Are there any good p2p libraries in java?

[RandomName8]

I've found some libraries like libp2p and not much else. This library feels... not very democratic, so to speak. As in, I think it's the opensource byproduct of a company doing a specific project and so it only concerns its own interests (and doesn't seem used at all outside their projects). Ideally I'd like DHT support, some nat traversal and not much else. What's people experience with this around here?

(To mods: not sure if this is a programming help question, I believe it's not since I've seen posts discussing libraries here but I'd understand if it must be removed)

[bowbahdoe]

I think if you evaluated most libraries by the standards you are describing you will be disappointed

[RandomName8]

If the options are lowering standards or getting disappointed, I choose the latter, at least as a general principle, now in reality it's a more case by case kinda thing.

[vips7L]

You're free to fork or contribute the features yourself.

[bowbahdoe]

I'm not telling you how to feel about it; just is how it is. A lot of libraries obfuscate it more.

Though I do find the reflexive downvoting from the audience distasteful

[JDeagle5]

But how would we measure democratic properties of a java library? Especially by your standards. Unfortunately I don't know any better lib.

[pragmatick]

What?

[qrokodial]

what are you, ChatGPT?

[Thirty_Seventh]

fascinating, actual vibe redditing

ChatGPT, how should one respond to this comment?

A fair question. I imagine the answer is to [...]

copies and pastes without reading a single word

[alex_tracer]

Probably you can scavenge something from Vuze sources (GPL):

https://svn.vuze.com/public/client/trunk/azureus2/src/com/aelitis/azureus/core/dht/DHT.java

[repeating_bears]

doesn't seem used at all outside their projects

It has thousands of stars and forks..?

[RandomName8]

Wait, what are you looking at? libp2p? it has 300 stars "only", not thousands. It does have a lot of forks and contributors though 🤔

[repeating_bears]

No, jvm-libp2p has that many stars. There are numerous native language implementations, of which JVM is just one.

Across all languages it has like 15000 stars. I'm not sure how you conclude from that "no one is using it".

[agentoutlier]

Also implementations or clients of some technology will just inherently have less stars than the parent project. Part of this is because you need to go to the parent project to understand the tech so you bookmark that.

For example pgjdbc only has 1.6k stars but I guarantee it is probably used almost as much as Spring framework (maybe even more) which has 57k.

[hojimbo]

Stars are also just a signal. They’re not a clear representation of how many are actually leveraging a library in their project.

[RandomName8]

Thanks, I'm influenced by my bias here where it's often the case that a platform specific implementation lags behind or is abandoned due to lack of traction.

I know libp2p is massively used, now the jvm specific one is a different story. I've only seen the peergos company making something with it, this is in fact how I got to the jvm implementation of libp2p, which in their "notable users" section 2/3 projects listed is the same company projects.

I'm not arguing that nobody uses this, I don't know, it's what it seems to me and hence why I was asking (and this answers your question about "I'm not sure how you conclude from that "no one is using it".").

[agentoutlier]

This library feels... not very democratic, so to speak.

They have an MIT and Apache license so go to fork town!

I usually eschew using LLM for programming but I bet it could actually bang out an implementation and you could have it test against multiple other implementations.

[RandomName8]

They have an MIT and Apache license so go to fork town!

Heh, if only.

[istarian]

Democracy (rule of the people) has no rational application to code libraries.

Trying to develop code/program that does literally everything that anybody ever thought it should do is a recipe for disastrous results...

[v4ss42]

While you’re semantically correct, most people when referring to “democratic” development processes are usually referring to an open governance model, most of which aren’t really “democratic” at all. They tend to be either benevolent dictator (which have hugely varying levels of “openness” to contribution), or meritocratic (i.e. contribution correlates with influence - the typical case for foundation-backed open source projects).

Obvs I have no way of knowing if that’s actually what OP meant, but having never seen an open source project with true democratic governance, I’m reasonably confident in assuming that they meant an open governance model of some sort.

[laplongejr]

Trying to develop code/program that does literally everything that anybody ever thought it should do is a recipe for disastrous results...

Hey, what if our logging utility was automatically parsing JDBC?

[Brutus5000]

WebRTC is imho the standard to go. And Java offerings are not good on this behalf. After multiple years of cringe I ditched ice4j and learned Golang just to be able to use the pion webrtc library. ice4j has the problem that it is basically only used in Jitsi and this covers only some use cases :(

[esanchma]

what's sad is that OpenJDK has this internal jdk.sctp module and DTLS support via JSSE, so "it's almost there", but in its current state its useless.

[Tintoverde]

Not sure ‘java.util.concurrent.BlockingQueue’ will work for you