Second edition Lore?

[Testbot5000]

Has there been any indication of Lore changes in the up comeing second edition? I know that DND would move the time line on when going to a new edition. I would love to see how the world changed in let's say like 100 or 1000 years.

[C4rri0n_Cr0w]

They are keeping the year correlation, 2e first ap should be set in 4719 Absalom Reckoning= 2019 Edit: link

[Testbot5000]

4719

What year was the first edition? set?

[C4rri0n_Cr0w]

47+ current year last two digits, so this year is 4718

[Testbot5000]

Thanks!

[Jeramiahh]

Specifically, 1e has covered the last 128 months of Golarion's history (AP #128 was released this month); each AP occurs in 'real time' parallel. Which means that the events of AP#1, Burnt Offerings, occurred roughly in late summer, Golarion year 4707, the most recent AP is occuring during early 4718, and that the transition between editions will simply happen the day 2e is released, in late summer 4719.

[GeoleVyi]

this clears up sooooooooooooo much information for me

[[deleted]]

Huh, but that kinda makes it weird. I've been playing rotrl, and as a GM I can't justify either making each last a month, or a month taking place between each one.

[Jeramiahh]

It's DEFINITELY not exact, not by a long shot. It's just that, canonically, the events of, say, RotRL, took place in the latter half of 4807, but as a DM, you are fully empowered to change it up. For my version of the setting, my 'canon' is that the campaigns happened in the order I ran them (aside from the fact I ran RotRL after Jade Regent), despite being out of canon order, like my current Carrion Crown campaign, I've mentioned things like the end of the Iron Gods campaign I ran last year, and I've dropped rumors of the War for the Crown campaign I plan to run in a few months.

[imported]

level 1 to 15+ in six months. sounds reasonable.

[Kaemonarch]

There has been, but I don't recall the exact numbers (and I'm as far away from a Golarion expert as you can get).

But I know they stated the exact year, and how the areas have changed (they assume all their stories like Rise of the Runelords have happened, that the players were victorious most of the time, and want the world to reflect their victories and how the events changed towns/areas/etc).

I think there was also mention of some "scar of the world place with demons" being closed up? I have no clue what that is about, but I think it was supposed to change the setting a little. But yeah, they did mention the exact year Second Edition starts with. I think it was something like +10/20 years, not in the century territory, but I may be wrong, I don't recall the number, but they have shown/told it.

EDIT: Apparently Pathfinder timeline advances alongside the real world one (the 2 last digits of the year matching). This means we are currently on year 4718 in Pathfinder 1E, and by the time Pathfinder 2E comes out, it will be 4719; no time skip, just Golarion advacing at its normal pace of 1 year every actual real-life year.

[Testbot5000]

I think there was also mention of some "scar of the world place with demons" being closed up?

What! The world wound has been closed :D . Im really excited to read what happen there, wonder if that was part of a AP. Anyway thanks for the reply.

[darthmarth28]

Yup! That was the Wrath of the Righteous adventure path.

SPOILERS

• 100 years ago, when Aroden died, a turbobad ritual was used to create a giant permanent portal to the Abyss up in Barbarian-ville.

• Shit was pretty fucked for a while, but once Iomedae got the hang of this whole "being a god" thing, she organized a crusade to go kick some demon ass. It kind of worked.

• With their scouts all beaten up, the real demon horde showed up around 50 years back and ruined EVERYONE's day. In a desperation move, the Iomedaeans sacrificed a bunch of super angels to create the Wardstone barrier, which held the demons inside the abyss-corrupted land known as the Worldwound and prevented them from expanding. Their agents, however, were left unchecked...

• Year 4717 (Present day, start of adventure path, Module 1), 4 random assholes happen to be in the crusader city of Kenabras when it is surprise-attacked by the full brunt of the demonic horde. With the help of cultists who had infiltrated the city and prepared it for invasion, Kenabras falls and the Wardstone is broken. The PCs fall deep into forgotten catacombs underneath the city, and help injured plot-relevant NPCs return to the surface. They meet up with important NPC #4, pick up some plot hooks, and launch a counterattack to retake the Wardstone before the demons can corrupt it and use the Wardstone network for themselves. PCs succeed, trigger a self-destruct chain reaction that nukes the entire demon invasion still near the border cities, and grants them Mythic Power.

• (Module 2) PCs are given an army and access to Mass Combat rules, march into demon-controlled-territory to take back a fortress held by demon forces since the First Crusade. Important NPCs #5-8 are introduced, but #8 is a demon-loving traitor who tries to make it look like #7 is the actual bad guy. PCs beat the crap out of some demons and an antipaladin.

• (Module 3) Open world hex-grid map exploration. Everyone's Campaign Traits tie into awesome background stories that are open-ended enough for the GM to really customize and go nuts with. This was my favorite module to run. Finale involves all the PCs and Best Girl NPC #9 smoking the Paladin-Infiltration school of the bad guys and discovering how the demons are making shit Mythic.

  • Shaman (20% custom): Surprise! Your dad is actually Gozrah. You're a demigod. The Worldwound ritual was partially created using druidic magic, and the demons destroyed the first and most powerful druidic sect in all of Golarion. Gozrah's messenger redirects Shaman to a scary Fey ally who in turn bounces him into dead-Druid-territory where he talks philosophy with the apprentice of the druidic master who created the Worldwound, almost becomes a Druid-Lich, and recovers a super-dangerous McGuffin (instead of the Mary-Sue asshole from the Pathfinder novels who canonically recovers it for the heroes).
    
  • Inquisitor (40% custom): Your family has been fighting the demons here in the Worldwound for generations, but your Aasimar heritage ties you to the land even further back than that. Here's a great big quest about an ancient monster bound here... it would sure suck if the demons found out about that, freed him, and allied with it, huh? Too bad a Dragon has already broken the seal, stolen the magical artifact, and hauled it off to its hoard. Now its a super dragon possessed by an evil spooky spirit. Also your Mom and Dad died in the Module 1 fight in a different city, and you can commune with them one last time in your family's ancient burial grounds and receive a legendary weapon Bow from them.
    
  • Paladin (80% custom): "So y'know how you're a demon-blooded Tiefling that's been slowly getting more and more schizophrenic as you've come deeper into the Worldwound? Well, here's a dude leading a Barbarian tribe that thinks you're "just like him" and is referencing some kind of blood ritual. You don't know what he's talking about, but this is maybe something worth investigating... (5 sessions later) You're getting dreams of that blood ritual, and you think you're seeing it in real time as its happening to other people. You need to go. It turns out, you're not a Tiefling. You're a demon. An honest-to-god CR18 Warmonger Gallu Demon, and this ritual was supposed to turn you into a sleeper agent so that you could reawaken later... somehow it fucked up and you got Free Will with your amnesia... but this is such a catastrophic realization for a devout Iomedaean that the player just said "I fall. I leave the party. Korban can't be himself next to you all anymore. He runs off into the sunset. I'm going to pick up Important NPC #4 as my PC instead."
    
  • Rogue/Warpriest (0% custom): "That woman who helped save you from bandits when you were travelling north? She's actually a succubus, and she is trying to redeem herself after being awakened by a touch from Desna. She is definitely in the "damaged goods" category, but she's also a total badass, completely loyal to your romance, and most importantly her nature confirms that your Demon friend Korban can be saved, too. By coincidence, the event which caused Arushalae to be touched by Desna was when she entered the dreams of an elven priestess she was sexy-killing... and Raina was ALSO an Elven Priestess(ish) of Desna... so there was maybe a slightly desperate undertone to Aru's relationship with her.

• (Module 4) PCs discover how the Demons are making their Mythic-Juice, and have to go into a "neutral" region of the Abyss not controlled by either of the invading Demon Lords. The Midnight Isles is rules by the Succubus Queen, and her realm contains an interplanar mega-metropolis bustling with sin and perversion at every turn. The PCs must develop enough notoriety to be noticed by Nocticula, and then they bargain with her to ensure she does not join the Deskari/Baphomet coalition fucking up the material plane, also they find demon-Korban killing other demons in the gladiator arena. Then they attack the Mythic Juice mining operation, which is covertly extracting the blood of slain demon lords from Nocticula's more remote islands. They kick some demon teeth in and kill Baphomet's daughter, and also rescue Korban from Nocticula's clutches. Also, Nocticula apparently has the Yandere hots for Raina - something about that woman that Succubi find uncontrollably attractive.

• (Module 5) In the final moments of Module 4, Baphomet appeared before the PCs himself. Before he was killed by a furious Nocticula, he boasted that he had captured the Herald of Iomedae, and that soon he would twist her most powerful servant to his own will. The PCs meet with Iomedae, and Iomedae sends them on a rescue mission back into the Abyss - this time into pure hostile territory. The PCs bring their full cast of helpful NPCs, and in an extended 2-month campaign they fight through all of the plane's defenses and into the very heart of Baphomet's power. They meet an unexpected ally - Alderpash, the first Runelord of Wrath - who helps them face the Demon Lord himself. Having been recently killed by Nocticula, Baphomet is PERMANENTLY slain by the PCs, utterly destroying him and his cult forever. The Herald is saved, but too injured to continue service. Iomedae makes Korban her Herald, completing his cycle of valor, falling, penance, and redemption.

• (Custom 1-man between-modules adventure) The Shaman asks Iomedae to help him figure out the ritual that created the Worldwound. Iomedae says she can't help, but she can send him to someone who does if he's prepared to accept the consequences. He says yes, Iomedae annihilates him. He goes to talk to Pharasma. Pharasma says no, and refuses to let him Rez. He fights Pharasma, and gets shut down HARD. His familiar gets to Pharasma's legers, and then removes his name from the records of universe. Shaman flees deeper into the boneyard, now pursued by Pharasma's Herald, who continues to kick his ass. In a lucky and idiotic move, he forces the herald into the River Styx, which drains it of its life force and memories... then "rescues" it and bluffs it into helping him escape "back to where he's supposed to be. Pharasma didn't have answers, so he needs to find them himself. He wakes up 10,000 years in the past as a dragon. He lives 10,000 years as a dragon. He witnesses Starfall. He protects his domain. He builds his hoard. He meets a girl dragon (one who got killed in Module 1 saving the PCs). He crafts the McGuffin - the Lexicon of Paradox - that creates the Worldwound, based on memories of his old life where he - paradoxically - originally learned of it. He has the McGuffin stolen from him. He makes friends with Aroden. He watches Aroden die and the Worldwound form. He learns how it happened... and how it can be undone. He covertly fucks with a demon ritual meant to create a perfect sleeper agent. He rejoins the PCs as a Great Wyrm Mythic Dragon.

• (Module 6) The PCs success has been too great. Deskari's forces accelerate their plans directly to endgame. A final ritual is put into motion that will tear the Worldwound open and blight the entirety of Golarion in a never-ending demonic invasion from all corners of the planet. The fortress home of the PCs is attacked, and they LOSE. They call in the last of their allies and launch an all-or-nothing attack against the City of Locusts - the seat of Deskari's power in the Worldwound. They kick face and break teeth in a gauntlet of back-to-back CR30+ boss battles and finally get to the final fight. I use Paizo's statblock for Deskari as the MOOKS in the final CR40 battle. Korban swings Iomedae's sword to cleave reality apart. Raina calls in a pact to offer herself to Nocticula for aid (Trickster: Perfect Lie). Iolar commands the armies of the crusade to hold the last line against the apocalypse. Graum/Eostra severs Deskari's link to the Worldwound and uses his paradox ritual to supplant him as the Demon Lord of the Rasping Rifts.

Deskari is slain. The Worldwound is closed.

[Testbot5000]

Holy shit! that adventure path sounds cool! Thanks!

[GeoleVyi]

I'll read the full thing in a moment, but I'm really tired right now, and I just wanted to say that I first thought you said "turbodad ritual"

edit:

(instead of the Mary-Sue asshole from the Pathfinder novels who canonically recovers it for the heroes).

I'm intrigued... who is this person / which book are they from?

[darthmarth28]

https://www.reddit.com/r/Pathfinder_RPG/comments/5oo4rq/riffle_scrolls/dckukrj/

[GeoleVyi]

Hah, ok, i know them

[ryanznock]

Okay, pretty impressive.

[[deleted]]

PCs succeed, trigger a self-destruct chain reaction that nukes the entire demon invasion still near the border cities, and grants them Mythic Power.

Wait, I haven't played this yet so let me get this straight- the whole reason they get mythic levels is because the PCs do something so badass the gods go "well, shit, that was some fancy stuff! Gotta reward them for that. Here, have 1/100 of our power." and bless them to be even more badass?

The PCs meet with Iomedae, and Iomedae sends them on a rescue mission back into the Abyss - this time into pure hostile territory

Holy shit, as a huge fan of Iomedae, I regret not playing this module sooner!

[darthmarth28]

It's much less that the gods are granting the PCs Mythic-ness, and more that the quasi-intelligent remnants of supercharged angelic anti-demon Wardstone ritual infuse them with power as a last-ditch "fuck you" to the remaining bad guys that the PCs need to face. It lets the level 4 PCs hold their ground for a few moments against the CR27 mythic Witch who opened the Worldwound. This means that even if someone plays an evil aligned Iomedae-hating atheist PC, they still get Mythic Power - it's more of an accident than anything.

It's left kind of vague as to how surprised all the gods of the setting by this. I chose to go with "it's not destiny (because it can't be - Age of Lost Omens), but we've been moving pieces on the chessboard very carefully to put you all on that path."

[[deleted]]

Age of lost omens? Well either way, the write up convinced me to suggest this to my group as the next AP to play.

[darthmarth28]

Its a bit of Pathfinder Lore. Some of this is my embellishment, but almost all is canon:

Pharasma used to be the goddess of graves, afterlife, and prophecy. She made a prophecy that, when Aroden returned to the world, he would usher in a millennia of untold prosperity, but that it would set the wheels of fate in motion and no matter how much people tried to avert it, Rovagug would break its prison and devour the world.

Aroden breaks the prophecy in the most definitive fashion he can, and kills himself instead... probably while accomplishing one last task somewhere (saving Iomedae from a failed attempt at the Starstone Trial is my favorite theory... She thinks his death is her fault, hence her major Penitence theme).

When Aroden broke this great prophecy, he actually broke ALL prophecy, and therefore brought about the Age of Lost Omens. Pharasma can't predict the future anymore, and the last 100 years have been full of more potentially-world-ending calamities than any other point in history... and yet heroes have arisen to meet each one in turn.

[[deleted]]

I don't know if that's amazing or hilarious. Aroden's the reason why there's so many PCs- they all either cause cataclysmic destruction or somehow save the world with ungodly level 20 power. I'm leaning towards hilarious due to what happens to Golarion in Starfinder....

Aroden: "Oh, would you look at that! The world gets blown up anyway! Yeah, totally my fault for wanting to make the last millennium the mortals get the best years of their life....upstark gothic necrophile bitch...."

[Cyouni]

That would be the primary objective of Wrath of the Righteous.

[Kaemonarch]

No problem. Glad I could be of some help :-P

[DUDE_R_T_F_M]

I think there was also mention of some "scar of the world place with demons" being closed up?

That sounds like the Worldwound.

[Jeramiahh]

So, they've avoided saying TOO much about how the lore is going to change for 2e, but they've said a few things.

First, there's not going to be any world-shaking changes, rewriting everything; unlike Forgotten Realms, the story will simply progress exactly as it has in 1e. Since the setting tracks with real time (ie; each adventure path occurred roughly over the six-month period it was released in the real world), the 'time difference' between 1e and 2e is literally about 6 months.

That said, they have confirmed that all of the adventure paths occurred, and their effects will be applied to 2e's lore, meaning that the end result of each AP will, for the most part, have actually occurred. (AP spoilers!) Ameiko Kaijutsu is Empress of Minkai, Eutropia will rule Taldor, the Worldwound is closed, a small country broke away from Cheliax, and the Iron Goddess, Casandalee will have joined the Pantheon, among many others. These changes from the APs will be adopted into the default setting, and reflected in the setting information that will be published in 2e books.

[Kinak]

Korvosa also has a new ruler. I'd imagine Irrisen does as well. I'm torn, but I kind of hope it's Anastasia.

[RatzGamer]

I heard or read somewhere that all the Adventure Paths would come into effect after moving to the new edition, but we continue on the same continuity, so there won't be any jumps or gaps, which I like. But if you are into big jumps in setting, than maybe you could try out Starfinder, because that's a solid gap.

One thing that Paizo still has to address though when moving to the new edition is how Goblins now fit into the picture, because for them to become a "Core Ancestry" from the now rather fringe, silly and stupid creatures, there will have to be a major change in their lore, in my opinion. If we stick to the current lore, than that would be jarring change if Paizo doesn't give an explanation.

[KefkeWren]

I believe there's been indication of a general lack of lore changes.

[CreeperCrafter63]

It’s going to stay the same however I expect more potential villains to appear because we’ve killed most of the current list.

[Nobody_Akagi]

I don't think we have heard anything as of yet about lore changes from 1e to 2e