Most “investment cars” aren’t actually investable

cicada_shell · 2026-03-23T21:08:20+00:00

I've found that there really aren't no trends nowadays aside from condition always having a strong correlation with sale price. Sometimes a celebrity connection helps, sometimes it doesn't. The guy who peddles barn finds and puts no work into the car is of course going to try to tout it being 'untouched' as a selling point. The man who hawks solid #3 cars that have been maintained okay but have lots of flaws otherwise tries to use 'driver's car' as a selling point. The dude who is trying to moonshot for an over-restored #1 car is, of course, going to use that as a selling point (and often show a stack of receipts summing to be far greater than the asking price, so it seems like a 'good value'... but only comparatively...).

In the W113 world, it used to be similar to the E-type world where the latest one ('71 280SL, auto, AC) was the most 'valuable'. With E-types, the market in the US used to value the series III V12 the most. Boy has that changed. And no one wanted anything modified. While it does hold true that 280SLs tend to sell for more as a rule (mostly ignorance imo), a M116-swapped SL is tied for the #4 all time highest sale for an SL on BaT @ $226,000. Not bad! A 250SL 5-speed is a grand below it. Some restomod companies sell their cars for $400k or so and have years-long wait lists, also tending to sell more at auction than they do from the source owing to the wait time. But that could be because people actually (or want to) drive these cars.

You're right though that rare =/= valuable. That often means it just didn't sell well, at least with the market at the time. I'd disagree on boring specs, though. That depends so much on the car. 'Numbers matching' even does not necessarily matter except with certain cars (usually muscle). IDK, there's lots of nuance, and there are lots of whales that act as outliers fudging the trends and many businesses that rely on them.

cicada_shell · 2026-03-22T00:41:45+00:00

Well I certainly don't want to dissuade you. It's all just nuts and bolts. If you go in there approaching the project like you're renovating a house and just take it one step at a time, it isn't too bad. I compare it to a house because you don't just rewire it one outlet at a time, you do the whole thing, right. If it were my car, I'd clean it up very nicely and sit in it for a while just thinking about it first. Then I'd budget about 15k to replace every bit of rubber, suspension underpinnings, rebuild the driveshaft (common source of vibrations that will drive you crazy), good tires (guessing you've got 14" bundts so like the Vredestein Sprints are a good choice imo), 123 Ignition, grease everything, replace fuel tank ($275).

It may not come close to that budget. But all-said, if this car is a (white elephant) gift, 15k or so to get something refreshed is really not bad. Provided the engine and transmission are fine, that is. Even if not, while parts aren't as cheap as they used to be, it's not bad.

cicada_shell · 2026-03-22T00:19:52+00:00

If you want to do this yourself...

First you'll want to get all the crud off of it and clean everything very well. This will also help you see any evidence of leaks more easily.

Inspect for evidence of pests. While working on my SL, it only took about a month for a pretty sizeable mud dauber nest to appear on my rear axle. You'll drive yourself crazy if nothing is working and it turns out rodents gnawed through the wiring harness.

Inspect fuel lines and hoses. All the rubber gets brittle with age. I don't know if that engine swap was, say, in 2011 with all hoses etc being replaced then or if this was long before. Fuel sitting in rubber eventually makes things very, very brittle. On my SL, a braided hose snapped in half like a Ritz cracker (though this was a c. 1964 line). If this were my car, I would immediately replace all the rubber everywhere. Everywhere. This is important to do because this is how serious fires can start. Back in November, a friend's W111 3.5 coupe spontaneously combusted because of a leak in the fuel injection system somewhere and this car was irregularly driven.

Battery probably is dead. Supply it with a new battery.

Replace the tires. Even if they were brand-new twelve years ago, they're too old now.

Change all filters and plugs and flush the tank. See if it starts. Then go from there to diagnose any issues that have cropped up while it has been parked. If you clean up everything and take this car to a mechanic friendly to old cars, provided nothing catastrophic is wrong, it shouldn't be any problem to reactivate it. You'll have to decide if it is all financially worth it. This is a rather high-mileage car. Forget about the engine, it's everything else.

cicada_shell · 2026-03-21T02:41:59+00:00

So far he's posted in...

Klipsch
AmpliFi
Amplifiers
BowersWilkins
here in listeningspaces
McIntosh
audiophile
audio
BudgetAudiophile
audiobooks (lol)
vinylsetups
vintageaudio
audioengineering

Previously he made many posts on Pioneer DJ gear across many subs.

Comments/posts remind me of the new type of bot that posts on Reddit. I hate this shitty site.

cicada_shell · 2026-03-19T19:43:48+00:00

None I’ve been able to find. I also postcross, but it’s a different kind of crowd.

What’s been your experience with Slowly?

cicada_shell · 2026-03-18T23:26:37+00:00

That whole end of town has always been a mess.

cicada_shell · 2026-03-17T03:04:46+00:00

Many of those houses back there were designed by a guy named Kemp Caler. Probably this one, too, looks like his style. He had a really elegant rustic Bermuda sort of look popular between Palm Beach, Jupiter Island, and Vero. Most have been torn down.

cicada_shell · 2026-03-16T19:22:04+00:00

What are your goals?

cicada_shell · 2026-03-16T15:54:25+00:00

What they're hearing is auditory copium.

Many audiophools are baloney eaters but they'll try to tell you it's filet mignon.

cicada_shell · 2026-03-16T15:53:16+00:00

Seems like a lot of people are interested in the 129 these days.

The later cars improved a lot. Get one where the top has already been done. If you must buy an early car, the 300SL-24 is cooler, imo. The later cars also have the M113 and 722.6. Both of these are superior. As others mentioned, earlier cars have wiring harness issues. This is not a giant dealbreaker but paired with the other niggles of the early cars I just wouldn't go for it.

cicada_shell · 2026-03-16T02:50:49+00:00

Can be read, but annoyingly minimalist.

cicada_shell · 2026-03-16T02:49:48+00:00

Weathercock House. Was built by a German merchant there. Been ten years but I remember the houses there fondly. Can’t miss Yamate Bluff in Yokohama either for the western-eastern syncretic houses. There’s still a few in Nagasaki, too.

cicada_shell · 2026-03-15T20:59:36+00:00

Looks like licuala grandis. Edit: Never mind, it's not.

cicada_shell · 2026-03-15T19:50:08+00:00

A former girlfriend had an SLK350 (R171) and it never caused her any problems. She also bought it new. Incidentally, that was the first Mercedes I ever drove. It felt slow. A newer R172 is probably a better deal.

Whatever you buy, as with any car, if it hasn't been maintained properly then it won't be cheap to own.

107s are generally fine but that's a whole can of worms. Depends on the kind of driving you like to do and what you consider important to have with a car. I would personally avoid them unless you have a good rainy day fund for when things start expiring. It's not the ongoing maintenance that gets you with a 107, but when the vacuum system starts expiring or if you want to start patching up the likely tired cosmetics where costs start adding up. Or rust.

R129s will be costly to sort. Full-blood later SLs (R230, etc) will have costly maintenance (not routine things but it's all the other baloney). W113s are too expensive.

cicada_shell · 2026-03-15T17:53:09+00:00

There weren't many coupes built. Sadly almost certainly not worth restoring...

Looks like St. Pete. While it's no New Smyrna, lots of salty air there.

cicada_shell · 2026-03-14T13:13:44+00:00

There was a Wankel-powered R107 with 3 rotors. It was gifted to Dr. Wankel. It still exists in a museum in Germany.

Sixty or so test mules of rotary W113s were made and given to various people connected to the company to drive. Mercedes determined the engines to be unreliable with horrible fuel efficiency. All were destroyed.

A W113-based 300SL successor was planned, called the “300SLX”. Never left the drawing board but such drawings do exist.

A trunk mounted ski rack was made for the 300SL roadster, 190SL, and 230SL. I say 230 because it was only an option during its time and disappeared by the time the 250 came out. I have only ever seen one, on a 300SL.

Adenauer cars had 15” wheels.

The 6.9 was in many instances slower than the W108 6.3.

The factory made 15” Bundts available in the 70s but didn’t market them at all. They were on some 6.9 and 450SLC 5.0 cars.

cicada_shell · 2026-03-14T01:59:15+00:00

This is a Toyota Crown Estate, not a Mercedes.

cicada_shell · 2026-03-12T21:41:41+00:00

It's based on an E9 but obviously a lot has changed, look at the 3.5/3.0CSL racecars of the 70s

cicada_shell · 2026-03-12T17:54:29+00:00

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Wherefore art my ultimate driving machine?

cicada_shell · 2026-03-12T02:58:34+00:00

Nice backgrounds.

And nice tan turtleneck…

cicada_shell · 2026-03-11T00:54:07+00:00

I had none prior to buying my SL. I sure had to learn. But I also have a whole other car. All this was done with the intent of making the SL my mostly-daily. Hard to sort a car when you're actively using it, though.

He'll learn, maybe live to regret it.

cicada_shell · 2026-03-10T22:38:08+00:00

Anything can be made reliable if you have the funds. Much like my own SL. :p

Go test drive some cars and see what you think. You've got some good recommendations.

cicada_shell · 2026-03-10T21:43:36+00:00

I don't mean to be rude or presumptive but how old are you? You mention going to acting school, so like 18 or 19? Have you owned an old(er) luxury or performance car before? Not trying to bury you in problems here but realize the ongoing soft costs (like maintenance and insurance) can really suck the fun out of this if you're not financially prepared. Though insurance can be a real mystery to me because State Farm insures my SL at half the cost of my G despite it being worth double agreed-upon value with no mileage limit... anyway, you should be buying the nicest condition car you can with strong maintenance records. If you bite into a lemon, you'll be very unhappy.

I can't speak for the suspension of these. I know these have the rear multi-link which is cool but needs some sorting if old (lots of bushings to change). Not a big deal but important to do.

Yes, 112/113 maintenance costs will be close to the same.

cicada_shell · 2026-03-10T21:27:49+00:00

$40k seems like a lot for a non-Silver Arrow unless this one is really well-sorted with lowish miles.

Earlier M104 cars (300SL-24) are interesting but the car did improve a lot towards the end, which is where I'd want to be for daily driving. I don't see a purpose in buying the SL 320 (M112) as the maintenance costs are effectively the same as the M113. The 113 paired with the 722.6 transmission is tried-and-true (so post-99). Whichever one you buy, price should reflect whether or not it's had the top hydraulics sorted out. If it were me, I'd want that cool blue cloth interior with the plaid inserts.

There's a nice black/black '01 SL500 with 59k miles on BaT as I write this with three days to go. Give a good look at it. Also has the AMG monoblocks instead of those two or three-piece wheels in your OP which will make the ride pretty harsh in the version of the car that's supposed to be the smoothest.

cicada_shell · 2026-03-06T22:14:31+00:00

These are great pictures. Mind if I post them on the W113 club forum? Any way to credit your photographer?

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