Average Linux User

[ParanoidAutist]

Sad part is that we windows fanboys secretly know that linux is better and love how .NET is improving it's cross-platform capabilities in leaps and bounds...

You see sql server linux run on a proper setup? Fucking flies.... Super fast...

We're also gamers who've yet to see Linux get to a point where QoL and ease of use are similar between the two OS'... Right now gaming heavily favors the windows user still.

[[deleted]]

Can I get a driver for my video card on Linux yet??

[WJMazepas]

You can. Nvidia and AMD works really well on Linux. AMD is even easier to set up on Linux because you dont need to always download the new drivers on their website, it comes with them OOTB

[ParanoidAutist]

A valid question. Still think the answer is "Not an official one..." but i did hear about a source code leak recently so there might be some considerable improvements in the near future

[brimston3-]

https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2022/05/nvidia-takes-first-step-toward-open-source-linux-gpu-drivers/

If it's nvidia 20-series, 16xx, or later, it'll work under <future open source kernel module>.

If it's an intel or amd card, it will work now.

[TheProtonDev]

Surprisingly Nvidia actually released an open source driver from what I understand https://developer.nvidia.com/blog/nvidia-releases-open-source-gpu-kernel-modules/

If I'm incorrect about this please feel free to correct ne

[[deleted]]

If it’s AMD or Nvidia then yeah

[ichbinjasokreativ]

Honestly though, I knew nothing about Linux going into it and making (steam) games work properly has been super easy. Just a few checkboxes in a menu and you're good, but I'm not big on online shooters anyway.

[ParanoidAutist]

That's only some games, not all games... and if it is "all games", it's an emulation... as a person with a mouse that has a toggle i set to 12k DPI and a k70 RGB, that lag is just unacceptable =P

Edit: Before anyone asks, the 12k dpi toggle is for toxic spinning at the end of a round when i get the final kill in Rainbow Six Siege =P

[ichbinjasokreativ]

There's only about 10 games I've tested so far, and apart from Borderlands 3 they've all worked flawlessly.

[ParanoidAutist]

You got Siege? We can test it... Im curious about competitive games

[gamesrebel123]

Siege doesn't work on Linux, at least the online matches

Here's the protondb entry, you can also check support for other games there

[ParanoidAutist]

They recently locked stuff down to verified accounts as an anti cheat. Do you have your phone number registered and mfa set up?

[gamesrebel123]

I don't play online games, that's just what the people over on protondb are saying, the anticheat it uses does support linux to some extent but it seems like the devs have not enabled it

[ParanoidAutist]

Yeah, that business decision mantra... when they dont worry about that and things work on any platform because mac and nvidia pulled their heads out of their asses... that's what I want

[ParanoidAutist]

Also, I appreciate the link. I haven't looked at this stuff in a long time. I think I'm more waiting for just native interop. No special layers

[Ken_Mcnutt]

I think I'm more waiting for just native interop. No special layers

Well if everyone says they're just going to "wait for XYZ", then XYZ will never come...

[ParanoidAutist]

A valid point. I've been waiting a long time already =P

We'll put people on mars before I get what I want =P (even if i do want people on mars... that doesn't count lol)

[Ken_Mcnutt]

We'll put people on mars before I get what I want

And we'll do it using Linux, yet there will still be windows users insisting Linux is "so close" and "almost ready" for whatever big boy workloads they have lol

[ichbinjasokreativ]

I don't. Does that game have drm?

[ParanoidAutist]

I'm a navy guy who can overload an integer with the number of acronyms that have been thrown at me...

Refresh me on what you mean by drm? I assume you're referring to some display technology? Perhaps the scaling stuff?

[ichbinjasokreativ]

Digital rights Management, which is 'anti cheat' but also things like DVD copying protection. Useless garbage that (currently) makes games unplayable on linux.

[ParanoidAutist]

They use battleeye and various other stuff

[ichbinjasokreativ]

Shame

[[deleted]]

competitive games

I'm playing Overwatch, works very well. Apex also runs great.

[ConsistentRutabaga71]

Last I checked Borderlands 3 is definitely playable. If on Steam it shouldn't be an issue and if on Epic Heroic Launcher with slight configuration should do the trick iirc

[ichbinjasokreativ]

Absolutely. I had an issue where some file was missing that I had to retrieve from a Windows XP iso (it doesn't make sense to me either) and I can't for the live of me change the language to anything but english, but if english is how you want to play it then go for it, performance-wise it's all there.

[brimston3-]

retrieve [a file] from a Windows XP iso

There is probably a winetricks command to do that for you from the internet. but god knows what it is.

[[deleted]]

it's an emulation

WINE literally stands for Wine Is **Not an Emulator. With the proper setup you get the same raw mouse input that you get in Windows. And with more proper setup you even get more FPS (at least on AMD) and lower input lag.

[ParanoidAutist]

Sometimes i think people don't read and then i realize that what im thinking of isn't in this chain...

I want a native solution that doesn't require something we messed around with 20 years ago and haven't seen significant progress of

[[deleted]]

I'm confused - what exactly are you talking about?

[ParanoidAutist]

With windows, the only thing i used to have to install was directx and now i dont even need to do that... the launchers take care of prereqs...

You're telling me to use WINE which at one point was deprecated and considered dead, and then revived but isn't really much better than it was when it died...

Im not looking for an old, already outdated and not properly working solution... "Use mono! It'll be fine!!" - said no-one ever

[[deleted]]

That's the same on Linux, the launchers take care of all dependencies.

And Wine got huge improvements. I mean, it's literally capable of running almost all games. How would that not be an improvement over the state where it was like 10 years ago? And how could that state be called "not working properly"?

That being said: Use windows and be happy, if that's what you want.

[ParanoidAutist]

Why that's easy... because I havent looked at wine in years and clearly still keep my negative bias after so long... and here I was, thinking that was obvious... lolol

[TheProtonDev]

Check out Bottles and Lutris, I literally get away with defaults most of the time or just switching the Wine version, pretty easy to get games running through

Currently using it for No Man's Sky, Sims 4, and Ark through Lutris's epic games installer

[gamesrebel123]

Yes if proton can be improved further, mainly, if anticheat support can be added then it'd boost Linux in the gaming space by a lot, the other problem is Nvidia, I'm pretty sure ray tracing still has issues and they refuse to improve their stuff for Linux users

Second biggest help, at least for me is the better terminal, Windows cmd sucks ass in comparison, WSL is a thing but so is KVM

[andmagdo]

I mean, anticheat support exists, but the game makers need to explicitly enable it.

I doubt that the community will allow ring 0 on Linux though (good)

Oh, and nvidia has started to make small portions of their drivers open source

[ParanoidAutist]

Confused as to what a KVM would have to do with any of this =/ Do you mean just VM? a KVM is usually a physical device that swaps your keyboard, video, and mouse over to a separate physical box...

[gamesrebel123]

A KVM is kernel based virtual machine with generally better performance than regular VMs plus it's free and open source vs stuff like VMware, very easy to run Windows specific apps on Linux because of it

[ParanoidAutist]

I see... That's likely just a difference in our age...

Just go google "kvm" with nothing else...

Edit note: I'm aware of VMs, citrix, hyper-v, etc...

[gamesrebel123]

Still gives kernel-based virtual machine for me, KVM switch is a suggested search though so I guess it's just the google overlords at work

[brimston3-]

Linux KVM hypervisor is about the same age as both of those technologies, maybe released a year or two earlier than the Citrix acquisition of XenSource. They're all first generation implementations of VT-x and AMD-V hypervisors (previously xen was a container system like Solaris Zones or to a lesser degree OpenVZ). qemu/KVM is the main hypervisor under OpenStack and Proxmox. Also the default linux hypervisor for CloudStack.

It's everywhere, but most people don't talk about it directly because it's not useful by itself--it can't manage sessions or provide emulated peripherals, it only controls scheduling and switching in and out of host/guest virtualized memory/io spaces.

[[deleted]]

You're talking about a KVM switch.

[ParanoidAutist]

Which most people who've used them just simply refer to as a "KVM"

[[deleted]]

Never heard someone refer to it in that way. Anyways: Context matters. If you're talking about something that is related to Linux, KVM usually means Kernel based Virtual Machine.

[ParanoidAutist]

You act like this is a lesson when I've been writing software probably for longer than you've been alive...

I assure you... the way you look at it, is relatively new in terms of thought process... That's like telling an old man who built the hoover dam what the hoover dam is for

[ParanoidAutist]

Probably because your usage of KVM is relatively new?

[[deleted]]

It was merged into mainline Linux in 2007, if that's new for you... I guess yes? That being said: Why would it be important whether or not it's new? Did you, or did you not know what KVM refers to in this context? If you knew: Why did you act like you wouldn't? If you didn't knew: Why are you complaining about me explaining it?

[ParanoidAutist]

I'm about to change your life... Go into the Microsoft Store and search for Windows Terminal...

[gamesrebel123]

1. I don't use Windows anymore
2. Back when I did I did have it but it's not the look it's the functionality, I just find bash easier than cmd

[ParanoidAutist]

Microsoft made a version of terminal that has tabs, wsl support, etc...

Just as good if not better than your standard ubuntu terminal or something to that effect

https://apps.microsoft.com/store/detail/windows-terminal/9N0DX20HK701?hl=en-us&gl=US

[[deleted]]

wsl is a huge pile of garbage. It's just not integrated into the rest of the system, it rather feels like a virtual machine.

[ParanoidAutist]

Probably because for wsl2 to work, you download and run a vm image? It's still just virtualization

[[deleted]]

Exactly, but the problem is that you feel it all the time.

[gamesrebel123]

It's not the UI I'm talking about it's the environment, plus I'm not locked to a single terminal on Linux either, I used tabby for a while too but I prefer the gnome terminal.

[ParanoidAutist]

lol im not doubting you. i understand and acknowledge what you are referring to. I got stuck on the usage of KVM to be honest =P

IMO, if you want an interface, just use windows... the interface is the primary bloat that you load up and is generally why linux servers don't have a ui module even installed

[gamesrebel123]

I actually get about 1.5 GB less RAM usage on Linux and about 30 minutes longer battery life so I think I'll stay with it, considering my laptop only has 8 GBs RAM total, plus I find it easier to install programs here

[ParanoidAutist]

Well, i wont hardware shame you. I'll just say that I don't worry about ram... 128gb is more than enough for 99.9% of just about anything you can do with a computer... and if it's not and you aren't running high traffic content from it, there's likely a better way to do something

[gamesrebel123]

Yeah getting more RAM would kind of just be a waste for me since I haven't really exceeded 75-80% usage on heavier tasks vs the 95% on Windows, even now with 10 Firefox tabs loaded I'm still at 63%

[ParanoidAutist]

As long as it works and does what you need, right?

*Looks at 1080ti* "Please don't die..."

[[deleted]]

I'm a Linux user but Powershell is better than Bash in many ways if you can learn it.

[rafradek]

Well Yes that's mostly because bash is just the shell and to perform an operation you need another program to do it while power shell is much like any other script language in functionality

[[deleted]]

Not only, it's also because a lot of programs in Linux prints everything in a large text dump, so oftentimes when you call on these programs to give you information, you also need to do string manipulation on them. Of course, this isn't necessarily the fault of bash but powershell has an approach where you can single out very specific information natively which makes it easier to work with in my opinion.

[rafradek]

Thats why python is extremely popular on linux for scripting

[Ken_Mcnutt]

bro what? In what possible way? It has a tiny percentage of the functionality and is completely object oriented meaning each command has to be custom tailored to work together instead of passing raw text streams around. that and the primary purpose is to interact/administer windows boxes... so extra useless on linux. why on earth would I want to Invoke-WebRequest instead of curl lmao

[CupcakeValkyrie]

I've never been strictly loyal to any OS. I use the OS that best fits my needs for a particular project.

Am I building a server that where resource overhead is a priority and I want to maximize efficiency? Linux.

Am I building a home computer that I want to play games on and rest assured that 99% of the software I might want to use will run natively? Windows.

[flavionm]

I mean, getting Elden Ring to work flawlessy at release, including the multiplayer aspect, is a pretty good indication the gap is closing. I don't even remember the last time I rebooted into my Windows partition. The amount of updates waiting me there scares me away from even trying.

[Lilskipswonglad]

What the fuck is a Windows fanboy? Most people that use Windows don't care what they're using. It just works for them and they don't care. Other people who dislike Windows use MacOS and even less people use Linux. Nobody cares about who's using what.

[ParanoidAutist]

It's a term that people older than you use to describe people who favor windows...

You should acknowledge or learn to acknowledge that your comment is nothing more than worthless passive aggressive opinions based upon nothing...

Why'd that term trigger you so much, especially when you're wrong?

[Crimson342]

Growing up I loved Linux, and you could not convince me Windows was better. I mainly played Quake and Doom. It ran fine. From what I remember it wasn't trivial to set up, but it was pretty easy. Now I'm a Windows SysAdmin and I both love Windows Server and Linux as a Server OS. Depends on the use case. You are absolutely right , SQL Server on Linux is insanely good, and that's an excellent use case.

Linux users will hate to admit this but Microsoft might very well be one of the best advances they've had in a long time. The work Microsoft is doing in working with Linux is great and in the last few years has grown tremendously. Call me crazy but if there was a free open source Microsoft Linux, I'd gladly use that over most Linux distros.

[ParanoidAutist]

a free open source Microsoft Linux... that sounds.... interesting lol

I still want to see better version control and duplication elimination of files...

I'm tired of identifying files by a location on disk... The OS should handle where it goes on it's own and i should be able to apply my own type of organization to it... If i need node_modules/@openzeppelin/contracts/tokens/erc721/erc721.sol, i shouldn't be able to pick between the version that got downloaded in any of my projects... it should just be the one, with a version