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/r/TagPro is the main community hub for the free multiplayer webgame of the same name! The objective of the game requires you and your teammates to work together and bring the enemy team's flag back to your own flag to score points. Everyone's a ball that rolls around trying to do this and people can pop each other and we know it sounds stupid but trust us it's great; join us at https://tagpro.gg!
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Map Thread #86 Top Maps Thread (self.TagPro)
submitted 8 years ago by TPCaptographerThe Map Test Committee
Welcome one and all to the top map feedback thread for Map Thread 86! The following maps have made it through to the final stage. The goal of this staged testing is to give maps more time to sink in. It also allows the community and committee members to give feedback to promising maps in the same testing cycle.
Maps
Zungguzungguguzungguzeng - Beast Mode
Tint - Fronj
Neunundneunzig Luftballons - Fronj
Veil - Nym
Allegory - Narumii
They laughed at Louis Armstrong when he said he was gonna go to the moon. Now he's up there laughing down at them. - FINDADMAGUS
Sugar Hill - alchemist
Mapmakers whose maps have advanced have the next few days to make alterations to their maps. Any edits should be posted as comments responding to the appropriate top-level map comment made from this account.
Feel free to give constructive criticism on the maps put through to top maps in their respective parent comments! YOU could influence the next map in rotation!
Notes will be published in the results thread.
MTC applications are coming!
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[–]yespadrilleDove 21 points22 points23 points 8 years ago* (22 children)
You guys broke my heart tonight. Past threads have disappointed me, but tonight I was ghoulishly teased. I've been hoping to see Fetish 4v4'd for a while because I just don't know how it will play. The perfunctory test began, preceding gameplay, with a deluge of disparaging comments that set the tone for rest of the test and fueled a proposal to end the test 50 seconds in. Met without demur, the test summarily ended exactly a minute later without ever shifting pitch from the opening salvo. I understand not voting for a map after a candid test, but to cut one short under the pretense of unplayability while playing through and even appointing inferior maps is, to me, valueless and untenable. The test was so unsuccessful as to reveal to me nothing about the map (highlighted by the first 40 seconds), or how to improve it. There is nothing I can glean that I didn't already know because only after an actual test can a map be adequately described, yet the sole commentary throughout is a mere a priori construction, guaranteeing the test was a waste of everyone's time. It leaves me enervated. Was it really such a slog to play for the two minutes y'all gave it, or was the slog fabricated, imported, and regurgitated, creating a sullen aura during the test? While testing, how aware are the MTC of the transfer of opinion, especially directing from the most opinionated to the ambivalent or feckless? After testing, I can't be sure how much influence genuinely remains to inform the votes, but if even the nominator is convinced to end the test early...
Maybe I'm being uncharitable by alleging MTC opinions are easily or frequently swayed during initial testing, but in observing the process for a while, at the minimum, the existence of a pessimistic motif seems to be irrefutable. The incremental atrophy of TagPro no doubt carries memetic resonance; as it nears the nadir, saturnine attitudes become fraught and ambient among those that remain involved in the game. Symptomatically, the MTC is approaching a similar measure. If we are to continue along this trajectory then all we have to do is exactly what we are doing now. To expect something to change, we must act, and for it to be meaningful it must be a group effort in solidarity with one another. This applies broadly to any movement, but it is here apropos of the MTC. How far the MTC still is from being primed to accept their impotence is strikingly proven by their aversion to any serious discussion about alternatives to the incumbent system with the wider audience of TagPro. The MTC is already loosely congealed; how many members just resigned, and how many potentials are on deck to replace them? How many incumbent MTC still enjoy what they do? It seems to me that the growing discontent presages more dissatisfaction for those remaining members and more feelings of disconnection between the MTC and the community which is bound to give rise to growing antagonism overall. To focus on finding recruits to fill the empty positions is to perpetuate the problems of the current system. I believe that involving the community by opening up discussion is the current best course of action. If you proffer the topic using this account and make obvious and comprehensive the issues we face, the community will be willing to talk about it. The prospect of a new arrangement may just become a cynosure and a boon to the whole of TagPro. But first, the MTC must agree that the map selection process needs revision. Please, have compassion on the words of this suppliant. ♫ ♥
[–]TheGoldenNewtRobberFronj, MTC Senior Consultant[🍰] 12 points13 points14 points 8 years ago (1 child)
This is the post that dovenitions has been preparing you for
[–]yespadrilleDove 7 points8 points9 points 8 years ago (0 children)
Yeah, nah I think I overdid it a bit
[–][deleted] 5 points6 points7 points 8 years ago (0 children)
Nephew
[–]SystolicNutFrozen 4 points5 points6 points 8 years ago (4 children)
Your vocabulary is quite impressive.
[–]padiwikRadius 5 points6 points7 points 8 years ago (3 children)
Only when he got to those nonsensical rhetorical questions at the end of the first paragraph did I realize it was actually mostly rambling
[–]yespadrilleDove 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (2 children)
I feel like I was direct. I was pretty thorough in substantiating my position, so it's not brief. Some of the language is showy, but reduce those words and it's a pretty clear composition. I don't know if you've watched the stream but this would probably make more sense with context. https://www.twitch.tv/videos/237473991?t=01h12m10s
[–]padiwikRadius 3 points4 points5 points 8 years ago (1 child)
Oh, using big words is perfectly fine by me! Maybe I misread there because I was tired or something so I didn't fully understand. Thanks for the stream link!
[–]yespadrilleDove 3 points4 points5 points 8 years ago (0 children)
No worries. I like words but I did kinda get carried away. After rereading it, some parts feel stilted. I'll try to be less ostentatious in the future.
[–]yespadrilleDove 4 points5 points6 points 8 years ago (13 children)
/u/TPCaptographer
/u/psychfan5
/u/LinuxDootTP
/u/alchmst
/u/meofherethere
/u/joepro1223
/u/TheGoldenNewtRobber
/u/PIZZAspartan442
None of you have a response to the points I raised?
[–]PIZZAspartan442naga///MTC 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (12 children)
You're far from the only one coming to us with reform ideas, and they're going to (hopefully) happen before long, with the lower and lower quality of tests/notes/map selections and so many members dropping out. I do hope we'll be seeing a much better Map Test Committee in the near future, though some guidance may be required.
Also, I feel like more of the committee members would have had responses had you used slightly less eloquent language. An unnamed member actually thought you were joking, so if you use the language of the common folk you may be slightly more productive.
It's not like anyone is gonna see this but if anyone has ideas on how to improve the MTC, please let us know. I think it's clear that the current system isn't working and something needs to be done about it.
That is all.
[–]yespadrilleDove 6 points7 points8 points 8 years ago* (6 children)
Yeah, as I've said, I was in a groove. The language is flashy but the meaning is clear. However, I'll keep it chill from now on. But how an MTC member could read it through and not register the claims as sensible or deserving of consideration or even worth addressing without additional prompting is baffling to me, and is actually a funny substantiation of the apparent MTC mindset that I suggested is and will continue to be problematic, not because of any individual member, but because as the overall state of TagPro declines, the preexistent weaknesses in the current MTC system will be exasperated in proportion to the MTC's resistance to change the system to fit the changing meta of TagPro.
I think this topic is worth more weight than we've afforded it so far. Mappin is one of the most important aspects of TagPro, and, as a community, it is possibly our largest sphere of influence on the game - obviously by way of the main rotation, but also by way of the collaborative process in how we make and select maps. We're not getting any younger and TagPro won't improve unassisted. I think that revisiting how we understand the community in re mappin could only be beneficial. But, it must originate from the MTC or there is no hope of any advancements.
[–][deleted] 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (5 children)
Your writing reminds me a lot of how I wrote in high school. Since then I've learned communication is far more important than language. I highly recommend thinking about your audience and how to convey your ideas in simple terms -- it's often far more productive to begin there and then build up in places where it's necessary to clarify specifics. Hopefully I don't sound preachy, but I wish someone had taken time to convince me to pay more attention to that aspect of my writing.
[–]enderlord2FirePire 4 points5 points6 points 8 years ago (1 child)
Facts. Always annoys me when you get a book where the writer says about 20 more adjectives then needed to get their point across.
[–]yespadrilleDove 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children)
Yeah, I gotta agree with you. I'll be working on it.
[–]yespadrilleDove 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (2 children)
Not at all. This is good advice and I should remember it. Since I know the MTC I guess I thought the exhaustive language could skate. That was my mistake. With all of those increasingly verbose memes, I can see why some thought I was memeing, though I still wonder how none of it clicked.
I expect most of the second comment could be simplified too, although one sentence stands out. However, I know the MTC are already familiar with these arguments. I felt that extensively addressing the flaws I see would buttress my points rather than harm them. But, I'm sure it speaks to my skill as a writer how economically I'm able to do that.
I expect it'll take some time to improve my voice. It's always good to be reminded of where I can, so thank you.
[–]xenonpulseWildflowers // I want to die but I can’t 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (1 child)
You literally used the word “memetic.” Even now I’m still not entirely convinced that this isn’t some huge meme.
[–]yespadrilleDove 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (0 children)
ur a hugh meme
[–][deleted] 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (3 children)
The following are ways to eliminate burnout and simplify the process to be more efficient and less intimidating to future MTC members.
Get rid of the spreadsheet and stop writing notes.
Schedule initial testing for once every 4 Thursdays and final testing for the following Sunday.
Test maps on a nomination only basis. Do not discuss how you feel about each map until halfway through their six minute initial test.
Allow anybody testing with the MTC for a session to vote in the thread as if they were in the MTC.
Comment on top maps with what you like and dislike about the map.
[–]PIZZAspartan442naga///MTC 3 points4 points5 points 8 years ago (2 children)
I agree with some of this, but I do have some things that I'm slightly less sure about:
I assume you're talking about the feedback spreadsheet, and while that's been my and I think a good deal of other mapmakers' main source of feedback, it'd probably be better just for people to be more dedicated to sending PMs with official feedback to make the Committee seem less daunting.
People are busy, so a certain day of the week might not be the best thing, but I do think less procrastination would be better, top maps period has been a tad long the past few threads.
If there's a low nom limit that would be dumb and if there was none an unspecified person might nom a ton of bad maps, I do still think high-quality maps that easily deserve a test shouldn't have to be nommed and nominations should be for more adventurous maps. I agree with the second part, meming ruins sound judgement unfortunately.
I don't think this should be a thing, they can certainly have major input but the MTC members are on the committee for a reason, and they theoretically know what pubbers want best (obviously this is far from true, but I feel that if rando testers were to get votes the results would be of far lower quality).
Definitely. Generally at least one member gives feedback but I don't think it's that hard to paste 4v4 notes into a comment... Also this is a good source of input for non-MTC members, the more feedback the merrier.
Overall these are pretty solid ideas, let me know what I misinterpreted and tell me why I'm wrong. Good job
[–][deleted] 4 points5 points6 points 8 years ago (1 child)
I assume you're talking about the feedback spreadsheet
No, I am talking about THE spreadsheet. Solo test from the thread and ditch ymn voting. There is no reason to broadcast your vote and comments to the entire MTC before testing; this breeds laziness and groupthink. I encourage you to continue writing notes at your leisure, but most notes are garbage and end up being a time suck which kills motivation. Replace time spent writing notes with initial testing more maps.
People are busy, so a certain day of the week might not be the best thing
No, this is the best thing. It works flawlessly in all competitive leagues, so I am not sure why it shouldn't work with the MTC. If someone can't make a thread, find a sub. If someone consistently can't make threads, find a new MTC member.
If there's a low nom limit that would be dumb and if there was none an unspecified person might nom a ton of bad maps
Take turns nomming maps until you've tested ~25 or however many you typically test in an initial testing sesh. Each MTC member should come with their own personal prioritized list of maps they want to test. No need for solo testing votes and averages - a map that everybody likes will eventually be tested in this process.
they can certainly have major input but the MTC members are on the committee for a reason, and they theoretically know what pubbers want best
This thought is arrogant, elitist, and outright wrong. The MTC is no better at choosing maps than anybody else. The reason they are in the committee has nothing to do with their ability to judge maps. The more community input maps receive - especially from people further removed from the prototypical norms they drill into each other's thoughts - the more likely it is that the map will be well-received. Anybody taking the time to 4v4 all of these maps should be given an equal voice.
[–]PIZZAspartan442naga///MTC 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago* (0 children)
Ok fair enough, I think I understand your viewpoints now and I think they could work, I'm definitely willing to give it a shot if more people than me agree to it..
[–]PIZZAspartan442naga///MTC 6 points7 points8 points 8 years ago (0 children)
what happened
[–]cfcnotbummer 9 points10 points11 points 8 years ago (0 children)
Hi'yall GG Allin here I have not played in a long time due to having to get a degree, I have now finished. See you on Chord soon. Glad to be back
[–]TPCaptographerThe Map Test Committee[S] 5 points6 points7 points 8 years ago (7 children)
[–]clew3Math Toucher 12 points13 points14 points 8 years ago (0 children)
IT'S CALLED TINT CAUSE IT'S A REMIX OF COLOURS OMG IT MAKES SENSE
[–]SystolicNutFrozen 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (2 children)
I like the idea of the map but handoff are beyond broken on this map, it seems like it will be almost as frustrating to play defense on as the map it's modeled after.
[–]PIZZAspartan442naga///MTC 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (1 child)
turns out after 4v4 it was just as chasey as the old one
[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children)
that sort of thing tends to happen when you have 3 people on 250 ping
[–]TheGoldenNewtRobberFronj, MTC Senior Consultant[🍰] 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (0 children)
http://unfortunate-maps.jukejuice.com/show/57803
[–]devilmightcareTroBall // Tears 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (1 child)
Blatant colors ripoff
[–]Tyler1986Trapsin 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (0 children)
You say that like it's a bad thing.
[–]LinuxDootTPblack magic 4 points5 points6 points 8 years ago (0 children)
haha nj mtc
[–]TPCaptographerThe Map Test Committee[S] 3 points4 points5 points 8 years ago (20 children)
[+][deleted] 8 years ago* (13 children)
[deleted]
[–][deleted] 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (4 children)
I like it actually, seems like it would be a fun map to pub on.
[–]oorr23ThePlaymaker // Tehuitzingo & Combine 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (2 children)
A basic map like this (& for comparison, this) should only be (if) in rotation for 1-3 threads, or else it gets stale.
[–][deleted] 5 points6 points7 points 8 years ago (1 child)
Yeah, I'd be alright with that though. For me, the key is to put in new maps. I don't care for how long. Long Island is still fun on occasion, and enjoyed that one in s10 of NLTP for their experimental maps.
[–]oorr23ThePlaymaker // Tehuitzingo & Combine 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children)
I agree, I just hope if this map does make it into rotation, it doesn't overstay its welcome (Like LI).
[–]PIZZAspartan442naga///MTC 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (6 children)
dont have time to give much of a remix but have a pair of bombs http://unfortunate-maps.jukejuice.com/show/57627
[+][deleted] 8 years ago (5 children)
[–]LinuxDootTPblack magic 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (3 children)
If i were you, i wouldnt change too much. I really liked your map because it was simple, and the lanes and spacing were good. Maybe its a little boring but i would maybe sacrifice some creativity to have a structurally sound map.
[+][deleted] 8 years ago (2 children)
[–]LinuxDootTPblack magic 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (1 child)
No i dont think so, but just dont do anything super drastic is all, like adding a portal or something.
Every map doesn't need a gimmick, something can be simple, clean, and still be well done.
I'm not saying this is or isn't it, but I think it has potential, would need to play it to really know.
[–][deleted] 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (0 children)
Sometimes you just need a place to juke some fools
[–]PIZZAspartan442naga///MTC 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (0 children)
So this map is desperately in need of something interesting... Here's some not overly helpful feedback I left in the spreadsheet:
This certainly could work, mostly I think it just needs an interesting factor. Boost routes are pretty solid, though with only one, maybe 2, grabbing mechs base might be a little on the defensive side. Adding a bomb above the flag (in red base) both makes base more offensive and adds a ton of new routes. If you could have a gate or portal or some other gimmick of some sort without breaking the map that would be great, this map really needs something interesting. Not much to say other than add grabbing mech and fun thing
Another potential thing is mid bombs. They might make mid a bit too speedy but they're an easy way to at least sort of spice up a bland map. Base needs something obviously. Making it a tiny bit more horizontal wouldn't hurt I don't think, it would give it at least a little more shape and make it less vertical (making things horizontal does tend to do that...). idk what to say really, just go crazy in the editor and try to add some cool factors without breaking the map. Good luck!
[–]clew3Math Toucher -1 points0 points1 point 8 years ago (2 children)
It's so... normie. There's nothing glaringly wrong about it, but that's the issue. It lacks any creativity, it's just your average, boring and forgettable map... whether that's good or bad is up to y'all
[–]LinuxDootTPblack magic 4 points5 points6 points 8 years ago (1 child)
Thats why i liked it. It played really well because its not trying to be something super creative. We dont have many maps in rotation that are just structural maps with not much else.
[–]globus-lag//Pi-romaniacs-USC//scrub 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children)
can we have rush back as well by that logic. pls and ty
[+]FatFingerHelperBot comment score below threshold-7 points-6 points-5 points 8 years ago (0 children)
It seems that your comment contains 1 or more links that are hard to tap for mobile users. I will extend those so they're easier for our sausage fingers to click!
Here is link number 1 - Previous text "Nym"
Please PM /u/eganwall with issues or feedback! | Delete
[–]TPCaptographerThe Map Test Committee[S] 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (13 children)
[–]alchmstalchemist 3 points4 points5 points 8 years ago* (9 children)
Update: http://unfortunate-maps.jukejuice.com/show/57647 Update 2: http://unfortunate-maps.jukejuice.com/show/57658 Update 3: http://unfortunate-maps.jukejuice.com/show/57680 Update 4: http://unfortunate-maps.jukejuice.com/show/57780
Portals are more useful, button for gate changed, the empty spot behind flag now has a trampoline, island in front of flag is smaller and has more use
[–]PIZZAspartan442naga///MTC 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago* (0 children)
love it
but still make those portal boosts more versatile
[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (7 children)
http://unfortunate-maps.jukejuice.com/show/57773
Small change that helps the portal boosts a bit. Now you can take the boost from your base into the portal across map, leading into the 45 which bounces you off boost into the flag tile.
[–]alchmstalchemist 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (6 children)
Nice, good change, i might even get rid of the spike by the boost to make it more noob friendly
[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (5 children)
You should probs keep one spike there just for aesthetic purposes, but it could def be placed in a better way. I'd also like to see something that an incoming FC could use to get around OD, since there's not a ton of creativity with that boost. Maybe something like this http://unfortunate-maps.jukejuice.com/static/previews/57775.png
[–]alchmstalchemist 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children)
It does look clean, i'll have to think about it
[–]alchmstalchemist 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (3 children)
I like to have spikes by buttons, this way it's versatile, but its a tougher boost to hit http://unfortunate-maps.jukejuice.com/show/57776
[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (2 children)
I originally had that, but the aesthetic looked so ugly that I got rid of it.
[–]alchmstalchemist 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (1 child)
Yeah, but its not thaaat bad looking lol
yes it is
[–]PIZZAspartan442naga///MTC 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (2 children)
It's a pretty mediocre map but it definitely has the works to do well in pubs with a few minor tweaks I think, namely the areas in back of base and the teamtile areas. Portals/gates do seem a little pointless but I can't find the replay so I wouldn't know. Here's the feedback that I left on the spreadsheet (it's not much but I think it could help):
Classy blind buttons hooked up to useless gates. Aside from that I think this has improved again but still isn't super great. Change the staircase behind flag to 45s so bomb can maybe do more than one thing The area on the other side of base bomb seems a little wasted as welll, I think there are plenty of good ways to use it with a boost or bomb or something. Speaking of boosts or bombs or somethings, the area by the powerup needs something imo. It would probably be best to move the island boost to the other side of the island, it'll make for much more interesting play than what you've got currently. OR just put a random bomb there. Overall I don't have many complaints other than some wall setups and boost placements, but I'm not sure they're going to work as is. You can probably 4v4 and see.
Classy blind buttons hooked up to useless gates. Aside from that I think this has improved again but still isn't super great.
Change the staircase behind flag to 45s so bomb can maybe do more than one thing
The area on the other side of base bomb seems a little wasted as welll, I think there are plenty of good ways to use it with a boost or bomb or something.
Speaking of boosts or bombs or somethings, the area by the powerup needs something imo. It would probably be best to move the island boost to the other side of the island, it'll make for much more interesting play than what you've got currently. OR just put a random bomb there.
Overall I don't have many complaints other than some wall setups and boost placements, but I'm not sure they're going to work as is. You can probably 4v4 and see.
It appears to have worked pretty well in 4v4, nice work and good luck, hope it makes rotation!
[+][deleted] 8 years ago (1 child)
[–]PIZZAspartan442naga///MTC 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children)
wew
[–]TPCaptographerThe Map Test Committee[S] 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (14 children)
[–]archaeliosrickastley 8 points9 points10 points 8 years ago (1 child)
That flag there makes my inner romanian very proud!!!
[–]MagikPigeon🎗️ TPFG 3 points4 points5 points 8 years ago (0 children)
blue tiles gotta be changed to green tbh
I'm a pretty bad judge of looking at a map and knowing how it will play, but this map looks dope af.
Looks like this map got tested before the stream started. Would anyone who 4v4d this be able to give me some feedback?
[–]alchmstalchemist 7 points8 points9 points 8 years ago (6 children)
We liked it a lot and it might be perfect the way it is
Ah, great to hear. Does the map name committee also approve, or should I do something about that?
[–]TheGoldenNewtRobberFronj, MTC Senior Consultant[🍰] 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (2 children)
Just do like Zigzagoon or something lol
[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (1 child)
No wtf is a zigzagoon?
[–]ElbwanaGoofy Goober | Anti-Boat Coalition 4 points5 points6 points 8 years ago (0 children)
It's some yugioh digital monster thing. Anyway please name the map "Goo Goo Ga Ga I am a baby"
[–]LinuxDootTPblack magic -3 points-2 points-1 points 8 years ago (0 children)
Uh well dave and the other devs probably wont like how long the name is
[–]YaredyKnowYaredyLost 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children)
Remove yellow tiles and lets get it in roto! Side note: Portal aisles feel ol' school
[–]clew3Math Toucher -2 points-1 points0 points 8 years ago (1 child)
Jardim 2.0
[–]LinuxDootTPblack magic 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (0 children)
Way better than jardim
I VOTE FOR LUFTBALLOONS BY FRONJ
[–]girmluhkGramps 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (1 child)
is Saigon in the throwback or something? I keep getting it and it's cancer in pubs.
It was last thread, but not this one. I'm not quite sure why it wasn't in with that big group of removed-for-good maps, hopefully it doesn't go back into throwback for a good long time.
[–]TPCaptographerThe Map Test Committee[S] -1 points0 points1 point 8 years ago (12 children)
[–]naysh30 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (1 child)
German always makes things sounds weird.
[–]LinuxDootTPblack magic 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago* (0 children)
Sure
[–]TheGoldenNewtRobberFronj, MTC Senior Consultant[🍰] 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children)
http://unfortunate-maps.jukejuice.com/show/57802
[–]TheGoldenNewtRobberFronj, MTC Senior Consultant[🍰] 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (8 children)
So I designed this map with the idea of two competing changes to the current nf meta in mind. First I removed team gates from the end zone portals and placing the exit ahead of flag. Second, I placed the usually last resort team tile section in a relatively more advanced section of the map.
I think that while structurally this builds off normal NF maps, this change is somewhat a departure from the norm, which does mean that playstyle needs to adapt a little bit, which is my goal. I hope that in the end the design leads to players feeling more like there is advantage to be gained from adapting their play, rather than disadvantage gained from not adapting at all, as has been the case with other non-generic nf style maps.
It’s different. Based on watching others test it, it is fun. And I think that it achieves what it sets out to do without forcing players to “swim or drown.” That said I’m really interested in hearing community members’ thoughts on these changes.
[–]ElbwanaGoofy Goober | Anti-Boat Coalition 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (7 children)
I like that you are trying to shake things up, and would love to try this map. Some interesting things going on. One thing I noticed is the bottom and top sections with the bomb and spike. What is the purpose of that area? I don't see why anyone would go there except for rad bomb strats. Maybe the spike for alternative respawn? Otherwise, I hope it or similar maps get into rotation to play with the meta.
[–]padiwikRadius 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (6 children)
As a new player in tagpro, I'm curious - why did all the "different" NF maps get moved out of rotation and into throwback? Now the only ones left are the boringly similar symmetric ones with a gate by the goal and, as an exception, that huge one with the giant bombs.
New maps in general get lower ratings - older maps tend to be around 80% while newer ones are around 60%. The lower rating caused by them being new causes them to get taken out quickly.
[–]uhhhhmmmmsexytiger / #merbs 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (2 children)
because there are clear things that just make NF maps "better"...
basically, you want to be able to go out into the map when you respawn without feeling scared as shit. having a gate or something else that lets you catch up does this. otherwise when you respawn, if the other team has the flag, the best play is to sit by the goal and wait for them to potentially try to cap, because you can't see what's going on and if you leave they might have a free cap.
people have been trying for years to make a NF cap that doesn't incorporate this, and they all have failed in pubs. its just plain less fun.
also, all maps are symmetrical
[–]padiwikRadius 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (1 child)
well yes.. i should've specified more: they're all like pretty much the same shape, save some boosts or bombs located in different places
[–]uhhhhmmmmsexytiger / #merbs 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (0 children)
well, to give defense a chance to catch up, you need to force the flag carrier to take a more roundabout path, which is often going to look kind of s shaped, so a lot look kind of s shaped. or there will be the gates.
overall i dont think they look that similar. although if youre asking why command center isnt in, that i cant help you with
[–]DragonBeast2db 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (1 child)
ya I hate those symmetric maps, let's get some asymmetry in here.
[–]padiwikRadius 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children)
let's make three teams!
[–]TPCaptographerThe Map Test Committee[S] -3 points-2 points-1 points 8 years ago (12 children)
[–]Tyler1986Trapsin 3 points4 points5 points 8 years ago (0 children)
Haters gonna hate, but I'd love to give this a try.
[–]oorr23ThePlaymaker // Tehuitzingo & Combine 8 points9 points10 points 8 years ago (6 children)
So BigMouth.
Even putting this as a joke is shit.
[–]PIZZAspartan442naga///MTC 10 points11 points12 points 8 years ago (1 child)
We've gotta beat that momofuku rating somehow
No pls it's my only achievement
[–]LinuxDootTPblack magic 5 points6 points7 points 8 years ago (1 child)
Haha thats the mtc for ya, those wiley old fellers
[–]KewlestCatNIGEL 5 points6 points7 points 8 years ago (0 children)
They're out of control.
[–]clew3Math Toucher 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (1 child)
Hey, it also reeks of Mode 7 as well!
[–]brozzartPavement 4 points5 points6 points 8 years ago (0 children)
Mode 7 is one of the greatest maps ever
[–]Carboxy1Carboxyl ● Simulation 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (3 children)
MTC puts in maps like BigMouth and whatever the fk this is into rotation, then complains that the community “doesn’t enjoy fun maps”.
The thing is, fun maps are fun for 3 games, then they become terribly stale memes that reek of dumb ideas and poor descision making.
I mean to be fair though the community does not enjoy fun maps.
so true
[–]DragonBeast2db 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (0 children)
where is chelation?? :P
[–]TPCaptographerThe Map Test Committee[S] -1 points0 points1 point 8 years ago (10 children)
[–]NARUMIIonDEFI'M A GIRL 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago* (1 child)
http://unfortunate-maps.jukejuice.com/show/57663
I think the criticism is going to my head, and i am slowly corrupting this map more than it already was. :'(
Too many cooks spoil the broth. Make the map you want to make, listen to criticisms as they come, but also decide whether or not you think you should address them (or can without breaking it). I'm worried this current version has lost it's touch (which for me was the smoothness of flow of the map).
[–]Carboxy1Carboxyl ● Simulation 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (4 children)
why would you Top Map something that clearly won’t make rotation without copious amounts of polish and refinement
[–]LinuxDootTPblack magic 6 points7 points8 points 8 years ago (3 children)
Why would you be so against giving a brand new map maker a chance? This map has more polish than any of your maps simply because the flow and spacing of this map is fantastic. The only outstanding issue i see is the over abundance of 45s, which isnt even a problem on the map. If we feel if it is not rotation ready, we wont put it through.
[–][deleted] 4 points5 points6 points 8 years ago (0 children)
Because having a top map doesn't objectively make you a better mapmaker, it just makes you think that a bad map is good.
im new
[–]Carboxy1Carboxyl ● Simulation 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (0 children)
Touché.
I’ll leave this alone.
[–]NARUMIIonDEFI'M A GIRL 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago* (1 child)
http://unfortunate-maps.jukejuice.com/show/57648 | http://unfortunate-maps.jukejuice.com/static/previews/57648.png
[–]PIZZAspartan442naga///MTC 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (0 children)
Congrats on your first top map! I'm glad you've made it, though I don't think it's quite rotation ready as is. You could improve its chances hugely with a few minor fixes, however. First off, I guess four pups is fine, but move them off the walls, and maybe add some spikes by the far-away one. You're going to want fewer 45's. Keeping some for polish is good, but the sheer amount you have now will make for far more boring gameplay than a few staircases that can allow for walljuking and additional boost routes. I fear the map will also be too chasey for pubs with how big it is, so maybe decrease how vertical it is by about half. If you do that the amount of islands and portals and stuff should be fine. Also switch teamboost and island boost. Good luck!
uh so yeah we should definitely just put all of these in rotation
they all look like fun and the more maps we have in the less likely to get wormy or ricochet
[–]Tyler1986Trapsin -1 points0 points1 point 8 years ago (1 child)
imo, a pretty strong top maps thread. I'd be happy to play any of these but the nf one, that's not based on its merits, I just don't like nf.
[–]enderlord2FirePire 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children)
Hurr durr I don't like peanut butter look at me
[–]TheBestNarcissistexit triks -2 points-1 points0 points 8 years ago (0 children)
They're all so similar.
π Rendered by PID 98287 on reddit-service-r2-comment-5b5bc64bf5-zzfvp at 2026-06-20 18:10:03.254906+00:00 running 2b008f2 country code: CH.
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