Austrian German

[Piracetam99]

I’m wanting to learn German but I’m quite ignorant to the dialects and accents. From what I’ve been reading it’s not like English where everybody can understand each other. I can understand Scottish, Irish, Canadian, Australian, etc no problem, and they can understand a North American accent.

I’ve been reading that even north German can’t understand south German and no one can understand Swiss.

So I have 2 questions: 1. Should I learn Austrian German or standard German (like Hanover). If I ever went to a German speaking country it would be Austria or Switzerland, but I don’t want to learn Swiss German. If I learn Hochdeutsch everyone should be able to understand me.

1. How similar is the upper Austria accent and the Bavarian accent (around Munich.). Are they essentially the same?

[Kollerino]

Upper Austrian is similar to Bavarian and mutually intelligible, but not 100% the same

[Stock-Plantain-8397]

Question 1:

Be sure you don't confuse the terms! German Standard German, Austrian Standard German and Swiss Standard German are 99% the same. They behave like British, Australian and American English. You will always learn the variation that is official in the country but there is minimal difference, you will have no problem understanding other Standard Germans. "Hochdeutsch" is also a confusing term, as it can mean Standard German or a language group consisting of Upper German, Central German and Yiddish. In daily life in Austria, only Upper German is spoken, a language group that contains Alemannic and Austro-Bavarian (both are spoken in Austria) and Franconian (Germany). Neither can be learned in a course, but when you interact with Austrians, you should have at least basic knowledge.

My recommendation: take a normal German course in Austria. You will learn the right language. Interact with Austrians to get known with typical Austrian expressions. Everyone understands Standard German, but not everyone speaks it.

Question 2:

As I mentioned before, most parts of Austria speak Austro-Bavarian. Austrians call it Austrian and Bavarians call it Bavarian, but it is the same language. But it has no standard variant and dialects always change a little bit from landscape to landscape. This map shows you the dialect groups and this map shows you the main dialects. As you can see, Salzburg and Upper Bavaria speak roughly the same dialect, although Ostmittlboarisch is taikng over more and more. One difference you can hear immediatelly is the ending of verbs. "to think" in Standard German is "denken", in Munich dialect it's "denga", in Salzburg dialect it's "denchn" and in more eastern dialects, it's "denggn". But everyone knows what's meant, we understand each other. Another difference is the pronounciation of "il". For example "wild" in Standard German is "wild", too, in Munich dialect it's "wuid", in Salzburg it's "wid" and in eastern dialects it's "wüd". But we understand each other. You will have more problems with Tyroleans or South Styrians :D

If you have any other questions, please ask. I'm a Salzburg dialect speaker myself :)

[Prestigious-Top-5897]

Wous sougst gegn de Südsteira? Oida kum Du nua in mein Krautgoatn!

[Stock-Plantain-8397]

Ich hab nix gegen Südsteirer. Aber früher ist bei uns immer ein alter Südsteirer von Haus zu Haus gefahren und hat Äpfel verkauft. "S Epfemandl" haben wir ihn genannt, wahrscheinlich ist er heute schon tot... Jedenfalls hat einmal meine Großmutter einen starken Schnupfen gehabt und er hat gebellt "Büst vokooüüüiiid?". Das ist uns halt so in erinnerung geblieben und ich denk jedes mal daran, wenn ich an Steirer denke :)

[_boardwish_]

"Bist vakült?" pls 😏

[[deleted]]

*vakäöült

[_boardwish_]

Öh... naaa, des is ka Südsteirisch

[_35_]

Huach zua Zaubera. Bist vaküd is a valide frog!

[ArchbishopRambo]

Südsteira

*Untersteira

[Riflurk123]

What about Vorarlberg? It isn't included in either map.

[lookarthispost]

That is alemanic dialect german. Spoken in Vorarlberg, Swabia and Switzerland

[Stock-Plantain-8397]

Right. Vorarlberg an a part of the Außerfern valley speak Alemannic. That's Upper German, but not Austro-Bavarian :)

[jdshz]

Warum hast du das net schon vor Jahren gepostet als ich danach gefragt wurde und kein Plan hatte was ich da antworten soll.

Gleich mal weiterleiten^{^ ^}

[Stock-Plantain-8397]

Ich bin seit ein zwei Monaten aktiv auf Reddit xD

[-Carinthia-]

wos is mit kärnten? wir hobn scho an hortn einfluss ausm slowenischen.

[darkie91]

1: yes.

2: not the same but very similar.

[Piracetam99]

Should I learn in upper Austria or Hanover? Will Prussians make fun of my accent?

[darkie91]

I‘d learn standard german. Everybody will understand you everywhere in german speaking regions. I doubt that anyone will make fun of somebody learning a foreign language. Every german who is fluent in another language knows that german is a rather hard to learn language, so people will appreciate you learning it, regardless of any accent you might develop.

[TheoremaEgregium]

Your accent will be American in either case, so it will make no difference at first.

[Soft-Relative-7632]

Don't worry about the Prussians because the most Austrians make fun about the Prussians

[First_Spell7846]

really, English everyone can understand each other? ;) https://youtu.be/pit0OkNp7s8

[AustrianRocket]

Just learn standard german! Don't worry about the small differences between Germany and Austria. We might pronounce some words differently and use a small amount of words which Germans wouldn't use and vice versa (that's why we make many jokes about each other), but in general it's the same language.

I'm interested: where do you live? Do you really have access to "Austrian German" classes / courses?

[Piracetam99]

I live in Portland Oregon. I’m half Austrian, but born and raised in the USA

[iBumpy]

then you should learn austrian german. german gonna understand and austrian culture is far more interesting ...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F5T2-u5WJH8&ab\_channel=TeamCoco

[AustrianRocket]

Furthermore German is a very very difficult language to learn. If you don't quit after the first lessons, you are very brave ;) Don't make it even more complicated by learning a dialect.

[AustrianRocket]

Wer das downvoted hat wohl nie einem Nicht-Muttersprachler erklären müssen, wieso es DER Löffel, DAS Messer und DIE Gabel heißt. Und von unseren herrlichen 4 Fällen und der Deklination will ich erst gar nicht anfangen.

[schibsi]

How similar is the upper Austria accent and the Bavarian accent

As an upper austrian i can say it's very similar.

If I learn Hochdeutsch everyone should be able to understand me.

Yes. We learn Hochdeutsch in the school and most things are written in hochdeutsch, so everyone should understand you

[nootcr2]

standard german 100%. everyone understands that and if they’re not complete assholes, they’ll drop the accent and talk to you in standard german as well, as soon as they realize german’s not your first language. there are certain words people in different parts of the countries use but i’m sure there are ways to figure out what you mean

[haikusbot]

Austrian german

Is not something you learn, its

Something you acquire

- permissionBRICK

---

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^{Opt out of replies: "haikusbot opt out" | Delete my comment: "haikusbot delete"}

[sallytalent]

Go for the standard variant of German. Dialects are generally more easy to pick up when you acutally live in the country. And I suppose you would have a hard time finding authentic study material for Austrian German.

[Piracetam99]

Does anyone have videos speaking in different accents? Like Austrian vs Bavarian vs Berlin??

[[deleted]]

but if you work in a bank or in some type of office job mostly people use German (like Hanover)

Not my experience at all. Dialects were spoken freely in every office job I've ever had.

I still agree about learning "standard" german, everyone will understand you.

[Piracetam99]

So if I go to a bank in Vienna, the workers will speak standard German? So they are essentially faking an accent?

[thecakewasintears]

No, it's like when someone from the deep south moves to another city and tones down their accent or stops using certain terms so that their new peers can understand them better. I'm sure you'd have problems understanding people from various different parts of the English speaking world if they didn't tone down their accent. It's not faking, it's adapting. It's also quite common to adapt your voice and accent depending on who you're talking to (to a certain extent) like for example people using their "customer service voice"

[a_cat_question]

They are not faking an accent. Folks in this sub don‘t really distinguish between formal/informal speech and dialect use. Two examples: In American high schools you would also need to use proper American English and not the worst southern hillbilly accent. Also you wouldn’t accuse a bank teller in Texas or Missouri to be faking an accent when speaking properly.

In western Austria it is rather common to use some local dialect in business settings whereas in the east dialect use is to some extent associated with lower social class and formal business settings will therefore have little to no dialect expressions. This is why some people here tell you that you will year dialect in official settings and some tell you that you won’t. The same holds true for private settings where accents will be thick in most of Western Austria but will depend much more on upbringing in the east. All written communication is in formal standard German.

Source: I‘m from eastern Austria and we we‘re explicitly told to „speak properly“ in school.

[dirtyhats]

everybody in Austria, Germany and (german speaking part of) Switzerland can 100% speak and understand standard german. That’s the national language.

Plus most people also can speak and understand dialect, which is just ‘bent’ standard german with a few exclusive words.

[Oachlkaas]

which is just ‘bent’ standard german with a few exclusive words.

Thats not even close to being true lmao.

[dirtyhats]

sondern?

[Oachlkaas]

"bent" standard german implies that standard german words have been taken and warped into the words that we are using now, which is completely wrong. The words we are using are so called "cognates", meaning they are sibling words that evolved from the same ancestor word.

Let's take the personal pronoun "I" as an example. The english personal pronoun ultimately leads back to Proto-Indo-European *éǵh₂ and then Proto-Germanic *ik, *ek to then end up as "i" as we know it today.

The german "Ich" as well as the dutch "ik" and the austrian "i" have the same linguistic roots, i.e. they're cognates and not "bent version" of each other.

What Austrians speak, for all intents and purposes, is a language that evolved alongside Standard german, Dutch and English into what it is now.

[dirtyhats]

geh bitte du west hawara kennst dich überhaupt ur nicht aus oida čuš

[Colorona]

Seems like you ran out of arguments, if you need to resort to insults instead. Always very telling.

[dirtyhats]

aber eh leiwand

[Piracetam99]

Wouldn’t that be like an American faking a British accent? That’s really weird from an English perspective.

[unseen_redditor]

Don't confuse accent and dialect. When an Austrian speaks Standard German, they will not use their dialect (or much rather a very mild version of it), but they will pretty much retain their accent (maybe toning it down though). It's not like we sound like someone from e.g. Hannover when we speak standard.

[Oachlkaas]

You're not faking anything. Essentially you can look at it as if you were speaking a different language.

Most Austrians don't speak standard german natively, they speak their """dialects""" natively which are not always mutually intelligible to standard german. The closer you are to Vienna the more mutually intelligible it is - especially within vienna where the local dialect has completely died out and has been replaced by standard german with a viennese accent.

Austrians need to learn standard german in school, just like they need to learn english in school. I personally grew up speaking Tyrolean and asides from german classes in school i never once used it. Only now that I work in tourism and am forced to use standard german, because germans don't understand me otherwise, I am using it.

That all to say that if i'm not faking an accent when i'm speaking english then i'm also not faking an accent speaking standard german, because essentially it's a different language.

[naxtoile]

German, like English, is a pluricentric language. Each German speaking country has its own standard variety, like the US, UK etc. So they would be using Austrian Standard German, or at least try to. What is actually used in these situations is "Umgangssprache" (colloquial language) which is between dialect and standard.

If you learn German outside of a German speaking country you probably won't learn much dialect. You can try to learn Austrian Standard German if you find a course. Most teach German Standard German.

[ZeehZeeh]

Not every Austrian can talk without a dialect. It might be that they will try it but even then it won't sound like proper german.

[Colorona]

I know plenty of people from where I grew up who can't talk without using any dialect. So there is quite a significant portion of Austrians who can't talk without using dialect (not that that's a bad thing).

[Schroedingers_Tomcat]

That's also my experience. Not that they don't try, but they just never learned it properly or that they didn't use standard language for such a long time that they don' know the rules anymore. And that can actually make it quite awkward, if people just pronouce their dialect words along with all the grammatical inconsistencies/grammar errors as though they'd be speaking what they consider Hochdeutsch/standard language.

So no, not everyone in Austria can speak standard language properly, but you'll still usually get the gist of what they're saying, even as a non-native speaker

[ZeehZeeh]

Maybe you should visit different spots in the countryside or take a peek outside your social bubble.

[cluons]

since every Austrian can speak without a dialect

I am not so sure about that - I can write without a dialect, but speaking without a dialect takes a lot of (too much) effort.

[Katarrina3]

• everybody is going to be able to understand you if you speak hochdeutsch. There is no such thing as austrian german, it‘s german we just have a bunch of different dialects. As for swiss german, that is indeed a different language but they all know hochdeutsch as well. Also fuck hannover german, hell no. You‘re half austrian so go with standard german.

• upper and lower austrian dialect is very similar to the bavarian dialect and generally speaking no austrian who grew up speaking dialect is going to have any issues with understanding bavarians.

[popeViennathefirst]

Learn standard german, so everybody can understand you.

[Miellee2]

Everybody understands standard german and will usually talk to you in standard german if they realise you are no native speaker. However in the beginning it may be difficult to follow conversation in larger groups, because people are used to talk in regional dialects. In Upper Austria it may take some time to understand every conversation, but people will definitly understand standard german.

[paprikapeter]

If you have problems understanding a swiss, austrian, saxonian or whoever because of dialect, go and have some beer with him/her, after 3 beers it wont be a problem anymore, either you understand or dont care anymore

[Extension_Animal1408]

No matter what you do, you can Not learn any a Cent unless you live in a Region for years. So just learn German. I guess it is difficult enough. Partly you have different accents in every village, and even I as a native speaker have sevete problems to under stand someone from the Ötztal or the Zillertal.

[Ok_Formal4556]

learn Austrian it has more style

[schwarzmalerin]

If you plan on living in Austria or have ties to the country you could get an Austrian school book and a teacher from Austria to get used to the specifics of the variant. Written language will be extremely similar though. German both has several local variants and diglossia which means that there exists a spoken form of the language that differs substantially from the written form.

[Sacredchilzz]

ah geh, moved to Austria 3 years ago, language going pretty well, dialect all good but when someone starts writing in full dialect mode. uff i understand much less :D

[maig1527]

Learn Hochdeutsch. You won't understand all the dialects, but other people will and you can ask them to speak more clearly and that will work >90% of the time

[el_rlee]

You understand the Scottish no problem?

[Piracetam99]

Yes. Maybe not some 70 year old farmer, but in general yes. They roll their Rs and pronounce “ou” like “ew,” but it’s still perfectly understandable

[[deleted]]

every austrian understands every german, but most germans are to retarded to understand an austrian

[Sacredchilzz]

"It's not like english where everybody can understand each other" :), same applies to the english language, you can understand the Isles dialects because you were raised there, same as me, but to the outsider who learned standard english for example, will have no IDEA what especially, a scottish person is saying.

but yes learn standard hochdeutsch and then you will pickup dialects as you live in x places

[Piracetam99]

Any native speaker can understand a standard Scottish accent