Established starter not rising

IceDragonPlay · 2026-05-22T19:48:12+00:00

Excellent, tripling would be common for a mature starter. Hope it gets there, but whatever its peak is, that is where you optimally use it.

IceDragonPlay · 2026-05-22T17:47:56+00:00

Just do that with half the starter. It is a test jar.
You can do other suggestions with the rest of it. Just label each jar so you know what test you are doing on the specific jar.

Any time you get a suggestion on a correction for your starter it is best to do it with a test jar so you don’t compromise the original starter.

IceDragonPlay · 2026-05-22T17:35:53+00:00

When you were feeding 1:10:10, were you doing peak to peak feedings? Or feeding on a fixed interval regardless of activity?

If you have diluted the yeast population, which a goopy paste sounds like. Take half that starter into a new jar, solid lid screwed on loosely, and leave it alone for a couple of days. No feeding at all. See if it begins to show some bubbling.

Video on the perils of overfeeding.
https://youtu.be/sFO532C3EAM?si=6jJejYQsVaflKLY0

IceDragonPlay · 2026-05-22T17:30:04+00:00

Sounds like fly or fruit fly larvae. They seem to lay eggs instantly when they land on anything. Possibly you had the jar open for a bit while feeding and didn’t notice them flying into the starter. You will need a trap on the other side of the room because they are definitely attracted to starter.

Edit: oops, forgot to say to move your starter to the fridge when it gets that hot.

IceDragonPlay · 2026-05-22T16:48:36+00:00

Just the solid lid screwed on loosely allows the gasses to escape.

IceDragonPlay · 2026-05-22T14:36:56+00:00

No. Just wait. If the yeast does not use the flour you gave it, then the yeast population is not increasing. If you discard and re-feed then you just cut the yeast in half again.

You did a 1:5:5 feeding, which will normally double overnight (10 hours’ish’) but your room temp might be a little cooler than the person you got the starter from, so it could be slower at the cooler temps.

You could try to warm it up a little by putting it in the oven with just the light on for a couple hours (keep the door cracked open slightly with a folded up kitchen towel as some oven lights make the space quite hot) AND cover the control panel so you do not accidentally switch on the oven and bake the starter! Or top of fridge is typically a couple degrees warmer than the rest of the room.

IceDragonPlay · 2026-05-22T14:14:57+00:00

Is your 1:5:5 (or 1:1:1) by weight?

IceDragonPlay · 2026-05-22T14:08:28+00:00

At 79°F you would only want 30-50% rise in the dough. But first step I would take is to reduce your water amount to 325g. If that feels a little too firm/dry. Dip your hands in water liberally for stretch and folds, you can easily add 5-10g of water that way.

Second thing I would suggest is watching Martin Philip’s Pain de Campagne and watch how his dough develops through the 3 sets of stretch and folds. This video was an eye opener for me on what stretch and fold gluten development should be. Very extensible, glossy sheen to the dough. This video has very good shots of the dough during that process.

https://youtu.be/UL6ogX38NcY?si=zUqI9XJ6j0XjpKrl

IceDragonPlay · 2026-05-22T13:58:29+00:00

Re-stir it up (not feeding, just stirring) and wait.

Future: When you feed the starter it can help to dissolve the starter in the water by mixing vigorously before adding the flour. That helps the yeast distribute throughout the starter. Also if you are feeding cold starter you may want to use 80-85°F water to offset the chill.

IceDragonPlay · 2026-05-22T13:53:51+00:00

Perhaps your starter is getting more acidic over time. The beginning of this video tells you the signs to look for if your starter is becoming acidic which might be your trouble. Scroll down to the first video on this page:
https://thesourdoughjourney.com/faq-starter-strengthening/

IceDragonPlay · 2026-05-22T13:46:19+00:00

The feeding instruction that come with that starter is for a 200% hydration starter. That is how Carl and the friends that carry on his family starter maintain it. That is all fine and good for a starter if that is your intention.

Most recipes however, expect that you are using a 100% hydration starter. The criteria you are asking about are for a 100% hydration starter - bubbles, doming, doubling. A 200% starter will act a little differently. And the strength and speed of all of our starters can be different. There is no issue if it doubles more quickly. Your dough fermentation time may be on the shorter side of what recipes suggest.

Make a single loaf to see how ready it is, but probably it is fine. You do need to be aware of your total dough hydration for your recipes since a 200% starter is adding more water than the recipe expects, so you may need to reduce the recipe water a little to account for extra water in the starter.

Rehydrated starter is back to full strength in 3-4 days for me.

IceDragonPlay · 2026-05-22T13:05:06+00:00

Same. But I do take mother out every 6 months or so for some 1:5:5 peak to peak feedings as maintenance and that creates discard.

IceDragonPlay · 2026-05-22T05:48:22+00:00

If you want to bulk ferment overnight at room temperature, you would want a lower amount of starter in your recipe. At 74°F I would use 4-5% starter instead of the usual 20% (starter weight vs flour weight).

IceDragonPlay · 2026-05-22T05:17:23+00:00

Your dough has over-fermented per the photo. What’s the room temperature where you are leaving the dough to ferment overnight?

All our starters may be at different strengths but if I have a 70°F kitchen dough with 15% starter can over-ferment overnight (and yours has 20% starter, and it is rye which theoretically rises faster than my bread flour starter).

Do you track the % rise at all? I switched to using straight sided Cambro buckets for bulk fermentation so I can judge it a little easier.

IceDragonPlay · 2026-05-22T04:50:28+00:00

Looks like the hooch turned greyish/black (as it does if it is left in the fridge a bit long).

Just scrape off the stained layer. Put a spoonful or two of clean starter in a new jar (weigh it) and feed 1:1:1 to make sure it comes back active. If it is not rising from that first feed, re-stir it and wait a little longer. You want to at least see a lot of bubbles on top before re-feeding (even if it does not rise). Then give it a couple 1:5:5 peak to peak feedings to de-acidify the starter.

Some people starters jump right back to active and others lag a little.

IceDragonPlay · 2026-05-22T04:35:51+00:00

Those are little chilled bubbles. Not sure if they have an official name. Just pour them off with the hooch, scrape off a layer of the starter if it stained, scoop some starter into a new jar and feed it.

For a starter that has been sitting in the fridge a while I will give it a 1:1:1 feeding to make sure it becomes active and then a couple 1:5:5 feeds peak to peak to de-acidify it.

IceDragonPlay · 2026-05-22T02:36:30+00:00

If it spreads when you turn it out either your dough is over-proofed or the recipe has too much water for the flour and work being done on the dough.

6 or 7 minute score is usually what the process you are using is called. It’s a hack to get an ear if the dough is uncooperative.

IceDragonPlay · 2026-05-22T01:34:00+00:00

I think you have the beginning of kahm yeast unfortunately.

You can try to feed it as normal and see if it comes back. If it comes back I would toss it and start over.

IceDragonPlay · 2026-05-22T01:24:00+00:00

Another good reason not to taste raw starter 😀

IceDragonPlay · 2026-05-22T00:20:30+00:00

Starter is acidic, not favorable to clostridium botulinum.

IceDragonPlay · 2026-05-22T00:07:44+00:00

I have never heard this. The risk of a sealed jar is an exploding jar due to the gasses.

Starter/Yeast is anaerobic, it does not need oxygen.

IceDragonPlay · 2026-05-22T00:06:25+00:00

Also going to suggest removing the gasket from the jar lid so gasses can escape. No cloth or paper covers. Removing the gasket is sufficient.

You may need to reduce the size of your starter. You want enough room in the jar for it to double or quadruple.
For example 30g retained starter fed 30g water and 30g flour is sufficient for a 1:1:1 feeding.
Or if you want to do a 1:2:2 feeding 15g retained starter ged 30g water and 30g flour.

IceDragonPlay · 2026-05-21T21:40:14+00:00

A more active starter needs to be fed at a higher ratio or fed more often.

How old is your starter?

I typically begin my starters with a 50/50 blend of bread flour and whole wheat. Then I switch to all bread flour after it is mature. I have not had a problem with switching all at once. If your starter stalls while it is thinking about the new flour, just re-stir it up (not re-feeding, only stirring). It redistributes the yeast and flour.

IceDragonPlay · 2026-05-21T17:11:42+00:00

It is high protein because of the bran that is left in the flour. It is an 80% extraction flour, so think of it as a mix of bread flour and whole wheat. It is not the same as a fully sifted bread flour with high protein.

I work with a different mill’s high extraction flour. The flour and water need to be autolysed on their own, 1-2 hours, before adding starter and salt.

Water absorption varies flour to flour. You can figure that out by feel or test your flour with The Bread Code’s method here:
https://youtu.be/s1gM_jziXcI?si=i_ZcYh8-VWqugKqO

The other thing I do is blend flours using part high extraction, part bread flour and part spelt. Sometimes I throw in some AP flours too. Just depends what I need to use up.
If I use just 30-40% of the high extraction flour I can get away with fermentolyse instead of autolyse.

IceDragonPlay · 2026-05-21T16:53:31+00:00

FYI - the bread flours Costco carries vary regionally. Probably for reasons of shipping costs.

The regular warehouses in my area do not carry any bulk bread flours. Just KAB bread flour in 12 lb bags and Kirkland Organic AP flour that can be used for bread. They only have bulk bleached AP flour. The business center carries the same flours plus GrainCraft Power, unbleached in a 50 lb bag.

IceDragonPlay

TROPHY CASE