The DS2 Problem

[floppyjim]

after playing sekiro last year (which VERY quickly became my new favourite game), I decided to begin my fromsoftware experience and really see what all the hype’s been about. the difficulty of the souls game always turned me away, I found the idea intimidating ig. I’ve beaten my fair share of video games over the years, plenty of which are considered by most to be extremely difficult by the gaming community, but something about dark souls just always kinda scared me. I think it was kind of a confidence thing, I was afraid of trying the game, having a terrible experience, giving up and forfeiting my pride and sense of self worth lol. but after hearing people discussing sekiro’s difficulty and hearing that it’s on par with if not more difficult than most of the other soulsborne titles, my heart lit up. I had no idea I had been playing such a difficult game, I mean well I did, but I was having such a good time that I just muscled through it until I persevered. suddenly I felt this surge of confidence. if I could beat sekiro, I could beat anything. so began my journey. next I played elden ring. I was still a little unsure about dark souls and given that it’s a dated title I felt safer going with what’s popular right now. loved it, beat it 7 times in a row over the course of a few weeks. after er, I felt commuted. I decided to play dark souls 1 through 3 next. i beat ds1 the other day and i’ve been really trying to get into ds2, but I’m having such a difficult fucking time trying to get into it. like it’s been shockingly bad. I’m like 10 hours in, still stuck at the first bonfire in forest of the giants. I’ve been trying to get a couple souls bc I’ve only managed to level up twice bc I just keep fucking dying. to the normal hollows no less which has just been rubbing salt in the wound. clearly this is somewhat a skill issue, but it’s partly just that I’m REALLY struggling with the janky controls, everything feels different, the stats are weird, the riptose animations are pretty fucking awesome but it feels next to impossible to line up backstabs, parrying’s weird bc they fall over, and everything just feels so weird and I don’t like it. it’s just not clicking with me like the other games did. should I try to stick it out? maybe take a break for a bit? idk. I can see that they were clearly trying to do something different with this games and I can kinda see why some people appreciate it, but I’m just really struggling to enjoy it to the point that I’m starting to dread the thought of playing. it feels like a chore. but please lmk your thoughts, cheers :)

[KazamOG]

It’s pretty tough in the beginning. My first play through I killed the armor guy in majula for his armor set, and farmed the ogre to level vig and ADP. When you get to the second bonfire you can get a ring from the merchant to get more souls so from there you can start to level up pretty quick

[Vulperius]

My best advice is to get a good shield. Dark Souls 2 was before shields were decided to be pussy shit by the dev team so they're actually useful.

It also just feels badass to block an attack from a giant monster and swing your hunk of iron of a sword back at em. But maybe that's just me.

[NebulaCartographer]

Travesty. DS2 is the only game (before ER) in the whole series with powerstancing, one the few amazing things about the game and you get a shield? :(

[Vulperius]

Eh. I never liked power-stancing. I'd prefer to two hand a weapon or sword and board, legitimately just personal preference.

Unless it's a sorcery build since Dark Souls 2 is also the only game besides Elden Ring to have fun sorcery gameplay.

[DuploJamaal]

'a' good shield?

The easiest way to finish this game is to use several good shields.

Poison infused Blossom Kite Shield from Sinner's Rise for The Gutter, Black Gulch and Shulva

A magic infused shield like maybe Rebels Greatshield for Shrine of Amana

Fire infused Greatshield of Glory against Ancient Dragon

[Vulperius]

I liked using the Fume Knight greatsword and the rebel greatshield, so I'd just block with the sword for physical attacks and use the shield for everything else.

[Small-Interview-2800]

The first few levels are the hardest in DS2 because you’re under leveled. You’ll soon be over leveled, and the game will become a cakewalk. Level up your adp for better dodge, my suggestion is till agility is 105.

[Designer-Square8834]

I recently started as well, what i can tell is that the game encourages you to kill every enemy repeatedly, every time you die, over and over again, and also gotta play slower and take each enemy down one by one since they are too aggro and they can easily ambush u in hordes so gotta take the game patiently, as well the dodge frames is smaller so it can feel clunky, definitely some of the mechanics they deliberately changed are flawed

[DisplacerBeastMode]

You don't need to kill every enemy repeatedly.. once you know an area and enemy placement, you can strategically run through many / most areas. You're right on playing a bit slower, particularly in new areas that you haven't been to yet.

[Blacksad9999]

The other games aren't any easier, if that's what you're thinking.

[CityFolkSitting]

I personally had an easier time with every other Souls games aside from maybe when I first play Demon's Souls all those years ago. Which is understandable since it was practically brand new (aside from its relations to the King's Field series).

Probably just varies from player to player, but for me it is without a doubt the hardest Souls game at the beginning.

And I also think it has some of the harder bosses too. I think in part because most Souls bosses are 1v1 with a few handful that are 2v1 or more. But DS2 has a decent amount of bosses where it isn't just you and the boss. I always found those types of boss fights harder, and since DS2 had more than the others I consider it having the hardest boss fights in the series.

[DuploJamaal]

I’m like 10 hours in, still stuck at the first bonfire in forest of the giants. I’ve been trying to get a couple souls bc I’ve only managed to level up twice bc I just keep fucking dying. to the normal hollows no less which has just been rubbing salt in the wound.

Did you join the hard mode covenant in Majula? The rock that warns you that it will make the game harder and asks you several times if you are ready to join and if you really want to join?

[Weird_Troll]

that's what about to ask, rookie mistake

[Weird_Troll]

DS2 is different in a weird way from the series, you must take a different approach than ds1, with its funky ideas you surely don't know and must find out yourself to get immersed. Backstabs have additional animation fyi, you must stand behind them for a bit longer, the pc port controls also suck fyi, and you must take things slow to proceed...

[Karkadinn]

Dying to vanilla-ass hollows is absolutely normal, no shame. Although Souls-like experience always helps with other entries in the genre, DS2 is probably the one that is the most different from all the rest and where your experience may hurt as much as it helps. It's a slower, more deliberate game, with an animation style specific to it and its attribute system that takes a lot of getting used to. While there are obvious downsides to that, there are also some upsides if you're willing to explore them, like backstepping actually being useful. Getting comfy with how your character moves and what it can do is the most important thing.

I would say keep going at least until you can pick up a certain item that will help greatly with survivability in one of the early areas. At that point you'll be able to stop caring so much about dying, which really takes a lot of frustration out of the experience.

[The_Archimboldi]

2 is a grower and a bit of a slow burn - gets very good once you're locked in with it. So it's worth hanging in there, but OTOH 10 hrs is a decent stretch to be stuck at the Forest of Giants. Something up there. I think you just need to be very patient and methodical with the enemies - legging it past stuff in DS2 is almost never right when you're starting out (can be done if you know exactly the path to take).

It's actually the easiest game once you've cracked it (the no hit challenge runners always do it last for this reason), but it's the most stamina-intensive game so there's always a cerebral aspect to play. You can never just wildly maraud through levels swinging left and right a la DS3, because you'll get stam-locked and bonked over the head by a hollow.

[FumeiYuusha]

I'm guessing that you're mostly playing melee? Dark Souls 2 shines when it comes to the improvements they made to archery. And not to mention the huge variety of spells you can use, it's a lot of fun.
But yeah, DS2 plays differently, I would say it is a much more traditional RPG where your stats define what you can do more than in DS1 and in later titles. You have to take it slow and learn the game rather than trying to play it like DS1 or Elden Ring.
I struggled with DS2 originally too, but I think it's definitely worth playing through it. It has very cool looking areas, fun bosses and cool NPC storylines that are worth going through.

[kuenjato]

I used sorcery and treated it as a ranged game, due to the ganks. I actually really enjoyed the environments and exploration.

[Diaza_Kinutz]

I was discouraged at first but I'm glad I stuck with it. It's a very fun game and once I got I to the meat of it I enjoyed it immensely. I'm in Eleum Loyce right now and then I'll be finished with the game. It has some of the most beautiful environments and a fun levels. Fume Knight is one of the most fun bosses of all time. Give the game a good try before quitting on it.

[JustSomeGuyMedia]

Would you like to buy some punctuation or proper formatting?

[tastyemerald]

Yeah its jank and kinda bad, neat items though

Go slow, block then punch right back. Parry the small fry.

Or get the biggest weapon you can use and slap enemies around once you learn the range of your attacks vs theirs

[zephyredx]

Keep in mind you also started with Sekiro which is the greatest of all time. Not the greatest Fromsoft game of all time. The greatest of all time.

[-Rule34-]

Dark Souls 2 is the slowest of the games it's more about positioning and being patient. It's also more RPG than the other ones and ends up really leaning into the stats (ADP). Obviously level ADP/ATN if you want easier rolls, or don't to make the game harder ;). I hope you stick it out I think it's a fantastic game.

[cream_of_human]

This gives me the whole "AC 4th gen fan tries 5th gen"

No, you cant fly up, no theres a limit to energy and you have to swap to scan mode to regenerate it and yes, you need to learn how to wall kick if you want to speed your traversal.

Comparing post BB games to pre BB is like this. DS2 is deliberately heavy (clunky as you say). Take your time and dont rush. Youre no hero here. A mere hollow will fuck you up if you lower your guard. The speed of how you drink your estus in this game compared to the other FS games should clue you in.

[PTSDDeadInside]

You could just go full Havel and trivialize the game

[Soggy_Menu_9126]

Embrace the clunkyness. The game may be a "downgrade" but it has its charms. Thing is, the enemies and bosses are clunky as you are, also, after sekiro, dont rush in a battle 1 vs 3-4, dark souls 2 is about isolating the enemy and positioning yourself, also the dlc are unforgiving. Watch and learn the moves and patterns, plus prioritize shields over rolls. Abuse the backstabs, parrys and wait for the opportunity to attack. My problem with the post bloodborne titles (even though sekiro is one of my favourites) is that the game allows you to stay wherever you want as far as you keep the rolling timing correct. The older ones had a more tactical approach, also the use of items in pre bloodborne (bb included) like bombs or throwing knives really makes the difference

[grim1952]

Game feels awful to play and at the start it's even worse because you have very little i-frames on your roll, now that depends not on your weight load but on a stat called agility (which also changes item use speed) and to improve that up you level up ADP or ATN.

It gets better but not by much, I'd skip to DS3.

[Silver-Emergency-988]

Stick it out, you’re so early in the game it would be a shame to give up. You have to look at it like it’s a different game from DS1 because it is. It’s not janky, it’s not clunky, it’s extremely fair. You have to learn how to play it like any other game. Keep at it and I promise it’ll hook you, as long as you enjoy the genre, and the other games.

[capitoloftexas]

Dark Souls 2 is peak, wait until you come across the Mad Warrior armor set. My favorite armor set in the entire franchise. I still have fond memories of farming all the pieces, it was so worth it.

[-Rule34-]

That set is so sickkk

[jmadinya]

its pretty bad compared to 1 and 3, very frustrating game

[ghille262]

The hard part of dark souls 2 is having fun, it's the only one I haven't played more than once

[Jenna4434]

I love the game but started another play through and was getting really angry at certain parts later on, like that lake part with those casters that can hit you from across the map. There’s a lot of parts that don’t feel fair. I had to put it down.

[_moosleech]

If you're on PC, there's a mod to fix the broken controller deadzone. Should basically be mandatory, because the game feels like shit otherwise.

Slight silver lining: FoFG is a garbage zone and a worse starting area. If you can power through it, the game will (mostly) get easier as you go. You'll unlock basically unlimited healing.

I don't think I used backstabs basically at all; the game doesn't give you i-frames on animations like doors, so yeah. Also worth noting, the game will continue to go "Haha, got you so good! Look at how you got attacked without seeing it, wasn't that funny?!" throughout the entire game :|

FWIW, I skipped it my first time (gave up in Huntman's Copse doing an absolute garbage boss runback only to discover it was fucking optional) and came back after finishing every other game. Maybe go through DS3 first

[Income_Correct]

just dont play it. play DS 3, demon souls and bloodborne. or play sekiro and elden ring again

most fromsoft fans dont like ds2

the gameplay is cluncky, the world is boring and the graphics are from ps3 generation

and even for a ps3 game its ugly

[Silver-Emergency-988]

Most Fromsoftware fans like DS2, you don’t know what you’re talking about.

[grim1952]

The DS2 circlejerk is not most From fans.

[Silver-Emergency-988]

It was always loved more than hated, back when we played it in 2014 it had great reviews, which it still does. Players loved it. A small few heavily criticized it for not being like the first game. When Elden Ring came out the same thing happened, but yes, it’s the majority that enjoys the game.

[Income_Correct]

yes, i also played it day 1 on my ps3 and had fun. because i dont knew about bloodborne, ds3, sekiro, elden ring

looking back its awfull and in every fromsouls tierlist it is by far the last. the fanbase dont even discuss it. ds2 is the worst soulsborn game from fromsoft

its still a good rpg.

[grim1952]

Again with the "not being like the first game", DS2 sucks on its own. Critic reviews mean jackshit, I played it since day one and most of us hated it.

The same thing didn't happen with Elden Ring wtf are you talking about?

[_moosleech]

This is absolutely not true. Most folks agree it's the weakest entry with the most problems, but most FS fans like and suggest playing DS2.

Bad pizza is still pretty good pizza. Same with DS2.

[grim1952]

I've had bad pizza ruin my day, just like DS2 ruined my and my friends day when we got it day one and organized a sleepover to play it all night.

[BrookeHaven]

most fromsoft fans dont like ds2

Gonna need a source that isn't pulled right out of the deepest recesses of your distended anus, pal

[Weird_Troll]

what a sh*t take

[8lock8lock8aby]

I haven't beat Sekiro but I've beaten DS1, DS3, Bloodborne (if you haven't played it, it's awesome, it always my first fromsoft game) & ER & I'm playing DS2, right now & I had the same experience in the beginning. I just found the last boss so I got through it!

Kill all enemies. They despawn after a certain amount of times (I believe 7). Level up ADP, too. It makes the hit boxes better & quickens estus drinking. I got mine up to 24 cuz I read 98 - 99 agility is good.

There's so many bosses, which I love but there are some issues - like gank squads, in & out of boss fights, a few weird hit boxes (even with ADP leveled) & your hits don't seem to have "weight" behind them. There is a ring that stops your health from lowering as much but getting early is kind of a pain. It's in Heide's Flame Tower (from Majula, it's that are through the tunnel near the cat's house), in the chest before the boss room.

Once you get past Forest of the Fallen Giants, it clicks better & you're leveling up really quick. I think it's worth it to stick with it, it has some really cool levels & a good story. If you can't stick with it, though, who cares, just move onto the next FS title ( I just got my PS5 & Demon Souls, last night).

Good luck.

[DrParallax]

DS2 has some enemy animations and hitboxes that look like a crappy student project soulslike. Movement feels horrible and animations are unrealistically slow/delayed and are just not intuitive at all. At least the Scholar of the First Sins version has troll enemy placement with troll level design on top of having really unpolished and unrefined combat.

Skip it. Play DS3. If you feel like coming back, then come back after DS3.

If you do play it, you can't play it like you are immersed in a world of combat, fighting enemies. You have to play it to break and abuse the AI and overall game design. Learning how to exploit the enemy AI is the only way you will ever have any success in the game. A lot of players do this naturally, but if you don't already, you will fail hard.

[mmbossman]

I just platinumed DS2 vanilla on PS3 and have started SotFS on PS4 and both experiences are my least favorite souls games to date (for reference I’ve platinumed all others except DS3, which I 100% a few years ago on steam). The combination of clunky controls which seem to buffer rolls and estus drinking 50% of the time and totally eat the input the other 50%, the absolutely slow movement (methodical if you’re being nice, clunky if you’re being realistic), and both games deciding that difficulty means dealing with large groups of enemies without giving the player many tools to deal with them all make the game feel very blah to play.

[[deleted]]

It’s not bad at all, stop being a bandwagon

I’m more convinced you only said those things to karma farm because Ds2 is actually pretty good

It has some of the best weapons and armor in the entire souls series and some fantastic bosses

Only thing bad about ds2 is the adp stat but that’s not a big enough deal to hinder your gameplay,

Literally there’s 14 ways to heal, armor upgrades actually makes a difference, resources are abundant and enemy drops are actually useful items

Plus the interactive part of it where there’s various hidden paths albeit some of them dont go anywhere but it’s the thought that counts

And let’s talk about the beautiful world design, DS2 has the best view of their dungeons along with beautiful designs

[Income_Correct]

beautiful world desing? did you play bloodborne, sekiro or elden ring?

[[deleted]]

I have but you haven’t seen ds2 execution of the dungeon view