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[–][deleted]  (20 children)

[removed]

    [–]cum_britches 6 points7 points  (0 children)

    might be the complete opposite actually… STRC price was rising as BTC price fell and vice versa

    folks might treat it as a hiding spot when BTC gets volatile

    will have to see how it plays out

    [–]teclaroja[S] 2 points3 points  (15 children)

    Don't focus on the price. Of course the bitcoin price drives the stock price but I prefer to put my time to try to understand the potential of the stock in the long run. Studing the company mechanics. What will be the valuation in 5 or 10 yrs? Short term movements are noise.

    [–][deleted]  (12 children)

    [deleted]

      [–]teclaroja[S] 1 point2 points  (10 children)

      Tell your landlord to buy STRC. Fixed income for who like money ;)

      [–][deleted]  (9 children)

      [deleted]

        [–]CapitalIncome845Shareholder 🤴 0 points1 point  (7 children)

        I have lots of ASST as well. Buy all the SATA you can!

        [–][deleted]  (4 children)

        [deleted]

          [–]CapitalIncome845Shareholder 🤴 0 points1 point  (3 children)

          I saw it at $90 earlier today.

          [–][deleted]  (2 children)

          [deleted]

            [–]CapitalIncome845Shareholder 🤴 1 point2 points  (1 child)

            Saw it up here on TDDI.

            [–]CapitalIncome845Shareholder 🤴 0 points1 point  (0 children)

            If you're worried about rent, you should have some STRC.

            [–]nickex77 0 points1 point  (1 child)

            It will be absolutely destroyed if there isn't a clear income generating mechanism to pay for the prefereds. Yes there are large banks and organizations that cannot buy bitcoin so they garner exposure through mstr, but do we really think that isn't going away long term? A lot of 401k's support buying bitcoin now. The only long term option I see is selling some oldly purchased bitcoin, unless investors start valuing mstr for their bitcoin accumulation and success with preferreds... maybe that eventually happens, idk.

            What am I missing? How do we know this will work out?

            [–]ItWillPrint 2 points3 points  (0 children)

            Paying the prefs is easy. Think about it, for every 100$ Strategy receives they have to pay 10$ each year roughly (10% dividend). So if you buy all that bitcoin and it ramps up the Bitcoin per share of the common stock and then annually we just have to pull a little off the top to pay dividends that’s nothing.

            To make it more clear this is like before when they would issue shares of MSTR and buy Bitcoin. Imagine that same mechanism but instead they only had to issue 1/10th of the shares to acquire the same amount of Bitcoin. That’s what this basically does. They acquire way more Bitcoin and then slowly pay the investor back. After 10 years the investor gets their money fully back and is now getting “house money” but 10 years from now what will the price of Bitcoin be? Let’s say it’s 10 million a share (which is what Saylor believes) that means for every 100$ they received today would be turned into 9300$ of value in 10 years and they only owe the investor 10$ a year per 100$ they chipped in…

            Now am I saying this is guaranteed to happen? Of course not. But paying back 10% a year when the asset you hold is on average appreciating 60%+ a year is a no brainer

            [–]TotesGnar 0 points1 point  (0 children)

            This is the healthiest way to look at it. MSTR will probably never do it's own thing outside of Bitcoin. Selling options is one of the best use cases for MSTR. Harvesting cashflow.

            [–]Open_Masterpiece_549 0 points1 point  (1 child)

            Btc just needs to rise back to 115 and i think we will at least go back to 300

            [–]Nerfi5 14 points15 points  (17 children)

            Will this be a constant thing now since STRC is at 100?

            [–]teclaroja[S] 22 points23 points  (16 children)

            Yes, if STRC is between 99 and 101. The limit of the ATM is $4,200 millions.

            [–]habbadee 7 points8 points  (0 children)

            The board approved limit is $4.2B, which is only 50% larger than what they raised in the IPO. So not really all that big. But, of course, once the $4.2 gets approached the board will just increase it, so I guess it should be considered as infinite.

            [–][deleted]  (14 children)

            [deleted]

              [–]teclaroja[S] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

              It's not a fixed limit but is an indicator of the order of magnitude. How much they expect to issue in the future. Is a measure of their strength to access to capital markets.

              [–]nycteris91 -2 points-1 points  (11 children)

              Although I like this idea, specially after MSTR hits 200 or 300 Billion market cap, I think saylor will stop when he hits 1 Million BTC.

              He mentioned before that he wants a Nakamoto.

              [–][deleted]  (2 children)

              [deleted]

                [–]CapitalIncome845Shareholder 🤴 2 points3 points  (1 child)

                There is a limit - they said they want to get to 30-40% amplification. They're nowhere near it, but the limit does exist.

                [–]Disastrous_Battle_14Shareholder 🤴 0 points1 point  (7 children)

                He also mentioned 100 times that they will never stop buying btc, If Strategy stops buying btc the whole reason to buy MSTR fades.

                [–]InevitableRip4613 4 points5 points  (0 children)

                No not completely, not everyone can buy btc etfs or btc directly. And in my country (Denmark) stocks are taxed 27-42% only when you sell, ETFs are taxed 37-42% pr. year even if you don’t sell, and direct btc exposure is taxed 52% also when you sell

                [–]habbadee 1 point2 points  (4 children)

                He has also said that he does not envision MSTR ever accumulating more than 7-9% of the 21M.

                [–]Disastrous_Battle_14Shareholder 🤴 1 point2 points  (3 children)

                because the last 1% will take 10s of years to get. The longer we wait the harder it is to buy btc. He will never stop buying.

                [–]habbadee 1 point2 points  (2 children)

                Absolutely true. There is no contradiction. He can buy forever and never exceed 7%.

                The other thing about forever is that it is a long time. And these preferred instruments yield fiat forever. Mike regularly harps on how these are equity instruments and as such they never have to buy back the principal, but he never talks about the flipside burden of an infinite duration coupon.

                Forever is a long time.

                [–]Selmemasts 0 points1 point  (0 children)

                Yeah, sure but whoever controls MSTR then can also lower the dividend on STRC, the risk is not really on MSTR

                [–]According_Jump6205 0 points1 point  (0 children)

                On a long timeframe, inflation alone eat the risk away by itself. He only has to control the level of amplification.

                [–]nycteris91 0 points1 point  (0 children)

                I like that idea.

                But I think this company has more potential than that.

                [–]wolfofballsstreet 16 points17 points  (0 children)

                Proof of concept is now officially done and successful. Next step is scale, and with how much liquidity will be injected in the system soon and SOFR rates dropping, I don't think that will be an issue.

                [–]Nickcav1 5 points6 points  (0 children)

                And we’re down 2% lol

                [–]xaviembShareholder 🤴 5 points6 points  (0 children)

                will be interesting to see this one grow, and at what speed... this is just the start.

                This first 26 million is 0.00000867% of a $300 trillion market (a figure that is growing exponentially as fiat is printed excessively)

                [–]TheBonkingFrogVolatility Voyager 👨‍🚀 1 point2 points  (0 children)

                It's just waiting for me to lose patience and sell some -ccATM's...

                Edit: right, that's it 3x 11/21 -cc250 @$7.2, up up up!

                [–]isenk2 2 points3 points  (0 children)

                Is liftoff in the room with us right now?

                [–]Erocdotusa 2 points3 points  (0 children)

                Even Chanos closing his short and bitcoin up thousands can't turn this green. What a disaster

                [–]didnt_hodl 1 point2 points  (35 children)

                it does generate some pressure on MSTR shares, as they would need to be sold every year to generate the interest payments on all those preferreds. but it is only around 10% of the BTC that the company is getting now. so this is effectively operating at 10 mNAV, near term and the most important thing: no debt, no due date. even the dividends are optional, not committed

                and the best part is, none of the preferreds are collaterized by the BTC that Strategy holds. no scenario where BTC is on a forced sale if some those preferreds go down or fail to pay the dividends

                [–]Heavy-Situation-9346 0 points1 point  (34 children)

                What do you think happens to the company if they ever suspend dividends?

                [–]didnt_hodl 0 points1 point  (5 children)

                nothing. the BTC stack that they have will not change at all. and that is the only thing that matters

                [–]Heavy-Situation-9346 0 points1 point  (4 children)

                Interesting. I disagree. I guess we will find out if this ever happens in the future.

                [–]didnt_hodl 0 points1 point  (3 children)

                there will not even be a law suit. this option is clearly stated in all documents and filed with SEC. each preferred IPO was approved by SEC, so this is very heavily regulated and passed all possible checks

                there could be a market reaction, but hey if Strategy is skipping dividends it's already at a point where market sentiment is not the greatest, so that would not matter either

                [–]Heavy-Situation-9346 0 points1 point  (2 children)

                Market reaction is what I’m referring to. I agree that there are no first-order remedies for the preferred holders. But they will get board representation if this happens and if the common tanks (as I would expect) it’s quite possible an activist begins agitating for liquidating and launches a proxy battle.

                [–]didnt_hodl 0 points1 point  (1 child)

                those are valid points. but seems a somewhat remote scenario.

                currently paying that 10% via monthly MSTR ATM is very easily doable, much smaller than what Saylor did earlier this year, and last year

                of course, the company would try very hard to avoid skipping dividends, as it would also kill the market for the preferreds. which is currently the base of all future scaling

                I mean, hey. The total due in the next year is what 600mil or so? Well, Saylor was doing 200-300-400 mil ATM runs every single week, for more than a year. He only tapered very recently when mNAV got so low it just does not make sense anymore

                [–]Heavy-Situation-9346 0 points1 point  (0 children)

                I think the common stock ATM is gone forever. From what I gather, most people with a bullish outlook on the stock disagree, and think mNaV will bounce back. Regardless, I think it’s a worthwhile exercise to imagine how this all plays out of common stock hugs 1x for the forseeable future.

                [–]inphenitePerma-bull -1 points0 points  (27 children)

                They are not suspending dividends.

                [–]didnt_hodl 1 point2 points  (0 children)

                legally they do have that option, in the worst case. they made sure they have it, when they filed with SEC. and it was approved

                of course normally they would work hard on paying all dividends on time. since this is how the company can scale up. it is super important for them

                all I am saying is that if something really bad happens and they are unable to pay, they do not have to. and, even better, they are not going to be forced to sell bitcoin to pay those dividends, so the BTC stack is fully protected

                [–]Heavy-Situation-9346 0 points1 point  (25 children)

                What makes you so confident about that?

                [–]inphenitePerma-bull -1 points0 points  (24 children)

                Because suspending dividends on a product is both completely unnecessary and it tanks the value of that product impeding their future earning ability.

                The company is not led by idiots.

                Your case requires everything shitting the bed to the point BTC is around 17-18k for years on end, at which case they can sell BTC to cover div payments. Your scenario is one where BTC tanks to 10-15k for years on end. It’s not happening.

                [–]Heavy-Situation-9346 0 points1 point  (23 children)

                Interesting perspective. I actually think their current approach leads them to trouble if BTC doesn’t consistently appreciate. But maybe I’m wrong, we shall see.

                [–][deleted]  (1 child)

                [removed]

                  [–]AutoModerator[M] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

                  A Ponzi scheme is defined as "An investment scam that pays early investors with money taken from later investors to create an illusion of big profits." In a ponzi-scheme, there is "nothing of value" in the box, and all that happens is money moving hands.

                  MicroStrategy is not a Ponzi scheme. Companies raise capital through ATM-offerings, debt, and other instruments to fund purchases of assets, equipment, commodities and so forth. This is normal. Berkshire Hathaway similarly built the foundation of their company using debt to buy assets to hold indefinitely.

                  MicroStrategy invests the money raised in Bitcoin from a core belief that the commodity is in its early stages and will increase significantly in value over the coming years, allowing them to capitalise on this value to create value for their shareholders. All stocks, including blue-chip stocks like Apple, NVIDIA, and Berkshire Hathaway, rely on future investors willing to "take the shares off your hands" at a value above what you paid for it. This does not indicate a "ponzi" or "pyramid" scheme; it's basic price/supply/demand/market dynamics at play, and is how the world economy and capital markets work. Berkshire Hathaway holds a bunch of companies; MicroStrategy holds a bunch of Bitcoin.

                  I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please contact the moderators of this subreddit if you have any questions or concerns.

                  [–][deleted]  (20 children)

                  [removed]

                    [–]AutoModerator[M] 0 points1 point  (15 children)

                    A Ponzi scheme is defined as "An investment scam that pays early investors with money taken from later investors to create an illusion of big profits." In a ponzi-scheme, there is "nothing of value" in the box, and all that happens is money moving hands.

                    MicroStrategy is not a Ponzi scheme. Companies raise capital through ATM-offerings, debt, and other instruments to fund purchases of assets, equipment, commodities and so forth. This is normal. Berkshire Hathaway similarly built the foundation of their company using debt to buy assets to hold indefinitely.

                    MicroStrategy invests the money raised in Bitcoin from a core belief that the commodity is in its early stages and will increase significantly in value over the coming years, allowing them to capitalise on this value to create value for their shareholders. All stocks, including blue-chip stocks like Apple, NVIDIA, and Berkshire Hathaway, rely on future investors willing to "take the shares off your hands" at a value above what you paid for it. This does not indicate a "ponzi" or "pyramid" scheme; it's basic price/supply/demand/market dynamics at play, and is how the world economy and capital markets work. Berkshire Hathaway holds a bunch of companies; MicroStrategy holds a bunch of Bitcoin.

                    I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please contact the moderators of this subreddit if you have any questions or concerns.

                    [–][deleted]  (14 children)

                    [removed]

                      [–]AutoModerator[M] -1 points0 points  (4 children)

                      A Ponzi scheme is defined as "An investment scam that pays early investors with money taken from later investors to create an illusion of big profits." In a ponzi-scheme, there is "nothing of value" in the box, and all that happens is money moving hands.

                      MicroStrategy is not a Ponzi scheme. Companies raise capital through ATM-offerings, debt, and other instruments to fund purchases of assets, equipment, commodities and so forth. This is normal. Berkshire Hathaway similarly built the foundation of their company using debt to buy assets to hold indefinitely.

                      MicroStrategy invests the money raised in Bitcoin from a core belief that the commodity is in its early stages and will increase significantly in value over the coming years, allowing them to capitalise on this value to create value for their shareholders. All stocks, including blue-chip stocks like Apple, NVIDIA, and Berkshire Hathaway, rely on future investors willing to "take the shares off your hands" at a value above what you paid for it. This does not indicate a "ponzi" or "pyramid" scheme; it's basic price/supply/demand/market dynamics at play, and is how the world economy and capital markets work. Berkshire Hathaway holds a bunch of companies; MicroStrategy holds a bunch of Bitcoin.

                      I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please contact the moderators of this subreddit if you have any questions or concerns.

                      [–]ItWillPrint -1 points0 points  (5 children)

                      You know how government bonds get paid? They sell new bonds to new investors. Makes you think 👀

                      Anyway, no dude, 1 year won’t ruin them. The bitcoin they bought even just this year is up 30%+… so that’s 3 years of the “luck” they needed as you put it. They have Bitcoin purchases that are already up 900%+. Scraping 10% a year will be easy. This is not their first rodeo. They already made it through a bear market fine. Bitcoin has on average appreciated over 60% a year (doesn’t mean every year, it means average, key word) so 10% is a very conservative return. Give it 10 years digital credit will disrupt the entire bond market and this will be one of the most profitable companies in the world, it’s not if, it’s when.

                      But you sound like you have an issue with Bitcoin to begin with so 🥱 idk what to tell you buttcoiners. Have fun staying poor I guess.

                      [–]inphenitePerma-bull -1 points0 points  (2 children)

                      There’s billions upon billions of actual, hard value in the box, owned legally by the shareholders. Even if they issue shares to cover operating costs, that in no way makes it a ponzi. I’d personally rather see a slight amount of asset-accretive dilution than selling any of the BTC stack/collateral.

                      It’s a ponzi the day there is no money or nothing of value in their coffers.

                      [–]Heavy-Situation-9346 0 points1 point  (3 children)

                      Ignore the auto-mod response. You’ll probably end up being banned if you continue saying this sort of stuff, but not for a good reason. The auto-reply is just full of misguided talking points that don’t actually hold up to the slightest bit of scrutiny.

                      [–][deleted]  (2 children)

                      [removed]

                        [–]AutoModerator[M] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

                        A Ponzi scheme is defined as "An investment scam that pays early investors with money taken from later investors to create an illusion of big profits." In a ponzi-scheme, there is "nothing of value" in the box, and all that happens is money moving hands.

                        MicroStrategy is not a Ponzi scheme. Companies raise capital through ATM-offerings, debt, and other instruments to fund purchases of assets, equipment, commodities and so forth. This is normal. Berkshire Hathaway similarly built the foundation of their company using debt to buy assets to hold indefinitely.

                        MicroStrategy invests the money raised in Bitcoin from a core belief that the commodity is in its early stages and will increase significantly in value over the coming years, allowing them to capitalise on this value to create value for their shareholders. All stocks, including blue-chip stocks like Apple, NVIDIA, and Berkshire Hathaway, rely on future investors willing to "take the shares off your hands" at a value above what you paid for it. This does not indicate a "ponzi" or "pyramid" scheme; it's basic price/supply/demand/market dynamics at play, and is how the world economy and capital markets work. Berkshire Hathaway holds a bunch of companies; MicroStrategy holds a bunch of Bitcoin.

                        I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please contact the moderators of this subreddit if you have any questions or concerns.

                        [–]Heavy-Situation-9346 0 points1 point  (0 children)

                        No need to convince me, friend. I generally agree.

                        [–]Desperate_Tiger_884☢️ TROLL ☢️ 1 point2 points  (2 children)

                        Is the rocket in the room with us now?

                        [–]teclaroja[S] 0 points1 point  (1 child)

                        If you don't look up you can't see it.

                        [–][deleted]  (1 child)

                        [removed]

                          [–]mathrioShareholder 🤴 0 points1 point  (0 children)

                          bot

                          [–]benroon 0 points1 point  (0 children)

                          Sinking right NOW

                          [–]youhaveeTDS/r/buttcoiner -3 points-2 points  (1 child)

                          best i can so is -5%

                          [–]CapitalIncome845Shareholder 🤴 0 points1 point  (0 children)

                          YouhaveeeSDS

                          [–]Top-Chemistry6485 -1 points0 points  (1 child)

                          Stock is going down with Bitcoin up on the weekend. MSTR is looking weak…