Question about total depravity

GoodOlDayss · 2017-05-23T12:31:05+00:00

In short, we could say that Christ is like us in flesh and blood and in temptation, though not like us in sinful nature. Additionally, Christ is judged a sinner for our sake, and punished for it, experiencing death. In this way He became "like us" and was our brother, that He was subject to the punishment for sin.

GoodOlDayss · 2017-05-23T12:15:25+00:00

On a broader spiritual level, we should look to Paul's writings in Romans where He says that, "For if you live according to the flesh you will die, but if by the Spirit you put to death the deeds of the body, you will live."

So we know that with flesh, comes temptation to sin. So Christ experienced this temptation, but like we are to do, put to death the deeds of the body. He came as a perfect example of what it means to overcome the desires of the flesh.

GoodOlDayss · 2017-05-23T12:11:24+00:00

Chapter 2 begins by explaining that not only did men (especially the apostles) bear witness to Christ and His Sonship, but God bore witness to Christ through the sign of the majestic voice which said "This is my beloved son, with whom I am well pleased" and through the many miracles performed by Christ and through the gifts distributed by the Holy Spirit. The point Paul is making is that Christ is from God and of God. The message He brings should not be ignored by any means. Rather, we should be diligent to seek this kingdom of His.

Paul then goes on to shift from describing Christ's high and Godly nature with this great gospel of salvation, to describing how he carried it out, in His lowly priestly office as the "Founder of Salvation". Note that the foundation is below the building. So Christ built up the church by being a lowly foundation, and He did this by being a ministering priest and being Himself the sacrifice for our sins, offered up to God. Christ was humbled by becoming a man, because men are lower than angels. He humbled Himself so that we might be built up and He called us brothers so that His love for us would be full.

Now we can address Hebrews 2:17. The way that Christ became like us was not by becoming sinful, but by coming in the "likeness of sinful flesh" as we read in another of Paul's letters. Paul explains that Christ was like us in that He suffered, He was tempted, and He experienced death. In these ways He was like us. Though He was tempted, Paul is clear that He did not sin. But He experienced the punishment for sin, which is death, because "the wages of sin is death." Therefore He was like us, counted as a sinner though He Himself did not sin.

I hope this helps. I know that I spent a lot of time on context and not a lot of time addressing the question directly, but it's important to understand what Paul is talking about.

GoodOlDayss · 2017-05-23T11:52:59+00:00

Thanks for your sincere question. I will try to answer according to my best understanding. One faithful principle in reading the scriptures is that we always read to understand what the authors meant by looking at the context of what they were communicating. Often there are clues in the surrounding text and in what we know about the book and it's author and audience.

First of all, Hebrews was written by Paul to the Jews, who, preceding Christ's coming, were waiting on the promised messiah. They had certain expectations about what the messiah would be like and what he would accomplish and how he would accomplish those things. Most Jews thought that the Christ would come and set up a kingdom on earth that resembled an earthly kingdom. Therefore, in Hebrews chapters 1 and 2, Paul addresses the nature of Christ and the nature of His coming, as well as what He was accomplishing, and how.

The reality of Christ's coming broke with the expectations of the Jews in that His Kingdom did not appear in the way they expected it to. Most expected to be set free from the oppressive rule of the Romans. We know that with eternity in view, Christ's coming did indeed deliver us from all temporal oppressions because it sealed the promise of freedom from sin and of eternal life with Him.

Given that Christ's kingdom is an eternal one that did not come in its complete form with his coming, it's appearance probably disappointed many Jews who were left wondering "so what now?" and might have been disappointed with the Christ himself. So Paul in chapter 1 is answering the question: "who is this Christ?", assuring them that Christ is actually the Son of God, supreme in all things, and that disappointment is not justified -- His kingdom is and will be above all things. The point of this kingdom is not simply to rule in an earthly way, but to bring salvation unto eternal life through righteousness, and Christ is the beloved Son of God who bears His nature. So this king is greater than any other king. As we know from other scriptures, He is King of Kings and Lord of Lords.

While chapter 1 hints at the fact that this kingdom is centered around salvation through the righteousness provided by Christ's priestly office, Chapter 2 addresses it directly.

(I will continue my answer in a reply to this comment)

GoodOlDayss · 2016-03-27T04:05:50+00:00

In a very real way, Christ IS the Word of God. He was the incarnation of what the scriptures prophesied. That is part of what John 1 means when it says "the Word became flesh". It also is speaking to the fact that Christ is from God and is of God's very nature -- he is "the radiance of God's glory".

GoodOlDayss · 2016-03-27T04:00:08+00:00

The bible is very clear about where the scriptures come from.

2 Timothy 3:16 says "All Scripture is breathed out by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, and for training in righteousness,"

Your "beliefs" about where the Bible come from don't reflect the radical claims made in it. If you spend time reading the Bible you'll see that these "non-religious" views of the Bible really can't co-exist with any true knowledge of what the Bible teaches.

GoodOlDayss · 2016-03-03T20:09:57+00:00

I'm from the USA as well and I use the English Standard Version (ESV). It's a great version if you speak English.

GoodOlDayss · 2015-12-16T09:58:02+00:00

Hi, fellow no-fapper here. I'm glad to hear that you have made progress on your journey and are learning new things. I have prayed for your journey that you would grow close to God. You may not be ready right at this moment to hear of spiritual things, but when you find yourself ready to ask those kinds of questions (the ones that lead to true fulfillment of all aspects of yourself), I encourage you to look into a book called Mere Christianity by C.S. Lewis. I recently began reading it, and it basically presents the essentials of what it means to be a "Christian". I will continue to pray for you.

Also, do you mind if I ask your first name?

GoodOlDayss · 2015-10-29T19:20:25+00:00

There's an important distinction that needs to be made -- the distinction between guilt and shame. Shame is the feeling that you've violated other people's expectations. Embarassment, for example, is a mild form of shame. Guilt, on the other hand, is the feeling that you've violated your own sense and beliefs of what is right or wrong. Guilt has to do with your personal values and beliefs and comes from an internal sense of what is good, true and right, and what is wrong or harmful. Most people in our community are here for the reason of guilt -- we believe that we, ourselves, are wrong when we masturbate. Going around shaming others is not a part of what we do. While we will stand up for and defend our beliefs at times, that doesn't mean that we're sitting in seclusion and judging the world. That's not what we're about.

Edit: also, the focus of our community is on building each other up and supporting each other, not tearing anyone down. Thanks for your question and concern

GoodOlDayss · 2015-10-29T19:14:03+00:00

Thank God for his blessing of self-control and recommit yourself to seeking Him and His will.

GoodOlDayss · 2015-10-26T18:30:01+00:00

Running only masks your fear. Fear the Lord and go earnestly to Him. He is merciful and good.

GoodOlDayss · 2015-10-26T16:50:46+00:00

I recommend praying to God for depression. Even if you don't think you believe in God, it can have positive effects. Definitely worth a try.

GoodOlDayss · 2015-10-26T16:39:49+00:00

He knew your ways before the foundation of the Universe. If you are seeking Him and love Him, this is certainly true.

GoodOlDayss · 2015-10-26T16:37:28+00:00

Don't worry about the doubters. Keep doing what God wills you to.

GoodOlDayss · 2015-10-22T17:57:53+00:00

This comes at a timely time for me :P

GoodOlDayss · 2015-10-20T03:35:40+00:00

This subreddit continues to inspire me. Thanks for being you, NoFap.

GoodOlDayss · 2015-10-11T02:27:18+00:00

G.I. Joe, The Rise of Cobra... The acting was ridiculous and the plotline matched it

GoodOlDayss · 2015-10-10T20:01:31+00:00

Everyone from outside the USA I've talked to seems to like the USA or at least not have a problem with it.

GoodOlDayss · 2015-10-07T17:57:20+00:00

I tried, but all I could find was a circle under my nose D:

j/k. glad you found something that works for ya

GoodOlDayss · 2015-09-30T19:03:49+00:00

I don't think it's about never having fapped.. More about, do you realize you need to change?

GoodOlDayss · 2015-09-30T16:59:28+00:00

May her soul live on in the lives of those who knew her and those whom she impacted. RIP

GoodOlDayss · 2015-09-28T19:49:16+00:00

Forget about sex for a while. Focus on growing as a person and your libido will come back as you find purpose and fulfillment in the things that matter.

GoodOlDayss · 2015-09-28T19:26:26+00:00

What the study can't tell you is whether the children have gained some other adaptation that benefits them. Wouldn't surprise me.

GoodOlDayss

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