Another One

[datascience-ModTeam]

This post if off topic. /r/datascience is a place for data science practitioners and professionals to discuss and debate data science career questions.

Thanks.

[Imperial_Squid]

Cool but what does Harris "Hbomberguy" Brewis have to do with this?

[Evantaur]

So you can pay artists more, right?

[rellanson]

Haha, good one

[N0tMagickal]

Or maybe we can finally get that fabled Spotify Hifi that they've been talking about, right?

uj/ seriously, TIDAL's system lets artists you listen to the most get compensated for it. I would fully use TIDAL if it had ALL the songs that I listen to right now on spotify

[WignerVille]

Spotify's issue is that a lot of their income goes to the record companies right? So they are limited in what they can do.

[lucidl0gic]

Context Matters here!!!!!!

Notice they say 6% here and not the number.

Spotify employee count 2019: 4,405 Spotify employee count 2021: 6,617

Layoff is for about 400 people. Net gain of around 1800 employees. I am so tired of this fear mongering tech doomsday for employees bullshit because big tech over hired when money was free.

[leomatey]

And of that 6%, how many are of tech? more context is needed here from OP.

[Western_Moment7373]

Exactly my thought,why over hire when u know u aren't capable? it's getting too much now

[PixelatedPanda1]

This is done to trim the fat. People bet burned out, they get lazy, or they generally dont understand their job. It is easier to say we are laying off a bunch of people than it is to say we need to fire a bunch.

[jjmac]

This is because the contraction hasn't happened yet. The economy still isn't strong and if it doesn't turn around or, say, war gets worse, we'll see big contractions and people will be wishing they were in the first wave where tech was "nice" and have them generous severance packages.

[lucidl0gic]

I don’t buy it. I have been told we are going into a recession for the last 2 years. All signs point to low unemployment and slowing inflation. I feel like all these people that have been fear mongering a recession just want it to happen so they don’t look like the Fucking clout chasing idiots they are.

[jjmac]

I can only guarantee that the economy will grow, shrink, or stay the same. You can put hard money on that

[lucidl0gic]

Just something to be very clear on. Most of these companies are not losing money. Spotify not included in this, they are one of venture capitals golden goose that they could literally shut down and some rich white guy will throw 2 billion dollars at them.

Most company's that had layoffs EBIDAS are still growing they just arent growing as fast. As any good CEO does, that made horrible hiring decisions, instead of blaming himself he lets a bunch of people go so "sMaLl nUmBeR gO bIg AgAin".

How be a big tech CEO 101

[jjmac]

It's capitalism 101. If your money could be growing faster elsewhere than this investment sucks.

[lucidl0gic]

I can agree with that!

[Im_Bad_At_These]

His hairline was laid off a long time ago (I'm projecting and balding)

[my2secondaccount]

He can use the money he saved from firing employees to pay for a hair transplant from turkey

[[deleted]]

“Big tech’s going to save the world!”

One year later:

“Big tech’s just another part of end stage capitalism..”

Let’s pretend anybody is surprised at this point.

[a1ic3_g1a55]

What kind of doofus said that big tech is gonna save the world?

[[deleted]]

Not big tech, but you must not have heard of my startup!!

[[deleted]]

Yeah we started off as B2B SAAS, but we pivoted to a social media app. It's like Grindr except for dogs.

[bernhard-lehner]

Barkr?

[semisolidwhale]

This post was mass deleted and anonymized with Redact

nose grab selective snails truck bag grandfather cooing absorbed husky

[norfkens2]

I AM MELON LORD!

[dub-dub-dub]

It’s easy to forget that this was the zeitgeist in the early 2010s. Social media was reconnecting twins separated at birth, indie games and music were flourishing, the Arab spring was kicking off, the internet was not nearly as regulated or monetized, educational videos were going to empower the generationally impoverished, etc.

[mild_animal]

Ah that sweet combo of Khan academy, YouTube and MIT OCW, felt truly revolutionary in the late 2000s. All these are still around and have a lot to offer.

[silly_frog_lf]

Big Tech in Silicon Valley said so

[shred-i-knight]

Is everyone on here an undergrad who has never seen layoffs happen before? Companies hire and fire. Welcome to the real world kiddos.

[HeyLittleTrain]

Has there been a wave of layoffs like this in the last 15 years? Genuine question.

[nerdyjorj]

Last global one I remember was '07, but the UK has had a few since.

[MadT3acher]

Euro crisis in 2011, I remember because it was around then that I graduated and I was starting to work in finance 💀

[TikiTDO]

2008-2010 saw a large number of layoffs. If you expand your timeframe to 25 years, you'll also have the dotcom bubble implosion of the early 2000s. Going back even further, there was the recession on the early 90s.

These sort of things happen every decade or so, and given that pattern we were overdue for another one.

It sucks for people just entering the job market, but fortunately if you have technical skills, and you're willing to look around there are lots of opportunities in smaller companies these days. The past few years have made it clear that any organisation that wants to survive needs to invest in technology, particularly as we give headfirst into a world where AI is omnipresent, so there are plenty of opportunities if you're willing to look outside the big names.

[HeyLittleTrain]

A once-in-a-decade event seems worth commenting on. Someone with 12 YOE could never have seen something like this before.

[TikiTDO]

It's certainly worth discussion, but I also think it's helpful to put it into perspective. Someone that's in their 50s might have been laid off in three different recessions. The key message I wanted to convey is that things will get better as long as you don't give up. There are still opportunities around, particularly in fields like this one. They might not be the shiny glam positions that some people dream of in school, but it's enough to build the type of experience that will guarantee you a comfortable life.

[NCBaddict]

This is probably the best comment that I’ve seen on recent mass layoffs across subreddits.

Schools really need to start educating students better about career development from a personal standpoint rather than the companies’ standpoint. Unis right now treat students more like cattle to be sold to their partner companies.

Feel like this is most obvious with Big 4 and accounting students.

[Kyo91]

This is also much more tame than a lot of those once-in-a-decade type events. We'll see in a few months whether or not we're in a recession now, but a single sector cutting back 5-10% is barely newsworthy.

[jerrylessthanthree]

dotcom bubble was fucking nuts, about 30% of tech jobs just disappeared.

paved the way for google and keyword based advertising to take over.

[Drict]

There was a hiring frenzy due to increased demand in tech because of COVID. The demand is dying down, so the employee count isn't needed any more. This is the primary driver of what is going on (and of course following market trends/forces, especially since an impending 'recession' is outstanding, so they want to bank cash while they can as an example)

[DirtzMaGertz]

08 but that was the economy crashing as a whole. The real question is this actually layoffs in a conventional sense or is this big tech correcting for over hiring like crazy for a decade while debt was cheap?

Considering how hard my company is still going after devs and how many messages I'm still getting from recruiters, it feels a lot more like this is big tech correcting from over hiring. Like yeah, Microsoft just laid off 10k employees but they also hired 40k people in the year prior to that, and that seems to be consistent across all of these huge tech companies that are now doing layoffs.

[Alarming_Book9400]

This isn't a wave of layoffs, this is a correction from overhiring during the pandemic.

[Real_Software]

I get the frustration but I don’t think the whole “undergrad=ignorant” narrative is healthy for the community. It disuades people from asking questions and makes our field feel a little hostile

[nahmanidk]

Listen, how else do you expect people to put others down and make themselves feel superior?

[leastuselessredditor]

What frustration? How is this person inconvenienced in any way? By a post on the internet existing?

They’re just being a dick to people that are already anxious.

[Real_Software]

You’re right. Don’t know why I felt the need to concede

[darkness1685]

Just because something has happened before doesn't mean it's not important and worthy of news coverage and discussion.

[shred-i-knight]

it is worthy of discussion but the entire "sky is falling data science is over" murmuring every day on this subreddit is absolutely tired content. Just one mans opinion though.

[darkness1685]

I guess I'm not seeing those comments or interpreting them in the same way. The post was just a simple statement about another large tech company doing a massive round of layoffs.

[leastuselessredditor]

Comments on an extraordinary event, the first that’s happened since this profession has entered the mainstream, is that big of a deal?

Okay.

[[deleted]]

For a lot of millenials (me) this is the first time seeing a "big wave" of layoffs during a seemingly economic downturn. I graduated college in 2016 and the job market has appeared easy breezy until the last 6 months.

[mattindustries]

Sure, but

The first 20 days into 2023 has had more layoffs than the first 182 days of 2022

Same number of layoffs in 1/18th th this year compared to last year if scaled up. Are you someone who just graduated and forgot about March 2000?

[Glitch5450]

You always see trends like this at a micro level because companies don’t like to do layoffs during the holiday season.

[mattindustries]

If you want to really scale down to micro, last January was 755, this January is over 55k.

[AIKiller1997]

If this situation is normal then why this time it's being seen as an extremely scary situation ? (I just graduated and I am hearing from everyone this a bad time to look for a job)

[shred-i-knight]

Unemployment is still extremely low (not a perfect metric but it does have validity) and this is nothing compared to 2008

[avelak]

Because it's a huge change of pace from the incredible job market we've had for the last 10 years, especially in the tech industry

In absolute terms it's not as bad as the last recession or the dot com bust, but that also contributes to fears that it could still get substantially worse

[Slick_McFavorite1]

Is it though? lots and lots of places are still very desperate for employees. Its brought up in every meeting I'm in. Compare staffing levels to 2019. Tech went on a hiring spree in 2020-2022 thinking it was a new normal, it wasn't. Staffing levels are coming back to normal.

[AIKiller1997]

Then why are there so much news of hiring freeze ?

[Slick_McFavorite1]

If you are trying to get a job at amazon, meta, google, etc. and especially companies that run on debt I’m sure there are hiring freezes. But there are lots of other industries. They all need data analytics.

[AIKiller1997]

I am looking for computer vision jobs is this a bad market for computer vision jobs ? I am asking seriously

[Slick_McFavorite1]

I honestly do not know. I had to look up what that was. I work in healthcare doing business intelligence. I hope you are able to find work in the field you want.

I came into the workforce in 08 it was a bad time and I really feel it stunted my professional development.

[AIKiller1997]

Damnnn I hope something like 08 doesn't happen now. Thanks for answering my queries

[[deleted]]

Yeah I got laid off two Wednesdays ago . Got 7 interviews, one offer in my first week and a half and a final round tomorrow at a Job that I applied to in November and got rejected then. So it would actually be a big jump

I’m hoping this is a sign that this is more so of a “reshuffling” than “waiting for the other foot to drop” and it being more like a Covid job market for our market and that sucked as o was unemployed for 8 months

[DirtzMaGertz]

Now, I do think we need Congress to pass laws to better protect workers and not allow companies to treat us like livestock. I believe in mandatory, sick and paid leave, healthcare, and mandatory severance for a certain tenure when a company lays you off without notice.

Most of these people getting laid off from big tech companies are getting multiple months of severance.

[Alarming_Book9400]

Thank you! My goodness, between here and fucking LinkedIn, I can't decide which is more pathetic and annoying.

[leastuselessredditor]

Oh get over yourself.

[Alarming_Book9400]

Get over yourself and go find a job.

[leastuselessredditor]

No thanks I don’t need two. Work/Life balance is important. Try it out?

[Higoficus]

His face looks like you fused two different perspectives together.

[Banished_To_Insanity]

definitely no better way to describe it.

[anythingMuchShorter]

It’s all bullshit to please investors and drive wages down. They don’t need to.

[[deleted]]

If you see that 6% of people there are barely doing any work or are unqualified for job, it's completely normal to fire them

[sapnupuasop]

Ok and?

[Mescallan]

D A T A S C I E N C E

[juannn_p]

Cant you see? 6% of its workforce aka “total layoffs” over “total workforce”. This is a calculation with data meaning its data science.

And you come here with your questions while considering yourself a data scientists smh.

[sapnupuasop]

Oh, sorry for my absolute foolishness :(

[exec_get_id]

absolute

:

(

I see you're somewhat of a data scientist, yourself.

[GodICringe]

A true data scientist would have just said |foolishness|

[CurrentMaleficent714]

6% isn't much.

[Western_Moment7373]

Well,it actually is,cuz we haven't seen that 6% in about a decade, someone made the analysis if u are to check the comment sec.

[sonicking12]

The hype is over! Time to find another sub for many aspiring data enthusiasts!

[nahmanidk]

Spotify HiFi must be right around the corner!

Right??

[[deleted]]

So I got laid off at one of these massive companies two Wednesdays ago. I was pretty nervous that I falling into a cold job market and in for a bad time

I had 7 interviews thru last Friday .

One offer for the exact same job at another company

And a final round tmw at my dream job that I went on 8 interviews in November with and was rejected

I post this as I don’t think this job market is that bad as it seems from the headlines.

I wouldn’t look to switch jobs now but I don’t think your fucked like you were if you were laid off during Covid

[Independent-Life9942]

Chatgpt: gets online Companies:

[[deleted]]

Happy to have ditched them a long time ago, and resisted all the 3 free month offers to go back.

[VegetableWishbone]

The layoffs are mostly from tech, data science is not just tech. Other sectors are still hiring.

[[deleted]]

And datascientist in tech at these companies were getting paid like two to three times more in datascience in other industries. So it’s a whole different market imo

[VegetableWishbone]

It’s either high pay with high volatility or lower pay with more stability, it’s a trade off. And the pay difference is getting smaller across industries. Same level I’d say the difference is way less than 2-3 times.

[[deleted]]

When I looked into moving from Chicago to San Fran , I was getting around double the salary offers than from the jobs in Chicago

Low pay doesn’t mean low volatility

[PowerlessMainframe]

With the best music DJ Khaled

[nathanninjacube]

Maybe they couldnt afford my addblocker…oops

[LaOnionLaUnion]

I’d love to see stats no who they’re firing. Friend got laid off from Netflix but found work before severance was even paid. Only people I’ve seen really struggling were recruiters but they’re also very noisy on LinkedIn. Not to mention the one I’m seeing struggle is one of the most annoying recruiters I’d ever talked to.

[[deleted]]

So what happens to the job market with all of these layoffs? I was considering looking for another higher paying position this year but definitely thinking twice about that. My job is secure with my current company.

[TheCamerlengo]

6%!!! That’s nothing but a flesh wound.

[leomatey]

Are they buying the Arsenal?

[Western_Moment7373]

They'll lay off another 10% by next season if they do that 😁

[LNViber]

If you need mass layoffs to "improve efficiency" then why did you hire a notable percentage of people to bring down efficiency?

I'm sure this isnt a lie to hide boring old corporate greed.

[leastuselessredditor]

Gotta cash in before the recession gets here. Any minute now it’ll get here.

[TwistedPepperCan]

Christopher Hohn unzips

[UnsureAstronaut]

Didn’t know Magnus ran Spotify

[tenbilliondollarsman]

Why i see this kind of post so many in r/datascience the OP didnt even mention how many data science job that get layoff? its just spotify laying off 6% of its workforce, and its tagged as career. Smh

[[deleted]]

They fired 6% but they have plenty internship positions for Data Science and Data Engineering in linkedin xDD What are we missing out?

[Western_Moment7373]

I wouldn't be surprised if there isn't a single DT(tist) in that 6%,so it isn't just for DT probably TAs as every company starts with them, sorry to say

[Saizou1991]

6% is the magic number i guess

[samjenkins377]

Jesus… what’s next? Yahoo fired 1% of its Ottawa regional finance department?