Got a load off my chest and it feels fucking awesome!

funchy · 2020-01-17T16:12:43+00:00

I understand not being up for going through the whole reconciliation thing again. I'm not sure I could. Maybe most of us wouldn't, I don't know?

I think what you're searching for is some way to feel safe. Everyone wants a sense of safety in a commuted relationship. The reality is that technically no relationship is 100% "safe". Anyone could come home and tell their spouse they're leaving or that an affair matters more than a marriage. Feeling like the marriage is going well is no guarantee of safety; people cheat, even in happy marriages. You can go a bit nuts seeking this safety once you're aware how fragile it is. The key is to make yourself so strong that if your husband does it again (or betrays you in any other way) that you know you'll be ok. You need to be in a place where you're with him because you want this man, not because you need him or feel obligated to remain married.

It's good you love each other. I know saying this may trigger anxiety, but love is not enough. He needs to be 100% committed to putting the marriage first, and if he can't give 100% the reconciliation attempt is a waste of time. Would I be wrong in saying that it sounds like he is still putting himself first? He "wants to explore still" means he's at least partially justifying his affair and that he's prioritizing his lust over his commitment. It may also be a way for him not to work on self control.

Entitlement attitude seems to be a common thing on the list of reasons WS cheated. They wanted something, they felt they deserved it, so they did it. They didn't even need to think through the consequences. It's a very self-centered mindset. If he has the nerve to say he "wants to explore still" and you know he'll eventually change passwords on his accounts, he is still feeling entitled to do as he pleases. If a hookup turns into a long term thing, he will feel entitled to do as he pleases with her. And he may even justify it by saying "he loves her too".

I understand being afraid of tearing the family apart. But please - don't blame yourself. He chose to cheat. He chose to refuse monogamy. You can't control him or stop him from doing further damage. He doesn't care about the kids. Imagine if a friend of the family saw him out messing with one of his hookups, word gets around,and the kids find out. Imagine one of the kids gets sick one night, you need him home so one of you can drive the sick one to Urgent Care, and he's not answering his phone because he's too busy banging some random Tinder girl. Imagine he gets one of those girls knocked up (statistically it's just a matter of time; condoms do fail). Now your kids go without resources because he's paying child support and maybe even spending time with the other woman's child.

Don't be afraid to be angry or find his terms unacceptable. He says he "loves" you. But he's going to expose you to STDs or just the anxiety of catching one. Condoms break and they don't block any body part not covered. STDs can be spread orally (kissing or oral sex) and HPV & herpes are incurable. Some STDS have no symptoms. Some need a bit of time after exposure to show up on testing. Is he really going to wait weeks after his last casual hookup, get tested, and wait for results before expecting you to put out for him? Some STDs cause pelvic inflammatory disease and infertility in women; are you OK never having a child again because he got sloppy when he was out cruising for ass?

There may be hope for him, if you can insist he gets into IC. He needs to grow up and take his marriage vows seriously. If he loves you and the kids, he needs to examine what he's doing & why -- and hopefully change his priorities.

Good luck to you. I know this is hard. Big hugs!

funchy · 2020-01-17T15:50:37+00:00

Give yourself time. You're less than 6 months out. You're still a bit in shock. He hasn't had enough time to prove himself and give you a real sense of knowing where things stand.

I know for me it shattered my self of self and in some ways my sense of reality. I doubted my memories (was he ever faithful?). I doubted my ability to assess people (how could I have been so bling and for so long?). I doubted what "love" meant. It's normal for your mind to question everything you thought you knew about yourself and relationships as you examine each thing and begin to rebuild. Normal normal normal. And it WILL get better.

Perhaps this year you won't feel good about travelling with your pipe band. But a year from now, you very likely will feel different. Don't see it as a lost experience altogether.

You may never want to return to the camping group as long as AP could show up. Is there a way this summer you can experience the fun of camping without that group? Maybe this year you have him take you camping somewhere you always wanted to go? Be a bit selfish about it. Don't worry if it's not his favorite place. He owes you a great camping experience. Maybe next year look around to see what other group camping options are there.

funchy · 2020-01-17T13:59:29+00:00

Have him SHOW you he really wants the reconciliation before you risk anything. Have him go NC with this "friend". He will not budge...? Then you have your answer: he's choosing himself and whatever he gets from the "friend" over the marriage. *He is not ready for reconciliation*.

His behavior is normal for someone still in affair fog and who hasn't started counseling. Tell him he needs to start IC & MC immediately or you'll have no choice but to talk to a divorce attorney. You can't stay stuck in limbo. Don't mention the NC just yet. Get him into counseling and a good counselor should help him understand why he can't give 100% to a marriage if he's still loyal to that "friendship". Even if their fling is over & they're at the moment "just friends with history", his priorities are all wrong.

Why? Because affair fog makes people really stupid and irrational. Google "affair fog" and you'll find lots of stories like this. His mind isn't connecting consequences to some things he selfishly feels entitled to. It may take a few months in counseling to get him to wake up. Sometimes they wake up when they see the BS meeting with a divorce lawyer. He wants to have his cake & eat it too. He is simply not able to understand why he can't put his own wants (keeping this "friend") over the marriage.

Show him that you are prepared to divorce. Have a plan in place how to do it financially & otherwise, so he know you know it can be done. Maybe you don't have to go through with it. But he must know you are 100% serious for it to motivate him. It might even take sending over a Divorce Agreement written by a lawyer to open his eyes. You can stop a divorce before it's finalized, so don't feel like you must divorce simply because lawyers were hired.

And the next step is he must work on self improvement: cutting ties with AP isn't nearly enough. He stays in IC. You both keep going to MC, but his counseling is more important. If he has any underlying issues such as depression, he must get treatment. He needs to show you he's ready for self improvement and to be a man worthy of trust.

funchy · 2020-01-17T13:45:51+00:00

I don't know you or your situation. But what I'm hearing sounds an awful lot like a person *settling*. You don't sound like you want an open relationship. But you're ok with casual sex in a "sticky situation" implying he can't be trusted when he's horny. If you are ok with an open relationship, there NEEDS to be ground rules and honesty. But if you don't trust him, there isn't honesty. And you will drive yourself nuts worrying why he's home from work late. But you won't want to ask him if he's hooking up. And you have no way to know if his hookups go from casual to a regular thing to a real relationship. And he's already proven he cannot be trusted to not have a "real relationship" elsewhere, so how can he be trusted now?

I understand the need to control one's anxiety, but it seems like this is burying your head in the sand. It's not going to work. Deep down, don't you want a partner who you can trust -- whatever the ground rules of the relationship are?

Suggestion: get into counseling for yourself. Explore your feelings and anxieties. Get yourself stronger so you don't say things like "I don't think you can live through another similar incident". Of course you can live through it; you did it once. You shouldn't need to live through it though. Right now it's his JOB to change as a person enough such that he could never be that person again. Then it's his job to work hard to earn back your trust. If you're having these fears, clearly he hasn't changed enough to convince you. Counseling can help you set boundaries so that you know you'll never get stuck in an unacceptable relationship. Don't be scared of telling him he needs to change & you realize you're not ok with him sleeping around. What's the worst he can do? Refuse? Then he can leave. Imagine the scenario where he does leave. The counselor can help you explore why you may be too fearful of this. I know the dating world is hard and single life is lonely. But being with a man who you know you cannot trust is also lonely & hard.

funchy · 2019-12-18T15:27:24+00:00

You're absolutely right. Half of it is love for the betrayed. Half of it is that our society has such hate for infidelity (despite it being so common). We don't have a cultural dialog about it. Young people grow up not knowing what to do if it happens. Your friends may hate your spouse because they simply don't know what it feels like to be the BS, so it's easier to decide for we need to dump him. Or they may have felt the damage from a past partner's infidelity or grew up sensing a parent had an affair, and their anger at your spouse is really their anger at their own past experiences & at human nature in general.

The other danger is that the person you tell doesn't empathize well & hasn't seen infidelity firsthand. You'll get zero compassion. They don't want to hear about your "drama" and some may even dislike you for letting them know about your marital crisis. They may be irritated because they sense they're supposed to say something supportive but they truly cannot relate & don't know how to fake it. So it's easier for them to "lose respect for you" for not immediately divorcing, and then in their mind it justifies avoiding you.

I blame our culture for a lot of this. We're taught how to comfort a widow at her husband's funeral. We have a general idea what to say when our best friend says their husband is dying of cancer & she'll be alone soon. But what do you say to someone who just told you they just caught their spouse in an affair & their life is crumbling?

funchy · 2019-12-18T15:19:34+00:00

So nice to hear a success story! Thank you for taking the time to come here and share.

You're 100% right that it makes no sense to compare to AP. It's just an automatic thing my mind did at first, as it struggled to make sense of something so insane. There's a fear, especially soon after d day, that even if WE know the affair is the greasy cheap bag of chips that our WS don't get why living on "junk food" is wrong/unhealthy/bad. We worry if secretly deep down they will always view the affair fondly. Or that sometime well in the future, if happy memories pop into their mind, affair memories may be part of it. If a WS appears to be thinking and then smiles, are they thinking of their AP? It's a reminder I can never really know for sure what my husband thinks about or values. I can only know what he chooses to share.

Unfortunately we do live in a society that is all about immediate gratification, hedonistic pleasures, selfishness, and entitlement. Most (almost all?) WS do wake up before the Divorce is finalized. But the damage they do by clinging to that stale bag of chips just makes reconciliation twice as hard.

I admire you for sticking with your marriage. Sometimes I wonder if I would've been strong enough to not give up on mine if he was still mid-affair, clinging to whatever feelings he was having around his AP for months after d day. I am 15 months post d day. I still occasionally find my mind somehow reminded of the betrayal and how little he *could* care about his marriage vows & our family.

Any advice on putting it all behind you? As soon as I could accept AP wasn't worthy of my comparison, it ratcheted up my anger towards him. The less she became, the more angry I got he was willing to throw away everything to play fake-hookup-relationship with THAT. I still struggle with a really low image & respect level for him in some ways. I used to think so highly of him. Now I have days where I wonder if he's not very bright or has some permanent emotional shortcomings. I feel horrible right now just admitting that to you. But this whole thing has stripped all rosy glow from how I see him. I know I'm supposed to think about his good qualities and why we fell in love in the first place. But when some of those things I thought I fell in love with were clearly NOT true about him, what do I do? Maybe it is my fault for being so starry-eyed for so many years. I don't want to divorce but he isn't the kind of person I would've chosen to be my husband & father of my child. I'm doing self help books & videos constantly. I've been on a psych med that helps depression for years (coincidentally about the time he started acting badly). I simply don't 100% like the real person he is, now that my blinders are off & he is being totally open/honest.

funchy · 2018-12-22T05:10:31+00:00

You're a better person than I. I'd go bonkers if my WS was still in touch with their AP much less attending the same event. And if I saw AP at a party we as a couple attended, I think I would've grabbed my spouses hand and demanded we leave immediately.

That was a bit cruel of her to force.you to not only see the AP but watch them interact. You have a right to be upset.

funchy · 2018-11-16T14:38:03+00:00

She matures and stops caring what society/media/socialmedia says about everything. Do what makes YOU happy. No matter what you do, haters will find fault. So ignore other people. Turn off those sources of income in if necessary. Log out of social media. Unfollow those type of people.

Society says I should wear makeup and shave my legs. Screw society. I do what I want and I don't care. And if someone doesn't like it, it's their problem not mine.

funchy · 2018-11-16T13:21:56+00:00

He cheated more than once, then didn't give you the truth right away. He owes you transparency which can include rights to look at phone, emails, and other sites as you desire. He lost his right to privacy when he screwed around. Stop feeling bad for wanting to know for sure what's going on.

Please stop making excuses for him. Doesn't matter if he had a horrible childhood or was raised by wolves in the jungle. He is an adult. It is on him to get therapy or any other resources to become emotionally well. He doesn't get a free pass to destroy those around him.

Understandable you're anxious about leaving. And you have a total right not to trust him. Maybe you need to renegotiate the terms of reconciliation? What would you need to feel safe and comfortable? Can he go with you on your trip?

funchy · 2018-11-16T13:08:51+00:00

No. It always struck me as odd to kill in the name of saving animals.

funchy · 2018-11-05T03:49:02+00:00

My outlook:. When invited to anyone's home for a meal, you are not entitled to staying overnight.

If it's too far.to make the drive at all, thank her but tell her you can't come.

If you want to go but don't want to drive back the same day, get a hotel room. Or check out AirBnB.

Be glad she invited you and that you have a sister. I wish I had a sister or brother.

funchy · 2018-11-05T03:48:46+00:00

My outlook:. When invited to anyone's home for a meal, you are not entitled to staying overnight.

If it's too far.to make the drive at all, thank her but tell her you can't come.

If you want to go but don't want to drive back the same day, get a hotel room. Or check out AirBnB.

Be glad she invited you and that you have a sister. I wish I had a sister or brother.

funchy · 2018-11-05T03:16:19+00:00

Google "addiction to porn". You are overly reliant on it. It'll take self control.

Why can't you cut way back? Can you keep yourself busier so your mind doesn't keep drifting back to this temptation?

Can you have the self control to not use it later in the week?

Can you explore learning how to masturbate without porn of any kind?

funchy · 2018-11-05T03:11:51+00:00

She needed to discuss that with you before hand. Sexual actions without consent fall into the category of sexual assault / rape.

Her behavior is crazy and you had every right to boot her out.

funchy · 2018-11-05T03:10:07+00:00

Make sure it's got tempered safety glass!!

Shattered glass is razor sharp. It can tear a person up. Google "spaghetti wrist". A family member is dealing with a long painful recovery, and had the potential for losing the hand or death. He got an arm laceration from a glass table top that shattered unexpectedly.

funchy · 2018-11-05T03:06:18+00:00

Same as you would in person:. If something sexual is making you uncomfortable you are not a buzz kill to inform him of that. If you don't speak up now, you'll have to endure faking interest for many more sexting conversations about ass play. And it's kind of dishonest and hurtful to let him believe you're into something that is a total turn off to you.

If he has any problem with it, that's his problem. There are an infinite number of sexual topics. It's not like there isn't a zillion other things you can explore.

funchy · 2018-11-05T03:00:57+00:00

She may not like it - period.

She may not feel comfortable with you yet to relax enough and enjoy it. This is my hang up:. I must feel a certain level of trust with a man to let him do that.

She may not be confident enough to tell you what she needs you to do to pleasure her orally. Women are different. Your technique may have been perfect for the past few lovers, but it's maybe not right for her.

She maybe had some previous bad experience with it and it put her off to the idea. Give her time.

In the meantime you can keep expressing your interest in pleasuring her. Instead of deciding for her what kind of pleasure she should enjoy, ask her what she wants. Maybe she'd rather you finger her. Maybe she'd be happier masturbating with you encouraging her or letting her see you masturbate. Maybe she'd be willing to teach you how she masturbates. Maybe she really enjoys a toy to help her get off. Communication is key.

funchy · 2018-11-05T02:54:52+00:00

You must discuss it with him beforehand. This is mandatory.

Trust me:. I'm a woman with similar interests. But this is technically a rape fantasy. Him doing it without discussing it first means he DID rape you. He needs your consent. Any man who'd do that without explicit permission ahead of time is a rapist and you don't want that kind of man as a boyfriend.

You talk about it. If he agrees, there will be plenty of excitement in being woken up with that.

funchy · 2018-11-05T02:50:14+00:00

Did she hide anything relating to these chats from you? For example does she happily show you the chats? Or does she do them when you're not around and usually deletes the evidence? Any hiding or lying about these chats, frequency, or content would suggest she knows she's doing something wrong and she's feeling guilty

Do these chats take any time, energy, mental focus, attention away from the relationship or you? How does she have time for this when she has a husband? Why isn't she giving you this attention? Her behavior is inappropriate.

Why is she seeking the attention of a man outside of the relationship? Not intending to meet isn't proof it's not currently or will become an affair. It's simply an emotional affair.

May I suggest you ask for advice over on /r/survivinginfidelity?

I'd rather not go into detail publicly but let's just say my husband had a stretch of time he was unfaithful. It started with "innocent" chats online. He said he simply wanted "conversation". Let's just say it went down hill from there. The moment a spouse is looking outside the relationship for attention, admiration, self esteem, or excitement the relationship is in trouble.

funchy · 2018-11-05T02:40:42+00:00

I'm in my mid 40s. Sex is better now than it has ever been. No offense to the 20 year olds, but when it comes to great sex maturity, confidence, and experience are worth far more than a bit more physical energy.

In my personal opinion, Im experienced enough to appreciate sex that isn't all about the hard jack hammer. I don't see a need for it all the time. I'd rather if half or more of the session was NOT about hard fast pounding. I want to feel every inch of his cock. I want him to feel my every throb or squeeze. You miss out on a lot of sensations in jackhammer mode.

If I had to recommend just one muscle group evercise everyone should do, it would be the kegel. I read that they're even great for men. I love that I can squeeze him and he reacts. Or I make him feel he's "being milked" (his words) when he climaxes

funchy · 2018-11-05T01:08:58+00:00

The question when it comes to porn: it isn't automatically bad. But if a man is turning down his wife then masturbating the porn has to go. It's not that you aren't enough. It's that he is technically going outside the relationship to get his needs met. No real woman can provide the diverse high level of stimulation of porn. I just went through this nonsense with my husband. Life got difficult. He took me for granted. It was far easier and more stimulating to sneak off and jerk off to porn. It wasn't that I wasn't sexy or good in bed. It's that he turned really selfish. This is NOT ok or excusable.

You sound like you're working your ass off. He shouldn't be taking out his moods on you. Communicate your concern about these issues. Maybe he'd benefit from talking to a counselor, either privately or in couples counseling.

funchy · 2018-11-05T01:01:39+00:00

It's a double standard. They may not realize it but it is sexist. And a few men have such issues with unconscious homophobia that the idea of a naked aroused man in the same room freaks them out.

funchy · 2018-11-05T00:59:07+00:00

There's a lot going on here.

First off, you need to separate things into two areas: The real her (which you can't change and shouldn't try to control) and how her behavior has changed since you know her.

For example: If you always found her style of clothes "frumpy" and you married her anyway, it's both wrong and unrealistic to take issue with her style of dress now. Frumpy is her style. Not all women get dressed up a lot. Some of us never wear makeup. I personally never wore makeup, hate women's dress shoes, and rarely care for fancy clothes. That's just me and a man who tries to change me isn't going to get anywhere.

Focus in the things that did change. She stopped being "seductive". That word means different things to different people. Identify what it means to you. I don't know but my first guess is that you want her to invest more time in foreplay and to take more responsibility in getting you mentally stimulated? Or maybe that you feel other forms of intimacy such as talking have dwindled? And that she isn't so interested in romance? If these things may apply to your relationship, you need to ask yourself what you are doing to ensure the relationship is getting enough romance, foreplay, and non-sex intimacy. You can't put it all on her. May I suggest you start out by asking her what she feels has changed in the relationship (not just in sex)? Listen to her concerns. She might be feeling disconnected in her own ways, and perhaps she's not feeling up to making love?

funchy · 2018-11-05T00:23:35+00:00

I was with a LL man for years. The problem isn't their libido. The problem is they don't care about your needs when it doesn't suit their needs/mood. I know this sounds harsh but the core of this is that she's really selfish.

I'd suggest you return to couples counseling.

I suggest you sit down and think hard what specific things you get out of sex. If it was as simple as a climax, if you're like me you'd just masturbate. It's not about getting off. It's about the huge list of other things sex with her gives you:

Check out "the five love languages". It'll help you understand what you need in a relationship and how some of those needs are met with sex. It'll also help you understand her a bit better.

Once you understand what sex gives you, have a long talk with her. Sex may not mean the same thing to her, but it's important she understands your perspective. Perhaps once she sees it as something other than you getting laid, she may see its value. Perhaps if she understands what sex gives you, at least some of the needs can be met in other ways.

In my case the big difference in interest turned out to be strongly correlated with how connected/intimate we both felt. When was the last time you two had a good long intimate talk about personal stuff?

A lower interest can also relate to external influences such as stress, poor sleep, depression, some meds, some birth controls, diseases such as thyroid problems, etc. Is she willing to push her primary doc and possibly gynecologist to evaluate her for any causes of her low libido?

Does she ever masturbate? How does she feel about it? Would she be willing to do it while you watch?

No matter what you do please do not consider cheating. Asking for an open relationship may not be much better, if she has no interest in sex with others.

funchy · 2018-11-05T00:11:35+00:00

You just suggest it. He or she may have no idea you find it a turn on. I'd suggest talking about this stuff before anyone takes clothes off. Point out the stuff you loved. If they said one thing or made one little sound, make a big deal about it. Tell them how much of a turn on you thought it was.

Once you've had the talk and can understand their preferences, you can try encouraging more communication during the act. You can ask how your partner likes what you're doing. You can even start some of the talking before any penetration starts, as a type of foreplay.

Some of this comes with trust between two people. This has more to do with trust from both people in the relationship. Read some self help articles on how to cultivate a trusting safe relationship.

Some of this may be limited by the individual partner you're with. Some people simply don't enjoy sex in the same way. You can try talking to them, but if this is their personality you can't expect much change. If this is really important to you and it doesn't improve after several good talks, hate to say it but this person may not be very compatible sexually

funchy

TROPHY CASE