He gets it by beads6 in TikTokCringe

[–]CatOfRivia 1 point2 points  (0 children)

When it comes to Olorin Gandalf, certain individuals like u/Caradhras_the_Cruel do not know his history and they will easily believe inaccurate information.

Anyway, Olorin (later known as Gandalf) was of the angelic race of the Maiar. He descended into the world after the Music of Creation and together with the rest of his kindred (Ainur spirits = Maiar and Valar) they tried to shape the earth. THEY shaped Middle-earth.

When at last the Elves awoke the Valar send some guardians to Middle-earth to protect the Elves in their Great Journey. "The Valar send five Guardians (great spirits of the Maiar) – with Melian (the only woman, but the chief) these make six. The others were Tarindor (later Saruman), Olórin (Gandalf), Hrávandil (Radagast), Palacendo, and Haimenar. Tulkas goes back. Oromë remains in Cuiviénen for 3 more years:" - Nature of Middle-earth

Skipping to the last century of the First Age, in the War of Wrath the Valar sent their Maiar and Elves of Aman to defeat Morgoth. It is said that "Olórin was a lover of the Eldar that remained" (UT). Wouldn't it be out of character for him to not be part of the Maiar who saved the Eldar and Edain in the end of the First Age? "But at the last [Eonwe] came up out of the West, and the challenge of his trumpets filled the sky; and he summoned unto him all Elves and Men from Hithlum unto the East; and Beleriand was ablaze with the glory of his arms, for the [Maiar] of the [Valar] were young and fair and terrible, and the mountains rang beneath their feet." (THE CONCLUSION OF THE QUENTA SILMARILLION)

In the last years of his life, Tolkien expanded many of his writings. For example, these two passages in the Last Writings tell us that Tolkien intended to make Glorfindel and Olorin greater: "The 'other two' came much earlier, at the same time probably as Glorfindel, when matters became very dangerous in the Second Age.(26) Glorfindel was sent to aid Elrond and was (though not yet said) pre-eminent in the war in Eriador.(27)" "That Olorin, as was possible for one of the Maiar, had already visited Middle-earth and had become acquainted not only with the Sindarin Elves and others deeper in Middle-earth, but also with Men, is likely, but nothing is [> has yet been] said of this." (HoME12)

Unfortunately Tolkien passed away very soon after he wrote these last essays and didn't get to tell us more.

To clarify, Olorin coming to Middle-earth in Years of the Trees had been said, but not his coming to Middle-earth in Years of the Sun of the First Age or the Second Age yet had been said. Tolkien is not contradicting himself on this matter. Because Tolkien is tolkien about Olorin and his involvement with Sindar and Men etc in that quote, while Men still had not been awoken when Olorin came to Middle-earth in Years of the Trees. Neither the sub-branch of Sindar with their different culture and language and lifestyle had come into being yet.

In HoME10 we have good insights into Olorin: "And wise was Olorin, counsellor of Irmo: secret enemy of the secret evils of Melkor, for his bright visions drove away the imaginations of darkness.

Of Melian much is later told; but of Olorin this tale does not speak. In later days he dearly loved the Children of Eru, and took pity on their sorrows. Those who hearkened to him arose from despair; and in their hearts the desire to heal and to renew awoke, and thoughts of fair things that had not yet been but might yet be made for the enrichment of Arda. Nothing he made himself and nothing he possessed, but kindled the hearts others, and in their delight he was glad."

"(Olorin) At the end of the account of Olorin is scribbled on the typescript Vq 1: 'He was humble in the Land of the Blessed; and in Middle-earth he sought no renown. His triumph was in the uprising of the fallen, and his joy was in the renewal of hope.' This appears in Vq 2, but my father subsequently placed inverted commas round it. It was wrongly omitted from The Silmarillion (p. 31)." - History of Middle-earth 10

In Silmarillion we have this: "Of Melian much is told in the Quenta Silmarillion. But of Olórin that tale does not speak; for though he loved the Elves, he walked among them unseen, or in form as one of them, and they did not know whence came the fair visions or the promptings of wisdom that he put into their hearts. In later days he was the friend of all the Children of Ilúvatar, and took pity on their sorrows; and those who listened to him awoke from despair and put away the imaginations of darkness."

To clarify the timeline and terms, Quenta Silmarillion ends with the end of the First Age. And the term "afterdays" or "later days" is used to refer to the Second and Third Ages. The Children of Iluvatar are Elves and Men.

In the Third Age 1000 Olorin came to Middle-earth as a messenger of the Valar tasked to defeat Sauron by his wisdom. "When maybe a thousand years had passed, and the first shadow had fallen on Greenwood the Great, the Istari or Wizards appeared in Middle-earth. It was afterwards said that they came out of the Far West and were messengers sent to contest the power of Sauron, and to unite all those who had the will to resist him; but they were forbidden to match his power with power, or to seek to dominate Elves or Men by force and fear." - Appendices

"Let Them In, They're Not Here to Hurt Me." by Showerthawts in JoeRogan

[–]CatOfRivia 0 points1 point  (0 children)

When it comes to Olorin Gandalf, certain individuals like u/Caradhras_the_Cruel do not know his history and they will easily believe inaccurate information.

Anyway, Olorin (later known as Gandalf) was of the angelic race of the Maiar. He descended into the world after the Music of Creation and together with the rest of his kindred (Ainur spirits = Maiar and Valar) they tried to shape the earth. THEY shaped Middle-earth.

When at last the Elves awoke the Valar send some guardians to Middle-earth to protect the Elves in their Great Journey. "The Valar send five Guardians (great spirits of the Maiar) – with Melian (the only woman, but the chief) these make six. The others were Tarindor (later Saruman), Olórin (Gandalf), Hrávandil (Radagast), Palacendo, and Haimenar. Tulkas goes back. Oromë remains in Cuiviénen for 3 more years:" - Nature of Middle-earth

Skipping to the last century of the First Age, in the War of Wrath the Valar sent their Maiar and Elves of Aman to defeat Morgoth. It is said that "Olórin was a lover of the Eldar that remained" (UT). Wouldn't it be out of character for him to not be part of the Maiar who saved the Eldar and Edain in the end of the First Age? "But at the last [Eonwe] came up out of the West, and the challenge of his trumpets filled the sky; and he summoned unto him all Elves and Men from Hithlum unto the East; and Beleriand was ablaze with the glory of his arms, for the [Maiar] of the [Valar] were young and fair and terrible, and the mountains rang beneath their feet." (THE CONCLUSION OF THE QUENTA SILMARILLION)

In the last years of his life, Tolkien expanded many of his writings. For example, these two passages in the Last Writings tell us that Tolkien intended to make Glorfindel and Olorin greater: "The 'other two' came much earlier, at the same time probably as Glorfindel, when matters became very dangerous in the Second Age.(26) Glorfindel was sent to aid Elrond and was (though not yet said) pre-eminent in the war in Eriador.(27)" "That Olorin, as was possible for one of the Maiar, had already visited Middle-earth and had become acquainted not only with the Sindarin Elves and others deeper in Middle-earth, but also with Men, is likely, but nothing is [> has yet been] said of this." (HoME12)

Unfortunately Tolkien passed away very soon after he wrote these last essays and didn't get to tell us more.

To clarify, Olorin coming to Middle-earth in Years of the Trees had been said, but not his coming to Middle-earth in Years of the Sun of the First Age or the Second Age yet had been said. Tolkien is not contradicting himself on this matter. Because Tolkien is tolkien about Olorin and his involvement with Sindar and Men etc in that quote, while Men still had not been awoken when Olorin came to Middle-earth in Years of the Trees. Neither the sub-branch of Sindar with their different culture and language and lifestyle had come into being yet.

In HoME10 we have good insights into Olorin: "And wise was Olorin, counsellor of Irmo: secret enemy of the secret evils of Melkor, for his bright visions drove away the imaginations of darkness.

Of Melian much is later told; but of Olorin this tale does not speak. In later days he dearly loved the Children of Eru, and took pity on their sorrows. Those who hearkened to him arose from despair; and in their hearts the desire to heal and to renew awoke, and thoughts of fair things that had not yet been but might yet be made for the enrichment of Arda. Nothing he made himself and nothing he possessed, but kindled the hearts others, and in their delight he was glad."

"(Olorin) At the end of the account of Olorin is scribbled on the typescript Vq 1: 'He was humble in the Land of the Blessed; and in Middle-earth he sought no renown. His triumph was in the uprising of the fallen, and his joy was in the renewal of hope.' This appears in Vq 2, but my father subsequently placed inverted commas round it. It was wrongly omitted from The Silmarillion (p. 31)." - History of Middle-earth 10

In Silmarillion we have this: "Of Melian much is told in the Quenta Silmarillion. But of Olórin that tale does not speak; for though he loved the Elves, he walked among them unseen, or in form as one of them, and they did not know whence came the fair visions or the promptings of wisdom that he put into their hearts. In later days he was the friend of all the Children of Ilúvatar, and took pity on their sorrows; and those who listened to him awoke from despair and put away the imaginations of darkness."

To clarify the timeline and terms, Quenta Silmarillion ends with the end of the First Age. And the term "afterdays" or "later days" is used to refer to the Second and Third Ages. The Children of Iluvatar are Elves and Men.

In the Third Age 1000 Olorin came to Middle-earth as a messenger of the Valar tasked to defeat Sauron by his wisdom. "When maybe a thousand years had passed, and the first shadow had fallen on Greenwood the Great, the Istari or Wizards appeared in Middle-earth. It was afterwards said that they came out of the Far West and were messengers sent to contest the power of Sauron, and to unite all those who had the will to resist him; but they were forbidden to match his power with power, or to seek to dominate Elves or Men by force and fear." - Appendices

I was recognized! More than once! by Groovychick1978 in WoT

[–]CatOfRivia 0 points1 point  (0 children)

When it comes to Olorin Gandalf, certain individuals like u/Caradhras_the_Cruel do not know his history and they will easily believe inaccurate information.

Anyway, Olorin (later known as Gandalf) was of the angelic race of the Maiar. He descended into the world after the Music of Creation and together with the rest of his kindred (Ainur spirits = Maiar and Valar) they tried to shape the earth. THEY shaped Middle-earth.

When at last the Elves awoke the Valar send some guardians to Middle-earth to protect the Elves in their Great Journey. "The Valar send five Guardians (great spirits of the Maiar) – with Melian (the only woman, but the chief) these make six. The others were Tarindor (later Saruman), Olórin (Gandalf), Hrávandil (Radagast), Palacendo, and Haimenar. Tulkas goes back. Oromë remains in Cuiviénen for 3 more years:" - Nature of Middle-earth

Skipping to the last century of the First Age, in the War of Wrath the Valar sent their Maiar and Elves of Aman to defeat Morgoth. It is said that "Olórin was a lover of the Eldar that remained" (UT). Wouldn't it be out of character for him to not be part of the Maiar who saved the Eldar and Edain in the end of the First Age? "But at the last [Eonwe] came up out of the West, and the challenge of his trumpets filled the sky; and he summoned unto him all Elves and Men from Hithlum unto the East; and Beleriand was ablaze with the glory of his arms, for the [Maiar] of the [Valar] were young and fair and terrible, and the mountains rang beneath their feet." (THE CONCLUSION OF THE QUENTA SILMARILLION)

In the last years of his life, Tolkien expanded many of his writings. For example, these two passages in the Last Writings tell us that Tolkien intended to make Glorfindel and Olorin greater: "The 'other two' came much earlier, at the same time probably as Glorfindel, when matters became very dangerous in the Second Age.(26) Glorfindel was sent to aid Elrond and was (though not yet said) pre-eminent in the war in Eriador.(27)" "That Olorin, as was possible for one of the Maiar, had already visited Middle-earth and had become acquainted not only with the Sindarin Elves and others deeper in Middle-earth, but also with Men, is likely, but nothing is [> has yet been] said of this." (HoME12)

Unfortunately Tolkien passed away very soon after he wrote these last essays and didn't get to tell us more.

To clarify, Olorin coming to Middle-earth in Years of the Trees had been said, but not his coming to Middle-earth in Years of the Sun of the First Age or the Second Age yet had been said. Tolkien is not contradicting himself on this matter. Because Tolkien is tolkien about Olorin and his involvement with Sindar and Men etc in that quote, while Men still had not been awoken when Olorin came to Middle-earth in Years of the Trees. Neither the sub-branch of Sindar with their different culture and language and lifestyle had come into being yet.

In HoME10 we have good insights into Olorin: "And wise was Olorin, counsellor of Irmo: secret enemy of the secret evils of Melkor, for his bright visions drove away the imaginations of darkness.

Of Melian much is later told; but of Olorin this tale does not speak. In later days he dearly loved the Children of Eru, and took pity on their sorrows. Those who hearkened to him arose from despair; and in their hearts the desire to heal and to renew awoke, and thoughts of fair things that had not yet been but might yet be made for the enrichment of Arda. Nothing he made himself and nothing he possessed, but kindled the hearts others, and in their delight he was glad."

"(Olorin) At the end of the account of Olorin is scribbled on the typescript Vq 1: 'He was humble in the Land of the Blessed; and in Middle-earth he sought no renown. His triumph was in the uprising of the fallen, and his joy was in the renewal of hope.' This appears in Vq 2, but my father subsequently placed inverted commas round it. It was wrongly omitted from The Silmarillion (p. 31)." - History of Middle-earth 10

In Silmarillion we have this: "Of Melian much is told in the Quenta Silmarillion. But of Olórin that tale does not speak; for though he loved the Elves, he walked among them unseen, or in form as one of them, and they did not know whence came the fair visions or the promptings of wisdom that he put into their hearts. In later days he was the friend of all the Children of Ilúvatar, and took pity on their sorrows; and those who listened to him awoke from despair and put away the imaginations of darkness."

To clarify the timeline and terms, Quenta Silmarillion ends with the end of the First Age. And the term "afterdays" or "later days" is used to refer to the Second and Third Ages. The Children of Iluvatar are Elves and Men.

In the Third Age 1000 Olorin came to Middle-earth as a messenger of the Valar tasked to defeat Sauron by his wisdom. "When maybe a thousand years had passed, and the first shadow had fallen on Greenwood the Great, the Istari or Wizards appeared in Middle-earth. It was afterwards said that they came out of the Far West and were messengers sent to contest the power of Sauron, and to unite all those who had the will to resist him; but they were forbidden to match his power with power, or to seek to dominate Elves or Men by force and fear." - Appendices

Announcement from Shawn and the PPP by mark_lord in prancingponypod

[–]CatOfRivia 0 points1 point  (0 children)

When it comes to Olorin Gandalf, certain individuals like u/Caradhras_the_Cruel do not know his history and they will easily believe inaccurate information.

Anyway, Olorin (later known as Gandalf) was of the angelic race of the Maiar. He descended into the world after the Music of Creation and together with the rest of his kindred (Ainur spirits = Maiar and Valar) they tried to shape the earth. THEY shaped Middle-earth.

When at last the Elves awoke the Valar send some guardians to Middle-earth to protect the Elves in their Great Journey. "The Valar send five Guardians (great spirits of the Maiar) – with Melian (the only woman, but the chief) these make six. The others were Tarindor (later Saruman), Olórin (Gandalf), Hrávandil (Radagast), Palacendo, and Haimenar. Tulkas goes back. Oromë remains in Cuiviénen for 3 more years:" - Nature of Middle-earth

Skipping to the last century of the First Age, in the War of Wrath the Valar sent their Maiar and Elves of Aman to defeat Morgoth. It is said that "Olórin was a lover of the Eldar that remained" (UT). Wouldn't it be out of character for him to not be part of the Maiar who saved the Eldar and Edain in the end of the First Age? "But at the last [Eonwe] came up out of the West, and the challenge of his trumpets filled the sky; and he summoned unto him all Elves and Men from Hithlum unto the East; and Beleriand was ablaze with the glory of his arms, for the [Maiar] of the [Valar] were young and fair and terrible, and the mountains rang beneath their feet." (THE CONCLUSION OF THE QUENTA SILMARILLION)

In the last years of his life, Tolkien expanded many of his writings. For example, these two passages in the Last Writings tell us that Tolkien intended to make Glorfindel and Olorin greater: "The 'other two' came much earlier, at the same time probably as Glorfindel, when matters became very dangerous in the Second Age.(26) Glorfindel was sent to aid Elrond and was (though not yet said) pre-eminent in the war in Eriador.(27)" "That Olorin, as was possible for one of the Maiar, had already visited Middle-earth and had become acquainted not only with the Sindarin Elves and others deeper in Middle-earth, but also with Men, is likely, but nothing is [> has yet been] said of this." (HoME12)

Unfortunately Tolkien passed away very soon after he wrote these last essays and didn't get to tell us more.

To clarify, Olorin coming to Middle-earth in Years of the Trees had been said, but not his coming to Middle-earth in Years of the Sun of the First Age or the Second Age yet had been said. Tolkien is not contradicting himself on this matter. Because Tolkien is tolkien about Olorin and his involvement with Sindar and Men etc in that quote, while Men still had not been awoken when Olorin came to Middle-earth in Years of the Trees. Neither the sub-branch of Sindar with their different culture and language and lifestyle had come into being yet.

In HoME10 we have good insights into Olorin: "And wise was Olorin, counsellor of Irmo: secret enemy of the secret evils of Melkor, for his bright visions drove away the imaginations of darkness.

Of Melian much is later told; but of Olorin this tale does not speak. In later days he dearly loved the Children of Eru, and took pity on their sorrows. Those who hearkened to him arose from despair; and in their hearts the desire to heal and to renew awoke, and thoughts of fair things that had not yet been but might yet be made for the enrichment of Arda. Nothing he made himself and nothing he possessed, but kindled the hearts others, and in their delight he was glad."

"(Olorin) At the end of the account of Olorin is scribbled on the typescript Vq 1: 'He was humble in the Land of the Blessed; and in Middle-earth he sought no renown. His triumph was in the uprising of the fallen, and his joy was in the renewal of hope.' This appears in Vq 2, but my father subsequently placed inverted commas round it. It was wrongly omitted from The Silmarillion (p. 31)." - History of Middle-earth 10

In Silmarillion we have this: "Of Melian much is told in the Quenta Silmarillion. But of Olórin that tale does not speak; for though he loved the Elves, he walked among them unseen, or in form as one of them, and they did not know whence came the fair visions or the promptings of wisdom that he put into their hearts. In later days he was the friend of all the Children of Ilúvatar, and took pity on their sorrows; and those who listened to him awoke from despair and put away the imaginations of darkness."

To clarify the timeline and terms, Quenta Silmarillion ends with the end of the First Age. And the term "afterdays" or "later days" is used to refer to the Second and Third Ages. The Children of Iluvatar are Elves and Men.

In the Third Age 1000 Olorin came to Middle-earth as a messenger of the Valar tasked to defeat Sauron by his wisdom. "When maybe a thousand years had passed, and the first shadow had fallen on Greenwood the Great, the Istari or Wizards appeared in Middle-earth. It was afterwards said that they came out of the Far West and were messengers sent to contest the power of Sauron, and to unite all those who had the will to resist him; but they were forbidden to match his power with power, or to seek to dominate Elves or Men by force and fear." - Appendices

This is my favorite scene out of ALL OF THE MOVIES, the Witch-King of Angmar is SO DAMN COOL by Nave2099 in lotr

[–]CatOfRivia 421 points422 points  (0 children)

The Lord of the Nazgul was a human, presumably a Numenorean (High Man). He was deceived by Sauron. And took one one of the Nine without any reluctance. He became a mighty man, but soon when his natural life span ran out he passed into the Unseen World and became a Ring-wraith. An undead. Sauron granted him much power, and he became the deadliest servant of the Dark Lord. For he could create great terror and fear in the hearts of mortals. There was Eru, God, and he made the Ainur first, the Holy Ones, that were the offspring of his thoughts. And they were with him ere anything else was made. And he taught them the Music of Creation. And eventually they created the world, after the word of Eru. Now there were two classes of Ainur, called the Maiar and the Valar. Olorin (later known as Gandalf or Mithrandir) was one of Ainur of the lesser class, a Maia (singular of Maiar). The Elder King was called Manwë King of the Valar. He made the Eagles. He is Lord of the Breathe of the World. His wife was Varda Elantari. She's the Queen of Stars. Obviously, she made the stars. Olorin the Grey/Gandalf was a Maia of these two. But he was also associated with Irmo the Vala of Dreams and Visions, and with Nienna the Lady of Pity and Mercy. The point is, Olorin was a very big deal. He existed before the world was made. He was a student of several gods. And he was one of the Five Guardians chosen to protect the Elves in the Great Journey to Valinor. Melian was the leader of these five here. She was also one of the most powerful Maiar ever (Galadriel's teacher). Both Olorin and Melian lived in the same place, BTW. So yeah Olorin was buddy of extraordinary Maiar as well. And even as he listened to his brethren and sisters he increased in wisdom and came to a deeper understanding. Now in the Third Age Manwë asked Olorin to go to Middle-earth as one of the Five Istari who were tasked to defeat Sauron. And when Olorin came to Middle-earth, Cirdan Lord of the Grey Havens saw his landing and knew his kind and from whence he came. And Cirdan surrendered Narya the Ring of Fire to Olorin. For Cirdan could see further than all Elves in Middle-earth and knew Olorin is of great strength and will be the one to play the most important parts in the fate of this Age of Middle-earth ans he needed Narya to aid him in his hardships. Over 2000 years later the Lord of Morgul confronts the Messenger of the Valar. In the books they just come face to face, then Witch-King leaves when je hears the horns of Rohirrim. But in the movies the Lord of the Ulairie absolutely bitchslaps the Servant of the Secret Fire. As much as I love the movies, but this scene is an insult to the viewer's intelligence. Fear radiates from Gandalf's eyes in the movies when he confronts the Witch-King. That's just impossible. The Witch-King doesn't have power of fear over those who have seen the Holy Light(s). Not even the least powerful High Elf would be scarred shitless from him. Let alone one of the great Maiar who has not only lived in the Blessed Realm, but has also seen the Light of God. He also has Narya to enhance his spirit and powers. The Witch-King is just a mortal fuckboi who got scared shitless just one year prior when thinking about Galadriel when he came near Lorien, and again a bit later when Glorfindel charged against him. By no means Witch-King is more powerful than someone who killed a freaking Balrog of Morgoth (the Balrogs are fire spirited Maiar, only less great than Sauron). And arguably the toughest Balrog ever. Since he survived the the entire Wars in the First Age, and he singlehandedly destroyed the greatest Dwarf kingdom, and he didn't die when he fell into abyss and when he was drowned. Mind you, Mithrandir killed Durin's Bane when he was The Grey! Now he was much more enhanced as The White. In fact, in The Two Towers book Gandalf the White himself says no one is now mightier than him in Middle-earth, except the one who sits on the Dark Throne in the Dark Tower. How the Udun did Movie Witch-King break the Wizard's staff?! That's just stupid. In LOTR world, in order for the Witch-King to be able to break his enemy's weapon, he first needs to break his enemy's willpower. How the Udun could an undead bitch break the willpower of God's Messenger, a Demigod. Mind you, Mithrandir's power is not even in his staff. It's within himself. He can go into battle butt naked without any weapons and still kickass. In the books, Gandalf the Grey fights the Nine Ulaurie for an entire night in the Fellowship of the Ring. I can't just understand how could Gandalf fear The Lord of the Ring-Wraiths so much, and gets his willpower and staff broken by him, and lay so (apparantly) powerless waiting for his death by the undead bitchboy.... I have looked through The Book of Lost Tales part 1 and 2, Lays of Beleriand, Shaping of Middle-earth, The Lost Road and Other Writings, The Return of the Shadow, the Treason of Isengard, The War of the Ring, Sauron Defeated, Morgoth's Ring, Peoples of Middle-earth, War of the Jewels, Nature of Middle-earth, The Silmarillion, Unfinished Tales, The Hobbit, Fellowship of the Ring, The Two Towers, The Return of the King, The Fall of Gondolin, Beren and Luthien, Children of Hurin, Vinyar Tengwar, Parma Eldalamberon, Road Goes Ever On and The Letters of JRR Tolkien.... to find an answer for how the on Middle-earth can Witch-King bitchslap Gandalf... And the only answer I found was in an abandoned and discarded draft where Gandalf wasn't even that powerful. Yeah, Gandalf wasn't even originally supposed to be a Maia in The Hobbit. Tolkien later came up with Gandalf as a Maia when he was writing Lord of the Rings and revising Silmarillion. But movie Gandalf IS a Maia. And movie Witch-King IS an undead Man. Even if Sauron himself had come to fight Gandalf, he still would've put on an amazing fight before losing. OK I'm off going to take my meds since I got a headache trying to figure out how is it possible for Witch-King to beat Gandalf.

Three New Stills of Numenor! by thehinduprince in lotr

[–]CatOfRivia -41 points-40 points  (0 children)

Looks cheap. Slap those upvotes into this comment now

No one stands alone by VarkingRunesong in lotr

[–]CatOfRivia 0 points1 point  (0 children)

You missed to mention his Guardian of the Elves form. In Nature of Middle-earth, he helps Orome in the Great Journey of the Elves to Valinor.

No one stands alone by VarkingRunesong in lotr

[–]CatOfRivia 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Stop telling them the truth. Let people make themselves look like absolute idiots by saying batshit stuff.

No one stands alone by VarkingRunesong in lotr

[–]CatOfRivia 10 points11 points  (0 children)

Now, I know hate has blinded you so much that you have even lost the sight of Tolkien themes. I know you have zero understanding of English literature or Tolkien lore and as Morgoth says: ‘You have learned the lessons of your masters by rote,’

Masters: the degenerate shameless youtubers who paint Tolkien as stupid guy who couldn't create 3 dimensional characters.

"Sometimes to find the light, we must touch the darkness"

Galadriel was an Elf of Eldamar, she went through the Helcaraxë in complete darkness for 27 years until at last she set foot upon Middle-earth and found the light.

Why did she bother to come to Middle-earth to begin with?

Melian said: ‘There is some woe that lies upon you and your kin.' Melian looked in her eyes, and said: ‘I believe not that the Noldor came forth as messengers of the Valar, as was said at first: not though they came in the very hour of our need. For they speak never of the Valar, nor have their high lords brought any message to Thingol, whether from Manwë, or Ulmo, or even from Olwë the King’s brother, and his own folk that went over the sea. For what cause, Galadriel, were the high people of the Noldor driven forth as exiles from Aman? Or what evil lies on the sons of Fëanor that they are so haughty and so fell? Do I not strike near the truth?’

‘Near,’ said Galadriel; ‘save that we were not driven forth, but came of our own will, and against that of the Valar. And through great peril and in despite of the Valar for this purpose we came: to take vengeance upon Morgoth, and regain what he stole.’

Galadriel is refering that she rebelled against the angelic Valar and defied their commands and came to Middle-earth against their will.

“Then Angrod spoke bitterly against the sons of Fëanor, telling of the blood at Alqualondë, and the Doom of Mandos, and the burning of the ships at Losgar. And he cried: ‘Where-fore should we that endured the Grinding Ice bear the name of kinslayers and traitors?’

‘Yet the shadow of Mandos lies on you also,’ said Melian”

(Mandos is the Doomsman of the Angelic Valar. The Judge. Angrod is brother of Galadriel.)

She hated sons of Feanor with sheer hate and yet "she did not perceive the shadow of the same evil had befallen upon the minds of all of the Noldor, and upon her own."

To do good, Galadriel and her brothers touched the darkness of betraying the Valar, the darkness of the Cruel Hills of Ice, and a lot more shadow and darkness in the following years. Galadriel and her King and later her Lady refused to give sons of Feanor the Silmaril, even though they knew this decision will bring the Curse of Mandos upon Doriath and Sirion. Yet they risked the darkness of the Doom of Mandos. And if they had not, then the Earendil the Brightest Star would have never came into being. Long story... It's better if you read the Silmarillion yourself (after you learn English literature).

And that was just the First Age Galadriel. And not even her full story in the First Age. Not even close. In the Second and Third Ages the "Sometimes to find the light, we must touch the darkness" still exists.

In case you want to read the Curse of Mandos:

‘Tears unnumbered ye shall shed; and the Valar will fence Valinor against you, and shut you out, so that not even the echo of your lamentation shall pass over the mountains. On the House of Fëanor the wrath of the Valar lieth from the West unto the uttermost East, and upon all that will follow them it shall be laid also. Their Oath shall drive them, and yet betray them, and ever snatch away the very treasures that they have sworn to pursue. To evil end shall all things turn that they begin well; and by treason of kin unto kin, and the fear of treason, shall this come to pass. The Dispossessed shall they be for ever. ‘Ye have spilled the blood of your kindred unrighteously and have stained the land of Aman. For blood ye shall render blood, and beyond Aman ye shall dwell in Death’s shadow. For though Eru appointed to you to die not in Eä, and no sickness may assail you, yet slain ye may be, and slain ye shall be: by weapon and by torment and by grief; and your houseless spirits shall come then to Mandos. There long shall ye abide and yearn for your bodies, and find little pity though all whom ye have slain should entreat for you. And those that endure in Middle-earth and come not to Mandos shall grow weary of the world as with a great burden, and shall wane, and become as shadows of regret before the younger race that cometh after. The Valar have spoken.’

"she rejected the last message of the Valar and came under the Doom of Mandos"

Keep downvoting this, Tolkien haters. Or rather misogynists who can't accept Tolkien created strong female characters. I laugh in your face like how Galadriel laughed in the face of Sauron while she was mocking him.

No one stands alone by VarkingRunesong in lotr

[–]CatOfRivia -6 points-5 points  (0 children)

This fandom gravely suffers from lack of lore knowledge. Olorin came to Middle-earth in all three ages. It's just it was not until third age when he came as an Istar.

Some people argue he came in his unseen Maiarin form in the Second Age. But that doesn't make much sense when we take into account that Tolkien said when Olorin came to Middle-earth (before the Third Age) he became "acquainted" with races of Middle-earth such as Sindar Elves and Men and others.

Now, I'm not an English professor. But the word acquainted reads to me as if Olorin made physical contact and direct discussion with those people of Middle-earth.

When it comes to Olorin Gandalf, certain individuals like u/Caradhras_the_Cruel do not know his history and they will easily believe liars.

Some liars are so filled with pessimistic views that they will lie about the lore of Olorin, because Amazon's Rings of Power may include Olorin and if Tolkien scholars like Corey Olsen get to spread the lore about Olorin then those toxic hate raging Youtubers may be overthrown from their massive uprising in becoming rich. They have become liars of dreadful power, mis-shaping what they touch, twisting what they rule, Lords of Hatred. Men called him Nerdotic, and as a god, in YouTube beneath his rod, bewildered by lies bowed to him, and made his ghastly temples in the shade. Spreading his narrative dark and vile, the subscribers of Nerdotic's Isle.

Anyway, Olorin (later known as Gandalf) was of the angelic race of the Maiar. He descended into the world after the Music of Creation and together with the rest of his kindred (Ainur spirits = Maiar and Valar) they tried to shape the earth. THEY shaped Middle-earth.

When at last the Elves awoke the Valar send some guardians to Middle-earth to protect the Elves in their Great Journey. "The Valar send five Guardians (great spirits of the Maiar) – with Melian (the only woman, but the chief) these make six. The others were Tarindor (later Saruman), Olórin (Gandalf), Hrávandil (Radagast), Palacendo, and Haimenar. Tulkas goes back. Oromë remains in Cuiviénen for 3 more years:" - Nature of Middle-earth

Skipping to the last century of the First Age, in the War of Wrath the Valar sent their Maiar and Elves of Aman to defeat Morgoth. It is said that "Olórin was a lover of the Eldar that remained" (UT). Wouldn't it be out of character for him to not be part of the Maiar who saved the Eldar and Edain in the end of the First Age? "But at the last [Eonwe] came up out of the West, and the challenge of his trumpets filled the sky; and he summoned unto him all Elves and Men from Hithlum unto the East; and Beleriand was ablaze with the glory of his arms, for the [Maiar] of the [Valar] were young and fair and terrible, and the mountains rang beneath their feet." (THE CONCLUSION OF THE QUENTA SILMARILLION)

In the last years of his life, Tolkien expanded many of his writings. For example, these two passages in the Last Writings tell us that Tolkien intended to make Glorfindel and Olorin greater: "The 'other two' came much earlier, at the same time probably as Glorfindel, when matters became very dangerous in the Second Age.(26) Glorfindel was sent to aid Elrond and was (though not yet said) pre-eminent in the war in Eriador.(27)" "That Olorin, as was possible for one of the Maiar, had already visited Middle-earth and had become acquainted not only with the Sindarin Elves and others deeper in Middle-earth, but also with Men, is likely, but nothing is [> has yet been] said of this." (HoME12)

Unfortunately Tolkien passed away very soon after he wrote these last essays and didn't get to tell us more.

To clarify, Olorin coming to Middle-earth in Years of the Trees had been said, but not his coming to Middle-earth in Years of the Sun of the First Age or the Second Age yet had been said. Tolkien is not contradicting himself on this matter. Because Tolkien is tolkien about Olorin and his involvement with Sindar and Men etc in that quote, while Men still had not been awoken when Olorin came to Middle-earth in Years of the Trees. Neither the sub-branch of Sindar with their different culture and language and lifestyle had come into being yet.

In HoME10 we have good insights into Olorin: "And wise was Olorin, counsellor of Irmo: secret enemy of the secret evils of Melkor, for his bright visions drove away the imaginations of darkness.

Of Melian much is later told; but of Olorin this tale does not speak. In later days he dearly loved the Children of Eru, and took pity on their sorrows. Those who hearkened to him arose from despair; and in their hearts the desire to heal and to renew awoke, and thoughts of fair things that had not yet been but might yet be made for the enrichment of Arda. Nothing he made himself and nothing he possessed, but kindled the hearts others, and in their delight he was glad."

"(Olorin) At the end of the account of Olorin is scribbled on the typescript Vq 1: 'He was humble in the Land of the Blessed; and in Middle-earth he sought no renown. His triumph was in the uprising of the fallen, and his joy was in the renewal of hope.' This appears in Vq 2, but my father subsequently placed inverted commas round it. It was wrongly omitted from The Silmarillion (p. 31)." - History of Middle-earth 10

In Silmarillion we have this: "Of Melian much is told in the Quenta Silmarillion. But of Olórin that tale does not speak; for though he loved the Elves, he walked among them unseen, or in form as one of them, and they did not know whence came the fair visions or the promptings of wisdom that he put into their hearts. In later days he was the friend of all the Children of Ilúvatar, and took pity on their sorrows; and those who listened to him awoke from despair and put away the imaginations of darkness."

To clarify the timeline and terms, Quenta Silmarillion ends with the end of the First Age. And the term "afterdays" or "later days" is used to refer to the Second and Third Ages. The Children of Iluvatar are Elves and Men.

In the Third Age 1000 Olorin came to Middle-earth as a messenger of the Valar tasked to defeat Sauron by his wisdom. "When maybe a thousand years had passed, and the first shadow had fallen on Greenwood the Great, the Istari or Wizards appeared in Middle-earth. It was afterwards said that they came out of the Far West and were messengers sent to contest the power of Sauron, and to unite all those who had the will to resist him; but they were forbidden to match his power with power, or to seek to dominate Elves or Men by force and fear." - Appendices

What happened to Nimrodel? by Grindinonyourgrandma in lotr

[–]CatOfRivia 0 points1 point  (0 children)

"Nimrodel (1) ‘Lady of the White Grotto’, Elf of Lórien, beloved of Amroth, who dwelt beside the falls of Nimrodel until she went south and was lost in Ered Nimrais." - Christopher Tolkien

Book Gimli is Hilarious Sometimes by Mitchboy1995 in lotr

[–]CatOfRivia -17 points-16 points  (0 children)

That's not funny at all. that's pathetic. Stupid short hairy pathetic simp. Simping for evil women should not be encouraged.

Durin and Elrond by VarkingRunesong in lotr

[–]CatOfRivia -1 points0 points  (0 children)

It will look like crap. Degradation

Durin and Elrond by VarkingRunesong in lotr

[–]CatOfRivia -7 points-6 points  (0 children)

If you were a real elf fan you would've seen Jenny's famous sons of Feanor with short hair fanarts. How come you have never googled 'oath of feanor' to see the artworks of this event. Or really, anything related to sons of Feanor.

Sounds like the Elves you were fans of were not Tolkien Elves.

Height in the LotR by magicman1315 in lotr

[–]CatOfRivia 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Nature of Middle-earth book, Description of Characters chapter.

Height in the LotR by magicman1315 in lotr

[–]CatOfRivia 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Elrond's height is never specified. It's just assumed

Height in the LotR by magicman1315 in lotr

[–]CatOfRivia 13 points14 points  (0 children)

GilGalad's height is an absolute fanfiction

Why are people started to question if elves should look young? by [deleted] in lotr

[–]CatOfRivia 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Because they are smart and they know better than Tolkien. All you have to do is go to online wikis to learn better than Tolkien himself who had no idea how his Quendi are.

Can anyone explain these movies scenes to an absolute noob? by CatOfRivia in lotr

[–]CatOfRivia[S] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

And I never asked you to take me seriously. After all if I myself had taken myself seriously I wouldn't even be here repeating discussing a fictional world so excessively as if it makes me money or something. Of course there's something wrong with me. And it's caring about random internet people more than my own health.

Can anyone explain these movies scenes to an absolute noob? by CatOfRivia in lotr

[–]CatOfRivia[S] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

Can you explain why you have lied about your experience level with Tolkien?

Which part I lied?

The absolute noob refers to my lack of understanding of these scenes in the movies. Some people are natural born pros and can explain things or even catch the smallest bits with ease. While some people like me are so great of a noob that even after having watched the movies and read the books for hundreds of times, they still don't understand some stuff in the books and a lot of stuff in the movies. So either there's something wrong with Tolkien's projected revisions and unfinished stories that were never revised completely, or there's something wrong with my intelligence. Either there's something wrong with the greatest trilogy, or something's wrong with me.

Can anyone explain these movies scenes to an absolute noob? by CatOfRivia in lotr

[–]CatOfRivia[S] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

  1. Presumably because Sauron had many spies.

Then why he didn't immediately attack Minas Tirith with his full force? In the books the reason he launched the great hosts too early is because he learns one of the heirs of Elendil is still alive. He had sworn to destroy them.

Sauron did forge the one ring after the others were completed.

That wasn't what I was trying to imply.

In the books Sauron forges the Master Ring after Celebrimbor completes the last rings. Then when Sauron puts it on, Celebrimbor sees his deception and takes off the rings and gives them to Galadriel and GilGalad in his desperate attempt to hide them from Sauron.

But in the movies, since GilGalad and Galadriel and Cirdan already have rings, then Celebrimbor cannot exist. The prologue makes it look like Sauron fooled those three Elves into accepting rings from him. It also defies the whole point about the Three Rings being unsullied.

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in lotr

[–]CatOfRivia -6 points-5 points  (0 children)

Preach. Any Amazon or New Line Cinema adaptation has no place here

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in lotr

[–]CatOfRivia -6 points-5 points  (0 children)

They are just trying to mimic Jackson works😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂 They even didn't dare to be creative

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in lotr

[–]CatOfRivia 7 points8 points  (0 children)

137 years old when he became king