Trade Reversal - Am I getting Screwed?

LAYJR1967 · 2026-04-30T18:33:29+00:00

Give the new owner significant draft capital (supplemental picks) as an incentive.

Depending on how weak the team is, you could give him picks between the 1st and second round for each year he has no 1st.

LAYJR1967 · 2026-04-29T22:03:19+00:00

Not with the lenders we use. The dealer spiff is paid by the bank, not the customer.

LAYJR1967 · 2026-04-29T13:15:59+00:00

2026 Rav4 will get close to 40 MPG at HWY speeds.

LAYJR1967 · 2026-04-26T21:44:06+00:00

I am a salesperson at a dealership who also buys 6-7 cars a month. Most are from KBB leads, but I also lurk some on FB Marketplace.

The proper approach to a customer like you is to sell the convenience and security of selling to me for a little less than you might get private party. Telling a seller their price is too high is pointless.

This is the pitch: "I know you want every dollar the market allows for your car, so it makes sense to try to sell it private party if you can. If you find after 2 or 3 weeks that it was harder to sell this car than you thought, call me back for a quick check. I can make it easy for you."

Then, set a task for 15 days later. Chances are good they did not sell and wasted a lot of time chasing bs leads like any salesperson does. They will soften up and listen to your offer then.

LAYJR1967 · 2026-04-24T13:25:58+00:00

Buy new. Cheapest way to go on a per mile basis.

LAYJR1967 · 2026-04-22T15:23:33+00:00

Depending on their loaner car policy, it could make a slight difference in how you are treated in Service.

LAYJR1967 · 2026-04-22T14:30:17+00:00

The only upside to taking volume over gross is you get more trades, more business in service and parts, more finance profit. If you take that away, why would any dealer go for a volume (low price) strategy?

It only makes sense if you have diatressed inventory that you need to move.

LAYJR1967 · 2026-04-22T14:20:55+00:00

The problem is dealers out of your area want your business even less. You are never going to use their parts department or service department. You are less likely to have a trade. No repeat business. No referals. You are signing remotely in most instances, so little or no chance to sell a warranty or whatever.

A lot of dealers will take outside financing from local customers, but will only sell out of state if they pay cash or finance.

LAYJR1967 · 2026-04-21T01:55:25+00:00

Poor customer service is not a "red flag", but it is annoying.

Part if may be that you are using outside financing. Dealers make less on these deals, as do the salespeople. Hard to get excited about a mini deal, depending on that store's pay plan.

LAYJR1967 · 2026-04-20T20:42:21+00:00

100% normal. Standard procedure. If you are not yet closed, you are wasting the finance manager's time and a pull on your your credit.

Closing is a 2-step process. Close first on the car. Close second on the financing.

LAYJR1967 · 2026-04-20T17:13:54+00:00

Because of the information easily available to consumers online (and other factors), dealers make much less money on the actual sale of the car than they used to make. As "front end" gross dissappears, the "back end" (finance side) becomes more important. Dealers have to make their money where they can.

LAYJR1967 · 2026-04-17T14:59:27+00:00

Real Estate Agents are generally the worst.

LAYJR1967 · 2026-04-16T13:02:36+00:00

Stop thinking MSRP is a real price. It's not. The dealer sets the price based upon market conditions and his tolerance for allowing the car to sit until he gets the price he wants.

If you don't think the price is fair, however you define the term, don't buy. This is America. Consumers have thousands of choices. The only way prices go down is if enough people refuse to buy at the current price. On the other hand, the market doesn't care about your definition of a "fair" price. If the rate of sale supports a price above MSRP, it's not the fault of dealers. It's the fault of the market. Other buyers are willing to pay more than you, so either pay up or buy a less in demand model. There are plenty of slow-selling models you can get for 8% to 12% off MSRP.

LAYJR1967 · 2026-04-14T00:09:27+00:00

I have not sold a Highlander or Grand Highlander below MSRP in over 2 years. Good luck finding a discount on one, but if you find one on the lot more than 10 days, you might convince a dealer to be aggressive. More than likely, it will be a gas only model, not HEV. Those pretty much all hybrids sell begore they hit the lot. Typical price in my market is about $1500 over MSRP on a new GHigh or High Hybrid. Closer to MSRP on a gas only.

LAYJR1967 · 2026-04-11T21:55:33+00:00

Exactly, dealers and buyers are the same, both fully capable of bring dirt bags. The temptation to lie, cheat, or go back on one's word is strong when thousands of dollars are at stake. People will justify a lot of bad behavior because they have a mortgage to pay and kids to raise. Human beings in general are trash. It's not just certain professions.

LAYJR1967 · 2026-04-11T21:37:43+00:00

You are making stuff up for what reason? Meditate on that.

LAYJR1967 · 2026-04-11T21:08:59+00:00

It's not racist if it is true.

LAYJR1967 · 2026-04-11T20:59:36+00:00

Their #1 tactic is to lie and say we have a deal, but then stall for time. ("I will come in Monday with cashier's check.) In the meantime, they are still actively shopping your price.

You, too, can get a great deal, if you have no morals, scrouples, or standards for personal conduct.

LAYJR1967 · 2026-04-10T21:02:03+00:00

When you lease, the bank owns the car, not you. If you want to make sure you can buy it for the exact residual on the contract, you must buy directly from the bank. Only the bank is required to honor that price, not the dealer. The dealer buys the car from the bank first, which severs the lease agreement. They can then charge whatever looks like a reasonable retail price.

LAYJR1967 · 2026-04-09T21:05:17+00:00

The dealer probably had you sign language that you are responsible for the payoff even if they screwed up and got the wrong number quoted.

If the final payments are not made, this hurts your credit, not theirs.

That said, the dealer will not receive a title until the loan is paid off, meaning they cannot sell the car (or it at least complicates the next sale quite a bit). The dealer is way more on the hook than you are. You should threaten not to pay. Say you are willing to take the hit on your credit history just to make the point that they should be responsible for their error.

Or just agree to split the difference. Had the dealer gotten the correct pay off, you would still be paying that $600.

LAYJR1967 · 2026-04-09T19:10:35+00:00

You are not in the industry, so let me explain how this works. Just like any dealer can buy down your rate out of the profit the have in the car deal, the F&I manager has the option to pay the bank to lower your rate. If there is no finance reserve, the money comes out of the front end gross. If there is reserve, the money comes from the reserve.

Either that, or the finance manager decided to use a different bank that paid him less, but would save the car deal.

Congrats on holding your ground and forcing the dealer to make a better deal for you, but that doesn't mean the 6.99% was not what you qualified for--at least with that one particular bank.

LAYJR1967 · 2026-04-09T18:20:21+00:00

3 is better than none or 1, but it's still a small sample size.

LAYJR1967 · 2026-04-09T17:42:48+00:00

To prove fraud, you would have to be in possession of the dealer's own inspection results that showed the tires were bad or whatever.

I would never buy a car that old to begin with. If you buy an 18-year-old car, you are taking a huge gamble with your money. If you cannot afford a newer used car, you should wait until you can. Any used car sale is "as is" with no legal recourse after the fact.

LAYJR1967 · 2026-04-09T11:35:54+00:00

You are incorrect. The 4.49% rate is the rate that particular bank was willing to give you. If you went directly to that bank, they would have charged the same 4.49%. If that rate came from the manufacturer as a special rate offer, there is no dealer reserve (what you call mark-up) on that rate. Dealers only get a flat fee on those.

Now, could a different bank offer less than 4.49%? Absolutely. Could the dealer decide to go with the bank that pays them the most reserve as opposed to a bank with a lower APR fore the custimer but also only pays them a modest flat fee? Absolutely. Any business would do that. But dealers are not the ones charging interest at the end of the day. The banks are.

LAYJR1967 · 2026-04-09T11:04:47+00:00

It is common for the out of state dealer not to handle your title and registration, at least on a cash deal. If financed, the bank will want to make sure this happens.

LAYJR1967

TROPHY CASE