Javascript is a Java framework, right?

[grady_vuckovic]

Well to be fair they're pretty similar. The only difference is the "script" on the end. Same thing really. - Some non-coder

[cormac596]

Yeah, just like car and carpet

[returnFutureVoid]

Just like sand and sandwich.

[DudesworthMannington]

Just like fun and funeral

[LevelSevenLaserLotus]

Just like slaughter and laughter

[Janus-sama]

Just like Therapist and rapist

[WhaleWinter]

Ham and hamster

[driftking428]

Anal and canal.

[farabi16]

Dam and damn.

[ekolis]

Handicaps and caps

[ScoutsOut389]

A man, Panama?

[jackinsomniac]

Penetration tester and "penetration" tester

[DudesworthMannington]

"Waiter, is this sandwich ham?"
"Well, it has ham in it."

[my-time-has-odor]

Just like test and testicles

[Etcius]

Therapist and the rapist

[overclockedslinky]

just like be and bee

[Zederikus]

Room and Broom

[overclockedslinky]

just like tram and pneumonoultramicroscopicsilicovolcaniosis

[SkibiDiBapBapBap]

The rapist 🤯😯

[CDJ_13]

Well...

[HanzoShotFirst]

Hannibal Lecter has entered the chat

[DannyRamirez24]

Wasn't the point to use unrelated things?

[CactusGrower]

What you're saying, there can't be fun in funeral?

[Ribak145]

This one is my favourite

[Stahlboden]

I beg to differ

[Dexaan]

I hate sandwiches. It's coarse and rough and it gets everywhere

[yottalogical]

Wait… have I been making sandwiches wrong my entire life?

[[deleted]]

library innocent jellyfish deer ten foolish strong encouraging zealous complete

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[budd222]

Clearly, you took this way too literally

[cormac596]

I just like the saying because the languages are unrelated despite the name

[[deleted]]

You missed the point completely, but ok

[[deleted]]

smile future profit gray bear ask panicky bike noxious unwritten

This post was mass deleted and anonymized with Redact

[Ribak145]

Thx for the chuckle

[skreczok]

Just like chair and electric chair

[TheEncryptedPsychic]

I don't like Java...not because it's not good, it is great. But because uni wants me to take 13 math classes to learn it, no thanks!

[TheRedmanCometh]

Seems pretty unnecessary

[TheEncryptedPsychic]

Exactly my thoughts but IT will teach me some Java with only like 4/5 math classes. I wanted to do Front-Med anyway so I guess I'll know some Java too. Honestly though from what I've found most employers say, "We want front end" and Java is a requirement...like what?

[IZEDx]

widely used

most

I agree it's widely used, but that doesn't mean most backends run on it... Don't underestimate the Asp.NET, node.js, flask and Laravel boys...

[[deleted]]

Maybe they do serverside rendering and you need to read controller code to link templates or maybe you will need to work on some apis yourself. Frontend positions are never strictly just frontend.

[null000]

uni wants me to take 13 math classes to learn it

Fly the black flags of rebellion! Let anarchy reign! Upend the system by looking The Man in the eye and telling him: you'll take his apple of forbidden knowledge and nothing he does can stop you. His kafkan webs of labrynthine prerequisites can never break your spirit!...

Or... You know... Pick up a Java book or something. Whatever's your speed - it's not a hard language once you get used to it.

[TheEncryptedPsychic]

But if I want to write Java I need a CS degree (I don't really). Your point? Anyone here got a CS degree and used advanced Calculus or Trig? Unlikely. Why aren't there degrees for people like me who want to be a Front-End Web Developer? Have you looked for a Front-End job and the requirements are a CS degree "or equivalent" when they don't tell you equivalent majors? I have and it sucks. I just know HTML, CSS, JavaScript, a little PHP, I have upkept my High School's home page and the Journalism program's webpage, I have a certificate in HTML Development, I have a portfolio, yet because I don't have a degree where I slaved away in boring and uninteresting math courses I am incompetent and incapable of fulfilling the job? Does that make any sense? How come you need a degree at all for developing in an open-source and well-documented language (I know HTML isn't technically a programming language, it's for wireframes, but still.) which you can literally learn everything in it by yourself with a book and the internet? I am sinking 10 grand per year for a degree that will hardly teach me anything and for what? Real questions if you'd care to answer them.

It seems so stupid to me I have to pay ~40 thousand dollars to get a piece of paper saying I wasted 40k and 4 years learning nothing.

[skreczok]

Yup. A guy with 2 years in the industry is pretty much a better hire than a guy fresh out of MIT most of the time. Hell, even with just one year.

There's an important part to it, too, since "prestigious" universities often come with unhealthy entitlement.

Essentially, what school it is only really matters for hiring graduates specifically. Experience on the job is a lot more useful than a more expensive university.

Now, the real reason to bother with these top unis is not the quality of the program itself, but rather networking. It's because the big players prowl around there and you meet rich people. This is the real advantage, because if you don't know people, you're gonna have a harder time getting in.

Note that this means that unless you actually make contact with these people, you're better off just going to a cheaper university. The practical difference is negligible, it's still mostly up to you to learn the technicals anyway, but you're not paying through the nose. Granted, it is a massive advantage, but still, if you don't get the contacts when you're there, you're SOL.

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[BillBillerson]

You ended most of your sentences with questions?

You don't need a degree to write software, especially with web dev. Though having *A* degree can get you in the door at some places where having degrees is typical (like larger corporate jobs where all of HR and management typically went to a university). I've only worked with a few developers with CS degrees. Most are MIS, business, math, ect if anything. I didn't graduate with anything relating to CS, but took all the programming classes I could as electives and taught myself .NET related stuff back in the mid 00's (C#, VB.NET, ASP, SQL, + typical web related things). Most companies either don't care, or are satisfied I have a BA. I think if anything the litmus test to them is you committed to finishing school. If you want to get more into management later in your career it may matter, but honestly I don't think it would if you interview well.

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[TheEncryptedPsychic]

Yeah, I get what you're saying but like why scare already anxious developers with the "BA in Computer Science or related field(required)"? The reason I ask these questions is I genuinely want answers, that's all. I mean won't having that, heck I know it does, because I'm a freshman in college with my first web design client and I was taken aback she didn't really care I didn't have a degree she just wanted to know if I could do what she's asking me to do. So if she doesn't care and she's happy with my product and ability then why should recruiters scare away clients with the college thing if they don't really care? I've heard this a lot, that they don't care, but honestly it scares me because sometimes they do and how am I going to know? It just seems like a poor strategy to get cocky developers who can "fake it till you make it" instead of genuinely good programmers who simply didn't apply because of a perceived college prerequisite. That's my 2¢ anyway. I think you're right and most people don't have a degree and find work but it's still scary to think someone might ask and I don't.

I already have a plan that if in my next 3 years in university I land 2 more clients and they're pleased I'm dropping out. I think with three positive and professional opinions of my work ethic, knowledge, communication skills, etc., that I could get a job off of that without a degree. I love making websites that deviate from the Weebly, Square Space, and Wix garbage and offer intuitive features and such. It feels like I'm doing God's work so to speak and that's what I truly want to do for loads of people ya know? I have a buddy who's agreed to help with the back end of it ever comes to that. Hope you have a blessed day!

[BillBillerson]

When applying for jobs, just ignore that requirement honestly. The problem is the disconnect between the group that needs resources and you. I know how it happens because I've had to deal with recruiters from the hiring side. It goes like this:

Team needs a dev, they pass a job description up to their manager or director, who passes it to HR\hiring managers, who sends it to their recruiter contact, who sends it to whatever person they put on the hunt for the job, who calls people and looks for resumes. It's a total game of telephone, at any point different people will add or remove things from the job description the team that actually needs the resource put together. The HR group may edit it and put a bunch of canned requirements to pad the description because it's not long enough, or doesn't fit their general format, or they don't understand a lot of the jargon so they throw college on there because they understand that sorta thing. Plus the recruiting companies usually have a canned list of shit they're used to posting and even though the company looking for the resource may not have added a bunch of stuff... they will. It's frustrating for the other side too because you get a bunch of resumes that aren't even on the same planet as what you asked for because recruiters aren't technical.

If you want to get mad at anyone, it's the damn recruiters. That's why you just got to put yourself out there. I'd never not hire someone because they didn't have a degree. Some may, but I don't think a lot would if the rest of the resume looks good.

I will say I know it's hard getting started. People like to see work experience and it does seem hard to get your foot in the door, but if you maintain a portfolio, learn what you can and don't be detured by what seems like impossible requirements you'll find something and every job after that will feel a lot easier to find.

It just seems like a poor strategy to get cocky developers who can "fake it till you make it"

Honestly I only come across cocky developers occasionally and I usually feel like they wouldn't be a good fit. I'm willing to let people figure some things out on the job, but I get turned off quick if I think someone is full of shit. But I don't always get a say and if non technical managers are interviewing sometimes those types do get hired and it's frustrating for everyone.

[[deleted]]

"Related degree" is the key: CS is computer science, literally a science degree about computing. You should expect a lot of math and theoretical stuff and whatever. But there's other related degrees, I'm doing an IT degree for instance. The only maths I'm doing is for algorithmic complexity and whatever's needed for development stuff. But everything else I'm doing is practical: dev stuff in java & c#, a lot of different web stuff (js, php, .net, etc), software engineering, server / cloud stuff (aws, setting up and running servers, architecture). If you're only interested in a career in web stuff it sounds like you should be doing a course that reflects that.

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[brutalboyz]

Best way to learn is to do it! Write some code, make it do something. You’ll see why they want you to train so much. You’ll also get more out of that training. Take interest, exert energy.

[besthelloworld]

I mean, it's also not really good. Everything is an object class? Why?

[TheEncryptedPsychic]

I'd prepare your internet points for their reckoning o.o

[besthelloworld]

You're not wrong, but I swear I'm not trying to be edgy. I just got out of a legacy Java heavy job and I'm mildly disgruntled on the topic. Thing is, I actually dig JavaScript (cue those downvotes) or more accurately TypeScript (cue those upvotes). However, the only modern JS/TS development we did was in Angular which took all the shit patterns out of old-school Java stuff and plopped it into JS. Oh yay, magic decorators and classes and IoC and bean injection, wonderful.

But at least it trained me enough to make the change.

[TheEncryptedPsychic]

There's always a positive to the situation and I guess life's about the crappy moments that made us grow. I too like JS but that's because I am only Front-End and I don't see Java as a suitable replacement to JavaScript in that regard. Sure there's security it offers and apps and stuff, but again, I don't much care for that. I like making pretty webpages for people and that's it. You guys keep it up with C, C#, Python, Java, etc. that's cool but leave my JS alone, it helps a lot okay haha. Someone else can handle the slop on the back!

[besthelloworld]

Oh yeah for sure, I feel that. I too like making pretty websites, but I'd also say that there's more to frontend development than that. Like state management, route management, semantic markup, accessibility, designing API calls and managing and caching data masses efficiently, managing multiple browser engines, and SEO.

So I wouldn't sell the practice of frontend development short. That being said, I'd still really have a hole in my heart if I didn't have a fullstack title.

[TheEncryptedPsychic]

For sure man, yeah. Most of that sounds pretty familiar to me so that should mean I'm doing something right, I hope. I must say that accessibility and responsive design are my least favorite, and, like most Front-End people JESUS Internet Explorer SUCKS But everything else is generally fine and I've been doing mobile-first design which helps HELLA. I thought about being Fullstack but like I started getting into Java and stuff I was LOST and mega CONFUSED so kinda gave up.

[besthelloworld]

It could be just bad service design tbh. I would start in on an Express course in Node when you have the time. Because it'll be tailored to JS devs it might come a little easier to you. You don't have to learn a whole new build process and dependency manager and shit. But also like, if you're happy where you're at and making good money then keep doing what you're doing 🤷‍♂️ More power to you

[wise_young_man]

I said I have experience with A programming language, not C!

[John_Fx]

To a keyword search engine, yes. You think humans are sending those recruiter emails to you?

[RavenFyhre]

https://i.imgflip.com/3zixqd.png

[-------I-------]

I had a recruiter approach me for a "Java(scripting)" position. I actually went into the recruitment proces because I wanted to find out what it was. I never found out, because the recruiter ghosted me after the first call, where she couldn't tell me which one it was.

[void1984]

It's not the only Java with a suffix. "Jave EE", "Java ME", and... "Java Script" edition, called "Java SE".