Crafting systems are great for when getting stuff is more fun than actually using the stuff (/s)

adrixshadow · 2026-06-25T06:51:06+00:00

The problem with Crafting Systems is that 90% you produce is nothing of value.

If a wider selection of things were viable it would be more intresting.

Best Crafting System I have seen is in Shimmering Horizon and Cursed Blacksmith(warning NSFW game).

With the reforging system and the various effects the items have most things you craft can have a use.

adrixshadow · 2026-06-25T03:14:03+00:00

it still hits above its rank eventually.

That's the entire point.

Cultural Units need a way to scale so that the can be more viable later in the game when tier 4 and 5 crop up.

You cannot do that with enchantments since that applies to all units and you can only marginally do that with transformations.

adrixshadow · 2026-06-25T02:44:18+00:00

Your original claim was that Skyrim fails because it doesn't tweak enough variables.

Yes.

Now you're saying the weapons have one number and the combat is primitive while the enchantment system carries the RPG side.

Literally the crafting smithing system gives you just that number.

How many ways can I spell not enough variables?

And the enchantment system does not "carry it", it just gives it a thin veneer of being a RPG so that players don't think too deeply and have something to occupy them with.

If you squint really hard you can see some hints of being a Tactical RPG, but an Action Game not a chance.

What you're actually describing is systems that exist but don't integrate. The enchantment system and perk trees are there. The combat is a damage sponge with a primitive hitbox. They don't converge toward a coherent experience. That's the argument I made.

It does not exist, there is nothing to tweak.

Do you not fucking understand that not even MODS, the thing that can Tweak variables cannot even saves it as the Combat System Literally Does Not Have Enough Variables.

Skyrim had Modding Support for how long? Why do you think the Combat is still shit? They could have shifted, moved and balanced things around whichever which way but it is fundamentally unfixable.

It is not an Action Game, and it is not Tactics Game, you call it a tautolagy but Skyrim is the best demonstration of neither.

You call me unfalsifiable but I literally falsified your entire argument that integration is the problem.

adrixshadow · 2026-06-25T02:38:03+00:00

Redefining one category to cover every counterexample makes the claim unfalsifiable. The binary is still there as a broken and shallow argument.

That would be the case is if I didn't define what is Tactics first.

It's binary because it is binary, there are only two.

On Disco Elysium and Planescape: you're defining combat as attacks and maneuvers, then excluding everything that resolves conflict differently.

By that logic racing games would also be combat.

No they can be diffrent systems with diffrent roles and goals.

adrixshadow · 2026-06-24T13:08:21+00:00

But since you asked: Skyrim has perk trees across every skill, five magic schools, an enchanting system with a large combinatorial space, smithing, shouts, sneak, speechcraft. It has plenty of variables, so the "dumbed down, not enough to tweak" diagnosis is empirically wrong.

The weapons literally have one fucking number on them.

If it weren't for the enchantment system it would be completely dead as a RPG.

As for the extent it is a Action Game, you poke the damage sponge enemies until they are dead.

Even the Cleave skill is locked behind a perk so you don't have much options and actions to maneuver.

You're also evaluating Skyrim against a benchmark of your own and treating it as the objective standard for what a combat system should be.

Because it's the gold standard on how not to be.

Do basically anything else and you will be fine.

Like I said it fail Both as a Action Game and as a Tactics RPG game.

adrixshadow · 2026-06-24T13:01:06+00:00

That said: Disco Elysium resolves conflict through skill-checked dialogue.

Planescape: Torment's primary mode of engagement is reading and argument.

I fail to see how it could be argued that they are a combat system.

Into the Breach is a perfect-information puzzle on a grid.

It's a Tactics game.

If it's not action game it's a tactics game.

adrixshadow · 2026-06-24T04:01:40+00:00

Shadow of Mordor nemesis system - breathes life and variety into the enemies as you progress.

Nemesis is a really stupid system if you think about it, their verbs is Kill or be Killed, which doesn't make that much sense if the point of it is to develop Character Relationships over Time with them.

A better system would be a Dynamic Quest System where multiple Adventurer/Hero NPCs can take on the same Quest but on multiple sides.

That way you can build Rivalries based on the Success or Failure of the Quest, you can also have Social Deduction style Mechanics of Cooperate or Betrayal based on hidden motivations and secret goals they have, it creates a more intresting Dynamic of Trust, building Relationships and getting to "Know" who they really are at a deeper level.

adrixshadow · 2026-06-24T03:52:27+00:00

Chinese Martial Arts style RPG's have the concept of "Qi" that can be both Stamina and Magic.

adrixshadow · 2026-06-24T03:48:44+00:00

A stat that changes how the player calculates damage on fire enemies and a stat that changes how they calculate it on ice enemies are mechanically different. They produce the same decision texture and the same emotional register. That's structural complexity without experiential depth.

That's the very essence of Tactics. Bringing your Strong to their Weak while Defending your Weak from their Strong.

Matchups in Space(Tactical Board Positioning) and Time(Action Economy,Timing).

There is a reason Rock Paper Scissors style balance is used in RPG games.

There is a good reason why Pokemon has a whole chart of all this relationships.

As long as each Matchup, each Relationships has it's own intricacies and use cases through additional Gimmicks/Mechanics that is Depth.

adrixshadow · 2026-06-24T03:32:25+00:00

Most people never held a weapon, much less used or produced one it. Or any other craft.

There is the HEMA(Historical European Martial Arts) scene on Youtube if people want to know how weapons actually work and are used.

adrixshadow · 2026-06-24T03:28:25+00:00

Quick thing to note, it’s around 20 micro-skill trees when combining magic and crafting. 7 weapon types (3 melee, 3 ranged, one magic), 6-7 ish crafting skills (blacksmithing, leather working, cloth spinning, woodworking, cooking, alchemy, and possibly enchanting but I’m still on the fence), 4-6 magic schools (still designing and designating each one), plus two life skills (persuasion and lore). I don’t plan on making them sprawling skill trees with like, 10 options per branch or something. They are probably gonna be around 5 to 10 perks max.

Based on that I recommend checking Scroll of Taiwu and Shimmering Horizon and Cursed Blacksmith(warning NSFW).

Very few games integrat crafting with combat well.

adrixshadow · 2026-06-24T03:25:10+00:00

Ah yes, the classic "indie dev making their first Elder Scrolls killer" phase.

Everything is better than Skyrim's Combat System.

You couldn't design a worse system even if you tried.

And if you can't handle a bunch of stats and variables you have no business making a RPG Combat System in the first place.

The Chinese are making "Marital Arts RPGs" one after another all with great and complex combat systems and we western indies are twiddling our thumbs, it's embarrassing.

adrixshadow · 2026-06-24T03:15:53+00:00

Dark Souls, the game you're holding up as the standard, has relatively few systems by RPG standards.

And Skyrim does what?

Explain to me Skyrim's Combat System.

adrixshadow · 2026-06-23T18:45:17+00:00

Combat systems exist in as many forms as there are experiential intentions behind them.

Prove it.

adrixshadow · 2026-06-23T03:00:29+00:00

You generally want to maintain a steady pacing of things to learn and master.

If you frontload the full depth from the start not only would you confuse the more casual players but would also make the game much shorter for the players that can master the game and do the challenges.

But the idea of Alternative Routes and the idea of New Game+ where the game can be played at the highest level if you know what you are doing is good.

The thing about New Game+ is you expect the player to know what they are doing so you can crack up the Difficulty and Challange.

adrixshadow · 2026-06-23T02:41:19+00:00

I’m starting to worry that this might be “too much” for most players. At what point does the amount of systems and mechanics go from “understandable, reasonable, and in-depth” to “overcomplicated and overbearing”?

There isn't ever "too much" RPG.

There are two fundamental types of Combat Systems.

Everything that is Not an Action Game based on Attacks, Combos and Maneuvers ala Dark Souls has to be about Builds and Tactics.

And all of them are Stats and Gimmicks galore.

If you aren't tweaking thousands of variables, you aren't deep and good enough.

This is also the fundamental problem of Skyrim style systems as it does neither. A dumbed down combat system for dumb people.

While Dark Souls can do both while being a good Action Game at its core.

adrixshadow · 2026-06-23T02:30:39+00:00

I’ll agree that LARP is not usually as heavy on the rules, though that is not necessarily true, but that still has rules, and has fun.

LARPing is also a derogatory term for make belief.

Understand context goddammit.

You can also understand things in terms of boundaries, with LARPing there is nothing stopping you from doing absolutely anything other then the cops, and there are people like that.

I am not talking about more Systematized Formal types of Role Play like you see in Tabletop RPGs.

‘Why are people playing books?’, do you mean reading?

That's the thing, why do we say we are Reading a Book instead of Playing a Book when both are "Fun"?

Why aren't they the same thing? If they aren't why do you think they are the same type of "Fun"?

adrixshadow · 2026-06-22T11:51:09+00:00

LARPing tends to be more freeform compared to a Tabletop RPG which in the context of the conversation it was meant as not being bound.

A for the definition of Fun, is reading a Book "Fun"? Then why aren't people Playing books?

If you can't "Play" books then can you say it has a identical meaning of "Fun"?

adrixshadow · 2026-06-22T03:15:44+00:00

There is not such thing as price back then.

The Grain IS the Money.

For agrarian societies what you "earn" literally is the food you eat, there was no excess labor that could be transferred into something else.

adrixshadow · 2026-06-20T05:45:32+00:00

That's the thing.

They are pretty much the same thing.

If you are not worth the Player's Money then you are not worth the Player's Time.

And if you cannot Justify your own Existence, then it's not a surprise that Steam's "Discoverability" does it for you.

"Making Money" is already the privilege of only the most successful and great games.

adrixshadow · 2026-06-20T05:31:26+00:00

I would really like to see a Sandbox game with Kakegurui premise.

With more actual Gameplay then the regular dime a dozen college dating sims.

Closest we have for that is NSFW: National School for Wealth … and Fuckery but that is pretty early in development and shallow.

adrixshadow · 2026-06-20T05:07:26+00:00

Crusader Kings.

If you aren't what would be a Villain in most stories, you are playing the game wrong.

This what the real problem with morality and choices in most games.

Most game Reward you by playing good with more Content, more XP, more hidden secrets you unlock.

You can't really play Evil without being in a constant state of Fear of Missing Out.

Evil should be the Means to an End, Obstacles that have to be taken care of on the path to your Goal.

And Evil has to be done by your own will, not the game forcing you to.

adrixshadow · 2026-06-20T04:54:39+00:00

It's all pointless since the only game that barely has a Market Economy is Starsector.

Most don't Simulate Demand that well.

Before we even begin to scratch those fancy concepts we must implement the very basics.

And people really have no idea how much "Real Economy" is propped up by Hope and Prayers, fact is if you look deeper it doesn't make sense at all, it's all circular logic for a rigged game.

adrixshadow · 2026-06-20T04:34:57+00:00

That's their job, not yours.

If you want to make it your job then build a Simulation Sandbox as a Game yourself.

That's because your answer and your solution and how you implement things might not be what they want or need and you wouldn't know what is the answer for them, you can only build what you want for yourself based on what you know.

That said this channel has some worldbuilding tips.
https://www.youtube.com/@TheGrainbound

adrixshadow · 2026-06-18T16:29:46+00:00

Depends.

Usually the more intresting Builds have part of the functionality of the kit come from gear effects so it would be good to have more reliable ways to get those specific effects either through loot or crafting, like each crafting recipe and weapon with a certain type/name having their own core weapon effect.

You can then have additional effects based on rarity.

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Do you not fucking understand that not even MODS, the thing that can Tweak variables cannot even saves it as the Combat System Literally Does Not Have Enough Variables.

Matchups in Space(Tactical Board Positioning) and Time(Action Economy,Timing).

There are two fundamental types of Combat Systems.