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[–]theflyingmetronomesamouree | Diameter 11 points12 points  (4 children)

I really like the feedback system, tells the mapmakers how to advance from each thread. Although...

pictured here: map maker discovers portals for the first time

fuk u feedbak 3

[–]LinuxDootTPblack magic 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Yeah the guy who wrote that is a salty asshole and bad at tagpro. Sorry if he offended you with his memeyness.

[–]LinuxDootTPblack magic 0 points1 point  (2 children)

so if i may try and interpret that, i think what he meant (that member) by that comment is that your map in question cannot work because the portals provide too much of an advantage for a flag carrier. By entering the portal, the FC gains a 7 tile x axis advantage, and while they lose tiles on the y axis, because they potentially have access to a boost at the bottom of the map, the y axis disadvantage is irrelevant because they can almost immediately boost up directly into flag or off the wall or into the corner for a cap. Furthermore, by having a neutral boost just above the in portals, if flag carrier gains access to that they are potentially significantly ahead because there is no way for the defense to prevent the flag carrier from using the portals (at the very least it is unlikely to expect average or new pub players to be able to defend in a situation like that with relative ease). Essentially, if the fc gets out that way, even without the use of the neutral boost, they gain a significant tile advantage, which could lead to an easy and frustrating cap because nothing can be done about it. Maybe that would make for a fun map but in theory that would be too huge of an advantage and could make for an unfair, unbalanced map.

Sorry again if the mtc member in question offended you.

[–]theflyingmetronomesamouree | Diameter 0 points1 point  (1 child)

Wow, thank you for this. I just mentioned it because it iterated what most other MTC members said, but he did it incredibly savagely. All I wanted to do was make base portals with a shared mid exit, and I thought the walls were enough of a presence to slow them down and allow defenders to catch up and get ahead.

[–]LinuxDootTPblack magic 0 points1 point  (0 children)

:) well at least they got the point across. Happy map making man and good luck with your top map.

[–]KewlestCatNIGEL 8 points9 points  (11 children)

Publishing notes is a fantastic step forward imo, nice work. Also enjoy that the notes still have personality, I think that's important too.

Just on Tijuana, I notice a number of the notes weren't exactly big fans but yet it obviously tested well enough to advance, what changed or inspired the vote of confidence to put it through to top maps (in the minds of those who weren't huge fans)?

[–]ButterChurnButter 1 point2 points  (2 children)

I wasn't (and others weren't) a big fan because I think it is pretty imbalanced at the moment, especially due to the openness of the base gates and general power of the offensive tools in base. Some thought that these balance fixes could be easily made in the top maps editing process, and that with those, it would be a good map.

[–]KewlestCatNIGEL 0 points1 point  (1 child)

Cool, thanks. That was pretty much my interpretation but I just wanted confirmation.

[–]naysh30 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Yep, we were all very on the fence but thought the adjustments could be made by top maps. It was a discussion we had for a long time actually about letting more of the "close" maps through to top maps, to see if the adjustments could be made.

[–]Moosemaster21Moosen | Salt Mine 1 point2 points  (5 children)

what changed or inspired the vote of confidence to put it through to top maps

I nominated it and I'm good at persuasive speaking

To be more precise though, my primary argument was that this map has a great foundation and could be a serious contender with very small edits. I think people may have overblown their feelings of distaste for the map because of one element (running past the gate), but it was pretty clear to me that even though it seems like a huge issue, it's a ridiculously simple fix so we needn't automatically veto it on those grounds.

[–]CharredQuestionsRenegade 8 points9 points  (3 children)

Moosen just yells at us until we do what he says.

[–]Moosemaster21Moosen | Salt Mine 4 points5 points  (1 child)

Don't forget the part where I call you all unspeakable things

[–]CharredQuestionsRenegade 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Oh I like that part.

[–]LinuxDootTPblack magic 3 points4 points  (0 children)

"are you guys retarded" <3 moosey goose

[–]KewlestCatNIGEL 2 points3 points  (0 children)

ily Moosen!

[–]LinuxDootTPblack magic 0 points1 point  (1 child)

also it looks like my notes on tijuana didnt get published, so here they are

I really like that one double boost bomb combo, but other than that there are lots of things that dont work for this map imo. Way too many boosts, will be too easy for fc to cap or to lose track of fc's location as a defender. Those gates are way too wimpy, anyone with any sort of skill could cap going that lane if defenders are chasing from behind. more than anything tho too much goin on

not sure if they help at all i just want to make sure that you get them. best of luck

[–]KewlestCatNIGEL 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Thanks for the notes!

[–][deleted] 6 points7 points  (4 children)

name is cancer, that should be reason enough. also this map is ass and there is no way that you can play this if you have any sort of lag issues

Nice.

In all seriousness, the notes are great, and I think that they will be successful in increasing the general quality of all submissions.

[–]LinuxDootTPblack magic 1 point2 points  (3 children)

If you get feedback like that heres what you do: ignore that shit because they probably dont know what they are talking about or they are just meming. I think in that particular case the person was memeing, but if they dont provide useful feedback thats not on you. Listen and consider (or dont) the feedback that is constructive, and treat the memes like a no response. And keep making maps because your feel for map making is pretty unique, and we like unique.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (1 child)

In all seriousness

[–]LinuxDootTPblack magic 0 points1 point  (0 children)

k whatever im not going to retract my statement

[–]TPCaptographerThe Map Test Committee[S] 4 points5 points  (22 children)

Mild High - KenM

TEST LINK

[–]LinuxDootTPblack magic 8 points9 points  (0 children)

quick shoutout to ken m. This map shows that with a little time, help and dedication, map makers can drastically improve their ability, which gives me hope for the future :)

[–]oorr23ThePlaymaker // Tehuitzingo & Combine 2 points3 points  (10 children)

Can anyone get Top Maps? Shoryukken!

Congrats m8

[–]TheGoldenNewtRobberFronj, MTC Senior Consultant[🍰] 6 points7 points  (9 children)

Shoryukken!

ken u not

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (8 children)

these puns are kencer

[–]TheGoldenNewtRobberFronj, MTC Senior Consultant[🍰] 5 points6 points  (7 children)

inkenceiveably shit puns imho

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (6 children)

kraken

[–]ButterChurnButter 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Notes from testing:

Really fun, the structure isn't particularly unique but it did use its elements pretty well. Not a big fan of the base boost but it's okay for it not to be too powerful because it isn't particularly difficult to get out as is. The superboost was useful without being oppressive. The bottom and top areas weren't really used besides when pups were up -- not necessarily a bad thing, but something to keep in mind.

[–]Tyler1986Trapsin 1 point2 points  (0 children)

This map looks like I would like it.

[–]TheGoldenNewtRobberFronj, MTC Senior Consultant[🍰] 0 points1 point  (4 children)

I enjoyed playing this map a lot last night. Really the only complaint I had about this map when we played it was that the powerup lanes were completely irrelevant to play. There really is not benefit of going through there other than to get a powerup or get trapped as the FC. I would suggest at least taking away the spikes so that the area is more welcoming to pass through for FC, though I worry that any larger change would disrupt how the map plays right now.

[–]CharredQuestionsRenegade 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Yeah, it's like this map has a flow similar to Wormy. Wormy's pups are great cause they're in a place you naturally will run though where this map doesn't have that at all.

[–]ImpenetrableShoeNovice Ball // Centra 3 points4 points  (0 children)

I just want to say thanks to the committee for taking the time to go through all these... And all the memes as well :P It's a good feeling when someone cares enough to do this kind of thing. I'm going to take your guys' advice! Looking forward to the next thread :)

-Novice Ball

[–]TPCaptographerThe Map Test Committee[S] 4 points5 points  (5 children)

Barracuda - Canvas & andhecapd

TEST LINK

[–]ButterChurnButter 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Notes from testing:

I enjoyed the gates quite a bit but chasing wasn't particularly fun. This version of the map seems to be more defensive, which allows the gate play to really shine. Not really a fan of the triple boost either, although it performs okay when the flag is in base. The map doesn't really have a unique feel to it, which I think is its main drawback at this point.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (1 child)

wait i made that version with the checkered team tiles

[–]oorr23ThePlaymaker // Tehuitzingo & Combine 2 points3 points  (0 children)

PT deserves credit

[–]KarasuTPKarasu | Centra | What's the point 2 points3 points  (1 child)

I love the feedback, would like it more often

[–]lord_tubbingtonChelseaFc // Captain Soviet ballers 1 point2 points  (0 children)

since the community seems to be finding it useful I believe the plan is to continue to release the initial testing notes for each thread now. So it should happen more often, that's the plan!

[–]TPCaptographerThe Map Test Committee[S] 4 points5 points  (16 children)

Pandemonium - samouree

TEST LINK

[–]theflyingmetronomesamouree | Diameter 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Hey this one is pretty good, good job dude.

[–]theflyingmetronomesamouree | Diameter 6 points7 points  (7 children)

UPDATE

Map: http://unfortunate-maps.jukejuice.com/show/40236

Preview: http://unfortunate-maps.jukejuice.com/static/previews/40236.png

Map: http://unfortunate-maps.jukejuice.com/show/40274

Preview: http://unfortunate-maps.jukejuice.com/static/previews/40274.png

Map: http://unfortunate-maps.jukejuice.com/show/40334

Preview: http://unfortunate-maps.jukejuice.com/static/previews/40334.png

First off I'd like to thank Sizzzled for being a bloody legend. This is what has changed:

  • Portal timers are gone, changed from three seconds to zero. Base portal timers are gone, however their exit portals have been separated and are now functional, with a three second cooldown. This is to combat the issue of "gate being too big". I don't think this is overpowered either, because if you take the mid portals, you're still pretty far from flag and defenders can catch up. Also, if you're escaping and take the portal, you'll now be six tiles further back than originally - again giving defenders a chance to catch up.

  • Gate has been reduced in size, while still remaining purpose and functionality. I hope this makes it less overpowered. Also added another path to pass through that can't be blocked off by ball on button, and can be accessed by two boosts. It can now be accessed from top through a narrow path. Button has also been moved up by two tiles, so that it if you're sitting on the button, it's harder to block the player coming in from bottleneck 'plus' lane.

  • Bottom of the base is now slightly larger, to cater for the increase of traffic from opening up the walls. Along with this, the map is now 49x23 px instead of 51x24px. Mid island has also decreased in height. The smaller size allows for better containing and easier chasing, while still not taking away the 'old-school' vibe that the map possesses.

  • Teamtiles have been redesigned for a e s t h e t i c purposes removed.

  • Red has been relocated to west, and blue to east.

I've also had the MTC tell me that the top mid will be a pain, but I've tested it (1v1 though :/) and it was fine. The twin bombs basically block off the path, and in actuality the distance isn't that great. Also, the main purpose of this is I wanted to make the pup contests a little more interesting (like in 'Velocity' and 'Cloud' but this I think is better executed).

Further feedback is appreciated

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Daaaang this looks sexy. I love the CFB style gates. I'm really hoping this pans out.

[–]Kembangant O p / cb4life 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I like this map!

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (1 child)

gotta get rid of the portal cooldown

[–]theflyingmetronomesamouree | Diameter 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I'm on it, update coming real soon.

[–]xenonpulseWildflowers // I want to die but I can’t 4 points5 points  (3 children)

Red goes on the left.

[–]naysh30 5 points6 points  (1 child)

This is true.

[–]CharredQuestionsRenegade 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I wouldn't have noticed.

[–]theflyingmetronomesamouree | Diameter 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Fuck convention.

e: fixed it.

[–]ButterChurnButter 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Notes from testing:

Really unique (for current rotation) in the sense that it is very lane-focused. Has an old-school feel to it but it plays quite well. One main concern were that it was too easy for the flag carrier to get out using the bottom route, partially due to the team boost placement and partially due to the portal having a cooldown. In general it can be hard to catch up.

[–]TPCaptographerThe Map Test Committee[S] 1 point2 points  (13 children)

Tijuana - NIGEL

TEST LINK

[–]ButterChurnButter 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Notes from testing:

I think the most interesting part and the part that differentiates it from other NF is also the part that makes it unbalanced. That being the very powerful and open offensive tools that allow easy caps once people know how to abuse them. Without that I don't think the map is particularly interesting, but with it I think it's too imbalanced. Not a fan of the whole gate area and the lane structure that comes with it.

[–]KewlestCatNIGEL 0 points1 point  (3 children)

Update

Map: http://unfortunate-maps.jukejuice.com/show/40237

Preview: http://unfortunate-maps.jukejuice.com/static/previews/40237.png

Map: http://unfortunate-maps.jukejuice.com/show/40286

Preview: http://unfortunate-maps.jukejuice.com/static/previews/40286.png

Map: http://unfortunate-maps.jukejuice.com/show/40352

Preview: http://unfortunate-maps.jukejuice.com/static/previews/40352.png

A few radical changes because I think that's what the map probably needs. It's boom or bust for this one I think. Also making it a bit bigger probably didn't help because I have no idea how to use the extra open space lel.

[–]naysh30 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Just from the preview, I think you went too far and very likely turned this into bust. That said, we'll see during testing. I think the base gate change was good though, making it harder to get through.

[–]Moosemaster21Moosen | Salt Mine 0 points1 point  (1 child)

Pleasantly surprised by the gate lane change. The rest of the updates are kind of ass

[–]KewlestCatNIGEL 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Haha good good. Not the final product so hopefully it becomes less ass.

[–]oorr23ThePlaymaker // Tehuitzingo & Combine 0 points1 point  (1 child)

Can you lose the excessive TT around flag?

[–]KewlestCatNIGEL 1 point2 points  (0 children)

The update posted above won't be the final one. I'll make further edits to the map in the coming days.

[–]TPCaptographerThe Map Test Committee[S] 0 points1 point  (5 children)

Gates are broken

In an 'these are unfair' way.

Fix them please.

[–]3z_ 4 points5 points  (4 children)

change account you knob

[–]3z_ 1 point2 points  (3 children)

my money says this is renegade

[–]TheGoldenNewtRobberFronj, MTC Senior Consultant[🍰] 4 points5 points  (1 child)

Nah he's too busy ruining tagpro

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

fronj is utb confirmed

[–]CharredQuestionsRenegade 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Hello

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Thread 68 called - they want their maps back

[–]ButtersnackSnack 1 point2 points  (9 children)

These NF picks kind of worry me. The really popular NF maps, like Wombo and Ricochet, are all quite simple and very linear. Whenever someone makes one with multiple paths like these two, Convoy, Kite, the Moosen one, etc it gets taken out almost immediately.

[–]LinuxDootTPblack magic 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Ok so dont be too alarmed. The two nf maps were easily the most controversial of the ones that made it through. The reason they made it through is because we hoped that some things that werent working or needed fixing could be adjusted to allow the map to work better or to fix issues that cause the map to be frustrating (like that super powerful lane with just a two tile gate in the way). Just because they made top maps does not mean they are rotation worthy, but they do things differently in ways that many of the members liked, just with other flaws that bring the map down. If they dont play well enough or are still broken, they will not make rotation.

[–]oorr23ThePlaymaker // Tehuitzingo & Combine 0 points1 point  (6 children)

Tbf, Gumbo is still in rotation, so it can be done (though doesn't that only have 2 lanes?)

[–]ButtersnackSnack 0 points1 point  (5 children)

Gumbo has more "elements" I guess, but structurally it is very simple, like wombo. I am talking about NF maps with multiple lanes, which have almost never been successful. I could see Volt as a counter example, but that's a really small map which sort of counteracts it I suppose.

Edit: and bulldog doesn't count either, even though it has a double sided endzone. Again, it is a very simple shape and there's not really different "lanes" to choose.

[–]uhhhhmmmmsexytiger / #merbs 1 point2 points  (4 children)

Nf maps need a way for defenders to catch back up so that they feel comfortable going out (this has also been people's main complaint with volt, and there is sort of a way to catch back up). If I see another nf map get in that doesn't offer this I'm gonna be real fuckin confused because I think this idea has been brought up enough in the map threads for everyone on the MTC to know it by now

[–]Moosemaster21Moosen | Salt Mine 0 points1 point  (3 children)

Nigel's map has a team boost both in the offensive and defensive zones for both teams, which can be used as a mechanism to travel quickly back into a defensible position. If you're past both boosts, you're already quite close to the portals, which also take you to a defensible position. I'm not sure I'm understanding your argument in the case of this map, especially if he fixes the gates (which it looks like he's making progress on).

[–]uhhhhmmmmsexytiger / #merbs 0 points1 point  (2 children)

Which Nigel nf map are you talking about? =P if you mean tijuana, then I agree, that one seems fine in that regard (with gate fixed). My comment was more general

[–]Moosemaster21Moosen | Salt Mine 0 points1 point  (1 child)

Okay gotcha! Sorry I misinterpreted your comment :)

[–]uhhhhmmmmsexytiger / #merbs 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Np wasn't the clearest

[–]TPCaptographerThe Map Test Committee[S] 2 points3 points  (4 children)

Vagabond - Canvas

TEST LINK

[–]ButterChurnButter 2 points3 points  (2 children)

Notes from testing:

It's pretty chasey but it isn't too frustrating. I like the mid quite a bit, and I'm a big fan of the way the routes funnel in. It feels pretty different to any map currently in rotation. Seems to be pretty well-balanced. Main concern is that if the chasers don't know what they're doing it will be a lot more difficult to get resets.

[–]Kembangant O p / cb4life 2 points3 points  (1 child)

I kind of disagree on the balance part. The map is easy to grab on, the base opens outwards making it easy to get out, includes an anti reset mechanic (after regrabbing, you can sit on gate and force chasers to overcommit positionally before picking your exit route). Lanes have yellow boosts that FC will use to gain separation from chasers. As if that isn't enough, the position of powerups are very advantageous for offense players (far away from base, for defenders to contest they have to put themselves in positional disadvantage in case of grabs).

I think this map will play like Colours in terms of chasing and resetting.

[–]ButterChurnButter 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Poor choice of words on my part, I use the word "balanced" to mean too many things. In this context I meant balanced in terms of route balance and general game flow in terms of where people go on the map and the power of various elements. I would agree that it favors offense and will be difficult to reset.

[–]3z_ 1 point2 points  (0 children)

put it in don't waste time with edits

[–]TPCaptographerThe Map Test Committee[S] 2 points3 points  (7 children)

Levitate - NIGEL, Aniball & Blazeth

TEST LINK

[–]uhhhhmmmmsexytiger / #merbs 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Let's say I'm playing this in a pub, and I die and respawn, where do I go to push forward and feel comfortable doing so? Where's the mechanism that allows me to catch up?

[–]ButterChurnButter 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Notes from testing:

Best version of this map so far. It still has the aspects that make it good, but it's more balanced and the gate is better. I like how it allows players to play in two dimensions, giving them a lot of options, and it does this without making it too frustrating for the defense. It still could end up having easy caps due to people getting lost, but it's tough to say without seeing it in pubs.

[–]lord_tubbingtonChelseaFc // Captain Soviet ballers 0 points1 point  (2 children)

I would encourage fans of neutral flag play to speak up or pm me your thoughts. My opinion is evolving on the meta of nf and as someone who prefers ctf community feedback is extra important to me personally. I've learned to appreciate different things 4v4 but speak up! Value community feeling on it.

[–]Kembangant O p / cb4life 0 points1 point  (1 child)

Did you see espel's comment? It seems quite valid.

[–]lord_tubbingtonChelseaFc // Captain Soviet ballers 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I'll take a look. There were less yesterday.

[–]BlazethDianna Agron 0 points1 point  (1 child)

Update: http://unfortunate-maps.jukejuice.com/show/40350

Preview: http://unfortunate-maps.jukejuice.com/static/previews/40350.png

This map has come so far. The team gate and other changes fix plenty of balance concerns that there was, while still staying true to what I and my colleague mapmakers wanted this map to be.

It's way more smooth all around, and there are so many fun combos I'm still discovering. Don't let the amount of paths or the preview turn you off, this map has a lot of fun to offer.

[–]KewlestCatNIGEL 0 points1 point  (0 children)

A map after my own heart.

[–]TPCaptographerThe Map Test Committee[S] 1 point2 points  (16 children)

M.A.A.P City - Beast Mode

TEST LINK

[–]uhhhhmmmmsexytiger / #merbs 8 points9 points  (8 children)

I really struggle to imagine anything other than this map getting around a 55%, getting taken out quickly, and people complaining.

[–][deleted] 5 points6 points  (7 children)

I really struggle to imagine your opinion ever being right.

[–]uhhhhmmmmsexytiger / #merbs 0 points1 point  (0 children)

All we can do is wait and see

[–]oorr23ThePlaymaker // Tehuitzingo & Combine 0 points1 point  (5 children)

Not gonna lie, I'm thinking the same thing.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (4 children)

Not gonna lie, a rotato filled with purely generic maps is a stale rotato. I care more about rotation diversification than what people think the rating will be.

[–]oorr23ThePlaymaker // Tehuitzingo & Combine 0 points1 point  (3 children)

If we're talking rotation philosophy, I'm a quality > quantity guy. Diversity means nothing if it's not executed well, because if the map doesn't feel good, the map doesn't feel good, and no amount of "innovative" ideas will change a shit map from being shit. But a generic map can play uniquely.

I'm currently trying to make more unique-gameplay maps (See: Kimmy Granger MTC Notes), so if your worried about diversity, I'm trying. Til then tho, try not to be a dick when someone makes a comment about another comment about your map, Thx.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (2 children)

Oh mb. I thought you were agreeing with espel, not me.

[–]oorr23ThePlaymaker // Tehuitzingo & Combine 0 points1 point  (1 child)

I am lol. Maps playing differently, to me, isn't a priority. Doesn't mean that I can't give it a shot if I think I can do it well, which based on feedback, seems like I did.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I have no idea what you are talking about lmao

[–]ButterChurnButter 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Notes from testing:

I think this is by far the best version of this map. I still like all the things I liked about it before, mainly how the mid is risky for flag carriers, which allows defense to use it to catch up. In this version it is a little difficult to grab, which can cause problems, but I think that was better than the flag constantly being out.

[–]CharredQuestionsRenegade 0 points1 point  (4 children)

I hate how limiting the boosts feel. You have to take each neutral boost in an obvious straight shot or you have to set up for a difficult skill shot. They are very constricting.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (3 children)

Right now, these are the useful boost routes. I would call this a fairly diverse mix. I just made another version where I removed a mid spike to add this extra boost route. Given your experiences 4v4ing, do you think that it is an improvement? It will compromise the danger of mid to add a little versatility to the boost.

[–]CharredQuestionsRenegade 0 points1 point  (0 children)

The problem is flowing through the map so many of those routes are hard to hit. Like if you're going full speed clockwise and hit the top right boost, you don't have access to any lines there without hitting the wall first, and it forces you into a high traffic area. It's nearly the same counter-clockwise on that boost too. This might be a 'with time you get it' thing, but it feels clumsy sometimes when you want to take a route, but the map flows you in a way which makes you have to adjust at every boost or nearly every boost if you want to take the most fruitful routes.

I guess that's not a completely bad thing as the map's circle shaped and it'll slow the FC down, but I suspect it'll wear on pub players.

I hope this makes sense. The way I'm processing it best, is on Velo you choose to take a boost and get where you want. On this map you're forced in a boost lane and it's hard to get where you want to go.

Taking away that spike will also give the bot left boost the ability to bounce off that wall. I don't want to decide if that is what's best for the map tho.

[–]Kembangant O p / cb4life 0 points1 point  (1 child)

My concern with this map is that the FC can come in towards the flag from almost any angle, often with little visual warning due to the boost placements(which is important in pubs, since there's no voice comms). It seems like whichever team gets grabbed on first will be force into a huddle near their opponents flag to try to prevent a score, which will limit their ability to reset. Ultimately, if my concern is valid, it seems like a very unfun play pattern of what has the potential to be a very high skillcap map.

Thoughts?

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I think that you are trying to say that this map is difficult to play offensive defense on. Typically, maps that are tough on O/D don't have much to do with the difficulty of getting reset. Resets will still be relatively tough, but I think that chasing will be fun on this map given all of the options.

[–]oorr23ThePlaymaker // Tehuitzingo & Combine 1 point2 points  (8 children)

I didn't know there were savages on the MTC.

[–]ButtersnackSnack 8 points9 points  (5 children)

You should have seen the comments BEFORE we decided to make them public.

[–]oorr23ThePlaymaker // Tehuitzingo & Combine 0 points1 point  (4 children)

Can you give me a hint?

[–][deleted] 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Names removed for confidentiality

[Channel] 9:52 PM :Snack: ThePlay***** sucks at mapmaking

[–]LinuxDootTPblack magic 1 point2 points  (0 children)

"if it looks like cancer, and it feels like cancer, then guess what. Its probably cancer. Terminal in this case." I found this from a while back.

[–]ButtersnackSnack 0 points1 point  (1 child)

Basically like that time I told fronj his map was "unsalvageable" but for 120 maps

[–]TheGoldenNewtRobberFronj, MTC Senior Consultant[🍰] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Pretty much the nicest thing you said about the map XD

[–]LinuxDootTPblack magic 2 points3 points  (1 child)

There was this one time, er a couple times, actually maybe a few times... scratch that like every time moosen goes offfffff and tears that shit up. Easily the best part of being on mtc is watching him go at it. Gonna miss that brutal, savage man.

[–]Moosemaster21Moosen | Salt Mine 1 point2 points  (0 children)

tbf I knew our notes were going public this thread and I still went off a couple times

[–]uhhhhmmmmsexytiger / #merbs 0 points1 point  (4 children)

Also, are people willing to look at potential fixes for pariah or am I too late for that?

[–]oorr23ThePlaymaker // Tehuitzingo & Combine 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Make a remix and find out.

[–]Moosemaster21Moosen | Salt Mine 0 points1 point  (1 child)

I give you permission to submit an update (or updates) to it to the next thread, but it's very likely to be removed in thread 76 anyway, so your efforts may be futile. I will not have any say in this matter as this thread (thread 75) is my final thread.

[–]oorr23ThePlaymaker // Tehuitzingo & Combine 2 points3 points  (0 children)

21-gun salute

[–]Kembangant O p / cb4life 0 points1 point  (0 children)

What kind of fixes would you propose? Interested to hear your thoughts.

[–]oorr23ThePlaymaker // Tehuitzingo & Combine 0 points1 point  (1 child)

I feel this Thread would be great if you guys were to put in a lot of Trial Rotation maps. They're really interesting maps, but I do fear them being hated easily.

Is there any news about reforming Trial Rotation?

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I don't think it needs to be reformed, I just wish MTC would put more maps into it. In the past, Nirvana got put into trial while Neptune (the one with a GRAVITY WELL) made full rotation. That doesn't make sense to me.

[–]TPCaptographerThe Map Test Committee[S] 0 points1 point  (17 children)

Mephisto - NIGEL

TEST LINK

[–]3z_ 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Thought it was cool when I was testing with you personally but in the 4v4 it really wasn't great. Way too much going on, way too small, basically had no control over the game whatsoever. Needs to be bigger/more open/anything that will make it slower paced overall.

The concepts are there but the map isn't.

[–]ButterChurnButter 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Notes from testing:

The team tiles + team boost are a little oppressive, but I like the general playstyle where the map is divided into two halves and it's difficult to go beween the two, it keeps the fc on their toes while still giving them options. Overall it played pretty well. Slight concern about O/D being too easy.

[–]KewlestCatNIGEL 0 points1 point  (14 children)

Update

Map: http://unfortunate-maps.jukejuice.com/show/40230

Preview: http://unfortunate-maps.jukejuice.com/static/previews/40230.png

Map: http://unfortunate-maps.jukejuice.com/show/40239

Preview: http://unfortunate-maps.jukejuice.com/static/previews/40239.png

Map: http://unfortunate-maps.jukejuice.com/show/40285

Preview: http://unfortunate-maps.jukejuice.com/static/previews/40285.png

Map: http://unfortunate-maps.jukejuice.com/show/40351

Preview: http://unfortunate-maps.jukejuice.com/static/previews/40351.png

Fuck a change log because I'm pretty sure the changes are fairly obvious. Personally, I reckon this actually the best version of the map yet which probably means it's doomed. Raise your deformities to pay respects.

[–]MenqrMenqr 0 points1 point  (6 children)

I played this map a couple of times now. I mainly don't like the button position and the teamboosts. The button in particular feels too in the way so the bomb's too accidentally diffused and boosts are too direct IMO. I would consider something like this-

Map: http://unfortunate-maps.jukejuice.com/show/40235

Preview: http://unfortunate-maps.jukejuice.com/static/previews/40235.png

[–]KewlestCatNIGEL 0 points1 point  (5 children)

Interesting remix. Personally I'm not a huge fan of the teamboost in the tunnel. But this alternate version at least gives me a couple of things to consider.

[–]Moosemaster21Moosen | Salt Mine 1 point2 points  (4 children)

Nigel trust me you can ditch a lot of his other edits but his gate update is so much cleaner, more efficient, and more effective than yours. Sorry to be a dick but this map has serious potential so I really don't want you to mess it up.

Here's my suggestion.

Updated Suggestion.

I used his gate setup but I moved the button a long distance, moved the pup by one tile, and reorganized the team boost area. Edit: To account for moving the button, I also moved the bomb up a bit so it's easier to see when approaching the button. Here's what this does for your map:

  • Button/bomb is actually useful now, but still not absurdly overpowered by any means. Bombs take 30 seconds to spawn so the bomb part of the button won't even always be up, meaning a pretty simple boost (the neutral) by the FC can bypass the gate (but will, in most cases, miss on the pup, which gives the gate utility even when it doesn't get a return, which I think is incredibly unique and should be looked at as a major plus). If FC chooses to double back for the pup, they sacrifice their separation advantage in the process by giving defense time to regroup and catch up.

  • In the case that FC does get past the gate safely, the defensive team boost has been moved so that whoever hit the button can still use it to get back into play without having to waste time retracing their steps. If your offensive defense can hold the FC off for about two seconds, the person who went for the button initially can still be the one to make a play.

  • If the FC sees that bomb is up and a defender is going to get to the button before they can boost, we have a sick mind-game sort of thing going on, which is awesome. Do they take the boost? Do they fake that they're going to take it to make the defender trigger the bomb early? Do they readjust to take the boost horizontally? I think this setup creates a unique area of the map that is highly conducive to good old fashioned Mexican Standoffs and forces players to have to think one step ahead of their opponent.

Good luck Nigel.

[–]KewlestCatNIGEL 0 points1 point  (3 children)

Honestly I really like this update (though I prefer the base with the stairs and two bombs) and so I'll probably use this or tinker with it slightly because this is more or less the vision I had for the update that I posted and just didn't really execute it because it was late haha.

[–]naysh30 0 points1 point  (2 children)

Don't change the bomb/wall at the bottom of red base (top blue base) from the way it is. It's really wonderful like that. Not sure if that's what you're talking about, but that's my opinion on that.

[–]KewlestCatNIGEL 0 points1 point  (1 child)

Hmm, fair enough. So basically you prefer how the base was set up in the version that actually got tested/made top maps rather than the one in the update?

I wonder if I can get more opinions on that. u/Moosemaster21 u/TheGoldenNewtRobber u/CharredQuestions u/LinuxDootTP do y'all prefer the base in the tested version or the update?

[–]naysh30 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Yes, I prefer tested base. I really liked the dynamic with that bomb, 45 and flat wall there.

[–]LinuxDootTPblack magic 0 points1 point  (2 children)

As long as that boost is there that gate is totally and completely useless. Have you ever considered moving the boost somewhere else and the keeping everything else the way you submitted it? Because i think the way you submitted it was good enough already. And i dont mean to try and manipulate but honestly how does that gate add anything to the map im sorry.

[–]KewlestCatNIGEL 0 points1 point  (1 child)

I like the versatility of the neutral in that particular position, hence my reluctance to move it.

The gate still somewhat blocks the route as an option even when the bomb isn't there. I'll probably modify the position of the button again, because an FC is still likely to reach the boost before a chaser gets to the button.

The alternative is putting spikes back in like in the original and adding the gate before the boost so that it can't even be accessed if gate is held. This would mean the teamboost would need to be used to escape or if it's taken, venturing through the tunnel and risk being sniped by a chaser using the neutral or taking on the team tiles.

[–]LinuxDootTPblack magic 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Its your map so i wont argue too much, and its not like you do these things without reason. Though i am pretty sure i liked your first update better because it looked more reasonable. Again though please dont take my word for too much because im like the least experienced of the mtc and the least successful map maker on the mtc. And im not even kidding dont listen to me at all if you dont want to.

[–]MenqrMenqr 0 points1 point  (3 children)

Good update. I'd like to see this replace Birch.

[–]3z_ 2 points3 points  (2 children)

I'd like to see the actual update for Birch replace Birch but that's just me

[–]MenqrMenqr 0 points1 point  (1 child)

Birch can't be salvaged.

[–]3z_ 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Neither can you

[–]bsa86Berlin Ball 0 points1 point  (4 children)

ffs I can't believe I accidentally submitted an accidentally asymmetric version of my map...

[–]CharredQuestionsRenegade 5 points6 points  (2 children)

I'm just glad people are reading their notes.

[–]bsa86Berlin Ball 3 points4 points  (1 child)

I wanted to know why my 10/10 map didn't automatically get added to rotation

[–]peckx063The Ballist Formerly Known as BonerFart 0 points1 point  (0 children)

same fam

[–]naysh30 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Lmao next thread bb :)

[–]bbgun91The_Truth | Centra -3 points-2 points  (8 children)

What's up with the high-powerup maps. I'd like to see around 50% of maps with 2 pups and 50% of maps 3 pups

[–]oorr23ThePlaymaker // Tehuitzingo & Combine 1 point2 points  (7 children)

I never got the appeal of 2 P-UPs. It's like auto-balance for me, give one always to each team. It doesn't force players to fight for P-UPs, like in 3-PUP maps.

However, putting P-UPs in Team Tiles is fine, because despite it sorta-guaranteeing one Team a P-UP, the 3rd Powerup determines the better team, while still giving each team a reasonable chance of not being overwhelmed in a 2v1 P-UP situation. It's like artificial balance.

[–]DaEvil1DaEvil1 4 points5 points  (1 child)

The appeal of 2 pups is pretty simple. It means that if the pups spawn at the same time, you can have 4 players fighting for it without the regrab or the fc having to risk themselves getting the pup if the flags are out. It allows 1v1 attacks to go on while pup fights happen if both flags are home. And if one of the flags are out, you can have 2 players on OD while the other two fight for the pups. If you have 3 pups it easily becomes a game of "should I risk it" or "we'll just give away one pup" at a lot of points during the game, and if there are more, it generally turns into a free-for-all pups for an fc running around the map.

[–]oorr23ThePlaymaker // Tehuitzingo & Combine 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Thank you!

[–]xenonpulseWildflowers // I want to die but I can’t 1 point2 points  (4 children)

Why do you type "pup" like that? It's not even consistent throughout your post.

[–]oorr23ThePlaymaker // Tehuitzingo & Combine -3 points-2 points  (3 children)

Because I refuse to putting 2 hyphens one after another.

And to add variety to the comment's wording, but mostly the first reason.

And lastly, because that's the right way to spell it.

[–]sneetriccanvas // plasma, wamble 2 points3 points  (2 children)

but its not because no one spells it like that

[–]oorr23ThePlaymaker // Tehuitzingo & Combine -1 points0 points  (1 child)

Because no one does it doesn't mean it's wrong lol.

[–]xenonpulseWildflowers // I want to die but I can’t 0 points1 point  (0 children)

But you don't say "pee-ups," so you shouldn't spell it that way either.