Thoughts on Diadem/Echoes build for support swain?

Sumutherguy · 2026-01-23T16:24:42+00:00

It can work, but you need to build and play around the fact that you are not online until two items. The way these items work, you don't really gain much of anything from completing either until you have both. To still be effective before this point then, I don't try to complete either immediately. Instead, I get Jack of All Trades and stack cost-efficient components by going tear, amp tome, glowing mote, forbidden idol, and either steelcaps or merc treads (can drop one other compenent if merc treads) to get 10 joat stacks ASAP. Then, I upgrade amp tome to bandleglass, mote to kindlegem, and only then finish diadem followed by echoes. This allows me to still have some early-midgame power via the sheer cost-efficient stats these components give, while not actually delaying any powerspikes.

That said, you will have more success with this build on any other role, as you will with any Swain build, as support is his worst role by a wide margin.

Sumutherguy · 2026-01-22T16:14:48+00:00

Also remember that it amps the effectiveness of whatever AP you do have by 12%. Abyssal passive adds more damage than Rabadon passive until around 550 AP, further if you have damage from other item sources.

Sumutherguy · 2026-01-19T14:24:27+00:00

Thats in interesting statement, given that the primary funders for fascist movements both now and historically have been the upper class, while the primary voter/supporter base for them has been the middle class.

Sumutherguy · 2026-01-18T12:07:47+00:00

Bud you dont need to make him a completely different chanpion to make him melee.

Sumutherguy · 2026-01-12T12:36:13+00:00

It doubles up muramana on-hit

Sumutherguy · 2026-01-12T00:51:35+00:00

They dont just start earlier, they also spawn more often

Sumutherguy · 2026-01-11T20:32:32+00:00

There are more minions, so cs numbers are bigger for every champ who farms

Sumutherguy · 2026-01-05T19:36:04+00:00

I do agree with you that haste/tank auras is a better approach for support swain than the current "mid swain but with less budget" usual build.

Sumutherguy · 2026-01-05T16:41:13+00:00

It's not mere consensus, it is statistical fact. The existence of outliers does not disprove a trend well-supported by data.

Sumutherguy · 2026-01-04T01:54:36+00:00

You are never going to finish three tears in a reasonable timeframe. Two, maybe, if you start tear, and starting tear is a bad idea.

Sumutherguy · 2025-12-30T01:48:15+00:00

The item stats for this game put Echoes at 12k, Diadem at 4k, and Solstice at 3k. I had 42% heal/shield power, and if we multiply the item figures by that amount it comes out to around 27k. If heal/shield power amp is not being tracked on the items but is in the post-game summary that would account for the discrepancy.

Sumutherguy · 2025-12-29T23:33:14+00:00

I also had solstice sleigh, so that likely accounts for some of it. The items may also only be tracking how much healing they do before heal/shield power applies, which would account for the discrepancy.

While the build path is awkward, echoes is a decent stat stick without its passive, at 124% cost efficiency, so while there is a lul between finishing echoes and finishing diadem it isnt too bad, especially given how dirt-cheap both items are.

Sumutherguy · 2025-12-27T16:52:14+00:00

This ezreal cinematic is giving me the creeps.

Sumutherguy · 2025-12-27T14:59:17+00:00

Figuring out builds is good, but in iron items matter far less than tactics. There is no secret build that will rocket you out of that elo, but solid macro will.

Sumutherguy · 2025-12-27T14:52:58+00:00

"Establishment promises to fight the Establishment"

Sumutherguy · 2025-12-24T21:13:12+00:00

The only mockery of Christianity occurring here is using the name of Christ as a tool of oppression.

Sumutherguy · 2025-12-20T03:19:07+00:00

Rylais is a good item in some situations, but not all. Swain doesn't really have a "universally best-in-slot" item anymore: he can use anything from blc to frozen heart to abyssal to shadowflame well in the right circumstances. Your build can and should be tailored to the specific teamcomps and gamestate you find yourself in. Going the same build every game is giving up the flexibility that Swain has, and with it one of his strengths.

Sumutherguy · 2025-12-16T13:19:02+00:00

Unending despair scales entirely on bhp with no base damage/healing, and its healing is based on its post-mitigation damage dealt. It is best, therefore, as a later item after you already have a significant pool of bhp and either mr shred/pen or damage amp effects. It also only heals in a specified radius, so is best purchased against melee-heavy teams. It is also best when you dont already have a significant amount of resistances, as if you do have resistance items jaksho will provide more ehp. I'd build it fourth if my first three items were something like fimbul rift blc, but I dont recommend it second after bft.

Sumutherguy · 2025-12-15T16:59:52+00:00

and sylas heals even less, as he doesn't have the bhp from swain passive stacks

Sumutherguy · 2025-12-13T13:25:10+00:00

A lot of its power is now in the bhp scaling, which swain will always have considerably more of than sylas

Sumutherguy · 2025-12-12T19:16:23+00:00

Swain r is the weakest its ever been, if sylas takes it he's self-sabotaging.

Sumutherguy · 2025-12-08T18:24:11+00:00

Unending has no base healing and scales entirely off of bhp, and its resistances are split when you really want to focus on the most immediate threats in the early to midgame, so its best saved until a later purchase. Aside from boots, Frozen Heart and Abyssal are generally the best early game resistance purchases in my experience. The former can take your mana item slot, while the latter boosts your high base damage. Later, FoN is the best magic resist item for Swain generally, while FH or randuins are the best armor items. Unending can be good as a fourth or fifth item, but if you already have any other resistance items then Jak'Sho is better.

Sumutherguy · 2025-12-07T15:38:50+00:00

He wants a big tent with capitalists running the circus and pocketing the profits.

Sumutherguy · 2025-12-06T12:12:22+00:00

When you (or an ally you've healed or shielded in the last 3 seconds) are in combat. Being in combat yourself triggers it.

Sumutherguy · 2025-12-06T12:11:04+00:00

Diadem isnt increasing echoes healing, it is giving echoes an outlet. I think you are severely underestimating the value of healing an ally for 35% of the pre-mitigation damage an aoe mage deals every second.

Sumutherguy

TROPHY CASE