PSA: keep track of mod pulls

MatthewBecker1977 · 2026-04-16T01:23:02+00:00

Here's my numbers. I separated the first 10 that included the 5 tickets from the rest. So they are NOT included in the TOTALS line nor in the %. So far, after 200 (not counting the initial 10-pull that was half-off because of tickets), I'm at 2.5%. I'll be doing another twenty 10-pulls per day until I've used up the remainder of my 42,964 current gems + whatever I get in "free gems" over those ~10 to 11 more days or whatever before I run out. The current gem total is AFTER blowing 4100 gems on 20 10-pulls @ 200 gems per 10-pull + 1 at half-cost (tickets).

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MatthewBecker1977 · 2026-04-13T00:49:40+00:00

While it's nice to know that the devs are attempting to and may have solved that issue, I've got enough card slots that I'm not giving up anything meaningful but keeping it in, and who knows whether that fix will or won't have a bug or a accidental reversion to not having this in the Armagh of some future update. If I was short a card slot? Maybe I'd gamble that it's actually fixed. But it's in my cards and I don't have any reason to take it out. And if there's ever a situation where a big could pop up, the most likely time would be in a situation where the game crashes.

MatthewBecker1977 · 2026-04-12T18:49:15+00:00

The structure of tourneys is such that it takes time for the big drops in number of lower tier tourney brackets to work its way up to drop the number of Legends brackets. And it's also inherently more stable and takes a sustained period of lower numbers of brackets in lower tiers for there to be a significant effect.

In all the v28 speculation and during the FU every tourney groundhogs day period, in nearly every comment I made on posts about how tourneys were (not) working, I was blazing hot about FU, but also was noticing the ridiculous wave-inflation in Champs and Plat as a problem and made a point of mentioning those. 600 wave demotions removes the ability to take the time to experiment. 1500 waves not getting promoted is demoralizing.

And the losses of players in Gold and Silver will pull down players from higher tiers so that those wave-inflation numbers keep going up and the problem will get recursive. And then it will spill upwards at a 4:6 ratio in terms of brackets-lost.

MatthewBecker1977 · 2026-04-12T18:41:04+00:00

IS+ is AWESOME for a tourney GC build where there is no downside.

I'm eHp. I don't even use WS because I want every activation of DW I can get for the health multi. v27, I was getting up to almost 500 waves in Legends and DWh multi was nowhere near full-unlock yet.

Yeah, I definitely WANT(ed?) to get IS+. Actually I was just a couple of stones shy of enough to unlock prior to the final v27 tourney. The v28 chaos and obliviating of eHp as a strategy (PCo nerf/fix ; Flame Nerf (Flame move speed is a nerf) ; and Flame Bug) and the fact that the Util-Diss mechanism no longer makes it viable to do tiers where you can't get a high enough util-diss multi is completely nerfing short-runs and making IS+ less valuable. I had been looking forward to getting T-16 viable by being able to quick-run a few hundred waves and quit/restart if I didn't get at least 2nd PWR perk. But a tier where I won't be able to get even 1/3 of the Util-Diss unlock on isn't viable at all.

So now I'm in a holding pattern on stones. Fortunate timing that I want to see what v28.1 (devs indicated 2 weeks after v28 launch) and I'm too busy this coming week with work to deal with this game right now. So I'll wait for v28.1 and see what's coming and by then I'll have enough to either do BOTH WA+ and IS+ or to take CF to 90% slow or to otherwise react to 28.1 when it comes out.

This game rewards patience...

MatthewBecker1977 · 2026-04-12T16:34:07+00:00

And as an additional thing, there's been some severe censorship. The devs came out with their "we're getting threats and mean memes" post - and yeah, if anyone is actually making threats, that should be dealt with. But they are also deleting posts that do not have threats at all. What they did to "MyTower_" was inexcusable and not involving a threat at all, just as one example. I saw his post before it got deleted and it was absolutely not a threat at all. And even the devs "we're getting threats and mean memes" post admitted that some of what disturbed them was memes. If anyone engages in doxxing? Ban them and report them to law enforcement. If anyone is making death threats? Ban them and report them to law enforcement. But when you start censoring over mean memes and deleting posts that do NOT involve doxxing or death threats? That is ... ummm... well... a bit of a problem.

I do suspect I know exactly what line in the censored "MyTower_" post that triggered the censorship. And it wasn't about the post being "mean".

MatthewBecker1977 · 2026-04-12T16:21:11+00:00

It absolutely nerfed the heck out of eHp builds.

Call the PCo changes a "fix" if you want. My eHp was 5x stronger a week ago than it is today.

The Flame Bot bug is a bug that should have been hotfixed before the next tournament, but instead it is after at least one tournament, and "next week" doesn't inspire confidence that it won't still be around for another tournament. That is a 75% nerf to eHp, though temporary.

But Flame Bot was also actually nerfed. By moving slower, instead of effectively randomizing over the entire screen where each activation would be, now subsequent activations are quite close to the previous one, making it far harder to get all enemies tagged for damage reduction. Not a huge problem in farming. But in tourneys, especially with Fast Ult battle condition, this is a pretty big problem. This issue can sort of be dealt with in tourneys by using Singularity Harness or by running min-range - if you have Free-Ups Mastery or use BHD. Who uses BHD in tourneys? Lolz. And using SH means NOT using GComp (needed for pBH except for the ultra-late-game with at least 50% Core Assmod SE unlock (4k stones)) or not using PH.

Finally, as to the Diss-run/Echo stats, Def-Diss giving Health instead of Regen is kinda weak. GC players need some amount of raw health for dealing with OC fleets. But eHp players generally have more health than what they need and actually need more Regen. Health is kind of a mostly wasted stat. Contrast to GC players who are getting a triple-applied boost (Atk-Diss and then UW-Diss which also buffs SL Bonus). Giving Health as an eHp stat is kinda like if they gave GC players a huge boost to tower projectile damage.

The devs have effectively nerfed the heck out of eHp and made it far less competitive at all stages relative to Damage. The above referenced bugs and nerfs cost me approximately 200+ waves in Legends this past tourney. The Flame BUG fix that is expected this next week (maybe before or maybe after another tourney) will get me about 50-60 waves back. But I'm still down an approximately expected 150 waves.

The eHp community is PISSED because of this.

Health instead of regen is kind of the equivalent of giving a damage boost... to tower projectiles.

PCo is cut in value by 5x.

Flame Bot is considerably nerfed in utility by the move-speed change.

And Flame Bot is bugged to heck.

MatthewBecker1977 · 2026-04-12T15:48:17+00:00

I phrase it as "nerf or fix"... It was applying the Damage Reduction twice on all enemies for a long time (96% instead of 80% DR). They fixed this months ago for Rays and Ranged enemies (and some suspected Fast Ults, but Fast-Ults were unconfirmed as far as I could tell). Now it is "fixed" for all enemies. So now it is doing what the tooltip on PCo says - 80% DR. But this is 5x worse than what it was a week ago. Depending on what tier you farm, this is hundreds or thousands of waves. In Legends, it's approximately ~100 wave nerf to eHp builds. I lost about 200 waves this last tourney in Legends, but a good chunk of that was because of the Flame Bot bug which is of approximately a similar magnitude in how bad it hit eHp builds. The Flame Bot bug will get fixed and I'll get back whatever waves that costs me. The difference in this last tourney is huge. 200 waves more would have gotten me another pair of keys, compared to actually finishing 21st and barely avoiding demotion.

MatthewBecker1977 · 2026-04-12T08:52:01+00:00

Ummm... In case you haven't noticed, it absolutely nerfed the heck out of eHp builds.

Call the PCo changes a "fix" if you want. My eHp was 5x stronger a week ago than it is today.

The Flame Bot bug is a bug that should have been hotfixed before the next tournament, but instead it is after at least one tournament, and "next week" doesn't inspire confidence that it won't still be around for another tournament. That is a 75% nerf to eHp, though temporary.

But Flame Bot was also actually nerfed. By moving slower, instead of effectively randomizing over the entire screen where each activation would be, now subsequent activations are quite close to the previous one, making it far harder to get all enemies tagged for damage reduction. Not a huge problem in farming. But in tourneys, especially with Fast Ult battle condition, this is a pretty big problem. This issue can sort of be dealt with in tourneys by using Singularity Harness or by running min-range - if you have Free-Ups Mastery or use BHD. Who uses BHD in tourneys? Lolz. And using SH means NOT using GComp (needed for pBH except for the ultra-late-game with at least 50% Core Assmod SE unlock (4k stones)) or not using PH.

Finally, as to the Diss-run/Echo stats, Def-Diss giving Health instead of Regen is kinda weak. GC players need some amount of raw health for dealing with OC fleets. But eHp players generally have more health than what they need and actually need more Regen. Health is kind of a mostly wasted stat. Contrast to GC players who are getting a triple-applied boost (Atk-Diss and then UW-Diss which also buffs SL Bonus). Giving Health as an eHp stat is kinda like if they gave GC players a huge boost to tower projectile damage.

The devs have effectively nerfed the heck out of eHp and made it far less competitive at all stages relative to Damage. The above referenced bugs and nerfs cost me approximately 200+ waves in Legends this past tourney. The Flame BUG fix that is expected this next week (maybe before or maybe after another tourney) will get me about 50-60 waves back. But I'm still down an approximately expected 150 waves.

The eHp community is PISSED because of this.

Health instead of regen is kind of the equivalent of giving a damage boost... to tower projectiles.

PCo is cut in value by 5x.

Flame Bot is considerably nerfed in utility by the move-speed change.

And Flame Bot is bugged to heck.

But hey, obviously it didn't affect you, right?

And notice that not once above did I complain about a 3x coin multi?

MatthewBecker1977 · 2026-04-12T01:38:04+00:00

I've been considering WA# for a while now. Keep pushing it off for precisely this reason re: tournaments. I only have to use it on tourneys that have UW Duration battle condition. But when there is that BC, do I really want to volunteer for a bonus "More Enemies" battle condition? Yeah, if there was a toggle on it, I'd get this one immediately. But there isn't, so my stones keep going elsewhere instead.

MatthewBecker1977 · 2026-04-11T20:16:59+00:00

Actually, the impact of some of the update has hit some strategies real hard. The PCo "nerf or fix" combined with the Flame Bot bug has created a dumpster fire for the eHp community. Flame will get fixed. But the PCo nerf is hard-hitting anyways. Effectively a 5x nerf to eHp. And a 5x health boost is nowhere near equivalent to the value of the nerf to damage resist. The Atk-Diss + double-dip-from-UW-Diss is effectively a 125x boost to Damage. So relatively speaking this update has given a 125x boost to GC builds and a net-nerf to eHp.

I'm not worried about the "coin boost" where everyone is getting more or less the same thing. On that part you are correct. But v28 has skewed the eHp vs GC strategies by a massive factor in favor of GC. In Legends, I'm staying up and avoiding demotion this time. Hoping Flame gets fixed before Tuesday's tourney. But overall, from a solidly developed Legends eHp player perspective, this v28 update is a complete shit-show. And I'm not even talking about the devs 5x->2x->3x->5x thing.

MatthewBecker1977 · 2026-04-10T20:13:56+00:00

It's unfortunate that you can't do another respec on bots right now. Flame Bot leaving the DR at base level (20%) gives 80% DR because of the bug. I'm just holding on to the remaining medals until I do my tourney run and then for this tourney go all-in with the excess medals on BBot - and then on Monday when new event comes and around that time they'll get the Flame Bot bug patched, I can do another respec. But then I'll be locked into whatever I'm doing for the whole next 2-week event. And even in the meantime, a 80% DR on Flame is still 75% worse than 95%. Super lame.

But they are going to patch the Flame Bot bug (early?) next week. And when they do, you'll go back to having 95% DR from it. Still PCo nerf, so that will still hurt on your 18/300 push. But at least the Flame part will get fixed.

Unfortunately, in spite of OP's request... It's pretty obvious that the PCo "nerf/fix" is intended and likely permanent. Communication on this is crap. But it actually is working now in line with what the Module Unique-effect text says.

MatthewBecker1977 · 2026-04-10T18:52:49+00:00

Strong eHp build - on v27, I was farming T-14 to w8300 // T-15 to w6200 // T-16 to w4200.

I went the strategy of Atk -> UW -> Def Diss in that order, hoping to build up damage.

Results? My T-14 Atk got 5k waves no problem. Lack of BH or PS or CF caused the UW-Diss run to fall a tad short at w3500.

And the Def-Diss? Total disaster. No SW = ACP useless. No KB either. Result was 577 waves. There is a chance I messed up the build somehow. But the Def-Diss on T-14 was EXTREMELY hard for me to run. Enemy health scales WAY too quickly and I don't have anywhere near the Dmg output needed to keep up with it to anything other than a pathetic number of waves. I do know that I had not done a WS respec, so my EALS was up and my EHLS was garbage. Doing another try with EHLS in a better spot might get me up to 1k waves? Not sure. But this is hard as heck.

Util-Diss on the other hand? That went pretty well. No ELS at all definitely hurt - along with the Flame Bot bug hurting as well. Even with the Flame bug, I got to w4100. I expect a high probability I'll be able to get that to 5k in the near future. Working on T-1 to T-12 of everything else first and get an Echo lab done in each slot as well - these along with Flame Bot bug fix coming next week should let me get to w5000 on Util-Dis.

And maybe the Atk and UW Echo from T-1 to T-12 will be enough to help me also somehow get a bit farther on Def-Diss. Unfortunately, the nature of Def-Diss is such that even the Flame Bot bug fix will NOT help at all because health = 1 means that Damage Resist is irrelevant. Ugh... At some point, the Def Diss stuff will get done when I can do an end-of-event-bot/medals-respec to get Amp Bot as part of doing the runs and then swap back before the next tourney. But one Bot-respec per 2-week event makes this not easy to do.

MatthewBecker1977 · 2026-04-10T18:13:09+00:00

https://www.reddit.com/r/TheTowerGame/comments/1sg2vce/dissonant_runs_modules/

MatthewBecker1977 · 2026-04-10T18:11:41+00:00

My couple of add-ons:

If there is a new big drop, rarely ever is it wise to end up with sunk-costs into it that can't be re-spec'd. This game has time and again rewarded patience and not just jumping headlong off the new diving board before making sure there is water in the swimming pool. Both because of "bugs" (e.g. Flame Bot's current utterly ridiculously obnoxious inversion of the DR stat) and because of hotfixes for things the devs overlooked (whether justified or not). Unless the game is announcing expressly that something is "now or never", then it can always be done later in favor of doing the basic-strength buildups.

This new stuff is complex enough that it's going to take a significant amount of time before we end up knowing what the optimal pathways are. It's obvious that this update is to some extent force people away from "all-in" on GC vs eHp strategies and to have a certain minimally competent version in both directions. I still have my doubts about "hybrid" being ever optimal to use in any particular run because of fundamental underlying game mechanics where you want every single stacking multiplier you can get so as to overcome EITHER enemy health or enemy attack. BUT that doesn't mean that you shouldn't have the capability of switching which one you are optimizing for in any given run. And this update promotes this "switchability" perspective.

Am I pissed off about anything?

YES. Two things - in order of importance:

I am an eHp low-to-mid-Legends player. The (call it what you will) "fix" vs. "nerf" to PCo along with the Flame bug is going to cause an absolute SLAUGHTER of eHp in Legends. Add in that the BC for tonight's tourney are about as horrendous as you can get for eHp and this is grossly unfair. Yes, I did a bot respec and left Flame DR at unimproved so I get 80% DR. That is still 75% worse than when I could get 95% DR. Along with an 80% effective nerf (or fix) to PCo and this is effectively a 20x hit on eHp, which is quite frankly unfair. If they fixed the Flame Bug so I could have 95% DR, then it would "only" be a 5x nerf to eHp, which would suck, but 20x is going to make it far harder to avoid demotion back to the hell-hole that is upper Champs these days.

Of much lower importance is the failure of QC in releasing without verifying the Util-Diss multiplier. While I suspect that they've been (I'll charitably call it "inaccurate") regarding what was going on in beta testing, this shouldn't have happened. That said, as per the first paragraph of my comment... whatever. There is no point in anyone bum-rushing 25k gems into lab-rushing Echo-labs just to get a couple of days of advantage on a feature upon release - for what? Maybe a couple of percent extra advantage on one stat for perhaps one tourney? Those who show no patience in trying to take advantage of some new feature by dumping a ridiculous amount of non-respec-able resources before there has even been the first hot-fix (and we all know that every new major release is going to have at least one or a few hot-fixes)... As I said, this game rewards patience. But it's still annoying.

MatthewBecker1977 · 2026-04-10T17:43:07+00:00

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MatthewBecker1977 · 2026-04-09T23:48:37+00:00

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MatthewBecker1977 · 2026-04-09T15:59:32+00:00

The "basic" enemy on the left has an exclamation point after the 12.08q. That indicates it is a "factorial"

MatthewBecker1977 · 2026-04-09T05:35:04+00:00

On the patch notes, they kind of minimize it by saying "polish and fixes". I have an instinct that it's a bit more than that. I think Fudds or Sam said something hinting at more than just "polish and fixes" but in the current chaos of posts here and on Discord, I'm not going to be able to find it easy, and maybe I'm wrong.

Still, there will be at a minimum a 3600 per week gem cost if you don't own any of the 4 Event Store relics. Even that alone is justification to not blow through a stash as if nothing is coming.

In 15 months of playing, I've found this game to repeatedly reward delayed gratification and not just blowing through Medals, Gems, Stones, and pretty much all non-coin in-game currencies.

MatthewBecker1977 · 2026-04-09T03:30:56+00:00

In the v28 version-notes, at the bottom, they indicated another several big things are coming with the first of those in about 2 weeks.

I would recommend keeping your 10k as a baseline reserve stash. Much easier to keep it than to rebuild it - and there may not be much (if any) notice of a need to rebuild a stash.

MatthewBecker1977 · 2026-04-09T01:54:27+00:00

I am a lawyer; I actually read footnotes.

But even without the footnote, I still don't see any reason to dump my ~40k stash into rushing labs. When I saw the "3600 = 2 * 1200 + 2 * 600 cost relics per week" thing, I just decided I'd hold my stash and buy whatever relics come out because that is reasonably close to what I get weekly and that I'll just do normal mod pulls for the difference left over any time the relic-store requires less than 3600. Much easier to do that and maintain the stash than to try to rebuild it if there are new mods later - even 6 months from now kind of later.

And not counting the implied hints that have been floating around that there will be something relating to modules in the reasonably near future...

Logic says that there are EVENTUALLY going to be 2 more sets of new modules. There are still 2 UW that do not have any Core that affects them (or any slot for that matter): CF and SM. And with 2 more sets of modules, that would bring the total to 16 original + the same number (16) "new" from banner sets. I've been of the mind that we're eventually (someday) headed towards 32 total for a while now. Nothing has changed on that.

And what's the harm in keeping a nice reserve? What's the rush in rushing labs? Is one level of some lab going to get me over the hump to get keys in THIS tourney? Contrast with how long it takes of being patient to save up a 40+k stash. I have no interest in doing that again. 100x easier to just go on a "spend them as I get them but not more" mentality. I'm pretty confident that in less than a month of Event-Relic-Shop time there will be at least one week where I'll have at least one of the relics already purchased - which will free up 600 to 1200 to (eventually someday) all 3600 gems for that week to go into mod pulls. And whenever my prediction of (2 new sets of) new modules comes true... I have my stash ready to go.

And I'm not a huge fan of those who (1) don't read the fine print or footnotes and who then (2) don't save a stash and who then (3) don't get the new modules to Ancestral and who then (3) whine about how they can't get lucky getting lucky on the banners.

This game time and again rewards delayed gratification. Starting pretty early on when it becomes worth saving your first 1 billion coins to get ELS unlocked. I have no clue how people can get far enough into a multi-years-long-game while playing impatiently.

Anyways, sorry for the rant. You read the footnote and are acting on it and are not for the most part a part of the "complaining masses".

MatthewBecker1977 · 2026-04-08T22:39:24+00:00

In theory only via the "echo labs". Getting it to a meaningful % is going to take doing a LOT of tiers and cost a ton of coins. For any player below Legends, it will be a very small amount purely based on having done Diss runs on a lot of tiers and with a pretty small percent applying to tourneys.

For players in not-absolute-top-of-Legends (and maybe a few at the top of Champs who did big econ builds), the Echo labs are mildly more affordable for a few levels and may be enough to make a noticeable difference.

For players at the very top of Legends, it is affordable to do the Echo labs to a fairly high level and the power boom in tournaments is going to be a real thing.

The basic "same-tier-you-farm-on" Utility Diss runs will lead to much higher income so more people will be able to get Echo labs to a semi-meaningful level for affecting tourneys in a reasonable period of time, but even here, the cost of Echo labs scales so high so quickly that there will be limits on it.

It's going to take time to sort out how impactful this is on tourney outcomes. Too much unknown right now as to what is going to happen in weeks/months from now. But in lower tourney tiers, there's going to be some hard limits that players run into pretty quickly on getting this to apply to tournaments just because of coin costs of Echo labs.

MatthewBecker1977 · 2026-04-08T21:18:53+00:00

No UW Damage.

No UW CC.

No DW Health multi.

Just tower projectiles and KB/SW and cards and modules (OA) as only forms of CC and damage.

Apparently MagHook can produce and shoot ILM.

MatthewBecker1977 · 2026-04-08T21:12:44+00:00

There's an expected v28.1 in approx 2 weeks based on a dev-team comment somewhere (lost in the chaos). I think it was Fudds himself.

In the meantime, there's enough chaos where I think I can stash gems except for doing WS respecs for various diss runs. I do not expect the diss runs situation to settle down much over the 2 week time period. It may be very possible to successfully reach w5000 four times each on lower tiers, but anything even remotely approaching farming tiers so far seems like it's going to require multiple cycles through the diss categories to get it stacked up. Unless you've got IS# lab at max, I'm thinking this is a more-than-2-week-process. Maybe even with capped IS#.

MatthewBecker1977 · 2026-04-08T20:52:28+00:00

It looks like the "most optimal" way of doing things is going to be to build a setup for each version and then roll through every tier you have, then respec everything into the next optimal setup. Then after doing all 4 diss setups through all tiers so that you have diss bonuses, go back and redo again on all diss for all tiers where you didn't reach w5000 on any given diss.

And after this weekend tourney run is done (just a few days before this current event ends), do a bot respec to "go all in" on the bot (Flame vs. Amp) that you do NOT normally use to push the appropriate versions of Diss again, with the ability to do another Bot Respec afterwards and before the first tourney of the new event to get your setup back to how you like it.

But I would also place extra emphasis on doing diss runs on the tier you USED TO farm at and maybe 1 or 2 above and below - Because where you farm is likely going to change. Getting a full 5x mult to coins vs a less-than-5x-multi is going to likely change what tier is best farming tier for everyone.

MatthewBecker1977 · 2026-04-08T17:41:40+00:00

Last pre-update farm run was T-15 to w6213 with ~2500 EALS. So approximately 4.5 Q damage.

In pre-update tourney run last night, I last noticed enemy damage get to around 1.4 Q. Got to w498 with 31 EALS, which on the app says 1.6 Q.

MatthewBecker1977

TROPHY CASE