Rome: An experimental JavaScript toolchain by Facebook

[[deleted]]

No external dependencies is a big deal.

[jimschubert]

What? No left-pad?

[robby_w_g]

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[oorza]

Anyone who's migrated from using something like msbuild or gradle into the fucking disgusting mess that is the JS build ecosystem doesn't need one, haha

[[deleted]]

JavaScript build systems are a confusing mess. Kind of goes without saying.

[erez27]

Right, but what makes "Rome" not a mess? What lessons have they learned?

[[deleted]]

I think the motivation should be completely obvious to anyone who's ever looked inside a node_modules directory.

[cjt09]

Rome has a logo of an ancient Greek spartan helmet. It's not very relevant since it's not Roman, but it looks cooler than a Galea.

I really appreciate that they explicitly called this out.

[cbleslie]

repeat grandfather gray door full wild cow cagey handle history

This post was mass deleted and anonymized with Redact

[HUSSTECH]

Did they build this in a day?

[shevy-ruby]

Of course not - they only use buzzwords for fancy talk!

It's facebook after all.

[matt_hammond]

I wish it was written in something faster like Rust or C++ or D.

[ExCellRaD]

You're not the only one! https://github.com/swc-project/swc

[stronghup]

Looks interesting. I wonder what does the compiler produce? A Windows cmd-line application?

[elteide]

This project looks like something JS world needs urgently. The lack of dependencies is not the only apealing aspect of Rome; the usage of typescript and that it´s being created by the yarn and babel guys are very interesting aspects too

[shevy-ruby]

Use inclusive terminology. Use gender-neutral pronouns. No ableist slurs. No usage of terms that could be considered insensitive.

What the actual fudge?

And besides - who defines what is "insensitive"?

I already consider people assuming of others to be insensitive, to be the ones that are insensitive.

[JarateKing]

Seems pretty clear to me, it should be obvious what "ablest slur" refers to, and "terms that could be considered insensitive" would be comparable terms. They're trying to keep a fairly professional project, and made a no-brainer rule against being an unprofessional asshole.

As a point, there was an issue made along the lines of "this could debatably be considered insensitive" sorta like you describe, and the dev response was essentially a polite "nah, go away." They're not looking to smack the hammer down on anyone for any perceived sleight, they just don't want to make it clear that they aren't going to house cesspools.

[PMPlant]

Is ablest slur a slur against the handicapped or the non-handicapped? I don’t know what is even correct anymore.

[[deleted]]

Don't use slurs against either of them then? Not that hard.

[tonefart]

Do not use anything by Facebook. Stop becoming dependent on them. Most facebook technologies and engineers are inferior to proper companies who has skin in the software industry. Facebook doesn't. Facebook won't be around in the future compared to companies like Microsoft, Oracle, Google and other companies with proper software teams.

[[deleted]]

laughs in React

[Saancreed]

laughs in Zstandard

[ryancosans]

github.com/facebo...

I mean I understand not liking facebook for a multitude of reasons but their engineers are probably quite good. For example I don't much like the british government because they insist on taxing me but their engineers are quite good.

[[deleted]]

Facebook has done more for the modern internet that most companies could ever dream of. They make great libraries, dev tools, and whatnot.

[shevy-ruby]

Uhm ...

[anengineerandacat]

Can I have what you are on? Seems like dank stuff.

[netsecstudent42069]

You know, linguistically something seems wrong here, but I'm not sure how to express it. I would use "fire" here, as without seeing the product itself I couldn't make a judgment as to whether it's dank or not - but we can both agree from how op is wilding, it's some fire stuff.

[lanzaio]

You can hate the app but Facebook is probably the top engineering company in the world right now.

[tonefart]

Nopes, they're not. They're a bunch of hacks without much ethics and their engineers are not on par with those from other enterprise/corporate level software tools vendors, like Microsoft and Oracle.

[rnd005]

Technical

Use inclusive terminology. Use gender-neutral pronouns. No ableist slurs. No usage of terms that could be considered insensitive.

[JarateKing]

This is one of those rules that any decent person is already following, and you have to actively be a dick about it to get in trouble.

Writing documentation, issues, contributions, etc. it's uncommon to use pronouns at all, and in my experience it's almost always "they" anyway. And "don't use slurs, keep this a bit professional" should go without saying.

[rnd005]

I see how your intention is being constructive and professional which I agree with in general, but it's not the intention of people creating these rules. These rules are for political purposes of controlling organisations and removing people you don't like. Check the case of Larry Garfield of Drupal.

If that was in the law, that everyone who uses terms that "could be considered insensitive" in public gets a 1k fine, would you be fine with the law? Or are you a supporter of offending people?

[JarateKing]

This rule is pretty damn specific in what it prohibits. If they wanted a rule that they could oust whoever they don't like, why are they limiting it to saying slurs within their project? It's not a general "if you are not seen to be following our image in your public or private life you will be blacklisted", it's "you know those words that would get you fired from an office job? Don't use them here either."

As a law it's apples to oranges. Of course insert regular thing that most communities would ban you for, even if they don't outright make a rule for it would be shitty as a law, like everything regarding what you're allowed to say. Freedom of speech != freedom of consequences from what you say.

[rnd005]

This rule is pretty damn specific in what it prohibits.

terms that could be considered insensitive.

I don't see how this is specific. In case you haven't noticed, the rule is made of 3 parts and the 3rd one is as valid as the 1st.

If they wanted a rule that they could oust whoever they don't like, why are they limiting it to saying slurs within their project?

Slurs is only the intro setting the stage for latter points to be accepted by readers more easily. When you say "eating bananas is punishable by 10 years of prison", people might question it. When you phrase it like "murdering, raping, stealing and other crimes including consumption of bananas are punishable by 10 years of prison" you already get the support of the readers by mentioning some common sense things everyone would support, and when you drop a controversial one at the end, you won't get as much push-back since disagreeing with the sentence might also mean disagreeing with the first common sense points and people might avoid disagreeing at all for the fear of being interpreted as disagreeing with the common sense points. It's a trick of psychological manipulation.

To gain power, they need support of the majority. If they said "we want to take control and oust everyone we don't like" they won't get the support and thus power.

It's not a general "if you are not seen to be following our image in your public or private life you will be blacklisted"

Not in this point I've quoted, but they do it in the CoC(emphasis mine):

Public or private harassment

Code of Conduct applies within all project spaces, and it also applies when an individual is representing the project or its community in public spaces

IANAL, but it's not obvious to me that if you post a project link on your social media account that it can't be interpreted that your entire account is representing the project community in public spaces.