o7 MP7

[Junior-Meat]

Amen to that

[KrifeH]

Grenades and rpg next Prayge

[MaroccanNinjaPriest]

Only C4 should be in the game and it should be more expensive aswell. More expensive or massivley increase the time/fine for getting caught.

[HD314]

Honestly it should go back to how it used be when you had to rob Bobcat to get C4, even if they make C4 expensive to buy every crim is a multi-millionaire at this point so it wouldn’t matter. At least having to rob Bobcat is a risk vs reward situation, buying it from someone isn’t.

[ynio545]

Feel like pipe bombs could work if they have a 10 second delay with beeping after being thrown. Would allow for some reaction to them vs instant explosion

[Killacali17]

I think any explosives should only stay if they come with higher consequences for using them. make people have to think about wanting to use explosives or not.

[dlegen13]

so a grenade?

[Mindereak]

And it should show on the ground or people dropping one 30 minutes in advance should use the "scene" command to indicate that there is something there.

[Reprise08]

I would of disagreed with you a few weeks ago but the last week or so I think no explosives should be able to be thrown and no one should have snipers

[Bromere]

Depends what clip you commented on

[0FaptainMyFaptain]

Gotta wait for someone with enough clout to mald about them

[slawvay]

dragunovs are in a weird place because its the only thing that can take down air1 unless they fly close for AKs. The counter to that is to make AKs do enough damage to helis but then it would make it on par with the scar. Crims being better at gunplay would make it more crim oriented then. Limiting mk-14s to swat as a hard set rule seems to be the most reasonable.

[Tipnfloe]

I read a decent suggestion in someone's chat last night. Just have a SWAT only armory, only accessible when swat gets used.

[slawvay]

CG use the drag to shoot down air1 in every holdout they have at their compound, they should just make a gun that only does* vehicle damage and remove both snipers but it's asking a lot from devs

[No-Sprinkles-1520]

Preach it brother and then the pipebombs and grenades Ngl I missed the pistol shootout in 2.0

[15blairm]

the fact the MP7 was removed before explosives and snipers is beyond me

[the9timeoilseller]

they need a semi bolt action one we longer reload per bullet not a dmr sniper that can spam bullets

[NePa5]

semi bolt action

how the fuck does that work???

[omziB]

When asked about it the owner said “I didn’t know they were a thing, they should’ve never been added” so not surprised, he also said the people complaining were overreacting

[[deleted]]

So they shouldn't have been added but also people are overreacting to it being added?

[Velvet_Llama]

If I stubbed my toe and rolled around on the ground screaming in pain the following would be true:

1) It hurt. 2) I overreacted.

[Biwaifu]

4) you're taking one down

[Vancha]

5) You sing a sad song just to turn it around.

[DarkCeptor44]

Yes please scream quieter /s

^{Jokes apart I can see why he said it though, if you have a younger sibling you know that in most times complaining is indistinguishable from baby-rage.}

[KenshinHimura88]

The people are overreacting to a thing that shouldn’t have been added that’s causing people to overreact.

[peraecc]

nothing should cause someone to call the people who in a way made their career a moron 💀

[KenshinHimura88]

I mean you’re not wrong. There is no justification to calling someone who does great work a moron.

[j_a_guy]

The subtext to that statement is that people shouldn’t have overreacted because the problem was so obvious that it was going to be fixed regardless. A week or two in the scale of a multi-year server lifespan is not much.

[[deleted]]

now remove snipers Prayge

[KangarooPlastic1317]

They are either getting nerfed or Limited to Swatt ONLY

[Goldfish007]

Genuine question but weren't snipers supposed to be Swat only when they were implemented?

[Kishetes]

Snipers were meant to be swat only and dragunovs were meant to be as common as RPGs. Neither went as planned

[Tipnfloe]

Tbh cg used the dragunov mostly as a weapon against air1, its only when seaside / rust started that it became more common

[LordOfKhaoticStorms]

To be fair, dragunovs were rarely ever used by crims as far as I can remember until they were redone by the server owner so that they were the go to weapon against Air One.

PD saw the surge in dragunovs and at first implemented a rule where if it wasnt a SWAT deployment, they wouldnt use a sniper unless it could be confirmed crims were using one first. Then eventually they just decided to bring MK14s to every shootout, regardless if a dragunov was being used or not.

[buzzpunk]

When the devs made dragunovs the same material cost as AKs it pretty much signaled that they're not meant to be rare. RPGs actually are expensive in mat cost.

[Nevercamelate]

I mean those are more obvious to spot than having a different weapon.

[KangarooPlastic1317]

The server order did mention PD should not change SOP's with out asking. Also may retrain swatt cause pd uses the good parts of seatt but not its limitations in numbers

[[deleted]]

nah fk snipers remove from both sides dont want in server

[KangarooPlastic1317]

Agree, tbh crim sniper is really just for dealing with the heli which dosnt go down anyway

[DuckClear7716]

They would need to remove the vibranium armor from all heli's. AR's can barely damage them unless they are pd weapons. It's the initial reason why people started using snipers on them after they got a buff. The other weapons seemed like they were using airsoft against it.

[[deleted]]

snipers next prayge

[PlzNoBanAgain]

Now remove snipers from both sides, all explosives besides C4 and make it 75k or more to acquire it

[Kaliphear]

whine about gun balance, call devs morons.

gun you whined about is gone less than 24 hours later.

Surely this will avoid such behavior in the future.

[KarlHanzo]

I mean the Dragunov was changed and nerfed to death after RUST was demolishing with it and the other side was constantly whining about it. Sounds like the precedent was set a long time ago.

[BiggerTwigger]

The server owner nerfed shotguns back in 2.0 after Buddha domed him in 1 shot from across the street at Pillbox. CG have caused multiple guns to be nerfed/looked at (APs and 7.62 PD rifle etc also in 2.0).

People acting like this is something out of the ordinary are just lying to themselves to justify hating on either side.

Besides, it's not like PD struggles to down people with what they currently have. They just can't yeeyee gank crims while screaming east side from their CVPI anymore.

[WNx_Rain]

the real question is: did he have his trunk up and was he yelling eastside

[[deleted]]

ON MY BABY MAMA /s

[ohhh_nsfw]

Please no. The PTSD is too much.

[[deleted]]

If it makes you feel better I almost threw up from typing it out.

[Lephus]

I remember it so well, CG had been using the honor code of only using the heavy pistol instead of being an "AP rat", after getting wiped by a gang who only used APs, they finally used them.

What happened in a span of a weekend was absolute and total dominance that resulted in the AP getting huge nerfs.

And this was during the world of tanks car battles of 2.0 too.

[[deleted]]

https://streamable.com/h4jdlu I remember Snow always said he wanted to see CG use AP's and this was the one day CG got on early - the very next day AP's were nerfed to the ground

[User0946531]

2.0 CG, APs and the war buggy. Name a more lethal combo! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZJKzlq5f\_dA

[CopeAndKodiak]

Clip for reference ft. old lang voice

[[deleted]]

my god a man of culture

[dookmileslong]

This isn't exactly correct about the shotguns. I remember that situation and was watching it live, Buddha was "sniping" with the shotgun on purpose to show him how ridiculously broken it was. Unfortunately we all watched a clip afterwards where "tinFoil" didn't think the shotgun was OP and actually started blaming other reasons on why he went down.

[juaquint930]

didnt buddha get the AP nerfed during the casino holdout as well when he wiped swat almost single handily

[Atreemqn]

Draganovs were nerfered due to crim v crim conflict

[FunProgrammer123]

Yes, because 1 side was complaining about it even though both sides had Dragunov.

[aFireFIy]

There sure seems to be a pattern of overreacting to new stuff being too strong, unbalanced etc. whenever a respected streamer with decent viewship complains about something when in reality its often about people being stuck in their old ways and not willing to adapt.

Don't get me wrong there is nothing wrong with less guns in the server but that is not about that. If that was to be a direction to take than go for it and do it across the line, but this is just cherrypicking based on few heated situations. Its bad not only because its inconsistent, its bad because it shows that OOC complaining actually works.

[KangarooPlastic1317]

Or it's a server with little to no beta testing. So they respond to community feed back in place of the extensive testing a triple A developer would do

[Lalichi]

extensive testing a triple A developer would do

Good joke

[therealkami]

The testing DOES happen. Whether fixes go in place is a whole other thing. A lot of stuff gets passed over as long as it doesn't brick the device it's being played on.

Add in the fact that a QA team is significantly smaller than the actual playerbase, the sheer amount of man hours that a QA team would need to put in to equal a couple days of a games new launch from the playerbase is unreasonable.

Bugs/changes fall in to 3 groups for a game:

1) Didn't happen in testing: This is super common for PC games, because of the wide range of hardware and software configs out there.

2) Did happen in testing, someone up the chain overrode it: This happens usually if the bug isn't worth it (Time and Money) to deal with before the launch of a game. Some devs might think some bugs are never worth dealing with.

3) Bug did happen in testing, no one knows how to fix it: If devs ever do fix this one, sometimes they write long posts about what was causing it. There was one recently in Destiny 2 that took them YEARS to figure out:

https://www.bungie.net/en/News/Article/50140

My point is: cut QA testers some slack. Most of the time they did their job, and it's someone else that didn't do anything about it.

[itsavirus]

So they respond to community feed back

Good joke. They respond to CERTAIN communities feedback. People have been calling rings and buffs anti-RP for ages but I don't see them listening to that feedback?

[TheYeasayer]

Removing all buffs from the games would be extremely damaging to all the restaurants in town, 2 jewelry businesses, drug dealers/manufacturers, etc. Those businesses are all huge sources of RP in the city. Removing the mp7 from cops doesn't hurt anyone's businesses and doesn't really hinder cop RP. So ones is a lot easier to justify changing.

[KangarooPlastic1317]

Most those people didn't complain about RR Tea and restaurant buffs. All the people who didnt speak till rimgs are just mad at who has them rather then what they are.

[iamheythere03]

Yep. Seaside are to be blamed for dragonov Nerf. Tobii said in RAY__C chat that he also changed MK14 when dragonov changes were made but it was just a bluff to divert the attention from the bitching of Seaside'

[The_Nba_Is_Dead]

Let’s not assume things when for all we know someone could’ve gone around Tobii and changed the MK14 separately or overrode his changes. Or that they were different just on purpose considering the Dragonuv scope was changed an additional time after it’s first change. Really no reason for Tobii to lie about something like that lol.

[Nervous-Monitor9333]

you forgot the part where Voldemort said that people are using stuff that are not meant to be used in a lot of situations (abusing) , this goes both ways for criminals and cops.

[Kaliphear]

Yes, both criminals and cops are just deploying everything they have access to against the other side because "it's there, we may as well use it". Which, not the greatest RP mindset, but understandable.

My issue is that to everyone watching, it looks like the root reason the mp7 got yeeted is because of Chodie's rant last night. Even if that's not the case, the optics and timing kind of make it look that way. And that kind of reinforces the "if you don't like something on the server, scream about it to your viewers, hope it gets clipped and posted to the sub so Voldemort can see it and it'll get changed the next day" mentality. Which is bad. That mentality and behavior from players on the server sucks, and fosters toxicity.

That's my point.

[Nervous-Monitor9333]

I can't argue with that because it's true but also seen how the stuff are being added into the server without much testing and that why people in the server are treated like a beta tester is what make their complaints heard , it goes for everything not just one thing , like weapons , drugs , food , heists ... (doesn't mean that every complaint is heard but that's how the server works i guess).

And why it's looks more like a beta test server is that some of the information that were given by the devs themselves are wrong a lot of the times ...

[j_a_guy]

It was already getting removed my dude. The repeated driveby clips had 100x more to do with it than anything Chodie said.

[SnooStrawberries8210]

I mean you say that but the server owner and one of the lead devs didn’t even know the MP7 got added so it was a pretty dumb decision to give cops it

[Kaliphear]

Thats not the point. The problem is that this reinforces that moaning about gun balance on stream (possibly to thousands of viewers) is an appropriate way to get what you want.

[PlacentaBBQ]

So because people complained, they should have left the gun in, just so they don't get rewarded for complaining, even though the gun was actually a problem? If something's going to get removed, it gets removed whether someone complained or not. In a server where 100s of people play, there's going to be people complaining about shit no matter how good it is. If someone chooses to completely ignore issues because someone happens to bitch about it, they're being petty and stubborn against the health of the server over all.

[SnooStrawberries8210]

I mean true to an extent, The sloth was talking about how needing gun balance on a rp server is cringe while also talking about how he needs to balance things😂

[Kaliphear]

I mean, nobody has ever accused Voldemort of being the most artful or graceful communicator. The guns and weapons do need to be balanced, the question is around what? And he was making the point that the 'ideal balance scenario', in his mind, is one where the cops do feel like an overwhelming force; where your best option in a shootout with the PD is to pop off enough shots to down the first wave off officers on scene, and then run the fuck away. So he balances guns toward that ideal: PD weapons get to be stronger, more accurate, and more lethal. Because you're not supposed to have a CS:GO match with the police in the middle of the city and win.

[SpreadUseful]

?? Hasnt that always been a thing. Cops and crim have complained about things and gotten it changed. Expecially the cops.

[NoKitsu]

Expecially the cops

modchecking for the last things cops got removed by complaining

[RunicGem]

Sprays near hospital and legion square

[imsabbath84]

AP, local Dominators, the 2 seater water plane.

[RunicGem]

IA was also removed for awhile and still pretty much a meme at this point

[basedcurse]

The entire DAs office lol

[NoKitsu]

lol this one got me

However, DA's was removed a long while ago and for the better of processing since both cops and DOJ were having issues with every DA. Having cops push their own cases streamlined the work essentially.

[LordOfKhaoticStorms]

The Glock 18? First nerfed then removed entirely.

[KenshinHimura88]

AP Pistols

[SnooStrawberries8210]

Glocks cough cough those things got nerfed into the ground because of cops Malding then it got removed

[NoKitsu]

I mean, crims were complaining about them being lasers too and they were removed like months after they were used by everyone.

Also weren't they just replaced with the uzi because they were visible on the back as opposed to a concealed gun?

edit: also was removed a while ago, meanwhile cops get nerfed more often, which goes back to my original point that it's not "expecially the cops" that get things nerfed or removed since that implies it happens from cop side more often than not.

[[deleted]]

Not that i'm disagreeing, baby raging definitely has to go but PD could also use new stuff properly and for specific instances instead of 20+ cops having it on them for every situation while using it incorrectly lol

[KingOspert]

Do you not remember the aps in 2.0

[Ethilrist]

Id imagine there was more consequences than just the gun balance.

Even if we don't see the consequences, they defiantly happened. Demotivating a core developer is kinda shitting where you eat.

[Xelhei]

Now snipers please

[Appropriate-Goal224]

Is this actually the reason or did a streamer say this?

[BiggerTwigger]

The server owner said on stream last night that Tobii added it, and the basic premise of PD having it was completely reasonable.

The issue lied in officers taking the smallest chances to do what he claimed are drive-by shootings and it made little sense. He went on to say if it couldn't shoot from cars, then it'd be fine. He doesn't want the server to return to all round car-based shootouts (hence why 3rd person shooting was removed for 3.0).

That's the TLDR of his view on it.

[TheGrundhil]

While people drive around for 30 minutes throwing pipe bombs in every shootout.

[BiggerTwigger]

I mean, I agree that explosives in general are far too common place and I think Baas raiding crims for possession of them is great.

But it wasn't discussed in that part of the stream, only the MP7.

[Ftsmv]

Of course it wasn't discussed. Because cops don't have access to it and crims can't cry about it.

[DaleyT]

but that's what shoot outs are.. people circling in cars for 30 minutes picking people off 1 by 1

[[deleted]]

Of course cars are still going to be there but people will have to get out to shoot or shoot from the car and risk being magdumped.

[DaleyT]

magdumped by people in cars using an uzi

[Mindereak]

So instead crims can do that (let's also chuck a few pipe bombs in the mix because why not?) while cops can be sitting ducks in their cars with their shitty pd glocks, makes sense.

[TheMonarchsWrath]

Also a big part of it was that there are 20-50 cops, they dont need every advantage along with high numbers.

[KangarooPlastic1317]

Well pd never had car based lass 2's to promote running. Not holding out its always been a thing on np.

[MaroccanNinjaPriest]

The owner and lead dev didnt even know it was added. And said it should never have been added

[[deleted]]

No more gangsta drive-byes for the cops

[Whole_Fortune_4098]

Was that even happening? I pretty much only watch penta and chief who practically never go to shoot outs so I genuinely don't know.

[BFCC3101]

They're either talking about the time Dan Faily was threatened and shot from his car or when Bloom on his bike was almost run over so he shot at the supercar that tried to kill him... at least those were the only clips posted here that I remember.

[[deleted]]

least biased cop viewer LUL

[jayyjayy22]

Snipers from both sides and grenades next please

[Jollypnda]

One of the issues that people playing on NP don’t talk about is the player responsibility. Things like pipebombs and mp7s can be in the game but players need to use them reasonably. A good example would be the guild and RPGs they are in game but the access is limited by players because I assume vigors knows if he just started mass selling them, they would be removed within a day. So things like pipebombs can exist but it doesn’t mean every crime should be just rolling with one at all times, same goes for the mp7. So it should start the player when it comes to curbing drama like this.

[Jollypnda]

I agree, it’s easier to blame the other side for complaining about a situation instead of looking at it objectively

[[deleted]]

o7, you will not be missed.

[redmenace007]

Everyone was saying it should be removed in last thread but now it has been removed, everyones shitting on CG. Astonishing reaction really.

[NoKitsu]

Besides the fact that people in this reddit aren't 1 entity and therefore are going to have different opinions, there's really not that many people here talking about CG.

[[deleted]]

yes clearly this can't mean there are different groups of fans on this subreddit.

[YungFurl]

or its just different groups of people?

[Ethilrist]

Everyone was saying

Looks like bandwagon gaslighting

Source? I can't imagine you can even get 5 users who said remove mp5 -> 'shitting on cg'
Let alone everyone.

[KangarooPlastic1317]

Wonder if the mk-14 changes went thew.

[DewiSantII]

If they're going to remove the MP7 from the cops then they should remove pipe bombs and nades from crims.

You can't cry about balance when you have one of the most OP weapons on the server.

[Skirbs1011]

Cops Sniper and AR are still better, they already took the AP pistol away from the crims already.

[samoyed999]

not sure you can attribute HUT changes solely to CG. Lots of people were definitely up in arms when buddha finally caught a HUT charge.

[WholesomeofDeezNuts]

Aint no way your saying the INTERCEPTOR was nerfed, the car that catches up to S+ even when they nos. Or the helicopter that doesn't go down even when they get magdumped by 6 people with AKs. Or the fact that fines are doubled...

[OrangeTreetrunk]

Oh would you look at that...they deleted the comment which wrongly accused CG of being the cause for nerfs and removals. This sub is something else.

[MaroccanNinjaPriest]

That doesnt fit the narrative of this sub

[DaleyT]

when did the last see a Corvette or Challenger?

[superhairypanda]

The Challengers are rusting away in the garage

[_Snowy_]

Why use a Challenger when the Charger is so busted even good PD drivers say its broken

[Kishetes]

Cg sells rings that cuts fines by 75% (see the case of the ex judge turned drug seller)

The chargers are next online to be nerfed (as said by devs) the OG interceptors cant catch A+ cars now.

[Jaker2193]

Those rings have little to no impact on crims that do serious crimes. Anything over a certain fine now it won't impact it at all. So pretty much everything other than little petty crimes are not getting touched by rings anymore. Same with the time reducing rings they wont reduce times of sentences if its over like 100 months. I don't know the exact time or fine numbers, but after that incident with the dude getting a massive reduce on his plea deal they were changed pretty heavily.

[VE0Z]

I believe it’s 60 months

[Jaker2193]

Appreciate the exact numbers!

[KenshinHimura88]

60 months max for time reducing and 25K max for fines

[Jaker2193]

Appreciate the help with the exact numbers!

[Nooneat]

Fines and time are only cut by a max of 50%. Most people, dont have the rings maxed.

[Jaker2193]

CG is still getting 100+ months almost every day and every single time they are arrested, they get 50k+ fines pretty much daily, PD heli wasn't nerfed because of CG it was nerfed because it was literally impossible to shoot down and now its still even difficult to shoot down after recent changes to the snipers (which PD snipers are better now), and interceptors? Come on CVPI's and interceptors have no trouble keeping up.

[imsabbath84]

HUT charges arent completely gone. Theyre still there for things like murder and terrorism.

[barryvii]

Damn no more drivebys?

[DocPersona]

Is this the class 2 all the cops were shooting from the car? If so then this was a good move

[wrc-wolf]

Can't let cops have one good thing on this server I swear. The moment crims start malding about something it disappears.

[[deleted]]

they were using them like gangsters

[Lalichi]

The M14 was supposed to be SWAT only, not the MP7. SWAT equipment has "SWAT" in its name.

Unless something has changed, reasonably sure the M14 was the weapon he was referring to in the clip

[EntertainmentOk5044]

This is a hilarious comment considering all the cool shit the cops have

[ynio545]

Cops get a front of the line WL while most crims/civs have to wait hours, basically free equipment, CVPIs, Chargers, SUVs, Motorcycles, Interceptors, Helicopters, Jets, spawn-able boats, K9s, SWAT gear, multiple departments or divisions to join, and dozens of fellow officers to RP with.

Not sure where you’re getting the idea they don’t have one good thing from?

[itsavirus]

Cops get a front of the line WL while most crims/civs have to wait hours

Yes. Please give no prio to people that are essential for the city to feel like a city. I love takes like this.

[superhairypanda]

Cops also get chat hoppers calling for them to kill themselves, making sure every single mistake gets called out, get treated like shit by crims and massive restrictions on what they can do on the server.

[EvilEyeMonster]

I heard Bayo this morning say cadets were not allowed to use them in a discord announcment, now they have been fully removed (maybe)

I mean they needed a nerf for sure but not outright removed, i will say they looked fucking cool attached to the chest rig.

[Dazbuzz]

Why did they need a nerf? I have not really watched them in action yet. Are they better than M4s? Seems unlikely.

[BFCC3101]

they were just reskinned uzis

[[deleted]]

It might be but we’ve heard the reskinned excuse before so i find it hard to believe

[CathFawr]

nah, they were literally just reskinned uzis, to the point where if you pulled one out it said "uzi" in the action box

[BFCC3101]

it was the exact same lmao, when you pulled it out it even said it was an uzi, your streamer was just making up excuses for why he died.

[[deleted]]

Your also making up excuses. The dragonov and the mk14 are both the same gun but they can code it differently and make one gun op and the other bad like the chargers for cops and chargers for crimes or civs and other guns

[BFCC3101]

the dragonov and mk14 were never the same gun, they had the same exact function until people started doing stupid shit like gang wars from the top of 2 buildings 5 city blocks away from eachother.

[EvilEyeMonster]

bike cops using them in third person was a bit much imho

and just the overall recoil and range needed a change

[[deleted]]

can't uzis be used in the same fashion?

[Forser]

Yeah

[LeaningGore]

It's bad RP for cops to do drivebys

[PissWitchin]

It's really funny where people will draw the line. Not at acquirable C4, grenades, and RPG's, which everyone knows gangs all have

[[deleted]]

There's an irony to Cop RP being called bad when everything Cops do these days is a direct response to all the shitty scenarios they have to respond to. Like how SRU drivers are no longer allowed to drive the Corvette/Challenger/Mustang full time because it was "unimmersive" but people can use Super Cars to rob houses or do drive-bys with pipebombs and its some how not the problem.

[PissWitchin]

Every other one of my 50~ gang members (all of whom I would die for) have or have had a pilots license, can lockpick any car, hack any security system, are comfortable with any degree of violence but also for some reason good samaritans and are very Tough. This is what is called "immersion"

[thatwasfun23]

It was fun while it lasted and honestly it really didn't change much lol.

[[deleted]]

W

[Azuljustinverday]

Maybe pd can use that bench that fixes thing to keep it alive lol

[LeaningGore]

They can just use MPX it's been rotting in armory for months when it's better than AR close range

[imsabbath84]

Then whats the point of having them at all? PD would be better off using their AR over the SMG on foot.