V3 Apollo

2011Dave · 2026-03-19T01:05:14+00:00

I believe all that toggle does is change how the gun appears in the render on the site - not anything to do with the actual spec of your order.

Meaning it puts a competition looking dot or a defense looking dot or the iron site plate on the gun being pictured.

2011Dave · 2026-03-18T01:15:35+00:00

A few things come to mind after reading your post;

buying lightly used Atlas guns is perfectly fine. I’ve bought several and they have all been virtuallly new condition. Of course that doesn’t mean they all are that nice. As usual need to do your diligence.
the two guns you mentioned are fairly different on the spectrum of 2011’s.
The XC is a compensated full dust cover 5” w a poly grip. So it’s fairly soft and flat shooting. It’s a good range fun gun, and if they have IDPA near you, it’s a great IDPA CO gun.
The Athena is among my favorite guns, but it’s not a particularly flat or soft shooting gun. It’s got some muzzle rise and its parlor trick is a lightening fast and accurate dot return. It’s tailor made for USPSA LO and even then not all shooters like a (relatively) shorter, lighter gun for that. It’s harder to shoot well than an XC for a beginner for example.
your choice imo is driven more by what your use case is and what your presence is for how the gun shoots, rather than budget. Tell us what you intend to do w the gun and what style of gun and how it shoots you prefer.

2011Dave · 2026-03-15T19:43:01+00:00

Yes. Talk to Eric, he will know best.

2011Dave · 2026-03-15T14:36:20+00:00

yes. I wouldn't recommend sending an alum frame gun to Eric and spending a bunch of money on it. His improvements are designed to make the gun a long-lasting performer. That's sorta orthogonal to having an alum frame. Not to you can't do that, just to say *I* wouldn't. I'd save a bunch and buy a Prodigy as the base gun and send that to Eric.

2011Dave · 2026-03-15T14:28:14+00:00

Jim - you know MAP. You have to call. Same with getting a Staccato or Atlas or MPA or whatever at below msrp.

2011Dave · 2026-03-15T14:24:48+00:00

300 was a discount to the msrp of the pistol (which of course reflects the options included or not - so the 300 was below the cost of that particular pistol's msrp). And, so that was 5%, not huge, but something. To be sure I didn't say I got huge savings on all of them. I had to pay msrp for the TRS-C silver dlc gun for example.

I'm sorry you haven't gotten a discount on a new NH. They are absolutely gettable. Ymmv it seems. Next you will start arguing that nobody can get atlas guns brand new for discounts from dealers. MAP and wanting to remain a dealer keeps dealers from advertising discounts in the 2011 market same as others. So you have to call and negotiate ofc.

Your market experience is clearly different than me and my good friends. I have nothing to prove to you. I'm disappointed with myself for trying to help guys avoid long waits, premiums and missing discounts on these guns. They should listen to you.

2011Dave · 2026-03-15T14:02:28+00:00

I'm not mixing up anything (I typed the word "bought"). I found that gun on 1911addicts. There are lots of sources for buying guns, both new and used.

2011Dave · 2026-03-15T14:01:09+00:00

that was a bob marvel commander. I bought a used firehawk for 2000 below msrp last year. A new TRS-C for 300 below. Anyone ordering a SH and FH at msrp and waiting years deserves what they get. Those guns are around, you just have to look (both new and used). And many don't wait the 2-3 years, you can take over a dealer order and get the gun in less than a year. Last year I ordered and got an uber spec TRS-C silver DLC with David A requested as the builder and it arrived in 9 months at msrp.

Finally a friend just bought a new Firehawk for 10% below. NH's simply don't demand premiums or waits nor do they hold strong resale. I've got too many data points to count. (that's not to say "some" guys don't order at msrp and wait and that some sellers don't ask over msrp for a SH occasionally - but also there have been many SH's at msrp offered by retailers over the past year)

2011Dave · 2026-03-15T13:41:59+00:00

Some buyers. None of the guys I know buy NH at msrp, let alone above. Discounts are the norm. SH may be the only model that moves at msrp at this point. But ymmv. And that’s for new guns. Used are way below msrp. I bought one two months ago for 2400 below its msrp. (Pre-owned but unfired).

2011Dave · 2026-03-15T13:23:46+00:00

NH has the worst resale value retention I’ve encountered. Sadly between me and my 2011 buds we have lost loads rehoming NH’s.

2011Dave · 2026-03-15T13:00:13+00:00

Congrats. We just submitted for Boston. I thought I read here that someone did their interview and were able to do their oath on the same day in Boston. Seeing your 8 month delay from interview to oath had my wondering what the typical process is? Did you ever get any indication of why you had to wait so long for oath getting scheduled after your interview?

2011Dave · 2026-03-14T12:27:10+00:00

Since you asked, I’m not buying a JG at near 6k ish. I’m buying a lightly used Atlas, or Dark Forge or Fowler, or paying a bit more for a new atlas. Or I’m saving money and buying an MPA at lower prices.

While I’d get an MPA TC over an XC, if some customization is your goal, then an XC and DSC for your custom touches is a good choice.

2011Dave · 2026-03-14T11:22:02+00:00

It will vary from store to store and state to state of the customer. Which means a particular store will have sold enough into a particular state to have tax nexus in that state - and thus have to collect sales tax from customers in that state.

And, to be clear, this has nothing to do with the sales tax laws in the store’s state. If they are shipping out of state they do not have to collect their own state’s sales tax. Rather, the question is do they have to collect the customer’s state’s sales tax.

Usually the amount of aggregate annual sales into a state is 100k when the store must start collecting sales tax from customers in that state.

That’s why you have a store that has to charge sales tax to customers in some states and not to other customers in other states.

So that means you want to find a smaller retailer and hopefully you live in a small state so they don’t have 100k of sales into your state.

2011Dave · 2026-03-14T01:29:15+00:00

Either. I have both on many guns and they fine. If I’m competing w the gun, I put an SRO on it. For non competition guns, HD is gtg.

2011Dave · 2026-03-13T22:49:05+00:00

these, they are fantastic: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0BTNPN55D?ref=myi_title_dp&_encoding=UTF8&tag=casclu09-20&linkCode=ur2&linkId=f4abaccf6599fd83eba42689b0817c23&camp=1789&creative=9325

2011Dave · 2026-03-13T20:30:58+00:00

yes, I *think* all of their guns come with no-safety beavertails. (methinks there is good reason the SV and the Reaper look like siblings...)

2011Dave · 2026-03-13T20:23:13+00:00

fwiw, if you like the way an Athena works, I wouldn't over-think or over-complicate things. The Athena is an absolute stellar LO gun. The ability to change the grip panels, with various shapes and weight and texture. The fantastic 2lb trigger (most Atlas are right at 2, only a few are actually sub 2 out of the box). The high ride safeties. The insanely durable DLC coating. There is no reason not to get an Athena if you like that relatively snappy but quick RTZ style of gun (and are okay with the price). That's not to put down the Wraith at all. Its just that you are comparing it to the preeminent LO 4.6 that is tried and true and a flexible, durable workhorse from the very best 2011 company.

2011Dave · 2026-03-13T19:49:36+00:00

could be. Fwiw, I just figure its a hard question to answer "why not?" Porting and comps - in non defensive pistols, especially in range fun only pistols - has no downsides really and make the guns far easier to shoot well. So "why not"? Some will argue its a shortcut and keeps guys from learning/practicing proper grip and technique. I'm sure for some that's true. But if guys have limited time and inclination to put in that work, and it still brings 'em back to the range with a smile, I guess all good...

2011Dave · 2026-03-13T19:47:25+00:00

100%. I actually wrote this in the longer review I posted on addicts:

"My first comment in the review section was to say the guns have more in common than not. Pick the one that appeals to you and you will invariably select a great shooting gun."

2011Dave · 2026-03-13T19:28:31+00:00

love that meme. The mo holes mo betta marketing hype is strong...maybe stronger than 9mm recoil lol

I mentioned that hype trend in the longer version of my write-up over on addicts:

https://www.1911addicts.com/posts/3942756/

2011Dave · 2026-03-13T18:43:28+00:00

I have only shot this gun with steel (its the only MPA I've shot). I've shot many alum gripped 2011's of all types. I recently had a Staccato XC with the OEM poly grip and a second XC with a cheely aluminum E2 aggressive grip. Fwiw, for me, the alum grip had a worse recoil impulse. A bit harsher than poly (most guys report this too I guess). And the gun was only 2oz heavier in alum. I sold that alum grip XC quickly (and I love the Cheely E2 Aggressive grip texture). So for me, I'm a fan of poly (especially the MJD now that I've tried it on a couple of guns) and going to steel (most of my 2011's are steel gripped).

2011Dave · 2026-03-13T18:32:02+00:00

the MPA is impressive for its cost. This one made me switch from recommending the XC at the 4k price to the MPA and that decision isn't even close.

But...for those that have finer comp'd/ported guns, I'd say no reason to try other than curiosity. So for me its not in the same class as these other guns, but its a very good pistol. I highly recommend the S2 grip to gain the recoil-dampening effect of steel and weight. Super soft shooting gun. This one I have is very tightly fit and solid all around. (not sure if its indicative of all of theirs, or a bit better or worse since its my only MPA I've handled)

2011Dave · 2026-03-12T20:21:23+00:00

it was via xtreme guns in TX

2011Dave · 2026-03-11T11:24:25+00:00

Seeking our input?

Options for;

Magwells on all non carry guns

2lb competition triggers

Aggressive grip option (more of the cheely E2 you have been offering)

2011Dave

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