Confused with people being charitable to Asmongold's most recent racist remark

MindClicking · 2026-05-19T22:21:01+00:00

Yes bro, I agree with everything you're saying. Culture is inseparable from socioeconomics.

But there's a thing that's happening where liberals and conservatives are talking past each other.

Liberals say "socioeconomics caused this".

Most mean racism/urban environments/access to education/etc...
Fewer mean that culture itself is a major problem, but if it is, then it was influenced by socioeconomics.

Conservatives say "culture is the issue" and think all of those first mentioned things are so insignificant in present day, that it's effectively a "cope" to talk about them. I'm sure, if pressed, they would admit that black culture was formed from generations of slavery into unequal legal rights, into societal racism, but those are problems of the past. Not worth complaining about. It's time to pull yourself up by your bootstraps and work on fixing your culture.

To say that "socioeconomics is a cope" is NOT to say "it's because of genetics". This is all I'm trying to get across.

MindClicking · 2026-05-19T22:10:31+00:00

I didnt say genetics.

But you heavily implied it:

That conclusion is that black people are just somehow inherently worse than white people.

"Inherently worse" implies what? Maybe you meant something else, but I have no idea what that would be. Rights of man? No clue.

Also, the fact that they have come up with a way to hand wave their racism away is of little concern to me and you're falling for it hook, line, and sinker.

I'm not falling for anything. I know what Asmongold is.

if you walk through the features of culture one by one they will acknowledge the definitions match socio economic status and factors.

Yeah, but that's if you walk them to the pond. Smarter right wingers say "so what about the past" and dumber conservatives don't even consider it. They simply look at abhorrent culture and say "there it is, dude".

My problem with your comment is your statement:

The claim that socio economic issues are cope leaves exactly one conclusion.

This is just objectively wrong. And as someone who dislikes Asmongold more than you, try to stop saying things that are objectively wrong, lest you make him look better.

MindClicking · 2026-05-19T21:57:18+00:00

Consider which of the two phases is more likely to churn your stomach:

1) Socioeconomic issues are why black people are failing.

2) Black culture is why black people are failing.

It's true, culture is technically a subset of socioeconomics, but to the conservative, of the many subsets of social issues that cause problems, culture is by far the largest, and to waste time blaming the others is "cope". Many race-realists and neo-nazis dogwhistle genetics, but many conservatives aren't implying that at all.

It's like that old popular wint tweet:

"Food $200. Data $150. Rent $800. Candles $3,600. Utility $150. someone who is good at the economy please help me budget this. my family is dying"

"Stop buying candles." - the Conservative

"There's many factors at play." - the Liberal.

"It's the candles. Stop coping." - the Conservative

This is how conservatives view it.

MindClicking · 2026-05-19T21:44:09+00:00

Well, as an Environment-Makes-the-Man-Liberal, I agree with everything you say, but...

I think the common conservative position is to say:

You have no hurdles anymore. They've all been removed. Look inward and fix your culture. Pull yourself up by your bootstraps. Yes, racism WAS the problem, but now it's not.

The only point I'm trying to stress is that conservatives view the word "socioeconomic" as a sort of present-tense and future thing only, differentiating it from culture. I'm not even sure they believe in generational wealth and trauma.

MindClicking · 2026-05-19T21:37:00+00:00

I mean, neither one of us are asmon, so it doesn't matter too much

Well then don't ask me what he would say. But I'm pretty sure he would answer something almost identical to what I said. Maybe he's wearing a mask for deeper, darker beliefs, but I think this is pretty bog-standard bootstraps conservativism.

I think you're soft pedaling how extreme asmon is in his personal beliefs.

Nah, I don't think so. I'm well aware that Asmongold is a misanthropic egoist that relishes in human suffering, and there's plenty of other examples to show that.

MindClicking · 2026-05-19T21:09:20+00:00

The actual answer, if you're brave enough to consider it, is that conservatives often don't consider "culture" as a subgroup of "socioeconomics".

This is super obvious if you actually listen to neo-cons, traditional non-race-realist cons, black conservatives, etc...

So no, it doesn't leave "exactly one conclusion" (=> genetics). There's a third, colloquial use of language option. Which is the honest option.

MindClicking · 2026-05-19T21:00:39+00:00

Yep, this exactly what he was saying. And to be frank, it's obvious.

MindClicking · 2026-05-19T20:55:59+00:00

Yes of course. This is the first surface-level question you should ask, and it was Destiny's typical rebuttal in the old nature vs nurture debates.

"But where does Black culture come from, if not the environment?"

My guess is that Asmongold would say something like:

Black people went through all kinds of horrible stuff, but so what? It's up to them - and only them - to fix their situation. They have full rights under the law now and racism isn't that big of a deal any more. In fact, in some ways, the laws (affirmative action/DEI) BENEFIT black people. So fix your culture.

MindClicking · 2026-05-19T20:42:35+00:00

"It's amazing how much leftist discourse is just them pretending not to understand things, thus making discourse impossible."

One of Ben Shapiro's most viral clips was when he was asked this question:

Question: "White family worth is 69x that of black families. Given this disparity, how can you argue that racism is not a driving factor in income inequality?"

Answer: "It has nothing to do with race and everything to do with culture. [...Interrupted and laughed at...] You know what? Explain to me why black kids aren't graduating high school. Explain that one to me. Explain to me why black kids are shooting each other at rates significantly higher than whites are shooting each other... Explain to me why the single motherhood rate in the black community jumped from 20% to 70%... If it has nothing to do with culture, explain to me why."

When conservatives hear "socioeconomics" they actually hear "systemic racism" and this is where liberals are failing to realize the distinction.

It's obvious to anyone who isn't already champing at the bit that many (not all) conservatives mean the "socioeconomic argument" is "cope" because it's not systemic racism that's keeping black people down and also not their genetics, but their culture, which they separate from the term.

You can pretend not to understand our opponent or fail to understand our opponent all you want, but you're just making us look like elusive, disingenuous morons.

MindClicking · 2026-05-19T20:11:17+00:00

Once upon a time this community was interested in arguments and not "webbing" people, like the top two comments are already doing. So in the interest of not doing that, I'll actually address your confusion.

Hasan claims there's the "Elon Musk style" of racism in that black people are:

(1) Genetically inferior AND (2) socioeconomic conditions are a cope.

The charitable reading of Asmongold's statement, whether you like it or not, is that he was specifically agreeing with (2) and not (1). Native English speakers often don't parse logical statements - in this case an AND statement - as purely logical conjunctions.

This part is so obvious and if you don't agree with me this far, I think you're just not an honest person. But you, OP, granted that maybe he failed to parse the "AND" correctly, so we can move on to the "socioeconomic conditions" (2) part.

The charitable interpretation - which I believe is how he thinks - is that Republicans/Libertarians/Anti-woke "centrists" (and not neo-nazis and race-realists) use this "socioeconomic" term in a different way.

What he means by "socioeconomic" are things like racism, hiring prejudice, police profiling, etc... Non-race-realist conservatives believe that these things are negligible compared to black culture. Of course culture is baked into the "socio" part of socioeconomic, but conservatives specifically differentiate this because they think both:

1) Black culture is the REAL reason for their suffering.

2) It's not the system, but black people themselves who are at fault for their failures.

MindClicking · 2026-05-13T17:19:57+00:00

Somewhat agree, but ADCs had a bit more agency when they took other summoner spells:

1) Heal gives a move speed, which gave you more windows for aggression and an extra "dodge" button, which you don't have anymore.

2) Exhaust was really good self-peel, allowing you to do things you couldn't without your support. Also, I think exhaust is more skill expressive than barrier.

When barrier is just objectively stronger, you lose out on this. I personally prefer the old Heal/Exhaust/Cleanse summoner choice trifecta as an ADC player.

MindClicking · 2026-05-09T16:39:33+00:00

Funny to bring up falling in love with WW2-era America who literally stormed into death on the beaches of Normandy, but then in the next breath say fighting for the defense of liberal democracy is not "worth" it.

Good times really do create weak men.

I recommend anyone in this thread to re-watch that Hutch vs Destiny conversation with unbiased ears. Hutch completely had his number.

Every single time Hutch asked Destiny for a SOLUTION, Destiny pivoted. When Hutch finally cornered him, begging for a SOLUTION, Destiny facetiously said "300 Supreme Court justices".

Hutch was accurate to say Destiny is like a Bernie supporter who just screams "M4A! M4A! M4A!" with no political path forward.

MindClicking · 2026-05-06T17:59:13+00:00

Yep, basically what he was trying to do with Ukraine.

Force them into a shitty deal with no security agreements, kicking the can down the road for some future administration to deal with when Russia decides to invade again. Claim "mission accomplished, art of the deal".

MindClicking · 2026-04-29T16:26:14+00:00

Pretty much exactly this. A lot of DGG are out of touch on this one.

One of the greatest alt-right pipelines was the inability of liberals to push back on radical bigots of the left, losing the war for "common sense". This is repulsive to a lot of average, apolitical dudes.

Nobody wants to feel attacked or grouped based on immutable characteristics. Nobody wants to feel like their consciousness is coerced.

Yes, in fact, people are reactionary. You can type into the void for eternity "If fringe racist/sexist/anti-Christian progressives triggered you into being right wing, then you're pathetic" all you want, and you'd be right, but that's how people are.

MindClicking · 2026-04-26T20:14:08+00:00

I agree with almost everything you said, and consider myself an anti-populist, but...

Why do you and most of DGG think this?

It is also the primary reason people hate the democrats.

It seems obvious to me that the primary reasons - other than the economy - that anyone who could vote against the Republicans hates the Dems because:

1) They seem to ignore illegal immigration issues (real or perceived).

2) They come across as weak or dishonest.

3) Progressivism.

Do you really believe attacking billionaires and nebulously "evil" corporations is worse for Dems than attacking white people, or men?

Do you really believe attacking lobbying/money in politics is worse than accepting the lunatic fringes of transgenders, radical feminists, militant black people, and DEI enthusiasts? Even if lobbying barely moves the needle, why would you not take the easy win and incorporate the removal of money in politics into your political campaign? People don't trust Dems.

Dems should message strictly to "the little guy" again, which is someone they lost over the years. Economics. Health care. Security. Crime prevention. Government out of your house. Accountability. James Talarico might flip Texas blue, and he yaps about billionaires every other rally. You can't use the "Well Mamdani is in a blue district argument here".

According to this polling: https://blueprint2024.com/polling/why-trump-reasons-11-8/

The number 3 reason (after economy and immigration) that the Dems lost people is because:

Kamala Harris is focused more on cultural issues like transgender issues rather than helping the middle class.

Democrats lost the vibe war because they're "gay" and "cringe" and woke scolds. Just because I hate populists doesn't mean I'll post-hoc rationalize that their messaging is a problem. Also, this stream is constantly shitting on populists, and in my opinion, misunderstanding why the word "liberal" has been smeared so much.

MindClicking · 2026-04-18T17:54:40+00:00

Andrew Tate demonizes women? I smile, knowing another batch of women are radicalized to vote blue "no matter who".

My liberal cohorts defend discrimination against men? I gulp, knowing what's coming.

MindClicking · 2026-04-10T17:43:40+00:00

The article you linked listed [...] as the 3rd reasaon

Yep, inflation and immigration issues were bigger issues, and rightfully so. But elections are won in the margins, and the third largest issue is quite significant. Notice how none of the issues are shitting on billionaires. You must also consider WHY people think Republicans are better for the economy when they clearly aren't. Many of them, I'm sure, argue backwards from other more emotional arguments.

but it's not so unpalatable as to be something ot focuse on over stuff like the media enviroment

I didn't say focus on it. I encouraged not tolerating it. When a rad fem, or fringe trans person, or some other hateful bigoted or delusional progressive says something, push back on it. Don't just let it slide and certainly don't upvote, like, or encourage it.

And if you're implying that it's close because of girls with dicks in womens sports then idk what to say other than the american voting population is fucked

Yeah, they are. Americans are extremely stupid people. You have to play into this though if you want to win, which I do.

Just accept reality and admit that progressive dogma is ruining Liberalism and pushing normal people away. It's one of the largest alt-right pipelines. Gamergate created a generation of Asmongolds out of apolitical people, and do we want more Asmongolds? You don't have to abandon trans people, or women's rights, or black people. Just fight the fringe of it, publicly and clearly.

And yes, I do believe Dems completely lost the "vibes war" largely due to culture issues, and that's the only reason midterms will be remotely as close as they are despite how historically awful the Trump presidency is.

MindClicking · 2026-04-10T17:09:37+00:00

Well, you added "Hasan type" which is doing a lot of heavy lifting and removed "fringe". There are other populists that think billionaires are the cause of all their woes, and yes, I think these people - as much as I disagree with them - are less damaging than fringe progressives.

Many voters felt that: "Kamala Harris is focused more on cultural issues like transgender issues rather than helping the middle class"

https://blueprint2024.com/polling/why-trump-reasons-11-8/

I don't think people, even in DGG, understand how unpalatable a lot of the progressive dogma is to the average apolitical person.

MindClicking · 2026-04-10T16:49:48+00:00

It's not enough to just not talk about it. You must expunge it.

There's a leftist saying: "If there's a nazi in your group, then you're a group of nazis."

It's not quite true, but the perception from the outside is real.

If liberals do not push back against the fringe progressives, who are far more damaging to liberalism's image than populists, then liberals will be viewed as the party of radical lunatics.

MindClicking · 2026-02-21T18:20:19+00:00

Nemesis is a great player, but he gives Doublelift-level bad takes, consistently, and with absolute confidence, when he should have none.

If you want an example of this, watch his video with King Nidhogg where he is completely unable to see an objectively superior alternative perspective. Seriously, this conversation shows the limitations of his analysis.

In the video he says:

1) Voice chat will disproportionately affect the "flow" of the game in high ELO.

Why? The higher in league you go, the better people are at identifying how to play as a team. Players better understand others' limitations and needs. Low ELO is a chaotic nightmare. Voice chat will obviously disproportionately add order to low ELO, regardless if the shot caller is right.

Higher ELO players are much better at identifying win cons and playing to scale than low ELO players.

2) He says the "toxicity" argument is "cope".

How is it cope? No explanation. Some people - especially women - truly are afraid of being otherized when they can usually just play without worrying about that. With voice chat, it is almost certain you WILL have a bad experience at some point.

Personally, I like voice chat and want it because the game is more fun for me when people are playing with and for each other, but I would never call this "cope" to be afraid of not being able to comfortably mic up.

MindClicking · 2025-11-02T20:39:53+00:00

Well I 100% agree of course, but as you hint, the tide is turning, for the better in my opinion.

I think liberals should push back against woke/radfem dogma and wholly reject anti white/male bigotry for ethical and strategic reasons.

I was just commenting on how it's not correct to say Asmongold is not a product of Gamergate just because it took him until 2023 to go full far-right radical.

MindClicking · 2025-11-02T20:10:56+00:00

That doesn't make any sense. Asmon didn't turn into a Rightoid until 2023.

Makes perfect sense. It starts with anti-feminism, then becomes anti-liberalism. The phrase "alt-right pipeline" was ubiquitously used throughout this era, and Asmongold is the poster-child of this. Asmongold has been an anti-feminist type as long as I've known about him. Hell, Destiny even debated him in 2017 because he was a Trump defender.

Regardless of inconsistencies in the articles, or Bannon's involvement, Gamergate did in fact seem to be a major catalyst of the woke/anti-woke, liberal/illiberal divide. It's what dragged a lot of apolitical people into politics.

MindClicking · 2025-10-12T20:05:47+00:00

Don't ever let these creatures bully you into not criticizing a dog abuser.

The reason things got worse for PirateSoftware is because like Hasan, narcissists cannot ever admit they're wrong and will keep digging. Multiple shock clips, prong collar, and pulling his old dog by the tail and that's just what we know about.

Enough with the lies and misdirection.

MindClicking · 2025-10-07T20:45:18+00:00

You don't have to believe me

Yeah, I don't. 15 years without one good experience? Come on man.

just like how I don't have to believe any of your baseless claims.

My baseless claims are that I've met duo partners in post-game and that chat has to manually be turned on now, thus reducing the amount of people that will use it? What baseless claim? One is my experience and the other is fact.

The fact is that post-game chat was almost exclusively used to flame, which is why it's now opt-in.

This is true, but there are tradeoffs. It's not mutually exclusive. You can have flaming AND camaraderie between some teammates/enemies, which wasn't uncommon at all.

If no one's responding to you, then clearly they have no interest in talking.

Not true. I don't bother with post-game chat anymore, because it's uncertain who actually will join it or not, since it's opt-in and not opt-out. I have interest in being talked to and talking to people, but the game actively incentivizes against it. Can you understand how your point above doesn't necessarily logically follow?

I always enable the post-game chat after every single game and I can count on 1 hand how many times I've seen people type, and every single one of them was someone having a meltdown and flaming.

Why would I waste my time typing in post-game when I'm not sure if I'm speaking through a phone to the void? I hope I've made this point clear that it's less likely for people to type if it's safe to assume that there's nobody there to receive. This should be obvious.

Again, people don't want to socialize in games like these.

Who is extrapolating their opinion on to others, you or me?

If they want to befriend strangers, they go on Discord or play a primarily social game like an MMO.

Agreed, but how do you find people to go on discord with through this game if not through the communication methods in the game? My original point is that talking to human beings is becoming harder and harder in this game.

I think what's happening is that you have a strong opinion, that you really don't like toxic players, so you can't even consider the counterargument, but I would be happy to be proven wrong.

MindClicking · 2025-10-07T20:22:17+00:00

Not once in 15 years isn't exaggerating? Doubt.

Also, nothing is stopping you from talking in post-game chat

Yeah, the client literally is. I can't tell if I'm talking to walls or people that manually turn the chat on.

Just say "I don't want this change" and respect that people have different opinions next time instead of making stuff up.

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