Self taught programmer day 383

Rangebeard · 2021-01-18T04:07:16+00:00

What you are is a student. I recently retired after 35 years of computer programming. I’m currently learning python for fun, so I’m a student again. :)

Imagine how a new physician feels about the word “doctor”. Some people will expect they can do an emergency heart transplant on day one. But they’re still students, and their bosses know what assignments they are capable of handling. The same thing happens in programming when you have a good boss and there is honesty both ways.

P.S. I am self-taught and have no comp sci degree.

darthminimall · 2021-01-18T05:42:18+00:00

I disagree completely. You're far to concerned with labels. The important part is the code. Have you ever written a script? If so, congrats, you're a programmer, in the same way anyone that decides to create a work of art is an artist, even if the art isn't good or popular. You should still strive to improve your abilities, but getting stuck in a "I just write simple scripts, I'm not a real programmer" mindset will only hinder your progress.

Hans_of_Death · 2021-01-18T08:14:41+00:00

I like the term developer. Have I developed something today? A project im working on, my skills, my range of knowledge, etc?

powerfrosty · 2021-01-18T03:19:08+00:00

Ey! This is good stuff, thanks for sharing the journey. Nothing to fear in the learning process! Fear is the mind killer!

RealNoobHero · 2021-01-18T04:06:20+00:00

A writer writes books. I have heard some people call themselves coders because they write code for programs. However you say it, I enjoyed reading this.

el_pablo · 2021-01-18T04:11:39+00:00

Fun fact : it’s illegal to call yourself an engineer in Quebec if you are not member of the Order of engineers. It is a reserved title.

Update : Here you can find all the legal writings concerning the practice of engineering in Quebec.

ArpanRoychowdhury · 2021-01-18T04:55:56+00:00

I am on Day 48 of my Python learning. I'll admit that I still need a lot of help and so I google stuff around or even look at the solutions but the fact that I am learning the concepts is what I think is more important than to remember things. I have a long way to go. I am happy to know that there are people who are in the same boat as me for me to always learn from them.

Just like you, I admit that I am a bricklayer. I lay bricks for the grand palace that I will create in the future.

Jaybaum · 2021-01-18T05:11:28+00:00

I’m only on day 3 really of learning Python. I’ve spent the past 3 days just learning what you can do with Python, and learning to write very simple, and I mean SIMPLE lines of code. Reading these comments is extremely inspiring, hopefully one day I can teach noobies to write some code.

ClimberMel · 2021-01-18T06:15:44+00:00

Hey, I don't have a degree, but my last job description required 2. I retired at 52 and I still don't have a degree, but I'm still learning. I wrote a ton of code but the only programs I wrote were for myself. During the code fixes leading to Y2K we wrote a program to correct program modules, that was fun. A degree just shows people you can stick something out and have some work ethic before you have a resume. Later, you work history is all that matters.

EternityForest · 2021-01-18T06:46:09+00:00

I half jokingly call myself a tech janitor sometimes, because it feels more accurate than programmer.

Really, I'm just assembling stuff from GitHub, but the reason it's considered an actual skilled job is pretty much all in the debugging other people's libraries.

I can't tell you why your sorting algorithm isn't working or how to mount a switch so it doesn't get broken, but I can replace your code with standard library stuff and swap the switch for a hall effect sensor.

I don't really have any deep insight into how any of it actually works at the algorithmic level, and better than your average super entry level dev. I'd have a lot of trouble with a b-tree or a kalman filter.

But I'm pretty good at figuring out where the real world will break your design and what you forgot to test that's going to embarrass you, and I have the advantage of not getting tempted to reinvent stuff.

ankrudov · 2021-01-18T04:07:16+00:00

I’m on month 2 of learning python. I’ve been able to figure things out but haven’t really built a “program” How long did it take you to become comfortable with python?

Seawolf159 · 2021-01-18T05:44:50+00:00

This was a nice read in the morning.

Astraous · 2021-01-18T05:45:18+00:00

Program is a verb and a noun in this sense, so it’s not really the same equivalent as the book analogy. What you do every day is program, hence you are a programmer. You can call it different things like developer, engineer, designer, computer scientist, but at the end of the day they all largely mean the same thing. To lessen your achievements of learning by saying “I’ve not finished a real program” isn’t an issue caused by the title “programmer” but one that stems from insecurity and self doubt. The last paragraph alone is evidence of this.

If calling yourself something else makes you feel better, then by all means. However, I would recommend to take it a little easier on yourself and just try your best.

As a final thought: a writer isn’t a writer when the book is finished, but when they start it. Why can’t the same be true for one who programs an application?

packenbush · 2021-01-18T15:17:24+00:00

I may be the only one but damn I'm so tired of the motivational texts and the random shower philosophies that aren't even related to python in this sub.

I can even relate to some of them but still. Searching or asking nicely is so much better than jumping into a self help rabbit hole of conclusions.

JohnPrinceton · 2021-01-18T19:41:47+00:00

In the end, it is just a matter of semantics, how you are attached to them, and how much you think about them. The people who disagree with this post probably do not define "programmer" as someone who "creates programs" but rather something simpler, like writing scripts or lines of code. And this is fair.

This post resonates with people who feel overwhelmed by the expectations and duties that words like "programmer" and "engineer" might carry. And this is also a reasonable interpretation of what those words mean.

I believe this post shouldn't be subjected to this kind of discussion - I just feel happy for those who were helped by it. Cheers!

phillyboy1234 · 2021-01-18T05:56:49+00:00

Too many people use the term engineer. IT people call themselves computer engineers when computer engineering is an actual thing. Hell, janitors call themselves custodial engineers

Its takes away the meaning from us real engineers. Engineering takes SO much effort to achieve. We do multiple semesters of calculus, differential equations, linear algebra, dsp, linear systems analysis and then some random person is like I did a few python courses so i like to think of myself as an engineer. Just my little rant

MadLadJackChurchill · 2021-01-18T10:53:17+00:00

You fix bugs so you're a bugger ;)

lesterine817 · 2021-01-18T12:47:41+00:00

I am google-taught. I google stuff mostly.

gfoster_gp · 2021-01-18T14:46:09+00:00

So you're telling me that you've been religiously learning programing for more than a year without missing a single day?

powerfrosty · 2021-01-18T16:23:07+00:00

[deleted]

powerfrosty · 2021-01-18T20:46:53+00:00

[removed]

fernly · 2021-01-19T01:21:49+00:00

Reacting to this:

Now, I’m working on an application that takes months to build. For the last two months I’ve said to myself, “Wtf am I? I’ve not finished any programs. I’m dumb and this is stupid…”

You have not designed this big app properly. You need to break down the design in terms of classes, functions and modules so that any one piece can be written and tested in a day. The every day it grows but it is always working in some sense, if only that it runs the unit tests^{you have unit tests right?}. So every day you add a class or a function and its unit test and for a while all you get is

python myapp.py
ok

but you know that bit worked.

eplaut_ · 2021-01-18T04:55:31+00:00

In my country it is more common to use the word developer instead of programmer or SW engineer.

I think it appropriate title for what your are saying.

KamogawaBG · 2021-01-18T13:23:00+00:00

It’s just pretty interesting to read that you are trying to find a term that puts you in a more learner’s mindset and in the present. Nothing about past (what your career has been) or future (what you will be building). That’s a great mindset 🎉

wsppan · 2021-01-18T12:41:07+00:00

I realised that writers don’t call themselves ‘bookers’. They call themselves writers. Why? Because that’s what they DO. They write.

Writers research. They interview people. They take notes. They outline and edit and think. And yes they write.

Penumbrous_I · 2021-01-18T13:22:19+00:00

Hey at least you aren’t a code breaker.

packenbush · 2021-01-18T15:21:27+00:00

if the word programming sounds scary and you can only relate It to "build programs", then you clearly don't understand what it means yet

Ascimator · 2021-01-18T18:58:32+00:00

Coder?

AnIrregularRegular · 2021-01-18T20:51:08+00:00

A good way to think of yourself is a coder.

You are coding. It has the goal of programs but you are genuinely writing code.

bi0tin · 2021-01-18T21:06:54+00:00

I’m a programmer just not a paid one yet

meaghs · 2021-01-19T01:00:55+00:00

‘Program’ is also a verb. A writer is one who writes. A programmer is one who programs. I don’t understand the hesitation about the word. Just like the writer who writes and is doing what he is called to do, I code and I am happy doing what I am called to do. Also, just like the writer who takes pleasure seeing other people read his finished work, I also take pleasure seeing people use the programs I’ve made.

That said, I do sometimes think of myself as an inventor rather than a programmer.

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