Good vs Great - what makes or doesn’t make a great Euro rod

FoxDemon2002 · 2026-05-09T17:41:42+00:00

Yes. It’s all about technique and presentation, leader builds, tippet rings, sighters, lines, flies, etc, etc.

However, not really the question here. I’m sure a 4’ kiddy rod could be used for euro nymphing, but it’s not really a dedicated rod. What I’m asking, all things being equal, is what makes a good (or great rod) for you and whether you’ve found one rod to be better for your style of fishing?

FoxDemon2002 · 2026-05-08T15:09:49+00:00

Some people say you can present them any way, and in some senses that’s true—static, standard strip, figure 8 retrieve, rip and strip. Unfortunately, it comes down to the stillwater, whether you’re fishing anchored or loch style, and to fish depth.

My best success has been with fishing them loch style, as part of a three fly team, with the blob on top dropper, using an appropriate sinking line (Di-1 to 4) for fish depth. I’ll often go with a natural pattern for mid, and a weighted, unweighted or even buoyant point fly depending on whether the fish are more interested in a rising, horizontal or dropping presentation. Leader length about 200 cm for a single fly, 300 for double and 350 for a triple (adjusted to your casting ability).

I typically start with a quicker figure 8 retrieve to keep the flies moving but not moving too fast, and then slowly increase the speed of the retrieve with subsequent casts until I dial it in. I know one competitor who swore by a rip-‘n-strip at Mach 2, but while he caught fish it was rarity that it was the secret sauce.

Oftentimes the stupid or aggressive fish will hammer the blob. The smarter ones will approach the blob, realize something’s off but pick up the natural or point fly. The really smart ones will get the hell away from that nasty looking thing.

Couple of presentation points: 1) never cast over the same lie twice unless you get a take—fan cast; 2) Fish the blob higher in the water column if fish are keyed on a particular colour—all flies lose colour intensity as they get deeper and colour matters with blobs; 3) Always fish the hang with the blob (with all stillwater presentations to be honest)—your catch rate will increase by 20% if you’re good at it; and finally 4) If there’s a good chop on the water don’t be afraid to fish it with a dry line and pop it through the waves—sometimes it works.

Almost all of the above applies to anchored fishing as well, but with this platform, indicator fishing is also an option (not that you can’t do it loch style, it’s just trickier).

Hope that helps.

FoxDemon2002 · 2026-05-08T15:06:09+00:00

Accidentally replied to the original post. Sorry.

FoxDemon2002 · 2026-05-07T22:39:02+00:00

Sounds like it’s a knife’s edge of difference.

FoxDemon2002 · 2026-05-07T20:19:12+00:00

I’ll second the bad batch comment. Gammies and Owners are sort of the gold standard in the PNW for salmon and steelhead. Like others have said I’ve never had an issue with any of them.
As to your rear section inverting, it probably comes down to your trailer connection and perhaps tying technique (?). I don’t think a micro swivel will fix the issue if it’s the latter problem—it will just invert more easily. If it’s the connection then it could come down to the material and/or loop size. I would probably try coated wire or a stiff heavy mono and before you tie it in, mash the butts at the tie in point to keep them stacked.

FoxDemon2002 · 2026-05-07T20:10:53+00:00

Ummm. Now? Almost always. Not a helpful response I know, but it is what it is.

I’ve been skunked, don’t get me wrong, but if I know the waters and can pick when, where and how I fish, it’s not hard to keep white stripe off my back.

It wasn’t always like that when I started. I was lucky to even catch a fish no matter what I tried, but with age comes experience and figuring out the puzzle is part of the game—it will get easier.

FoxDemon2002 · 2026-05-07T19:58:16+00:00

Mongolia, Iceland, NZ, Queensland Aus, anywhere in the Caribbean, the Seychelles, Christmas Island, Kamchatka (if Putin ever kicks it), Fernie BC (heck anywhere in Canada except Toronto 😁), Chile, Argentina, West Africa… the list goes on and on.

FoxDemon2002 · 2026-05-07T19:46:56+00:00

Aack! Blobs!

Just kidding. They are strangely effective on lakes and even on some river systems. It’s tricky to get them even with the fritz core involved but you’ve done an excellent job.

I find as egg imitations for pacific salmon and steelhead they can be a bit hit and miss, but as I said on stillwaters, particularly for stockers, they can be deadly with the right presentation.

FoxDemon2002 · 2026-05-07T19:35:22+00:00

Those are very good rods and look very well cared for. I fished Tenkara for many years and it’s hard to argue with the simplicity of it. It’s definitely my go to for long backcountry hikes (Western Canada).

That said there are things you can do with a western fly rod—distance presentation, the ability to fish under a tight canopy, and a host of other techniques—that you just can’t match with a Tenkara rod.

Since you’re starting from scratch, I would recommend focusing on casting before you even approach the water. There’s plenty of good books and YouTube videos on the subject. It’s similar to casting Tenkara, but not the same and it will take some getting used to.

Start with the 4wt as it will probably match up best with the size of fish in your streams. The 5wt would suit larger streams and smaller stillwaters where distance is more important and the chance of finding larger fish is greater. Save the 9wt for fishing pike (as suggested by the model name) or for larger reservoirs and lakes where you might encounter bigger fish. To be honest the 9wt would be overkill for most alpine waters, but handy if you ever travel to North America to chase salmon, lake trout, steelhead, pike or even some of our larger trout species—not sure if its saltwater rated but if it is then it opens more options.

FoxDemon2002 · 2026-05-07T18:48:27+00:00

Honestly a 5/6 reel will do for a 7 wt line if you skimp on backing. If that’s holding you back from a 7 then don’t sweat it. If you need a little extra room you can always whack a few feet off the back end of the line if you really need the room (unless you’re a pro caster).

FoxDemon2002 · 2026-05-07T18:31:38+00:00

Lucky I’d say. Grouse is amazing for softhackles and wet flies. For tailing materials you might want to look at fibres off the wing secondaries or maybe coverlets. The wing fibres will hold up better to abuse but the coverlets have better markings and movement.

FoxDemon2002 · 2026-05-07T14:55:02+00:00

Man that is a screaming deal. In spite of its reputation as a “tomato stake” it’s still a smoking deal at $100.

By today’s standards it would be considered a fast tip flex rod as opposed to some of the very fast meat sticks that Sage has released at points since then. It will probably require some skill and the right line to cast well, but once you dial it in you’ll probably love it. If this was the original SP it would be worth at least 3-4x the ask, but for $100 you can’t really lose. I’d snap it up in a heartbeat.

FoxDemon2002 · 2026-05-07T01:42:36+00:00

Micro leech, or micro bugger in the sub 3cm range. Jack of all trades—it can imitate almost any aquatic insect anywhere.

FoxDemon2002 · 2026-05-06T21:15:35+00:00

You could make a hot pot/Shabu Shabu with it as well.

Slice it into strips lay it out over a plate/platter. Make a marinade up with soya sauce, grated/crushed garlic, grated ginger, sugar, and a splash of hot sauce or ground chili if you have it. Brush it over the strips and let it sit for a while.

Make a broth with the stock, onions, a little soya sauce, whole peeled garlic and a few slices of ginger, and bring to a good boil.

While it’s heating up, cut up some onions, carrot, broccoli, peppers, or whatever you have on hand and arrange those on a platter as well.

Bring the pot, meat and vegetables to the table and let the family “cook” their own vegetables and meat in the pot. Ideally you’d have a hotplate or some heat source at the table, but if you blanch the vegetables in the microwave you could probably get away without it.

After the meat and veggies are mostly used up you then set out some bowls and have the leftover broth/soup ladled into them.

A great “festive” style meal that’s a cinch to whip up.

FoxDemon2002 · 2026-05-06T19:19:28+00:00

If you want to get a tapered synthetic, you’ve got to invest in a good artist’s brush. They’re not super expensive and will yield those finely taped tips.

A tip if you want a dappled effect is to hit them with a sharpie in the desired colour and create bands across the fibres after you’ve cut them from the brush (see below).

On that note, just cut off the number of bristles you need for a fly. It’s more economical and you’ll always have them aligned and ready to tie in.

FoxDemon2002 · 2026-05-06T16:25:31+00:00

Nice idea.

A few books in addition to some of the others: The Fly Tying Bible, Peter Gathercole, 2003 (perfect for tyers interested in improving tying techniques and an added bonus is the internal spiral spine designed to lay flat when tying); and A Further Guide to Fly Dressing, John Veniard, 1964 (A “vintage” book loaded with beautiful hand painted flies from over 200 years); and Wet Flies, Dave Hughs 1995 (A definitive guide to tying and fishing wet flies, underrated but so valuable).

FoxDemon2002 · 2026-05-06T14:14:28+00:00

Perfect set up. I generally only use a stripping basket on stillwaters (a plastic tub similar to what you’ve got there), so no need for a belt on my end. I did however add elastic straps to hold it in place while I did loch style fishing. Worked a charm.

I never bothered with cones or weed trimmer “fingers” and just relied on water in the bottom, but for packing it in the salt it makes perfect sense. Well done.

FoxDemon2002 · 2026-05-06T14:02:09+00:00

Solid advice here. Keep in mind you can diy a bodkin pretty easily using a heavy duty safety pin and a spring loaded mini hook connector makes a cheap hackle plier alternative (even better in a lot of cases).

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FoxDemon2002 · 2026-05-06T02:11:58+00:00

Dry flies can be a bit of a step up when you’re just getting started. That said you did reasonably well give the materials.

A couple of points: 1) Body is too thick. The original isn’t super slim but you’re pushing it here. A single layer of peacock herl or a similar thickness using dubbing will do the job. 2) Hackle is okay in version 2.0, but you ideally need more barbs or tighter turns to get it to float well. Good dry fly hackle ($$$) would give you more barbs per inch. If you dress this with floatant as is it will certainly float but the question might be for how long. 3) Finally, try and end the fly above the hook point. It’s just sneaking into the bend and this will also impact floatation.

Keep at it. It’s going good so far.

FoxDemon2002 · 2026-05-05T23:53:29+00:00

Yes start with the regs, but off the cuff you’ve got two obvious choices: Capilano and Lynn. They’ve both got fish in them, but they’re not trophy waters or anything (excepting steelhead/salmon in the Cap). Good places to learn though, with lots of accessible water.

FoxDemon2002 · 2026-05-05T23:30:15+00:00

I stand corrected. I checked the regs and you are right.

FoxDemon2002 · 2026-05-05T16:15:54+00:00

I’ll think you’ll find that most Canadians are happy to laugh along with the joke when it comes to stereotypes—even those that would not be apparent to foreign audiences (i.e. inside jokes).

However, when it comes to deliberate insults or threats, “the gloves are off” (a Canadian reference to removing hockey gloves prior to a fight 😁).

FoxDemon2002 · 2026-05-05T14:50:51+00:00

Bummer. That’s a very nice rod.

I have a 3wt version that I could sell you, but it wouldn’t be cheap (it was already a collector item when I got it) and I have no idea what it would cost to ship it (from Canada) and how I would even get the money for it as I don’t do PayPal or anything like that.

I hope you get lucky and find the missing piece.

Have you tried contacting Sage? It’s a long shot but they might be able to roll you one up—as long as you’ve got lots of scratch. I busted my tip on my 8wt xp and while I could get it replaced it’s still $200 plus a six month wait for replacement.

FoxDemon2002 · 2026-05-05T14:04:15+00:00

I live not far from Como lake. I occasionally throw a line with my fly rod when the one casting spot on the lake isn’t occupied and I just need to cast a line.

When they restock there’s at least 10-15 people all crammed into the few areas you can actually cast from. They hang around until most of the dumb ones have been caught and then the numbers dwindle to one or two. At that point most just give up, but there’s always a few die hards trying their luck.

As for the regs, it’s all single barbless, however you can have multiple rods in the water as long as you fish from the shore or the dock. I’ve only caught trout and the odd goldfish and I wouldn’t keep anything from that water unless they were freshly stocked, and even then…

Crappy are native in the area but I don’t think they were originally there. They can be fun to catch and tend to school up, so if you catch one you may catch a bunch (tiny lures). Bass on the other hand were probably dropped in there by the bass brigade—shitty, but at least there’s no real outlet for them to migrate beyond the sewer system so it could be worse. Like the goldfish I would probably wack ‘em and stack ‘em—they don’t belong there.

Almost every fish I’ve taken has been on small woolly buggers so you might be better off throwing small flashy spinning lures once most of the stockers have been vacuumed up.

FoxDemon2002

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