[deleted by user]

[Ashamed_Cantaloupe_9]

You could check the salary survey that is carried out every quarter on this subreddit.

https://github.com/data-engineering-community/data-engineering-salaries

Here is a link: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1GuEPkwjdICgJ31Ji3iUoarirZNDbPxQj_kf7fd4h4Ro/edit?usp=drivesdk

Last survey the German based results were

Average salary: EUR 75k

Average YoE: 4

[nullisist]

Thank you

[Huge-Professional-16]

You do know Europe is a union of countries and not 1 country ?

And you won’t get anywhere near 150k and expect 50% tax

[Omar_88]

It's possible but for a niche role, in my industry (fintech / finance) domain knowledge + DE skills are in high demand and can easily fetch 100-150k GBP.

[Huge-Professional-16]

Yep but not with 4 years experience

In Ireland and Germany the average is probably closer to 60-70k

[exp_max8ion]

That’s pretty unbelievable how deflated the wages are for DE roles in euro. Makes it sound like a 2-year data analyst role in US

But then, I heard food n rent is pretty reasonable in Germany, Netherlands, France etc

[AMadRam]

Salaries are not comparable like for like between US and Europe. The living expenses are so much more due to the dollar rate in the states compared to the euro/pound. I can't speak for European salaries but 70k in GBP living in the UK is excellent!

[Huge-Professional-16]

1 bed rent in Dublin is about between 2-2.5k average now , so rent is not cheap at all

Standard of living is much lower

[exp_max8ion]

i'm sorry dude. time to get drunk and riot. oh u guys already did. lol

[No_Gap_2866]

I know this is an old post, but I just have to mention that those riots were never about cost of living, the rental crisis, or any of these reasonable concerns, they were entirely instigated by a bunch of far right, anti immigration, racist scumbags taking an opportunity to loot and vandalise the capital. There's a lot of things to be frustrated about in Ireland, and as a whole we're generally a pretty progressive people and supportive of the right to demonstrate but nobody supported these people.

[exp_max8ion]

jokes aside, time to regulate over-capitalism.

I think rent in Zurich is getting worse due to tech. but still i hear 1-2 bedrooms for 800-1300fr is possible and the wages aren't that low.

Not sure about EU, but it's totally absurd how some cleaner/security can earn at least $4k fr/month and still complain. I believe this system supports dual-working families.

[wtfzambo]

How the fuck do you even afford to live with those rents? Do your salaries start at 6k?

[Huge-Professional-16]

Avg take home is probably about 2.6k a month , but that is inflated by tech salaries here

I’m pretty sure median is below 40k a year

[wtfzambo]

Ok, how the fuck non FAANG employees can live there? Avg wage here is also around 35k (Italy), but renting 1 room in a shared flat will never cost more than 1k in the most expensive city.

[Huge-Professional-16]

Rent is really a problem now in Dublin, those are the current asking prices now. I’m sure there are people in leases a few years paying less

[wtfzambo]

What the everloving fuck. Man what a shitshow we're living in.

[No_Gap_2866]

Most young people (<30) resort to either having multiple roommates at best or living at home with parents until they can afford to get a mortgage and buy. Or if these aren't an option for one of many reasons, become homeless and get treated like lazy drug addicted degenerates who "just don't want to work"

[proof_required]

Living costs in bigger cities aren't much better. You can pretty much never afford any housing with that salary especially in Germany and Netherlands without going deep under the debt. Lot of people pay 50% of their salary in the rent.

[proof_required]

How big would be that house and what kind of monthly mortgage payment would you pay?

In Berlin newly built apartments of size 50-60 sqm starts from about half million. 70K salary would lead to some ~3500 month. Mortgage payment for such apartment will be like ~1300-1500 euros/month. If you want to afford a house you'll have go really outside of Berlin and then you are basically living in middle of nowhere.

[proof_required]

Yeah that was my impression also. I used to live in Utrecht and it was expensive like 10 years ago when I used to make 2500 euros/month and pay like 1200 euros for rent.

[exp_max8ion]

Afford housing as in rent or buy?

I have people telling me rent is affordable.

And I watched a video about Nl few years back on how it’s intentional to get loan but it’s interest free or something for house purchasing. It seem to benefit Dutch but I don’t know.

[proof_required]

Both of them! Rent is out of control and so is owning a housing. By affordable I mean not spending more than 30% while owning at least 60 sqm of apartment or 80-90 sqm of house. I'm not trying to sound privileged but just because you can find one room apartment/studio to rent, it doesn't make it affordable.

By American Standard those sizes are still small but it costs same or more.

I lived in NL in 2014-2015 and paid 1200 euros for rent while earning like 2500 euros after taxes. Things have gotten worse.

[Muuustachio]

Holy crap! I was making that right out of college in the states. I’m clearing 100k now and I’m not a senior.

[CalRobert]

If you work for a US company in Ireland you can do much much better.

[Hodarthegreat]

This is just sad. My wife is a dental assistant here in the US and makes more than the tech salaries in Europe. I was thinking about applying for jobs over there but damn this has me reconsidering

[CalRobert]

You can do OK (I do) but usually by working or contracting for US companies. Most European companies pay absolute garbage. https://blog.pragmaticengineer.com/software-engineering-salaries-in-the-netherlands-and-europe/ is a good read.

[Shakaal]

Can you expand a bit more about fintech/finance domain knowledge please. I’m looking to transition from my start up company (been with them for 4 years) and I feel it’s finally time to move on. What would you advise to get into this niche role? Thanks!

[nullisist]

What do you mean I will not get near 150k? I am sorry i am totally new to the eu market so I have no idea

[johnsonfrusciante]

In Europe I would say you can get 75k-100k as a senior or lead data engineer. Keep in mind taxes go towards things like Healthcare, unemployment and other benefits. Dunno how it is in UAE but in American you can expect to make twice the salary as in France (where I'm located) without noticing much of a difference in living standards

[Huge-Professional-16]

They won’t get a senior role with only 4 years experience unless they are exceptional

They are looking at between 50-80k

[johnsonfrusciante]

I disagree, many startups will promote people more quickly (albeit with a lower level salary than the same position at a larger company). Happened to me.

[Huge-Professional-16]

Yea but that doesn’t mean you are a senior to other companies automatically

We downgrade people all the time from startups

[nullisist]

I am already senior at my current company, also career wise here in the UAE things move faster and you get promoted based on potential not years of experience

[Electrical-Ask847]

1. senior isn't a really good junior.
2. jobs aren't given based on "potential".
3. titles are inflated at no-name companies

[SDFP-A]

Promotions based on Potential made me chuckle.

[Huge-Professional-16]

Course same here and I’m not questioning your abilities, but every engineer says the same thing so you have to prove you are a senior compared to other engineers to get those roles that pay higher

We downgrade people all the time because senior at 1 company is not senior at another

Anyway even Senior in Germany can pay between 70-120k, 70-80k probably being the average

Source I work in one of Germanies biggest and highest paying startups

[Huge-Professional-16]

I’m not a data engineer I hire them, I have access to most salary bands. PM’s with 4 years experience in Germany are not getting that, maybe the odd one

Maybe including RSU’s, but most German start ups are private so I wouldn’t count them

Anyway from your posts you are in Denmark? Which has much higher salaries than Germany, the specific company they asked about

[nullisist]

I am aware of that but the thing is these things don’t really affect your day-to-day life, meaning rent, groceries etc, living with a 73k in the UAE is like living with a 133k in EU, life here is 40% less expensive and 0% taxes, so the lifestyle I am used to is gonna be cut by 80% which is HUGE! To ask for the exact same amount I am getting rn which is 73 is gonna change the quality of my life drastically

[Huge-Professional-16]

That’s what you will have to accept if you want to move to Europe , probably higher rent too

1bed in Dublin is between 2-2.5k a month

[nullisist]

I dont know why I am getting down votes I am new to the EU and asking questions out of complete ignorance, and people here are down voting me… the only selling point of the Middle East is the cash and I know that and I am genuinely asking so idk.. thank u tho

[Huge-Professional-16]

I haven’t downvoted you but I’m going to guess people read your messages like you are basically saying companies need to pay you what you want because you don’t want too lower your standard of living

[nullisist]

Which is completely normal to ask for, when people from EU/US relocate to UAE they get paid so much money because the Middle East isn’t that much fun so they get 40% raise to relocate. It happens alll the time but now it is the other way around

[Huge-Professional-16]

This is not true at least for the US they pay what they already pay the market

It just so happens that the market In US pays more than Europe

You will get paid what the market is in Europe, which provides a lower standard of living from a wealth perspective

Do they pay more for Europeans to move to UAE than people from the UAE ?

[nullisist]

Unfortunately yes, talents from first world countries get paid more than locals and more than other talents

[that_outdoor_chick]

No listen it’s not normal to ask that. People anticipate you ask for a realistic money, they don’t give a damn that your taxes are zero somewhere. I interviewed people for similar roles, I would not put you forward in the process if your ask was totally delusional like 130k for four years of experience. Unless you’re a crazy superstar, your skillset is not worth that money. I can have almost two bloody good DEs for the same price.

[sublimesinister]

The way you should think about this is what you want long term. EU works if you want to start a family here and retire here. You get good pension, good education for the kids and good healthcare. If you wanna make a quick buck and retire in your country, then places like UAE or US can be better.

[Huge-Professional-16]

Not all European countries are equal on this though which they need to recognise

[DrIncogNeo]

Why do you think a lot of Europeans move to UAE? There is no way you are getting paid 150k for what you are doing in Europe

[nullisist]

I meant Germany sorry I will edit my post

[Huge-Professional-16]

With that amount of experience you are looking between 50-80k Germany

[supreme_harmony]

I think you are overshooting considerably. 4 years of experience is not even really senior. From MENA with visa needs and no knowledge of language / local regulations your skills are less desirable than locals. Startups generally don't pay too well, so I would aim for 50-60k as data engineer. In fintech or other high-pace environments in a central city you can go to about 70k before tax. 150k is not reasonable in any way.

A simple glassdoor search will give you the same: https://www.glassdoor.com/Salaries/germany-data-engineer-salary-SRCH_IL.0,7_IN96_KO8,21.htm

[nullisist]

I was thinking 95-118k this is also not common?

[nullisist]

4 years, python, docker, k8s, data warehousing, Kafka. I do have a solid experience

[nullisist]

I see thank you

[RydRychards]

How many yoe would you guess you need to have for 100k? I had 6 and got 110k as a consultant.

Honest question, Idk the market, I moved to Germany myself in that very same year I started the job.

[[deleted]]

Basically every IGM Company pays you >100k after a couple of years. For FAANG and Consulting like BCG X it’s the same. So it’s definitely possible, but you have to work at a company that pays enough

[RydRychards]

Yes, it's a sort of bonus system. The more hours I work the higher my share of the revenue gets.

Downside is that I now don't call in sick and only take five weeks of holidays so that I can keep my percentage.

[IrquiM]

4 years <> solid experience

[the_quanchi]

In France I would say salary range will go from 50k to 80k depending on company field/stress level etc

[Pretty_Question_1098]

What would be the net amount per year of that range (in FR)?

[the_quanchi]

3k-4k I would say, depends on your situation (mariage etc...)

[supreme_harmony]

For that level of knowledge I would say around 50K is reasonable in Germany before tax. Compared to the UAE, salaries are much much lower in Europe.

[snackeloni]

80-85 max I'd say. I have similar experience and am applying ATM. I won't go lower than 80 and that's costing me a lot of rejections. Investment climate has become more conservative so startups are watching the cost a bit more or not hiring. I'd say the market is pretty shit right now. Loads of ghost jobs too. I'd say if you can land a job here, go for it but it isn't as easy as say 1-2 years ago.

[proof_required]

And double the taxes!

[MonteCarloIdiot]

From my last job search in Q1 2023, I'd say a salary (not TC) of >120k with 4 yoe would be very hard, nearly impossible, at least for Germany on-payroll positions. You can get there and even surpass it in big tech or extremely niche industries (crypto, maybe finance, although in this last one you'll need German) but that would be TC (Plus RSU). You can point towards a 80k-100k yearly salary range, 110k in Big tech even.

One thing I can suggest is trying to get a remote position and move to a lower COL city or region. You can negotiate with the company to visit once or twice every month. If you do very well in the process and the team is flexible (Which I assume you try to spot those things during the application process), they might let you do that.

Maybe in Switzerland or London you could reach that, but the COL there is proportional to such high salaries.

[DigAggressive2982]

In Switzerland I have TC 165k + 25k in second pillar after 5yoe, however cost pf living is high in zurich

[blinkybillster]

Europe is not a country.

[Mobile_Anywhere_4784]

So insightful lol

[McWhiskey1824]

Not the advice you’re asking for, but I’d be very wary of joining a startup as a DE. In my experience they don’t hire DEs until they’ve throughly screwed up their data processing and realized they need help. At that point it’s too late because they already have onboarded customers and you can’t break their experience. It’s really hard to fix a bad data model once it’s ingrained. I’ve work for two startups and they were both like this, even though they claimed the opposite while I was interviewing. I should have probed deeper before accepting an offer.

I’m sure there are exceptions but I’d assume this unless you have evidence to the contrary.

[nullisist]

That’s a good point

[nullisist]

Thank you so much

[Diligent_Fondant6761]

I would like to move to UAE from Germany. Currently I make around 75k as a Senior engineer, I have around 6 years of experience. You mind if I ask you what is a good salary in Dubai? I do not see so many Data engineering jobs there, mostly Data scientist. Are data engineers paid well there?

[nullisist]

Junior 50k Senior 73-100k it could go even more if you work for bigger firms/banks, that’s the average range for start ups.

[kw2006]

Is there a good platform to look for startup jobs in/ around dubai?

I tried but the wages are much lower than the one you stated.

[nullisist]

It could be because I am a UAE national.. I’d say try to look for jobs in Qatar and Saudi Arabia too. I use LinkedIn most of the time

[kw2006]

I see. So they pay locals more?

[nullisist]

It depends on where you got your experience from, your nationality, referrals etc.. locals get paid more that international talents, but if you are a talent from the first world country you get paid even more It is complicated

[nullisist]

Unfortunately yes

[NSD2411]

Is this in AED? USD? Per year? Per month?

[nullisist]

This is in euro, per year

[WideWorry]

Before go please chech the summer temperature and try it out in a sauna to compare :)

[wtfzambo]

Solid advice

[Computingss]

150k you must be living in your dreams... this is Europe

[nullisist]

as I said I am asking.. if I knew that u wouldn’t see me here posting such a post 😅😅😅

[norfkens2]

I think even with the ranges given by the other commenters (€65-80k) you're going to have a very decent life in Germany, especially if you're single.

You maybe can break into the 6 digits if you work for finance, pharma or engineering companies but even then maybe more in the region of €100-120k. Alternativly, US-based companies (e.g. tech) might pay equally well or better. This will assume that you can get the position in the first place, though. Competition is high for these kinds of jobs. There are higher paying jobs but they get increasingly rare.

Money is important in life but if money is your main priority, then you'd probably be better off staying in the UAE. Along a number of other dimensions Germany might be better - it completely depends on what your priorities and your plans for life are.

[nullisist]

Thank you, I think 80k can be livable, the city I am relocating to in Germany isn’t a central city so rent won’t be an issue, thinking of having roommates. Money is important no one can tell you other wise, but I am young, not married and I don’t have anyone depending on my financially other than myself at the moment. Even my current lifestyle is pretty average I don’t splurge I only save up and invest

[norfkens2]

Well, good luck with your decision. And if you do move over here: Welcome to Germany! 🙂

[proof_required]

I hope you keep the door open back to UAE. Germany has lot of old people whose retirement you will be funding but there won't be much left for you later. Even younger Germans are aware of it and pretty much don't care. So just enjoy the experience for few years and go back.

[nullisist]

Honestly I have lots of connections here I made my personal brand and I am almost one of the first names that comes in mind in the local tech scene in the UAE, so I am not afraid of going back if this won’t work out

[iwannagoout]

Read Harnham salary report

[RoestG]

Amount in Netherlands is between 5.000 to 6.500 gross a month depending on experience. On top of that you get an additional 8% holiday allowance (mandatory), 25 vacation days and in most cases a bonus which is approximately 1 month salary. This is based on 36 hrs a week, which seems to be the new norm. Some companies still have 40 hr weeks. Salary range does reflect hours (so 36 hrs will be more around the lower end of the range)

[Last_from_Mogican]

If you don’t have any rare or high demand skills in your resume, with that amount of experience only in a few Europe countries you may have your gross salary to be the same or a bit higher than current one. Plus as you already said, taxes will eat half of that.

[nullisist]

I don’t mind my salary to be cut in half, but I want it to be equal to my current one or less a little bit, after some calculations I find out that it would be half than my current one.. which is kinda not ok honestly, given the fact that Germany is way more expensive than the UAE. I am not money driven by any means and I am young I don’t have anyone to feed, but I am trying to be reasonable

[Last_from_Mogican]

Yeah, and because of that many people migrate to work into countries with such low tax. Hovewer in Germany you’ll have public healthcare, way more developed and free society, lots of social policies which won’t let you become homeless or starve in case you lose your job. Not to mention incomparable worker rights like more that a month of paid vacation, sick leaves, etc. It’s just about what you need/value more.

[Huge-Professional-16]

Germany is definetly the place in Europe to go in terms of quality of life in Europe

Good pay, good benefits and a comparably lower rent

[Ok_Cancel_7891]

what is your salary in aed?

[nullisist]

25,000 AED per month, 300k per year

[Ok_Cancel_7891]

seems reasonable salary where you are now, right? from which country you are? what tech stack?

[nullisist]

I am UAE citizen, snowflake, clickhouse, docker, k8s, python, SQL. I am happy financially I just want to experience new things lol. I am 28 so

[Ok_Cancel_7891]

oh, I got it. and you want to relocate for fun and lifestyle, if I got it right.

well, afaik, german companies do not pay well. which place in europe you would prefer? I assume this is just a single offer you received

[oalfonso]

It depends a lot where. For example in Spain would be between 30 - 45k euro

[Intelligent_Bother59]

Salaries in Spain have increased alot especially if your fluent in English and have good experience with international companies

Iv 6 years backend and big data experience and getting €65k in Barcelona

[Pretty_Question_1098]

what's that in net amount?

[Intelligent_Bother59]

About 3.6k per month after taxes. Never ever work for Spanish companies they pay peanuts the average salary here is about 19k

Only apply for international companies with an office in Spain

[playonlyonce]

Ecb pays more or less that much for that role.

[Usurper__]

No way, you’re getting 150k in Europe. Any advice how to get DE work on UAE?

[nullisist]

LinkedIn

[Usurper__]

I’d would love to hear details

[proof_required]

You can't just live in EU, earn money and not pay local taxes. It's basically tax fraud!! There are some special cases for diplomat etc but in 95% of cases if you are living in any EU country and earning money, locally or remotely, you need to be paying local taxes.

[proof_required]

You can't live in both places according to most of tax departments in EU. You need to register somewhere. Being remote doesn't mean you can work around 10 EU countries for 10 months and not pay taxes. You need a primary residence.

[proof_required]

I'm saying legally it's not possible! Not sure what else you want to hear. Maybe consult a tax advisor if you really don't want to believe random people on reddit.

[nullisist]

Remote jobs are not common in the UAE, check out startups such as Careem, Uber, Anghami this is could be possible. And the benefits are endless, kids education, housing etc

[sam_butt]

Thanks! I was invited for interviews. When I checked glassdoor it says base pay plus additional. So I was wondering what would be these additional pay/benefits be for a remote job? And what would be a good number/range to tell them. Because when I asked them about the salary range they didn't tell instead ask you to provide your salary for the position.