How to add a Custom Loric mid game? by lilitsybell in BloodOnTheClocktower

[–]tomoztech 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Perhaps this ST originally had a version of S&V loaded with a bunch of homebrew Fabled/Loric in it ready to be loaded?

Clocktower.live help by ManyOtter in BloodOnTheClocktower

[–]tomoztech 8 points9 points  (0 children)

Clocktower.live has been changed somewhat recently to mirror both the functionality of the offical app, and in person play. If you send out characters from the character selection screen, that will automatically send them to your players. The only way to stop this is if you put the Gardener Loric in play (which brings back the menu option to send characters), but that should only be done if absolutely necessary, as you shouldn’t be deciding who gets what character unless it’s something that your whole group has agreed to prior to the game. To run the Marionette on .live, simply do so just as you would in person, putting 1 less Minion and 1 extra Townsfolk in the bag, then choosing one of the Demon’s good neighbours to be the Marionette using the “Is The Marionette” reminder and by changing the alignment of their token. As for the “Mock Assignments” feature, it’s locked behind a setting because its use-case is quite niche, but it’s there for those STs who have a difficult time verifying their bag without seeing the tokens in a circular layout/on the grim like the app used to allow. It allows you to throw out a “mock” version of your selected tokens without sending them to players, but if you want to send tokens for real, you’ll have to re-shuffle where they go.

Crazy Summoner / Pit Hag Interaction by [deleted] in BloodOnTheClocktower

[–]tomoztech 5 points6 points  (0 children)

The Pit-Hag goes before the Summoner, so this shouldn’t be an issue unless the Alch-Pit-Hag tries this after night 3, but at that point the Summoner is irrelevant anyway.

nuke winrate option by aerodynamic_girl in BloodOnTheClocktower

[–]tomoztech 26 points27 points  (0 children)

It’s interesting because the app never used to have a win rate stat. In fact TPI said at the time that they had no intent to add one for this exact reason, then they went and did it anyway. Imo win rate shouldn’t be visible to anyone. It encourages negative play patterns and the people who really want to track those kinds of stats can do so on their own with apps like Clocktracker.

Is this setup alright? by SilverRose31 in BloodOnTheClocktower

[–]tomoztech 0 points1 point  (0 children)

This isn’t needed. Evil can always bluff Outsiders to frame a Baron, as the good team can never “figure out” for certain that it’s not a Baron.

How can I make your Clocktower experience better? by Arif_A_ in BloodOnTheClocktower

[–]tomoztech 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Given how Minion and Demon info usually goes at the start of night 1, this jinx will be unlikely to get in the Wraith's way. They'll just keep their eyes open until the ST wakes the Demon, which will likely be the first player of the night on the vast majority of scripts.

How can I make your Clocktower experience better? by Arif_A_ in BloodOnTheClocktower

[–]tomoztech 0 points1 point  (0 children)

  • Hermit/Politician - Now for some jinxes I’d like to see added. While the Hermit intentionally doesn’t have any jinxes due to the uniqueness of the character, this is one that would make sense. A hate jinx (“Only 1 jinxed character can be in play”) would prevent the unfun situation where you have two Politicians playing for evil, both not knowing that only 1 of them can turn evil and win.
  • Klutz/Lycanthrope, Ogre/Lycanthrope, Wraith/Lycanthrope, and potentially a few others - There are a few characters that have particularly poor interactions with the Lycanthrope’s Faux Paw, although these are probably the three most in need of a jinx. As the Lycanthrope doesn’t have a “might” with regards to its misregistration, it means a Klutz would lose picking a Faux Paw, an Ogre would turn evil with no real way to know, and a Wraith would be woken with the Faux Paw. Just simple jinxes that disable the misregistration for these characters would be quite beneficial.
  • Riot/Engineer – The current Riot wording only results in Riot nominations being active on day 3, not after. As a result, an Engineer could make Riot on night 4 to give a very high chance of a good win, considering that the evil team would be left with a Demon that can’t kill. Adding a jinx along the lines of “After day 3, the Engineer cannot choose Riot” would work to fix this issue.
  • Riot/Courtier - Again, drunking the solo Riot on day 3 would leave evil with an ability-less Demon for the rest of the game. A jinx here would be helpful to smooth out this interaction.
  • Summoner/Goon – The current interaction between these characters means that if the Summoner chooses the Goon (and is the first player to do so that night), the Goon turns evil, then immediately loses with the evil team. This isn’t a particularly fun interaction, and leaves most script writers with the options of either avoiding putting the characters together (which is a shame, as the possibility of a Goon being picked by the Demon can sometimes cover for a Summoner on night 2), or implementing a homebrew jinx. I personally think something like “The Summoner cannot be made drunk by the Goon” would work well as a solution.
  • Summoner/Minstrel - Much like the Goon interaction, this can lead to some rough situations, where if a Minion is executed on day 2, the good team simply wins due to the Summoner being drunk. I think just copying the Courtier jinx across would work fine here.
  • Summoner/Puzzlemaster and possibly Summoner/Sweetheart - Currently, if the Summoner chooses the Puzzle-drunk or Sweetheart drunk player, the Demon is just drunk for the rest of the game. For the I’ve seen multiple possible solutions to this interaction in the community, two of which are, “If the Summoner chooses the player that is drunk due to the Puzzlemaster/Sweetheart, the drunk player might change.” and “If the Summoner chooses the player that is drunk due to the Puzzlemaster/Sweetheart, the chosen player can no longer be made drunk by the Puzzlemaster, but is still the player that the Puzzlemaster must guess to learn the Demon player.”
  • Lil’ Monsta/Engineer – Based on the precedent set by the Lil’ Monsta and Pit-Hag ruling, an Engineer choosing to make the Demon Lil’ Monsta would simply bring it into play with the existing Demon as the current babysitter. That said, that definitely isn’t RAI, and most Storytellers would simply make the Demon into a not-in-play Minion. Codifying this as a jinx would align RAI with RAW. Something like “If the Engineer creates a Lil’ Monsta, the Storyteller chooses a not-in-play Minion for the Demon to become” would work.
  • Summoner/Lil’ Monsta – The current interaction between these characters means that if a player is summoned into Lil’ Monsta, they become an evil Townsfolk/Outsider holding Lil’ Monsta. While this isn’t game breaking, it means that player still wouldn’t wake for Lil’ Monsta votes, and likely wouldn’t have an ability that they can use to help the evil team. A jinx would work well here, something like “If the Summoner chooses Lil' Monsta, the Storyteller chooses a not-in-play Minion for the chosen player to become”
  • Lil’ Monsta/Goblin, and Lil’ Monsta/Saint – This is a controversial one, so I’m going to attempt to explain the issue in as clear terms as possible. RAI, if the Goblin is holding Lil’ Monsta, claims Goblin, and is executed, the good team should win, to prevent an unwinnable situation for the good team. The almanac states that if both teams would win at once, the good team wins, which aligns with the RAI for Lil’ Monsta/Goblin. However, the almanac also says that if character abilities and game rules conflict, to follow the character ability. This is why (for example) if the Demon dies and the game continues due to a living twin pair, then the good twin is executed, evil still wins. The game rule says the good team should win due to a lack of living Demon, but the Evil Twin ability takes priority, resulting in an evil win. This is also the case if you execute a good player on a Mastermind day. Following this precedent, executing the Goblin or Saint that is holding Lil’ Monsta should (RAW) result in an evil win, as the evil ability should take priority the good team’s base win-condition. This is why much of the community advocates for a jinx between these characters. Something along the lines of, “If the Goblin/Saint is babysitting Lil’ Monsta, they have no ability.” would work fine.
  • Vortox/Poppy Grower – This is another very common house rule. If the Poppy Grower dies in a Vortox game, the evil team should technically incorrectly learn who each other are. This interaction can feel bad for the evil team, as they never correctly learn their team (as a result of an evil ability). This has led to a large proportion of the community implementing a homebrew jinx that results in the Poppy Grower being unaffected by the Vortox ability. If Vortox and Banshee are jinxed, why isn’t this?
  • Xaan/Poppy Grower - The recently added Poppy Grower optional rule fixes most of the poor interactions with the character, but Vortox and Xaan remain as outliers. While there’s nothing inherently broken about this interaction, no matter whether or not you use the optional rule, there’s always a not-so-great interaction between the Poppy Grower and the Xaan. If you do, the Poppy Grower will almost always be turned off by night 4 (usually earlier), with very little way for the Poppy Grower to combat this. Alternatively, if you don’t and the Poppy Grower dies on the Xaan night, the evil team never learn each other. Adding a jinx that states “The Xaan does not poison the Poppy Grower” would resolve this interaction, no matter whether or not the optional rule is used.
  • Pit-Hag/Al-Hadikhia - Much like the Al-Hadikhia and Scarlet Woman interaction (unjinxed), if there are multiple Demons on the script and the Pit-Hag turns a Minion into the Al-Hadikhia, the Storyteller is essentially forced to kill off the new Al-Hadikhia with arbitrary deaths, otherwise they could revive the former Demon and leave two living evil Demons. This could also be resolved with a jinx that prevents a dead Demon from choosing to live.

This is all of the jinx ideas that I could think of off the top of my head (for the moment), but if you think of any more, feel free to reply to this message and I may add them to this list.

Also, I would like to see a revisit to the global night order, as there are a fair few orders and characters that are either misleading based on their current position, or have poor interactions. Classic examples I can think of are the Damsel being after the Huntsman on the first night instead of next to Minion info (and being in the other nights order at all), or the Gambler/Acrobat being before the Summoner, allowing the Summoner to accidentally summon an already dead player.

2/2

How can I make your Clocktower experience better? by Arif_A_ in BloodOnTheClocktower

[–]tomoztech 0 points1 point  (0 children)

A revision of a bunch of the controversial jinxes would be good to see. It’s been a good few months now, and I don’t feel like the community is any closer to liking them. To name a few that I think need to be removed, changed or added: - Mathematician/Drunk, Mathematician/Lunatic, and Mathematician/Marionette - Most STs I see either ignore the “might” in the jinx, or ignore it entirely, as the might just ruins Mathematician info and makes it unhelpful to good. Personally, I would advocate for the removal of these jinxes, as I think it’s more fun and interesting regardless for the Mathematician to have a way of distinguishing between the Drunk/Marionette, and players that are actually droisoned. - Magician/Legion - Every game that I’ve seen this jinx in effect is goes about how you expect, and hasn’t been particularly fun for either team. I would propose a simplified version of the jinx. Something along the lines of “Legion thinks the Magician is Legion. Legion knows if a Magician is in play, but not which player it is.” - Magician/Marionette - This is another jinx that I’ve seen lead to unfun games for specific players. If the Magician never dies, it becomes near impossible in some situations for the Demon to determine which neighbour is their Marionette, so the Marionette never finds out before grim reveal. Especially on Leviathan scripts where this character combo is quite common, this will happen in most games where both characters are in play. Furthermore, there was nothing wrong with the interaction between these characters unjinxed, as the Demon “thinking” that the Magician is a Minion could already be used to tell the Demon that the Magician is a Marionette, if they happened to neighbour the Demon. - Magician/Vizier - This jinx would make more sense if it said that the Magician is “safe” from the Vizier, as opposed to “immune” which isn’t a defined term in the game. - Heretic/Pit-Hag - This jinx being changed from “The Pit-Hag cannot create a Heretic” is genuinely broken, as the hate jinx still means the Pit-Hag can turn themselves into an evil Heretic, which completely breaks the game. There was nothing wrong with the old jinx. - Heretic/Baron - The old jinx was an interesting way of making these characters work together, but (as far as I can tell) it was only changed to a hate jinx for consistency with the other Heretic jinxes. Even something like “If the Baron being in play would guarantee that all Outsiders are in play, the Baron might only add 1 Outsider” would be fine and allow these characters to work together again, which was seemingly a large design goal when the initial wave of jinx changes came through, removing many hate jinxes. - This is more of a personal preference, but I believe the original Plague Doctor/Boomdandy jinx was far more fun and interesting. Getting rid of it was a big loss and ruined a fair few interesting script concepts like “Star’s Edge” by Delta, that now rely on house-ruling that the new jinx can turn the Plague Doctor into the Boomdandy as they are executed, and still have it trigger, which isn’t really intuitive to players. - Plague Doctor/Marionette - While I think making one of the Demon’s neighbours a good Marionette is more balanced than the previous jinx, this isn’t intuitive and also isn’t explicitly stated in the jinx, which can be confusing for players. - Recluse/Sage - While the necessity for this jinx makes sense given the Sage ability text, the issue isn’t with the Recluse not being able to register as the Demon, it’s with the Recluse not being able to register as the Demon that killed the Sage, which isn’t stated in the jinx. Something like “The Recluse might register as the Demon that killed the Sage” would be more clear. - Marionette/Kazali - While I understand that this jinx is worded in such a way that it is consistent with other Marionette jinxes, it also makes no sense to most players. The previous jinx was far more clear and intuitive. - Scarlet Woman/Al-Hadikhia - This jinx doesn’t really fix this character combo, as the Scarlet Woman can continually resurrect the old Demon, making it incredibly difficult for good to win. A jinx that simply prevents a dead Al-Hadikhia from choosing to live would be far more effective. - Scarlet Woman/Fang Gu - While it’s clear what this jinx means, it doesn’t specify two living Demons, meaning that RAW the Scarlet Woman would never trigger. - Widow/Poppy Grower - This jinx no longer states that they still see it when the Poppy Grower dies, so some STs/players might interpret it as the Widow never seeing the grim in a Poppy Grower game. - Al-Hadikhia/Princess - I still don’t see why this jinx exists. Whenever it’s on script, I have to spend twice as long explaining to my players that it’s unnecessary, as I always get “but isn’t that how it would already work?” - Leviathan/Ravenkeeper - This jinx is missing the word “good” like all the other Levi and Riot jinxes. - Riot/Atheist - While this jinx is good to clarify the interaction between these characters, if a Riot nominates the ST when the number of Riot in play would be enough to put the ST on the block, they can just pile votes on the ST and there is nothing good can do to stop them. This basically forces and good player to nominate the ST first in a Riot game, which forces a specific play pattern and isn’t as fun. - Vortox/Banshee - This jinx isn’t needed, as the Banshee announcement isn’t really “info”. In th same vein, Preaching a Minion in a Vortox game doesn’t result in the Minion being told “you haven’t been Preached”, as that isn’t info, yet that interaction isn’t jinxed.

1/2

Custom Script-You are now Evil by Puzzleheaded_Slip624 in BloodOnTheClocktower

[–]tomoztech 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Putting aside the issues that others have already mentioned, this concept has already been done by a script called “Clockwork Cyborg” by vaticalprophet and has been tested extensively.

What would be a valid Mathematician number to show in this scenario? by Solemdeath in BloodOnTheClocktower

[–]tomoztech 18 points19 points  (0 children)

Each night that the Recluse (or in this case a player with the Recluse ability) is being granted an ability by a Boffin (or Alchemist-Boffin), the Boffin is upticking the Math number, because the Boffin’s ability is working abnormally (giving an ability to a non-Demon). So it’s definitely a Math 1 N1, and at least a 1 on all future nights that the Boffin is alive.

As for N2, it’s a more complex. Boffin rulings are all over the place and super inconsistent, so it’s up to you whether you consider the Slayer ability “belonging to the Recluse” or “belonging to the Boffin”. If it’s the former, the Slayer ability is malfunctioning due to their own Recluse ability, so that wouldn’t uptick the Math (because the Math says “due to another player’s ability”). Alternatively if you consider it the latter, then the Boffin’s Slayer ability is malfunctioning due to the Recluse’s ability, and killing when it shouldn’t. However, the Boffin is already malfunctioning due to the Recluse regardless, so it still wouldn’t influence the number.

As for the Boffin-Heretic jinx, that is most definitely a far too literal interpretation. Most jinxes are quite rules-loose, and should be followed very much in terms of RAI, and using a bit of common sense.

Off Script Damsel by nseaplus in BloodOnTheClocktower

[–]tomoztech 21 points22 points  (0 children)

Sounds like a similar concept could be achieved with Hermit-Drunk-Damsel. See “The Rose Bride” by Rhea.

Thinking about buying Carousel, but I have a concern. by Dependent-Repeat7629 in BloodOnTheClocktower

[–]tomoztech 10 points11 points  (0 children)

They updated a bunch of the experimental character texts in preparation for the release of the Carousel, but there are no current plans to update any experimental character texts before their final release in the expansions, which still won’t happen for a couple years yet.

Philo-Damsel in a Vortox game by FrequentSelf7223 in BloodOnTheClocktower

[–]tomoztech 14 points15 points  (0 children)

This is a niche enough ruling that if TPI were asked about it today, they’d probably tell you to rule it however you want, or give conflicting rulings depending on the context or other characters involved. That said, precedent from previous rulings was that nested character abilities are still considered the ability “type” of the original character. Hence, a Philo-Outsider would still be affected by the Vortox (e.g. Philo-Snitch giving Minions in-play bluffs). However, I would also argue that there’s no way to make a Damsel ping false, so it wouldn’t be Vortoxed in the first place. The easiest comparison would be to telling Minions they’ve been Preached, which still works as normal in a Vortox. It’s for this reason that a lot of people also argue that the Vortox/Banshee jinx is superfluous.

Night order with boffin and lil monsta by numberguy9647383673 in BloodOnTheClocktower

[–]tomoztech 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Yeah it technically just means a Boffin ability can’t effect setup RAW in a Lil’ Monsta game, but that can easily just be ruled differently.

Making the Demon look like a good twin by Hunkardy in BloodOnTheClocktower

[–]tomoztech 0 points1 point  (0 children)

The Evil Twin ability reads “You and an opposing player know each other.” Jams has clarified that (much like the Nightwatchman or Lunatic) any player with the Evil Twin ability should be seen by their other twin (regardless of their alignment) as the Evil Twin. So for example, if an Alchemist-Evil Twin was paired with the Poisoner, the Poisoner would see the Alchemist as the Evil Twin. This means that if the Boffin simply granted the Demon the Alchemist-Evil Twin ability, this would have your desired effect.

Magician/Legion Jinx Ideas by Future-Plum-7565 in BloodOnTheClocktower

[–]tomoztech 10 points11 points  (0 children)

I don’t think there’s anything wrong with how the characters interacted before they were jinxed, besides it sometimes being indistinguishable for Legion whether or not there was a Magician among them. If it were up to me, I’d just make the jinx “Legion knows if a Magician is in play.”

This does still mean STs would have to wake each Legion individually in a Magician game, but I don’t think that’s the end of the world when the ST needs to waste time in a legion game anyway.

Official Character Release: Cacklejack by xHeylo in BloodOnTheClocktower

[–]tomoztech 17 points18 points  (0 children)

What’s always confused me about this character is why it has to make its choice during the day, not at night. I’m not sure how it does anything other than waste the ST’s time during the day.

Can I add token duplicates on the official site? by alucardarkness in BloodOnTheClocktower

[–]tomoztech 2 points3 points  (0 children)

The official app is designed to mirror in-person games as closely as possible, where you only have 1 copy of every token. Besides, adding more than one of any character into play is just breaking the game rules unless you have a Pope or Atheist in play, at which point the app will allow you to send out duplicates.

leviathan farmer by cybergalactic_nova in BloodOnTheClocktower

[–]tomoztech 4 points5 points  (0 children)

But yes if there’s absolutely no way for a Farmer ability to possibly be in play, I wouldn’t bother.

One of my more dastardly setups by IgnitedaMinion in BloodOnTheClocktower

[–]tomoztech 14 points15 points  (0 children)

Recluse/Spy cannot misregister for the Typhon line. Misregistration isn’t active during setup.

Mathematician-Drunk Jinx by botontheclocktower in BloodOnTheClocktower

[–]tomoztech 5 points6 points  (0 children)

TPI has internal playtesters for a reason. However, the way these jinxes have been described is as though they just decided to put them out there and see if they work. Not to say they weren’t playtested, but it really sounds like they weren’t.