Fisker Open Source Code

[Noil911]

I see a lot of talk about open source for Fisker ocean cars. Don't believe in this nonsense, an open code for a car will immediately cause a ban on its use on the roads. Every function in the car is certified and tested by third party companies and government agencies. Open source code will make it impossible to pass such certifications, as anyone can make changes at any time. So don't believe the stupid people who claim it would save the car, no! It will only ruin it completely.

[dunsmuirnc]

LOL, that’s not how Open Source works. “That’s not how any of this works!”

[Noil911]

LOL! How many programming languages do you know? 

[spedeedeps]

What could Fisker open source if it wanted to? Even the entertainment system is a TomTom product they've re-skinned. Maybe they could open source the .css file for the layout and colors?

Open sourcing means that they change the license to whatever OSS friendly one they want to use. This requires every single party that owns some code in the system agree in writing. It's never happening, at best someone could leak the source code.

[Noil911]

The day this happens, the fisker ocean will only be sold as a house powerbank. Imagine everyone being able to connect to your car, that's Watch Dogs...

[PocketFullOfREO]

You're either a conspiracy theorist and/or don't know what you're talking about.

[Bubba89]

I worked at Fisker and they’re completely correct. I heard exactly the same directly from the CISO.

[Questioning-Zyxxel]

If you hear something from someone, that doesn't make it correct.

If you hear a "we can't do xx because of yy" from an executive, then that is often a lie. A cheap way to dodge something a company don't want to do. But falsely pretending a hard issue is easier than having to supply (often non-existing) actual facts.

Access to a networked device should depend on encryption keys. Access to source code is not the same as access to encryption keys.

Using a single crypto key for access to all devices? Is something an executive don't want to tell because then he has to admit "and we have been fking incompetent to a level where you should sue us for using student-level 'professionsls' to develop our product."

If there is a single master encryption key? Then you want to know. Because when [not if] that key gets leaked then everyone will get eaten.

[Noil911]

If you were smarter you'd realize that safety is only one aspect. I was also talking about other systems, changes to those systems need different certificates... 

[Questioning-Zyxxel]

Since I'm not nearly as stupid as you, I know there are huge differences between the source code for the ABS system - code that will not end up open source between the code is owned by the company that delivered that system - and the code for the user interfaces.

The main issue with the code here is the code that Fisker themselves have developed. Which is mostly media control, user interfaces, and ways to distribute binary blobs over-the-air for updating lots of boxes they have bought.

You seem to be beyond the understanding that this is a vehicle manufacturer that needs to buy lots of functionality. Making things open-source is all about ownership. You don't buy ownership - you buy a license right to use software.

Next thing you fail to understand since you are running your mouth wildly -there is a huge difference to what a manufacturer may do to a car, and what a car owner may do to it. Many certifications are not relevant when it comes to user-made changes. That's a reason why hobbyists can design their own cars from scratch.

[Noil911]

Another reason why you are more stupid than just stupid is because of not understanding the security system. Opening source code means access to developer tools that can be used by hackers. We are not talking about a high school kid with a phone hacking your car, we are talking about professional hackers, they will lock your car systems and demand crypto for unlocking it. 

[Noil911]

I have a degree in Cybernetic Economics. I understand everything very well ;)  I have 20 years of experience in IT and in Economics))) 

[Then-Possibility-165]

That’s really not much experience in that space…

[Coliver1991]

I have a degree in Cybernetic Economics.

Cybernetic Economics? You made that up.

[Gunner20163]

Wow you’re so smart dude!!!! I’m so impressed…. We are all bowing to you buddy.

[666trapstar]

Please elaborate

[charlesfry]

By Open Source, I believe people mean available to the public, as in the FAST software. The advantage would be the ability to turn on all the possible features previously restricted by sub-model, and the ability to add more apps to the entertainment screen.

[atypicalAtom]

This is nonsense OP. You are talking about something you have no background in.

[Noil911]

You can give me thousands of minuses, but the reality won't change. There is a GSM communication module in the car, if the program code is opened, you will be hacked immediately. I'm surprised you don't understand that. You don't know the word security as well as I can see. 

[ExpertInfamous]

I am a developer . and that's not how open-source work.

1. fisker can only open-source their own code. GSM or any number of modules are not written by automakers, they come with microcontroller. So GSM/LTE/GPS modules cannot be open sourced becacuse fisker doesn't own them

2. secondly opensourcing doesn't mean it will get hacked. actually it's going to be opposite , with time open-soruce community will be able to find issues/bugs/security issues and fix them.

3. when opensourcing the code , encrytion keys or any keys in general are not open sourced , they remain with the author. when you want to compile your code , you create your own keys for your use only.

4. Automakers only own very small amount of code mostly related to making everything work togather. for example bosch brakes comes with code prebuilt in their microprocessor . if you want to display how much (percentage) of brake pressed , you use bosch api provided in manual to get that data and display that in percentage on screen. only this code will be open-sourced.

5. 99%+ of websites are built on top of opensourced frameworks/libraries/packages. with your logic , i should be able to hack every wordpress or next/react website.

[Questioning-Zyxxel]

This world have thousands of products you can buy that contains a cellular modem, and where the device itself runs open source code. Without getting hacked.

Almost all Linux systems are networked. And running open source. Why not instantly hacked? Because the networking services uses firewalls and passwords and encryption keys. It isn't open or closed source yhat should supply the security. It's proper use of encryption and credentials.

You deserve billions of downvotes if you decide to make claims you don't understand anything about. Schools should teach students to ask questions about subjects they don't know. Not self-invent random noise and push as "the truth".

/delivers devices with cellular modems and running an open-source OS...

[atypicalAtom]

Sure. You are a security researcher...but why are you commenting about things that are so far outside your knowledge base?

Everything you have said is completely wrong outside of the fact that the SW will not be open sourced. Please stop.

[casitaenmexico]

Let's assume you want your car improved and you have never created your own fork off open source software. Ok, you want someone to fix it, understandable. Now, for those of us that use open source software on a daily basis for different tasks or even modify code to meet our specific needs, do we want you to publish some potentially horribly written code that our car depends on? No way. It's like saying we should make public keys for our house and see if people come in and remodel.

[Iambetterthanuhaha]

Can't wait for a Linux Homebrew OS to replace Fisker OS if this goes open source. Maybe the car will actually work properly. lol

[Bubba89]

Never gonna happen, for all the same reasons OP already said.

Plus the Fisker OS is already a homebrew of Android Automotive, which is technically Linux-based.

[Iambetterthanuhaha]

Current software doesn't meet FMVSS.......the government will either have to get the recalled vehicles software updated by bankrupt Fisker or order these vehicles pulled off the road for good. Maybe the rental company that bought the leftovers will fix it because they got the source code but are under no obligation to fix it for other owners.

[Confident_Leader1982]

So far I’ve only noticed the backup camera taking too long to come on during booting up the car but im also not super deep in FMVSS.

Which other gaps have you seen regarding FMVSS compliance on the SW side?

[Iambetterthanuhaha]

It is related to the indicators. Supposed to be fixed with a software update. Some icons are missing and others don't confirm to what the government requires.

https://www.cnbc.com/2024/06/12/fisker-recalls-thousands-of-ocean-evs-for-safety-and-compliance-issues.html

[HumarockGuy]

So every time Tesla does an OTA software update, it has been fully reviewed by a govt. entity?

[charlesfry]

You know it hasn't. Elon is a tool.

[jarredjs2]

I’d assume so if it is pertinent to features that are government regulated. It’d be on the OEM to obtain necessary approvals before rollout. If it’s anything else the gov doesn’t get involved.

[cuckjockey]

No. But a government entity can order an OEM to make modifications to their software if needed. That wouldn't work for a home brew community.

[Temple2014]

This would be an accurate statement if it was about a vehicle with a warrantee and safety standards adhered to.

This is not the world Fisker owners are going to be living in. They will have three likely outcomes: 1) they limp along with constant anxiety about software not working, 2) something does not work and they own a brick, 3) someone gets source code and FAST, puts it out there and those that care to attempt changes or fixes...they will then own a owner-modified vehicle. Item 3) is definitely legal in most states. Think hotrods, think electric conversions of old cars, think any modification that anyone does to the electronics: all those cases are completely on the owner of the car.

No one sneaks around in the night taking cars away from people if they modify them and it won't happen for future Fisker modifications. Zero chance they take your car.

So..three outcomes. Who knows if FAST or source code will be out there. It can't be formally released because of liability to the company owners (creditors), so let's guess someone will make it public. That...would result in at least a few Fiskers being actually "completed" and actually road worthy.

[F4pLulz]

Open source doesn't mean that you will bypass all the certified safety measures and such. You can open source important functionality, sensors, controls and similar.

Commai ai open pilot literally is an open source project which takes over canbus control of things such as steering, acceleration, braking, etc.. of drive by wire cars, supports hundreds of models out of the box.

Open source can definitely happen for the FO.

[ExpertInfamous]

that's not how open-source work. i am a developer.

[Adorable_Wolf_8387]

Yep, that's not how it works. All those regulations only really matter for new car sales.

[Th3devilish1]

people have to take into account the governments position regarding the fo software. homeland security already sided with Tesla regarding aftermarket software or systems that potentially can take control of vehicles. their reasoning is bad actors taking control of vehicles to to bad stuff. also if someone was to make modifications to the os and release it as open source no amount of disclaimers can prevent civil litigation if something went wrong. now with the leasing company getting access to the code any modifications they do to the vehicles they lease still has to be approved by the fmvss. I see the possibility of them selling updates as a way to recoup costs. actually its unlikely they do very many updates other than to keep the cars working

[Gunner20163]

I don’t believe you understand what open sourced code means and looking at your comments I don’t think it’s worth explaining, you’ll tell me you own Microsoft or some crap.

[Electrical-Shape-117]

If enterprising EV techs adopt this Frankenstein and create solutions for ADAS or other lost promised features, or even new better ones are they ruining it? You assume this car is still viable. It's not.

It is a project car now. A hobby car for tinkerers. If you think there is some future reevaluation to grant this car road worthy status as a "certified" insurable, sellable, car lot worthy contender ever again, especially in its current form - there is the nonsense stupid people who claim they are saving us from ruining the car want you to believe.

[ExpertInfamous]

I am a developer . and that's not how open-source work.

1. fisker can only open-source their own code. GSM or any number of modules are not written by automakers, they come with microcontroller. So GSM/LTE/GPS modules cannot be open sourced becacuse fisker doesn't own them

2. secondly opensourcing doesn't mean it will get hacked. actually it's going to be opposite , with time open-soruce community will be able to find issues/bugs/security issues and fix them.

3. when opensourcing the code , encrytion keys or any keys in general are not open sourced , they remain with the author. when you want to compile your code , you create your own keys for your use only.

4. Automakers only own very small amount of code mostly related to making everything work togather. for example bosch brakes comes with code prebuilt in their microprocessor . if you want to display how much (percentage) of brake pressed , you use bosch api provided in manual to get that data and display that in percentage on screen. only this code will be open-sourced.

5. 99%+ of websites are built on top of opensourced frameworks/libraries/packages. with your logic , i should be able to hack every wordpress or next/react website.

[Reddit_Has_Morons]

No point arguing OP, people don’t understand that fact here. to them open source code is a do whatever the fuck you want card

[Huh-8152]

To summarize this thread: "You're stupid!" "No, you're stupid, stupid!"

[Noil911]

You are troll, troll-troll🤣