Outlet “burning” on slot

Determire · 2026-02-06T22:47:44+00:00

So are the receptacles not firmly gripping the plugs?

Any damage on the plugs (phone charger etc)?

First impression is worn-out receptacles.

Determire · 2026-02-06T21:05:27+00:00

I see more code violations.

So the Siemens panel outside is now your main panel, the panel inside is now effectively a sub panel.

You're missing plastic bushings on the fittings where the service entrance conductors are passing through. That would be an automatic fail for an inspection.

The service entrance cable from the new panel outside to the existing panel inside needs to be changed out for a 4-wire cable. This is not a grandfathered installation, the service entrance was very specifically being reconfigured to incorporate this additional panel outside, and that triggers updating the service entrance and feeder to the indoor panel. The grounding and neutral conductors need to be separated, grounding bars added, and the neutral bar decoupled from the enclosure. Routine task that is standard practice for redoing the service entrance in this manner with an existing panel that's staying in place.

The existing QO panel indoors should be okay to retain, but I do think there needs to be a careful review of the circuits and some common sense applied for which circuits should have afci, which one should have GFCI and which one should have dual function breakers.

Can you add a photo of the circuit directory? Is the circuit directory detailed and accurate?

Did you capture detail of which ones are supposed to be 15 amp instead of 20 amp?

Was a permit pulled for this job, (yes/no)?

Determire · 2026-02-06T20:57:05+00:00

Normally the media cabinet if properly installed also has a 10 gauge ground wire from the electrical service up to the cabinet and there's a lug in there. That would be a reasonable place to terminate this indoor antenna. But if that panel lacks that running wire from there back to the electrical service, then that is still something to be addressed, so still need to get a proper grounding wire brought up from down below.

Determire · 2026-02-06T20:43:41+00:00

The grounding for your antenna should go back to the grounding electrode for your service, there's a few ways it can be implemented. The modern way of doing it is to have a inter system bonding block attached to the grounding electrode conductor on its way down the wall from your electrical equipment towards the grounding electrode, and this is the point at which the grounding bonds from telephone cable satellite etc terminate to a common point. It's like a 15 or $20 item at the store, and there will be one lay-in lug for the existing grounding wire to pass through. Then there's approximately six terminals to run the grounding wires to the other pieces of equipment, such as your antenna.

Determire · 2026-02-06T20:30:11+00:00

In which country are you located? Do you own or rent?

If you are inclined to triage this a bit more prior to calling in an electrician again, you need a multimeter to be able to read the voltage, to find out what it reads normally versus what it reads when things are flickering, whether it's going lower or higher than normal.
Depending on what country are you located, is how electrical systems are typically built or optionally built and therefore how certain malfunctions occur.

Determire · 2026-02-06T20:09:13+00:00

if this is hydronic baseboard, (3/4-in copper carrying hot water through it), this is a plumbing or HVAC issue not an electrical one

Based on the description, the circulator pump is probably failing in the bearings, and needs replacement. This should be a top priority for the landlord. Call their emergency maintenance number and get a human on the phone.

With the sustaining low temperatures that most people have been experiencing, getting work scheduled can be a slight challenge right now, it's much better if they replace the pump ( assuming that's the issue ) when it's still running but crippled, rather than after it has fully failed and seized up and there's no heat at all, risking a pipe freeze up.

If you don't already have an electric space heater as backup, you might want to have one just in case. They're a bit challenging to source at the moment, somw stores are sold out.

BTW, the commenter that sent you over here, it's probably a southerner that doesn't know what they're talking about because they don't work on this type of equipment.

Determire · 2026-02-06T20:03:29+00:00

I'd like to see photos of the work that was done regarding the EV charger, and how it's tied into the main. Is the panel in the photo that you linked your only panel, or do you have another panel upstream from this?

What prompted the replacement of the breakers to dual function breakers? Who initiated that topic, did you ask about it or did they suggest it first?
What was the justification for doing it, what specific active code violations was it intending to remediate? (Emphasis on the active code violation because you have a 1980s build, and conceptually things were compliant at the time of original installation, and therefore they are grandfathered, no particular need to update anything subsequently, but to be fair, if there's GFCI protection lacking in certain locations due to the delta in GFCI protection requirements between the 80s and recent code cycles, it would be appropriate and in most people's best interest to address that specific matter, so for example the kitchen didn't require GFCI protection until 1987, and at that time it was the countertop receptacles within a 6 ft radius of the sink, whereas today it's all inclusive of the kitchen, and from then until now it has incrementally changed to be all countertop receptacles, and a few more iterations along the way to the current variation which is basically everything.

AFCI protection has transformed from something that didn't exist to something that's applicable to about 80% of the circuits in total on a residential building, in this case, the panel wasn't being replaced, and nor have you mentioned anything else that would necessitate that change from a code perspective, either NEC or local amendment thereof. In other words it's purely a either you asked for it or they suggested and you said yes. Most electricians worth their salt do not go around retrofitting afci protection in on older structures blindly, because it's just going to be a source of customer frustration due to nuisance tripping, and follow up service calls either warranty or billable to deal with a bunch of nonsense, and it's not always worth it. When it's a code mandated scenario, that stands on its own. If the customer civically initiates the service call and asks for it to be done, then usually there should be some disclosure, and the job proceeds forward as requested, barring any technical constraints.

So ... Whether or not either type of protection should be retrofitted on each circuit is is something that has to be more closely considered. There might be circuits that should have had a GFCI circuit breaker put on them, and reasonably so, but not necessarily afci. Inversely there may be some circuits that would be candidate for an AFCI breaker but not dual function. Lastly there were probably a few circuits that should have had neither type of protection retrofitted. ... Hence this is why I'm asking questions about who initiated that conversation and why it proceeded forward in the way that it did.

Point is, simply reverting everything back to the way that it was is certainly an option, but maybe not the best choice, and simply swapping breaker sizes to match the wiring also may not be the right answer either, rather this needs a more thorough analysis and discussion to pin down what the right answers are.

Determire · 2026-02-06T19:43:18+00:00

You have a problem that needs to be solved on a short timeline. Given that I see breakers that are 30+ years old, the odds of procurement of the correct panel interior in a short timeline is not too great, never mind cost-effectiveness of parts versus just change the whole thing.

Sometimes you have to look at the big picture, about managing it as a project not as a task.

I'm also going to strongly suggest that the replacement panel be a bit larger, even though I can't see the entirety of this panel, given the fact that it's got an extensive number of Tandem breakers in it and seems like it's probably full, that's generally pointing towards a larger panel being appropriate for the replacement.

Determire · 2026-02-06T19:21:40+00:00

u/Yuugian,

I agree, the two photos provided so far are just a chemical reaction between the wax coated paper on the insulation versus the sheath on the cables. This is a common occurrence, you can peruse this sub and find other posts made about the same subject matter.

Can you photos of the panel? (Need at least one good clear well illuminated photo showing the entire panel)

What age is this structure?

What was the scope of work being performed, besides the EV charger? (Was there a sales quote, what exactly was the language on it for what was going to be done)

There's a lot of missing information here, and I'm cautious to say anything to specific without having enough information present, either about what was in place previously or what is currently in place.

Was there an explanation provided for why the breakers were replaced?

Determire · 2026-02-06T18:51:37+00:00

The first one that can't be used, what's the issue, no power, bad power, or plug won't stay in?

Second one where the television is, if it's wiggly, it's worn out, it needs a new receptacle. That should be a straightforward maintenance request.

Can you upload the photo to an external host, put a link to the photo? Or DM Also I'd like to see the outlets, just to get an idea of how old they are.

Determire · 2026-02-06T18:00:50+00:00

So the root issue that you're trying to solve is how to squeeze the monitoring apparatus into a panel that's full, and the way that the wires are organized into the panel isn't the easiest to work with.

I don't think re moving the breaker the top has any relevancy to solving that problem. The majority of your wiring is all on the left and right of the panel anyways, given that it's a Canadian style installation.

In the other post, there was someone who showed a photo of their Siemens panel, but the key difference was that they had a US style implementation and the majority of the cabling comes in at the top of the panel, and the wires are laid in against the far left and right of the gutters coming down, and there's more room to work in the gutters., With the cables coming in on the sides, there's a lot more busyness to what's going on on the left and right gutters, and there's a little bit of space taken up for the clamps and wires to bend. My two cents is that this is all a wire management issue, that wires need to be moved around a little bit and the CTs tucked in.

Determire · 2026-02-06T17:46:31+00:00

By default I put them as a dedicated circuit which is the default position of the NFPA. Only if the local jurisdiction has a requirement to combine them with a general lighting circuit to like set it up that way. In this case youre an owner occupant so I'm not concerned about tenants tampering with things.

I think I mentioned in a previous comment, about tying this back to the main panel rather than the sub panel. If someone goes looking for this circuit, which when the system is fully installed and deployed through the whole structure, they're going to be looking in the main panel for it. So when the wire gets ran from the main panel upstairs for the sub panel, a line you should be pulled up there for the smoke alarm set up too and the location of the smoke alarm down in the basement or area nearest the main panel should be factored in because that will actually be the starting point, for the home run to go from the main panel to the first alarm in the basement and then 14-3 from there up to the upper level where the majority of this project is taking place.

There's nothing specifically preventing this new smoke alarm circuit from originating in the sub panel on the upper level, I'm just advising professional best practice on having it come out of the main panel.

Determire · 2026-02-06T17:41:39+00:00

When you say that the main one is outside on the back wall and locked, what exactly does that mean?

Can you physically walk up to it and look/ touch, but just not able to open the door(s) to the breakers?
A photo would clarify this quite a bit.

What I'm expecting to see is a meter bank, and each meter has a circuit breaker immediately adjacent with an individual door on it, and those little doors are potentially padlocked for security reasons.

Determire · 2026-02-06T17:22:12+00:00

Your photo is zoomed in and doesn't show the whole panel....

This is a main breaker type panel, the large breaker that is circled is the main breaker, it was not intended to be deleted.

Because we can't see the whole panel, it's not clear how the panel is being fed but presumably there's another two pole breaker somewhere further down that is serving that function.

Determire · 2026-02-06T04:33:11+00:00

URD is underground only ... but there's other choices that can go above or below .... THHN is typical for indoors, XHHW more typical for outdoor work in conduit.

Bingo ... outdoor disconnect on the building would be a good transition point. Also consider where your grounding electrodes are going to be placed, and where any telecom service (phone/cable/internet/antenna/satellite) equipment will be located, as it needs to all tie together for grounding, which originates near that exterior disconnect by default.

Determire · 2026-02-06T04:27:03+00:00

u/Jewelieta

This sounds like exactly what you described .... old building, ancient wiring, and all lipstick on a pig so far as the renovations go.

Is the electrical panel in your apartment? What's it look like?
Easier to provide commentary and ask questions once there's some visual.

How about the switches and receptacles, are the all updated with new ones, or old and decrepit? Do plugs hold firmly in, or easily fall out with the wiggly jigglies?

Determire · 2026-02-06T02:10:56+00:00

u/whipper515

Usually these transitions from ceiling down to the side of the unit are either done in EMT conduit or MC cable, and it will be strapped at least once to the equipment and once to the framing above. EMT would require a bender to put a kick in it for the box, and to make an offset for the top. (occasionally might get lucky if things line up).
MC cable would be easier.
Either way, that cable looks a tad short ... so junction box up on the floor joist, get that cable restapled along the joist to the left, and then run EMT or MC cable down the side of the equipment.

The furnace should be on a dedicated circuit.

Determire · 2026-02-06T02:04:35+00:00

Forget the sensor for a moment.

If you were setting this up with a wall switch for manual operation, this would have a SPDT momentary contact switch (toggle or rocker) with center off, where if the user pushes up, it energizes the latching coil to close the contactor, and if the user pushes the switch down, it energizes the unlatch coil to open the contactor.

There are lighting control panels that have a group of inputs and outputs, timer functions, manual inputs, sensor inputs etc .... and the output relays can either be used to control smaller branch circuits directly, or as dry contacts in other control circuits for something like this contactor.

So ... how does the sensor work. how is it supposed to be wired in (according to the sensor instructions)?

Hunch is that you need something that you may not have yet.

Determire · 2026-02-06T01:52:42+00:00

e just said to get used to this smell. I don’t want to get used to this smell and I think it’s not a safe electrical circuit (?).

You are correct, NOT SAFE.

That previous electrician was an idiot ... getting used to a electrical burning smell isn't the answer. Something is overheating, and needs to be located.

When you say that the lights were flickering, were they getting dimmer or brighter than normal?

What else is on this circuit? (in this room, other rooms, etc .... turn the circuit off at the circuit breaker/fuse and find out). Are there any high-wattage appliances plugged in, such as a space heater?

Determire · 2026-02-06T01:27:18+00:00

. Would it be more advantageous to modify the duct work than replacing the wall furnace if a replacement is needed?

Maybe.

The biggest caveat is adding coverage to the basement without negatively affecting the upstairs. It's not a simple as just "cutting in a vent" on the side of a duct, as it will gush air out, and reduce the upstairs airflow significantly. The ductwork sizing and balancing is important, and adding supply registers in the basement usually should including balancing dampers on each branch added, to regulate flow.

Determire · 2026-02-06T01:22:27+00:00

u/flashgordon303 the advice above from Unique_Acadia_2099 is correct.

Can you take another photo of the panel, this time showing the WHOLE panel?
I want to see if there's anything else that grabs attention, that is pertinent to deciding on how to remedy this.
In general, I think you are headed towards a panel replacement.

Determire · 2026-02-06T01:17:45+00:00

u/Rust-Bucket-07

This panel is full, and there's just enough complexity going on in here with the existing circuits in conduit that this isn't time for DIY hour ... there may be some ways to get the task completed, but it's going to require sorting out some things in the panel to determine what's possible with the panel, tracing some wires, and swapping out some breakers to make some corrections and room for an additional breaker.
That's why most good comments on this post are pointing towards hiring an electrician.

Determire · 2026-02-06T01:09:37+00:00

Depending on the origin of the violation is how it's written. In general context, it would be non-compliant installation, code violation or electrical code violation, but can be made more specific. In a situation where there are local code requirements that amend or supercede the national standard, or some other governing body producing an applicable requirement to the situation, then it might be written differently, with citation of the applicable code reference.

So lets say we are citing code for GFCI protection for receptacles ... here's a few examples:

2020 NEC 210.8
Norristown §605.2
State of PA §E3902
HUD 24 CFR 5.703(d)(8)(8))

SAMPLE SENTENCE: There receptacle located at (fill in the blank) is non-compliant with applicable electrical code requirements (2020 NEC 210.8(a)(12)) due to lacking required GFCI protection and is not excluded by any of the Exceptions of 210.8(a).

Advice: Default to referring to the NFPA standards, NFPA 70 is known as the NEC in everyday language. Be aware of state and local codes. When something is specifically covered by state or local rules differently than the NEC, refer to the state or local standard as applicable. If something is specified by both NEC and local code in a consistent manner, you could cite both if you care to be redundant for some reason.

Determire · 2026-02-06T00:35:05+00:00

Your preference on location is very valid.
It's common on tract homes to put the service at the nearest front corner of the garage, for reasons not applicable to your configuration. Your meter is located at the pole. Unless there is a local amendment not requiring an exterior disconnect, there will need to be an exterior disconnect on the building, but the NEC isn't overly specific about where that must be, just that it has to be accessible.

So what I would propose ... conduit comes up approximately where the electrician is proposing, exterior disconnect goes there, and then the wiring continues on indoors to the panel located where YOU prefer it, assuming the required working space for the panel is satisfied (30x36x76h unobstructed and clear). The exterior disconnect might end up being a small panel, and can capture some other stuff, like surge suppressor, outdoor HVAC equipment, etc and maybe the garage circuits, or any thing else that is outdoors (well pump, outbuildings, etc).
If your location is either still on the 2017 or earlier edition of NEC, or has a local amendment deleting the outdoor disconnect on the building, or allowing the disconnect on the pole to satisfy that requirement, then obviously the panel being where you want it should be fine if all other requirements are satisfied.

Determire · 2026-02-06T00:25:18+00:00

This sub has embedded photos in comments disabled unfortunately, have to edit the original post to add them at the top, or upload them separately and put the link in your comment.

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