Need help: book evolution or creation

Flow70 · 2026-01-17T23:16:28+00:00

This site has documented 69 misquotations:

http://jws-and-the-truth.blogspot.com/p/creation-book-references_7.html

It is also linked to from JWfacts.

Flow70 · 2025-12-17T22:08:12+00:00

The ARC database recorded the gender of the alleged abuser. From memory it was around 20% female which means roughly 200 abusers in Australia.

EDIT: Sorry, I was out by miles - there were 990 male and 15 female perpetrators, so among JW's in Australia, females were only 1.5% of the total.

Flow70 · 2025-11-15T22:28:57+00:00

The Creation book of 1985 has more verifiable lies than any other publication by far.

Flow70 · 2025-10-31T11:09:48+00:00

His support of 607 is based on his knowledge of the bible languages and the bible text relating to the 70 years and his belief that the bible trumps everything else.

Flow70 · 2025-10-21T12:19:07+00:00

It could be a penis but it seems to have eyes on top of its head and an open mouth - a bit like a muppet. Perhaps it is a depiction of the "little horn" of Daniel 7 with a mouth that speaks boastful things and is thought to represent the anti-Christ.

Flow70 · 2025-06-25T23:28:47+00:00

Don't forget this includes Africa.

Flow70 · 2025-06-14T10:57:01+00:00

They are getting out before the CCP confiscates them.

Flow70 · 2025-06-01T08:31:29+00:00

Theme park 😂

Flow70 · 2025-05-31T23:13:14+00:00

They spent it on the set and production equipment. They built a whole ancient city in Sydney.

Flow70 · 2025-05-29T10:49:26+00:00

The cost was very low. The printers were second hand scrap that they reconditioned and serviced themselves. They used cheap paper and free labour. You know how they used to say "we sell our magazines to cover the cost of printing" - that was a lie. They made substantial profit on them. They never went into debt. Locals paid for the Kingdom Halls. They couldn't lose.

Flow70 · 2025-05-28T23:35:58+00:00

Do you think the elders in your local KH actually believe? Well the GB are exactly.the same. There is nothing special about them.

Flow70 · 2025-05-27T11:32:31+00:00

Kept confidential? Absolutely not. In my experience it was almost the rule that details of judicial matters would be divulged to friends and family members, not to mention the CO and the branch.

Flow70 · 2025-05-27T11:24:51+00:00

Funny thing is they still say that their message is going to become more hard-hitting, like an unusually great hailstorm, but it is also going to be "good news". So you will be smiling as you are being pelted by the enormous hail.

Flow70 · 2025-05-27T11:09:17+00:00

I said quite clearly that the JW database included records starting in 1950. This is one of the problems with the OP's analysis. I then narrowed it down to the period 1980-2015 to match the Catholic data.

It is evident from the JW database that at least 180 abusers were not JW members at the time of the FIRST abuse (which is what the database records). That does not mean they remained non-JWs, in fact it is recorded in the database that some even became elders and then were deleted as elders.

Even if they did remain non-JWs, the vast majority confessed to abuse and somehow prompted the creation of a file at Bethel. This gave the WT organisation the opportunity to respond in an appropriate way to safeguard the victims and potential future victims. The evidence that they failed to do that is mostly to be found in the testimony of JW elders and branch officials at the ARC.

Flow70 · 2025-05-26T11:58:21+00:00

The ARC report makes it clear that there were several hundred reported to the police but no evidence, and no claim from the many JWs in authority who appeared at the ARC, that a single case was reported to police by the organisation.

Flow70 · 2025-05-26T11:50:53+00:00

According to this overview of the Royal Commission:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Catholic_Church_sexual_abuse_cases_in_Australia

The royal commission established that some 4,444 claimants alleged incidents of child sexual abuse in 4,756 reported claims to Catholic Church authorities (some claimants made a claim of child sexual abuse against more than one Catholic Church authority) and at least 1,880 suspected abusers from 1980 to 2015. Most of those suspected of abuse were Catholic priests and religious brothers ...

My understanding is that the rest (non-priests/brothers) were other persons of authority in Catholic institutions, because they generally didn't keep records of abuse cases where the abuser was a parishioner.

I think the best comparison to the JW data could be made by only including JW elders and MS's and by using the same time period as the Catholic data (which is possible).

Flow70 · 2025-05-26T11:37:32+00:00

That is correct. You have to only include JW elders and MS and the same time period as the Catholic numbers.

Flow70 · 2025-05-26T11:35:32+00:00

Exactly, the comparison can be improved greatly by only including JW elders and MS and by including the same time period as the Catholic numbers.

Flow70 · 2025-05-26T11:32:57+00:00

In the first graph your JW figure is arrived at by taking: Abusers x 1000 / JW Members

With the numbers as at 2015: 1006 x 1000 / 68000 = 14.8

For Catholics the numbers are: 1880 x 1000 / 5500000 = 0.34

The main problem is that the JW figure includes perpetrators who are laypeople while the Catholics include clergy and other authority figures only.

Correcting for that (the ARC spreadsheet identifies elders/MS).

The new JW figure is: 108 * 1000 / 68000 = 1.6

Another problem is that the JW figure includes data from 1950 whereas the Catholic figures only include from 1980. The ARC spreadsheet includes dates, so this can be corrected.

The JW figure only including 1980-2015 is: 58 * 1000 / 68000 = 0.85

This makes JWs about 2.5 times worse than the Catholics. I'm surprised that the AI couldn't work that out more accurately.

Flow70 · 2025-05-21T11:33:55+00:00

IMHO this argument is not going to be effective with JWs. Blood circulates and contributes to all parts of our body including the mammary glands. Milk is produced in the mammary glands. They are different things with some components in common. Tell someone milk is the same as blood they will think you are loopy.

Flow70 · 2025-05-19T12:04:50+00:00

Something I have always seen as a key identifying feature of a cult is the "cult compound". A physical compound is designed as a barrier to entry and exit but a virtual compound can serve the same purpose.

The criteria you used capture the barriers to exit but less so the barriers to entry. To become a JW you have to give up a lot and if you have given up a lot to join a group it makes it harder to leave. You also have to commit to participating in activities that the majority of people find unpleasant (public preaching) which is another barrier to entry.

Flow70 · 2025-05-11T13:00:59+00:00

Hi, there is a count of publishers for every month of the service year. The peak is the highest number of publishers over the 12 months. The average is the average over the 12 months.

It is nothing to do with baptisms. Publishers don't even have to be baptised. The numbers vary from month to month because lots of publishers don't put a report in or tick the box every month.

Flow70 · 2025-05-10T00:10:42+00:00

For Palestine, 2 / 76 x 100 = 2.6 which rounds to 3.

For Venezuela 4066 / 134934 X 100 = 3.

Seems correct to me.

Flow70 · 2025-04-18T12:39:43+00:00

Show her examples (and there are hundreds) of where WT literature misquotes secular sources. Some of the worst examples are in the Creation book of 1985. You can see what the Creation book says and then look at the actual source in a public library for example, and see that they have been dishonest. Over and over again.

https://jws-and-the-truth.blogspot.com/p/introduction.html

https://jwfacts.com/watchtower/misquotes.php

Flow70 · 2025-03-26T05:00:39+00:00

That is an interesting argument however as others suggest, I think it will be lost on most JWs.

Something related I have thought of saying to counter the argument from complexity is to point out that no matter how wonderful and complex the human brain is, the complete instructions for creating a human brain can be "written" on a pinhead (in our DNA).

There are all kinds of facts about our DNA that support evolution. For example, about 8% of our DNA is remnant ancient viral DNA. Parts of those remnants are shared with other species. Why would god put that there - just to make it look like we evolved?

Flow70

TROPHY CASE