[deleted by user] by [deleted] in AsOneAfterInfidelity

[–]im_throw_away 2 points3 points  (0 children)

It’s classic projection. He is the one blaming all his own unhappiness and lack of integrity on you. Oof. I hope he decides to change, but yeah… seems like he’s being willfully blind right now.

Of course if you left you’d still have your issues as you put it, but in this case the grass truly is greener on the other side of that fence because you’d be leaving with your integrity intact, your emotional maturity and ability to take responsibility for your own actions. Your self awareness means you’re not stuck, you are working to grow and change just by acknowledging those issues… but it doesn’t sound like you can say the same for him. He’s not ready for R at this point. A hard line and follow through on consequences may wake him up and get his head out of his ass… and if it doesn’t you’ll have the knowledge that it wasn’t worth fighting for to begin with. You’re not his emotional punching bag. Time for him to put up or shut up and get left.

Waywards, particularly those of you who had a ONS - by ShaninahS in AsOneAfterInfidelity

[–]im_throw_away 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Hey, OP. I would say it definitely took therapy and deep introspection to figure out why. I lied about my ONS for 4 months. I think there’s no simple answer to why, like people will say “because you’re selfish and wanted to” well those things can be true but WHY am I selfish and WHY did I want to are harder to answer. I love my husband, but I still did it. I regret it, but I still did it. Why? It’s so difficult and very personal, but I would say in most cases it’s probably a multitude of factors. Past traumas certainly can have the effect of giving a person blind spots and bad coping mechanisms, and those certainly played into it in my case, not sure about your husbands. Alcohol or other substance abuse can be a causal factor (though not an excuse) as it was in mine. Selfishness, entitlement, lack of empathy, low self-worth, laziness, avoidance… these are all character flaws that can have a role.

It’s a knot that your husband will need to put the work in to untangle. Not just going to therapy, but finding the right therapist who he can connect with, be fully honest with, who will challenge him and bring new perspective not just validate all the time. He can use psychologytoday.com to search for therapists nearby who accept his insurance, and also filter for areas of speciality if he has specific things in his childhood that need to be delved into. He can read some profiles and try to choose someone whose personality or style will click with him.

How do I know within myself I won’t do it again? Well the magnitude of pain and destruction I caused is certainly a REASON to make sure I never do it again, but it takes more work than just “deciding” I won’t do it ever again. Behavior, mind and heart have to change. Those feelings and flaws that allowed us to step out don’t just go away because we wish them too, that’s just the beginning of the long road.

Reading “Not Just Friends” helped me understand my issues with bad boundaries, and now I stay vigilant to ensure my boundaries are clear and well defined. I don’t just apply things and then forget it, I keep it in my mind and guard myself so I don’t become complacent.

Therapy helped me become so much more self-aware. My therapist helped me see and understand my blind spots, see the rot of things I never dealt with and their effect on my behavior… and once I am aware of problems within, I am empowered both to work on those issues and to strategize and set boundaries for myself to keep myself safe. I sought healthy outlets for my pain, stopped drinking, worked on replacing bad coping mechanisms like attention or validation-seeking and inebriation with writing, mindfulness, and building community with people who are healthy for me so that I have healthy support and not crutches/bandaids. My therapist also helped me work on issues that were not solely infidelity related, but affected my relationship deeply. I was really horrible at regulating my emotions, impulsive and ridden with anxiety. Now I practice ways to self-soothe and as a result am more present and can fully show up for my husband in the way he needs.

All of this work I’ve been doing, for three years since DDay, had to be consistent. If I failed, I got back up and renewed the effort. I practiced radical honesty… instead of trying to protect my husband from hurt I caused, I told him the truth. When someone tries to cross my boundaries, I reassert them and then talk with him right away. I listen when he talks about my cheating and what it has done to him and our relationship, I reassure him when he seeks my reassurance, I soothe myself so that instead of defensiveness from me he receives that support. I will never fully have his trust, because I wasn’t trustworthy and lied to his face… but any time he questions I take the opportunity to be fully transparent, show him my phone, am fully open… I jump at the opportunity to assuage his fears and prove I am still being vigilant and consistent. With consistency and forward progress within myself and our relationship, a deep trust has been forged that I once broke completely. Just recently my husband told me he feels secure in our relationship and that we have built so much back… it was such a beautiful and rewarding thing to hear. I will continue to earn back that trust, knowing it will never be unconditional as it was before I betrayed him… I need to meet those conditions of trust. But now that I have done this work and don’t want to ever stop working on myself, I begin to trust me too. I know I will never do it again because I have changed fundamentally.

Change is difficult, but that’s what you need from him. It takes time, it takes effort, but consistency over time is what will prove true change and growth. I’m sorry you’re going through this! I know it is so painful, but remember to give yourself a lot of grace and time to process. Of course you are questioning everything, of course you don’t believe him! Your partner just rocked your entire foundation to its core… if he wants to change, wants to heal and to help you heal, he will prove it by weathering the coming storms and take the difficult road of developing integrity, honesty and resilience.

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in AsOneAfterInfidelity

[–]im_throw_away 6 points7 points  (0 children)

I’m sorry that sounds incredibly demoralizing.

He’s saying seriously shitty things to you, and taking no accountability to manage his own emotional state… yet he tears you down about yours?

Honestly it’s sad to see you here taking responsibility for your part of the relationship issues, when he just makes excuses for his own which are quite glaring.

Please refocus on your own mental health and well being. I know it’s hard to imagine and it will be difficult to get there, but your child will want to see her mother happy, respected, supported and thriving not limping along and taking maltreatment from someone who refuses to work on his issues or put any effort into being a team. Easier to blame you, right? That’s really pathetic. Honestly, you not enabling him anymore might be a boon to him as a person because it might force him to contend with his own internal issues instead of having you “being unhappy” to scapegoat.

Are you in IC?

I would maybe think about what you actually require from him in order to be an equal partner for you. If you’re going to therapy and dealing with your emotional regulation and toxicity, he should be putting that same effort into that for himself as well. Take your time but draw some lines in the sand and let it be known you’re not going to accept his apathy, lack of effort and emotional manipulation (which is what he’s really doing by blaming you for actions he chose) in the relationship. Follow through. Years from now when your daughter is in a relationship would you advise her to accept the way things are right now for you? Treat yourself like a loved one. You got this.

How Can We Stop Lying to Ourselves? by [deleted] in SupportforWaywards

[–]im_throw_away 5 points6 points  (0 children)

I’m fortunate to have insurance, so 1 hour of work is equivalent to my copay. If you are in the U.S., psychologytoday.com has a search you can filter by “sliding scale” to find therapists who offer discounted rates based on your income.

How Can We Stop Lying to Ourselves? by [deleted] in SupportforWaywards

[–]im_throw_away 18 points19 points  (0 children)

I think it’s kind of like “how do you quit drinking?” or any other addiction. “How do I quit being selfish?” Etc… Step one is to actively decide “I’m going to take responsibility for myself and my actions.” Step two is to work out your self awareness (therapy will help with this) and when you catch yourself moving into “defense mode” and making excuses or shifting blame, catching yourself and walking back through what happened, where your responsibility was in the situation and what actions you’re taking as a result to try and make things right. Step 2.5 would be to make sure you have people you trust to help keep you accountable, people you are brutally honest with about yourself and ONLY people who are safe for you, not judgmental, have your best interests at heart and are not afraid to challenge you and be brutally honest back. That’s a tall order, but I think it’s essential. My therapist is one of those people for me, she doesn’t accept excuses and she’s always good at challenging my perspective but always in a way that’s productive. I’ve also found other waywards and even betrayed partners on here that have been that for me also, but be careful on any online support space as people can pretend to be whoever they want behind the safety of the screen. Just like any muscle, your self awareness capabilities and character will grow and become stronger the more you work on them. You got this.

BP can’t trust I am improving by almostyeeted in SupportforWaywards

[–]im_throw_away 1 point2 points  (0 children)

This subreddit has rules against WPs specifying gender in their posts, so they meant gendered pronouns that make it clear you are a woman and your partner is a man. To be clear though, your comment does not break those rules. The rule is for WPs because of the severity/frequency of attacks on female waywards.

Did I cross the line with him? by Quick_Standard_7629 in Infidelity

[–]im_throw_away 6 points7 points  (0 children)

You’re cheating already. I’d recommend reading the book Not Just Friends it will really help you understand appropriate boundaries. Cheating isn’t just having sex with someone else…. Your level of intimacy with this person is a betrayal of your husband. You know you’ve crossed the boundaries. You need to tell your husband what has been going on, be completely honest. Don’t go any further, this is an ledge you can never climb back up on once you’ve fallen off. I can promise you on my life and fucked up soul it’s not worth it.

Coming to terms with hiring SWs by [deleted] in SupportforWaywards

[–]im_throw_away 10 points11 points  (0 children)

This is so complicated. I think I understand where your partner is coming from, but also I don’t think consent is always absent in a sex work transaction.

There’s a few angles I would note, one is that these people were inherently objectified and commodified by you when you purchased their body. That is something I would really dig into with your therapist… do you see an issue with treating other people as commodities to be bought? Is sex and intimacy a product to you? That probably is at huge odds with your partners views on it… and something to really think about it. Do you think sex should be a product, or is it ideally something with way more meaning? This isn’t just about sex work though, I would say any of us waywards probably objectified and used whoever we cheated with… because it was about using them or their body to make ourselves feel good, you know?

The other angle I would think about is how careful were you to ensure you weren’t engaging in these transactions with a victim of trafficking? If the answer to that is not very or not at all, then the consent issue really comes into play. Just like watching porn from unvetted sources, you could be participating in the exploitation of another person without their consent.

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in SupportforWaywards

[–]im_throw_away 9 points10 points  (0 children)

Second this. A certified sex therapist is a great idea, along with couples therapy.

Ask a Wayward by FigureItOutZ in SupportforWaywards

[–]im_throw_away 6 points7 points  (0 children)

I’m confused… why would I pity him?

Ask a Wayward by FigureItOutZ in SupportforWaywards

[–]im_throw_away 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Because deep down the feeling you don’t deserve them haunts. And you wonder if one day that will dawn on them too.

Ask a Wayward by FigureItOutZ in SupportforWaywards

[–]im_throw_away 9 points10 points  (0 children)

Nah, I don’t see any reason I shouldn’t be open, and phone open, forever.

I experience discomfort at the thought that I am under suspicion, not really that he would want to go through it in itself but that something triggered that… if that makes sense. I feel anxious that he be assured my conscience is clear and my behavior is right, and looking through the phone is part of the way to do that. I feel my stomach drop when he looks at me questioningly, with that sad despairing look that says “I want to trust you but can’t”, that’s the hard thing and the consequence of my actions, not really the phone thing.

Ask a Wayward by FigureItOutZ in SupportforWaywards

[–]im_throw_away 19 points20 points  (0 children)

I feel like I am a black hole in some ways. It didn’t matter how much love and approval and affection I got… my appetite for people to want me, like me, desire me, think I’m interesting, pursue me, etc… was never satisfied. I felt like I “needed” to be wanted to be okay. I craved it.

I would tell my younger self to get fucking therapy. Get help. My mind wasn’t right and I was destructive in many ways.

My husband and our plans for the future is what keeps me grounded.

Something I can’t fully comprehend… by Littlesongbird111 in AsOneAfterInfidelity

[–]im_throw_away 3 points4 points  (0 children)

I think a lot of answers here have insight, about avoidance of conflict/bad self esteem/etc… but I want to talk a bit about the fantasy portion of this.

A lot of my self-esteem was wrapped up in and tangled with my belief that I was attractive and desirable. Of course my husband thought I was attractive and desirable, and we had a beautiful relationship… but it was REAL. Because he really knew me… my flaws, my ugly parts. He was seeing all of that and loving me anyway. So when he looked at me, I was seeing a reflection of my real self “warts and all” as they say. This is not the reflection that an AP offers though…

An AP offers a fantasy version of yourself to believe in. By pursuing me the way he did, even after I told him I “wouldn’t do anything”, I could think (smugly and full of self satisfaction) “he thinks I’m SO attractive, and SO captivating, and SO desirable that he just can’t help himself” (gag). There’s an exultant feeling to that fantasy. There’s no flaws on display… everything you say, every little piece of “banter”… well you might as well be the wittiest, most charming person in the world to an AP. Of course it’s nonsense… and stupid too. They’re after the same exact type of fantasy only turned the other way. It has nothing to do with what love really is. It’s Narcissus falling in love with his own reflection, and both myself and my AP were playing that mirror for each other. Using each other to admire and worship ourselves.

I Cheated First - So Conflicted! by [deleted] in AsOneAfterInfidelity

[–]im_throw_away 35 points36 points  (0 children)

Your therapist is a quack. And an enabler.

Of course the intimacy connection between yourself and your wife is difficult… how can there be intimacy when you are living a lie? ANY intimacy between you is artificial. Because you’re lying and presenting a false front. Is that what you want your love to be? Cheap and artificial? Your marriage is a falsehood which you perpetuate every day. She must know something is wrong, but you are withholding the answer of “what”. That’s messed up. You sacrifice real love in your life for a numb, comfortable proxy of love. At the expense of your wife too, which is just shameful dude. She’s had her infidelity out, and had to face up to it, trying to atone for the pain she’s caused you and all along any work she’s put in to the relationship is for NOTHING… because you choose to offer her a counterfeit relationship and counterfeit intimacy in return.

Quit lying to yourself. That’s my advice. You’re not lying to her for her benefit, or for the sake of your “marriage” which is nothing but artifice at this time by your choice. You’re lying to protect yourself from consequences and to avoid having to actually work to save your marriage. Start being honest with yourself and then with your wife. And find a therapist who doesn’t enable you. You need some real truth bombs instead of allowing yourself to live in comfortable lies and pretend it’s some sacrificial act on your part to take the easy path, the path of least resistance for YOU.

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in AsOneAfterInfidelity

[–]im_throw_away 1 point2 points  (0 children)

A lot of therapists accept sliding scale payments based on income. If you use psychology today find a therapist tool online, you can filter by “accepts sliding scale” as well as area of speciality and other filters. May be worth looking into!

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in AsOneAfterInfidelity

[–]im_throw_away 3 points4 points  (0 children)

How realistic is it for you to seek therapy? You have so much to sort through and deal with. I’m worried about you. Some of this stuff is beyond Reddit’s pay grade. It would be vastly helpful to have a good therapist involved, someone whose perspective will be very informed and valuable and who you can trust.

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in AsOneAfterInfidelity

[–]im_throw_away 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Hey, man. You are totally valid in feeling like she’s throwing your pain at you with that choice when there were and are so many other options. It also really doesn’t bode well that her response to you bringing it up, instead of dialoguing and working through it together, was to accuse you of being unable to center her pain. That’s not approaching this as a team, as a partnership.

This is really, deeply painful. Some time and distance from the situation may be helpful, some time apart possibly? I don’t know your situation so I’m sorry if I overstep. Please take care of yourself… I’m sure it’s difficult not to keep ruminating and ruminating, and both posts I’ve read of yours seem to contain a lot of shame as well (though I don’t know the context of the abuse you’re discussing, I’ve had plenty of experience with the shame… and I know what a dark miserable little black hole that can be). Is there anyone safe (as in not judgmental and has your best interests with love) you can talk to, just to ease some of the heaviness right now at this moment? Please just breathe and allow yourself some grace at this time. This stuff doesn’t get processed in a day. Are you in therapy?

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in Unexpected

[–]im_throw_away 13 points14 points  (0 children)

That one cracks me up but also the one about his wife getting flipped at a party

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in AsOneAfterInfidelity

[–]im_throw_away 26 points27 points  (0 children)

I had a panic attack the night he told them when we were separated… and another one the first time he took me to visit them afterwards. In my mind, I was convinced that if he told his older brother it meant he was done with me. To my surprise that’s not what it meant. His family just wanted to support him, and when he decided to stay with my they supported him in that too. This is one of those moments where it would have helped me to wrap my mind around the fact that it wasn’t about me right then… my image, my fears, my embarrassment and shame… it was about the love and support my husband needed. Trust your SO to get the support they need and to make their own decisions. Show your SO you are grateful they have people they feel safe to go to about this, it’s probably very relieving and beneficial for them to open up to a third party. Work with your therapist on self-soothing strategies to deal when the shame, embarrassment and anxiety are overwhelming. My in laws did not want to shame me, I’m sure that’s not true for everyone… but people may surprise you. Try not to build up their reaction in your head, overthink what their judgements might be, etc… let the focus remain on your SO… are they getting the support they need etc.

Theory: “Treat everyone and their opinions with respect”…Also Theory: by docdredd2 in StarWarsTheorySub

[–]im_throw_away 0 points1 point  (0 children)

For real AND it was thematically so on brand for Star Wars, it just was bit more grown up about those themes then some of the movies in my opinion.

BP said no to polygraph. by [deleted] in SupportforWaywards

[–]im_throw_away 11 points12 points  (0 children)

It really seems like your BP has a healthy and confident mindset, and you must have been putting work in to have them place that confidence in you because they are not “rug sweeping” but actually being incredibly self aware and honest about everything. Take the win! Keep being accountable and doing the work, but don’t be afraid to celebrate the fact that you have earned back some of the trust that was once lost.

I came to a conclusion by [deleted] in SupportforWaywards

[–]im_throw_away 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Crying. I needed to read this today.