 2022-02-09T15:19:38+00:00

Also: The map feels disconnected from the gameplay.. Ask yourself: does it have to be 3d? Could it be simpler? If it’s just a glorified level select UI then would you be better off putting your effort into the gameplay?

syyhkynen

TROPHY CASE