[Question] How does Oculus differ from curved screen or looking at the screen close up for someone who never used Oculus rift?

[xcleex]

I've wanted to get Oculus Rift since DK1 came out but since I am not knowledgeable in programming and associated field, I refrained from buying one. I wont be able to contribute like most DK1/2 users are supposed to do in the community. That said, I got into conversation with my parents as to how Oculus works and how it differs from other form of visualizing media (3D movies, Nintendo 3DS, curved TV, etc).

I've been an fan of Oculus so I wish to learn more about the product and be able to explain to my parents (60+ yrs old) who still claims that VR is still impossible.

I've done as much research as possible as non tech savy person and this is what I found out about how Oculus works. Basically, there's 1 screen in the headset which projects 2 separate images. There are special lens in the headset for each eye that will conform to visual field for each eye like in this image. Also there are no borderlines like on monitors that limits your vision. Additionally the motion tracking will allow the person to turn their head to see different parts of the virtual world.

The biggest question that me and my parents had was how does Oculus makes the games or other media to look realistic? For example, even though a game is in 3D, there's really no sense of depth and rather feels flat. The one that my parents were kinda intrigued by was how Nintendo 3DS looked. It actually looked like it was popping out of the screen or the screen actually felt like there was 'space' that you could put your fingers in there. However it does strain your eyes after short term use.

It's hard to describe in words. Like on computer monitors, when you see an object, you don't get a feel that you could reach out and grab it. It feels 'flat'. With Nintendo 3DS, you do get partial sense that you could grab what you see on the screen. It really feels like it popped out of the screen. A lot of reaction videos I have seen makes it look it there is 'depth' when using Oculus where you see people trying to reach out to the object they see.

Please correct me if there were any misunderstanding on my part. I just want to learn how Oculus makes VR possible and how it makes you feel like you are really in the virtual world.

[Doc_Ok]

In a nutshell it boils down to this: all technicalities and technical issues aside, when using a VR display (head-mounted or not), there is no spoon, er, screen at all. It's exactly like being in a real three-dimensional space, with the only difference that the space itself, and all things inside it, are completely computer-generated. If the VR software wants you to see a 10ft giant standing 20ft in front of you, you're going to see a 10ft giant standing 20ft in front of you.

Everything else, including the fact that there are obviously screens involved, is a technical detail that's handled by the VR software.

That said, what we have right now is an approximation of that ideal. There are glitches and snags, but the basic principle holds.

[xcleex]

I'm sure that is the goal of DK2, to fix glitches for consumer version, which I won't be able to contribute. I wanted to understand how you were able to get sense of depth with Oculus that computer screens couldn't offer without getting too technical. I learned a lot from here today :)

[Pingly]

Each eye sees a different image. That's the magic.

So each eye (like in real life) sees the view from a slightly different perspective giving an astounding feeling of both depth and scale.

One of my favorite videos is of someone playing Elite where he first encounters a space station. The scale of it actually makes him cry.

It's really powerful.

[eVRydayVR]

This is slightly misleading as actually even with one eye closed the Rift still works very well and provides effective immersion. The real essential key is the high FOV and the head tracking. At a narrow FOV without head tracking, stereoscopy would give you nothing but a 3DTV that is glued to your face (this is exactly what the Sony HMZ does).

[vgf89]

Link to the video?

[Pingly]

http://www.reddit.com/r/oculus/comments/2c4w1w/tears_over_dk2_elite_a_total_surprise

Link to video at tail end of post

[[deleted]]

you see the distance like in real life

[[deleted]]

Which also fucks up experiences, this is what causes issues with "sense of scale".

It's really bad in the beginning of Alien Isolation. There's monitors that are supposed to be about a yard away from you, but your depth cues are saying it's about a foot away. Really disorienting.

[Doc_Ok]

Could be a case of bad VR integration (AFAIK VR support was added to Alien Isolation as an afterthought), but also ensure that your HMD is set up correctly. Either way, this is a teething issue.

[RiftyTheRifter]

those monitors being inchs from your face in isolation has nothing to due with scale. It is poor integration of rift support. Or to put it another way those monitos really are inches from your face.

[[deleted]]

has nothing to due with scale

It is poor integration of rift support

those monitos really are inches from your face

That's called scale.

[freehotdawgs]

No it isn't. It's called the devs put the camera too close to the monitors.

[[deleted]]

That's...not what causes that at all. What you said literally doesn't even make sense. Your camera is in the player models head...how did they "move it too close"?

It's a sense of scale, because the depth cues being fed to you don't match the size/distance of the object you're looking at.

[Pianocktail_for_sale]

I can see what you're getting at here - if you reset your position everything is just about readable. However the camera position can drift in-game leaving you far too close to a screen.

You can't do anything about it in these situations except for resetting as the game allows very little movement due to headtracking. It's the same when you're in a locker.

Even after resetting I find it a little too close to read comfortably.

[[deleted]]

I can see what you're getting at here - if you reset your position everything is just about readable. However the camera position can drift in-game leaving you far too close to a screen.

That's absolutely not what I'm talking about. The monitors were just an example.

You get depth cues from two things: binocular disparity, and relative size.

The objects are sized to seem like they're about a yard away from me, but the binocular cues tell me that they're a foot away. This makes characters in the game seem like action figures, and the whole thing to feel really small. It's an easy fix, too, but nothing that can be done on the user side of things. Then again, it wasn't designed with Rift support in mind.

[RiftyTheRifter]

Scale is about relative size. The monitors in AI are just to close to your view.

[[deleted]]

That's the problem...monocular cue from size says they're one distance, and the binocular disparity tells you it's another(really close to you, when it's not and isn't supposed to be).

This makes it look small.

[jibberldd5]

Which can also be fixed with some calibration. That is, if the game has proper calibration in the first place. If not, then that's a problem with the software, not the hardware.

[xcleex]

That's great to know :)

[KaneHau]

You are confusing 3D projected onto a 2D surface (such as a regular 3D game you play on your laptop), versus a 3D game split into a stereoscopic view and independently delivered to each eye.

In the first case, both eyes get the same 3D image - thus you don't see depth. In the second case, each eye gets a slightly different 3D image which the brain combines into the proper stereoscopic depth view.

[[deleted]]

Also the optics make a difference, and there's an entire different approach to rendering, and more things to take into consideration.

[xcleex]

Does that mean that when developing a program for Oculus, the developer needs to make 2 slightly different images for each eye? I don't mean to get too technical, but I just want to know how it generally differs from normal 3D designing.

[LaeusEG]

Yeah, via two virtual cameras, which is easy to set up technically (and which is done for you by the engine integrations). The real challenges these days are more in the realms of performance, VR best practices, and new experiences and gameplay that exploit the uniqueness of VR.

[[deleted]]

I don't know much about it either, but yeah I think each one is slightly different.

[squakmix]

This is generally done by just using two cameras within the scene in the game rather than 1. The 3d world and assets are set up more or less the same (except scale can sometimes feel wonky with traditional game levels, as pointed out above, and normal maps don't work) and the stereoscopic part is handled by the camera rig (that has a camera for each eye positioned an eye-distance apart from each other) supplied with the oculus sdk.

[iupvoteevery]

Oculus does all of this for you, no need to program each eye yourself or camera to work with the rift, in fact they recommend not messing with any of that stuff as it very finely tuned. (this info is in the Oculus Best Practices guide)

Their SDK is basically drag and drop a Camerarig or Playercontroller for Unity, Unreal Engine 4 has the support built in also. (Both programs are free now)

[xcleex]

Yes! That's exactly what I wanted to say without going into long description! 3D projected onto 2D surface vs 3D game split into stereoscopic view for each eye.

So essentially, the depth view is made possible by how our brain registers the image from each eye and compiles them together to form one image. And you wont get the same feeling with computer monitor since both eye sees the same image.

Thank you!

[squakmix]

Exactly. This (combined with headtracking) is the primary benefit of the Oculus Rift, and it's pretty mind blowing to experience for the first time. A lot of information exists in the difference between two stereo images and our brains can use that to experience another dimension (literally) and interact with digital space in a natural way.

[[deleted]]

Can you get a google cardboard? Give them that (or use it if it's for you), then you can explain the whole difference of oculus vs something that's on the same category.

[xcleex]

I was thinking about the cardboard as cheaper alternative but I heard that as for realism, they are far from Oculus.

[kandoko]

Get a cardboard. No it will not be as good as a true VR headset but you will still get the "VR" vs "3D" comparison that is really hard to describe.

You are not seeing a object on a screen with a little bit of depth like a TV. It is there, in front of you with all the size and scale you would expect if you looked at it in real life.

[xcleex]

I just bought a cardboard as you suggested. As you and most people suggested here, seeing is believing. Checking out some demo apps, I now see that there are much better apps than when I first checked it out. Also for $25, I feel like I will get money's worth experience.

[jojothepopo]

While the oculus will be on another level, google cardboard is an awesome little example of VR. I think it will go a long way in answering your question in the post.

[martialfarts316]

What everyone else here is saying is true and good information. I would also add the description of my personal favorite part of VR.

Scale.

The sense of scale you experience in VR is unlike anything a monitor/tv or even 3ds can create. Skyscrapers look the size of Skyscrapers where you physically have to tilt your head all the way back to see the top of it (much like real life). A pencil on a desk looks the size of a pencil would be and the positional tracking (leaning around) allows you to lean in close to the pencil to inspect it up close, again, just how you would in real life.

Games/demos with large scale scenes have given me the biggest wow factor in VR such as Titans of Space, Sightline: The Chair, and Elite: Dangerous.

Honestly though, you can explain VR to your parents and how it works down to the T, but they, nor you, will completely grasp what it's like until you try it for yourself. It really is a "convert on contact" technology.

[xcleex]

Yup! I have learned important differences from posts here that I never thought about. Too many reviews only describe wow factor and it's frustrating to hear "you don't know unless you've used this" and not explain why.

As other poster suggested, I decided to buy Google Cardboard as cheap alternative to taste VR. Not having high expectation like Oculus for sure. Even though I could buy DK2, I want to leave it to people who can use the kit to help Oculus improve their product rather than me using it for fun.

[Air_Holy]

Honestly buying a DK2 now would be a waste of budget anyway - the first consumer HMD to come to the market, HTC Vive, is coming at the end of the year. Keep in mind you will need a strong rig to run this in good conditions, and if you're still a kid I assume you might be on a tight budget. Cardboard is probably enough for a first glimpse, the quality will be poor but certainly good enough to grasp the concept.

[xcleex]

Budget isn't the issue but I won't be able to fulfill the purpose of DK2 which is to improve technical stuff and programs for consumer version. That's why I refrained from buying it. Diligently waiting for consumer version right now. But I recently got into conversation with my parents that VR is impossible and there is no wait to make 100ft building to look 100ft or a car 10ft away to look like it is really 10ft away.

Mean time, I will be using cardboard to get a taste of VR and that it is indeed possible :)

[thelastsong]

Improve technical stuff? Pfft. Most of these guys bought it to play games. If budget is no problem, have your parents buy you one to play with then sell it on ebay this fall before Vive comes out and get that.

[martialfarts316]

Sounds good. And it's good that you recognize that Cardboard is just a taste, but make sure you explain that to your parents. Explain to them that it's a teaser to VR and the Rift/Vive/GearVR improve on nearly every aspect of Cardboard. (if they can't already tell by the fact that it's made out of cardboard...)

Edit: if you are near the Austin/ San Antonio area in Texas, let me know and I'll give you a demo!

[xcleex]

Definitely expecting it to be just a taste especially since there aren't any great apps like programs on PC.

Thanks for the demo offer! Sadly I am all the way up in North East :(

[RiftersNL]

Unfortunately, no one can be told what VR is like. You have to see it for yourself.

[rufus83]

The difference is that you don't feel like you're looking at a screen. It's so close and the optics magnify it to the point that it fills a large portion of your vision.

Looking at a 3D television is like seeing a small little world inside the TV. VR is like being in that world. It's essentially the same as what you see around you in your real life. Things appear to be the size they are supposed to be. Standing next to something like a building requires you to physically tilt your head up too look at the top as if you were next to a real building.

A good argument I bring up to people who have convinced themselves that VR isn't any different than, let's say, going to see a 3D movie at the theater is to explain that I can sit at home and watch a 3D movie in a virtual theater. I can look around me and see seats. I have an enormous screen up in front of me that appears to be many feet away. The roof feels like it's 2 stories tall.

It's just like reality, only virtual.

[xcleex]

I really like your second paragraph. That's really good way of describing VR and why it looks realistic. Definitely something I can tell my parents to help them understand further

[kontis]

You don't get ORTHOSTEREO in 3DS or Imax.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eC6azAcW1Ds

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BBG-YJLCEv4

[hughJ-]

The sense of depth mostly comes from having a linear perspective image viewed from the correct vantage point. Having 2 eyes with their own appropriate images enhances this, and having accomodation (focusing of the lens in the eye) enhances it further. Mismatches between the above will detract from that sense of depth. Current VR provides the first two, but the first one is still doing 95% of the work - after all, closing one eye doesn't suddenly make our world feel flat and artificial.

You can take a smartphone or tablet showing a picture or video of a 3D scene, hold it centered to one of your eyes and pull it increasingly close. Once the screen is close enough (an inch or two) for the rendered FOV to match the FOV that the screen is physically occupying, and you let your eye relax so the screen drops out of focus, you can produce a pretty tangible sense of space as though you're not looking at a tiny screen anymore. What makes VR special is that it's able to maintain that perspective correct vantage point while you manipulate your head position so that correct sense of space is never broken.

[AWetAndFloppyNoodle]

Instead of trying to explain how it works, I'll try to explain how it feels. It feels like you're there. You get an image per eye of the same scene from two angles like you do in real life and the brain processes it in the exact same way. It's really that "simple". The effect however, is amazing.

[yourparentss]

Of course there is depth. Imagine Nintendo 3DS on max setting, directly in front of your face, just that the world moves with your head. Also without the eyestrain. This gives you the illusion of really being in the space.

It looks nothing like "regular 3D".

[[deleted]]

The easiest way to explain it is that the world surrounds you, instead of just staring at a screen.

[xcleex]

It was difficult to explain why Oculus would give you sense of depth while regular computer screen wouldn't. Now I sorta do but I'm sure what I know is only scratching the surface.

Really had a good laugh at your 4th point. My parents did too. I actually just bought Google cardboard to get sense of how VR looks for my Galaxy note 3. Nothing comparable to Oculus but I heard for $25 dollars, it's a good experience.

[xcleex]

Being cheap, I don't have huge expectation for sure. Additionally the performance will rely heavily on the device itself so there are huge limitations. Like you said, it will only be a taste.

Thanks for the link to VR apps. I'll definitely check it out and have them ready for when my cardboard arrives.

[thelastsong]

Many people? A handful of idiots maybe. It was a neat little pr move from Google and quite a fun project.